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Veteran
Posts: 148
 
| My stud horse will sometimes get anxiety before running which then makes him have trouble breathing and increase his heart rate. He's had cardiac work up done and his heart and lungs are fine. Any suggestions on things to try to calm him down? We've tried the Pozzi Relax and doesn't phase him. | |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
 
| If he has trouble breathing
Does he have a flapper issue?
There are so many different calming agents, it will be trial and error.
Omega alpha
The
Rivas remedies
Oxygen
Pretty much any brand has a chill product | |
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Veteran
Posts: 148
| Does not have a flapper issue? He has been scoped and the only thing he will sometimes have an inflamed airway. | |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| I have a horse that had terrible anxiety when hauled away from home. I talked to Dr. Tom, who makes the Cur-Ost products, we decided on Stomach and Adapt for my horse. it made all the difference in the world. He is now off the Stomach and Adapt and is now on the Total and when I start hauling I will feed the Adapt as needed. I recommend the Cur-Ost products and he also had me go on a forage based diet which was also a big factor. I now feed Omni cubes, free choice grass hay in addition to the Cur-Ost supplements. My feed and supplement bills have gone way down and I now have a sane horse again. | |
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  Twin Sister to Queen Boobie
Posts: 13315
Location: East Tennessee but who knows?! | Have you tried a feed change? As far as nervousness, anxiety I've found feed changes can make a big impact. | |
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Expert
Posts: 4766
Location: Bandera, TX | Inflamed airway? BAL? Have you tried running him in a figure 8 or Cornell Collar? PM me if you have a vet that will be open to script on some calming meds. Sometimes running them on meds for 1/4-1/2 year gets them over their anxiety. Stomach try to run your boy on a handful or two of alfalfa so that it soaks up any acid he dumps as you stand near the alley ready to enter. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 139
Location: Abbotsford B.C. Canada | At equine science society we had a paper presented saying 10 grams a day pure magnesium will reduce the fear response of a medium sized horse by about one third.
We use it all the time to calm horses and it works. Not a magic bullet but horses are noticably calmer. This is about 18 grams of magnesium oxide. You may recall the old milk of magnesia for tummy upset and maybe you will get some acid neutralization in the process. Your hays etc may simply be low magnesium.
I can guarantee you when he is getting worked up the acid is pouring into his stomach due to stress and or fear hormones. If his stomach is empty it will affect his gut big time. Maye feed little and often or use hay nets.
I also think you could feed two lbs of plain alfalfa cubes about one hour before your run and have a little mat to catch the acid that gets splashed up doing a run. LIke tums for the tummy. Alfalfa will truly directly buffer acid grass hay or cubes is neutral except for stimulating chewing and the bicarb in the saliva. I ma not syaing for sure he fears getting hurt but it can only help.
It will not blow his brains out nor sand bag him if he drinks some water to go with it.
This is a natural way to help him cope. He only needs to lug the water for 16-17 seconds so I think it is easy for him to handle .
Also, try using a lower sugar and starch diet for him , go with a fat and fiber concentrate with just a little sweet feed as a treat .
If his hind gut feels better he may be less anxious.
Just a suggestion, naturally check with your veterinarian to ensure no ulcers etc.
Also move up a little on concentrate at a show to give him more support since his heart rate is up there so high. He was also hauled which is like a mini endurance ride .
When his heart rate is up with worry and stress he is burning off muscle glycogen even though he is just standing there and could be getting a little run down over a two or three day meet.
I also suggest one teaspoon a day biochromium for muscle support and to relax him a bit.
That is what we do with the nervous thoroughbreds who wash out before a race especially the fillies.
THe rest may need a natural horsemanship trainer and vet support etc, may not be the answer , just trying to help you a bit.
Keep some omega threes in the diet and a cup a day milled flax will help with stomach function from my experience aside from the omega three fatty acid deal.
FYI
Good luck ,
Coastal Rider
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 Whack and Roll
Posts: 6342
Location: NE Texas | If he is having trouble breathing, one of two things is happening. Sometimes when a horse gets anxious and the heart rate increases, the soft palate will displace. You can initiate this during a scope by putting your hands over the horse's nostrils and see via scope if they displace due to the extra strain to breathe. If they are displacing, the question then becomes why, which leads me to the second part of why he may be having trouble breathing, even without displacement of the soft palate.....mucous/phlegm in the airways.
When a horse gets anxious or their heart rate increases, the airways likely constrict, which makes the air passages smaller. If there is mucous and phlegm in the airway, it constricts the airway even more and makes breathing difficult, hence the reason we often see horses cough during warm up only and then they are fine. They are clearing their airway of the mucous and phlegm so they can breathe.
I have dealt with an enormous amout of respiratory issues and anxiety issues due to the respiratory issues this year. My horse has always had mild breathing issues, allergies we'll call them, since he was sick as a yearling. He is now 5. I've been able to manage these issues with different supplements and keep him out of dusty situations as much as possible, which is difficult in Texas, but it was never bad enough to worry about. He ran on the track as a 3 YO drug free with no issues. Last winter as a 4 YO when we began seasoning him, his stress level increased, his breathing worsened, and we started going to vets. After 3 months, seeing 4 different vets, numorous medications at high doses, scopes, anti-biotics, nebulizers, supplements, steroids, etc, and over $5000 spent, I had a horse who was in complete respiratory distress on my hands. Last vet recommended to put him down, as we had exceeded all available treatment options.
Every single time we scoped him, which was 5 including the exercise scope, his soft palate was displaced. Question was why. The answer came later. This horse couldn't take a deep enough breath to cough and stood around panting taking short shallow breaths....heaving....even on 8 - 10 cc of Ventipulmin and Dex. He was pitiful. I began researching different things and a friend suggested 30 cc of French's mustard, which did help just enough to get him coughing a little bit and his nose to run. I began then researching what was in the mustard, which led me to turmeric, so I researched that, which led me to Curcurmin (http://www.curcuminforhealth.com/the-difference-between-turmeric-and-curcumin/). Then I took it a step further and educated myself on BCM-95 curcurmin (http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2007/10/report_curcumin/page-01), which led me to Dr. Schell and the Cur-OST product.
I visited with Dr. Schell for about 3 weeks and he explained to me in great detail and with great patience why no medications or therapies had been successful in treating this condition to this point. He explained to me why we were having soft palate displacement issues (due to the strain on the airways and lungs from the mucous and phlegm making the air passages smaller, as well as the glottis being vascular and heavy due to aggravation and mucous). He explained how stress and anxiety affects these issues as well due to the release of cortisol by the brain, which is also an inflammatory response, and can easily worsen an already fragile health situation. He and I emailed back and forth for about 3 weeks before I decided to try his product. I was so skeptical due to the fact that I have used almost every breathing supplement through the years on this horse and while they did help keep these issues manageable when he was healthy, he had been on them this entire time and had still gotten so sick, not to mention the fact that 4 vets hadn't been able to help. Dr. Schell asked that I give him 30 days on his product and to follow his specifications, and as a last resort I did just that. In 2 weeks I had a horse I was able to start exercising and that finally had a productive cough, and in 30 days I was back riding this horse and he was almost cough free. This was in March and i've been back to hauling this horse since June. His full story, along with others who have gone this route after seeing the changes it made in my horse, is on the Cur-OST thread on the product research forum.
Prior to starting this Cur-OST program, I removed my horse off of all supplements of any kind. No probiotics or prebiotics, no ulcer medicatiosn (which he'd been on for months during all of this to try to keep ulcers at bay....unsuccessfully), no joint supplements or additional breathing supplements. I took him off of all prescriptions medications as well. Clean slate. Feed, hay, cur-OST, and that's how he is today as well. I changed my diet to a whole grain (1 pound of whole oats once daily) alfalfa diet. No more processed feeds or supplements with synthetics in them anymore.
So many of us have no had such great success with this program, smokingirlie even had a horse who was on allergy shots due to an allergy panel she had done that showed she tested allergic to oats. Having discontinued her allergy shots and on the Cur-OST program, the same mare who was supposedly allergic to oats now eats oats twice daily without any problem.
It's hard to wrap one's mind around how the stomach and lower gut affects the immune system and all aspects of our, and our horse's health. If the stomach is inflamed and aggravated, then the immune response will become over active and will begin affecting other areas of our and our horse's health from allergies, COPD, ulcers, chronic joint and body soreness, etc.
I use the Total Support with the Adapt & Calm now that i'm past the first 90 days. Prior to that I used the Total Support, the Immune & Repair, and the Adapt & Calm. This has been an amazing journey for me and one that has been very eye opening and educational. I know some are tired of reading my story and seeing these results.....some assume i'm a dealer or work for the company, which I am not and do not.....I only hope that by sharing this information I can help others to not go through what I did and to help get our horses healthy from the inside out. There is a great deal of information from other folks and from Dr. Schell on www.secondvet.com as well. I encourage you to reat the Trusth & Transparency post as well, as it's very informative and IMO speaks volumes as to what kind of company this is. https://www.secondvet.com/index.php/kunena/equine/81-discussion-truth-transparency
Edited by Herbie 2015-10-28 10:10 AM
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 695
Location: Missouri | Try some animal element In the Zone Paste - it cost $20 a tube and you give it 45-minutes to an hour before you run or work and it will ease the nervousness. You give 20cc's for the average horse but can give a little more - it will NOT take the run out of one!
Great stuff - PM me for more info if you would like | |
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| coastal rider - 2015-10-28 1:49 AM At equine science society we had a paper presented saying 10 grams a day pure magnesium will reduce the fear response of a medium sized horse by about one third.
We use it all the time to calm horses and it works. Not a magic bullet but horses are noticably calmer. This is about 18 grams of magnesium oxide. You may recall the old milk of magnesia for tummy upset and maybe you will get some acid neutralization in the process. Your hays etc may simply be low magnesium.
I can guarantee you when he is getting worked up the acid is pouring into his stomach due to stress and or fear hormones. If his stomach is empty it will affect his gut big time. Maye feed little and often or use hay nets.
I also think you could feed two lbs of plain alfalfa cubes about one hour before your run and have a little mat to catch the acid that gets splashed up doing a run. LIke tums for the tummy. Alfalfa will truly directly buffer acid grass hay or cubes is neutral except for stimulating chewing and the bicarb in the saliva. I ma not syaing for sure he fears getting hurt but it can only help.
It will not blow his brains out nor sand bag him if he drinks some water to go with it.
This is a natural way to help him cope. He only needs to lug the water for 16-17 seconds so I think it is easy for him to handle .
Also, try using a lower sugar and starch diet for him , go with a fat and fiber concentrate with just a little sweet feed as a treat .
If his hind gut feels better he may be less anxious.
Just a suggestion, naturally check with your veterinarian to ensure no ulcers etc.
Also move up a little on concentrate at a show to give him more support since his heart rate is up there so high. He was also hauled which is like a mini endurance ride .
When his heart rate is up with worry and stress he is burning off muscle glycogen even though he is just standing there and could be getting a little run down over a two or three day meet.
I also suggest one teaspoon a day biochromium for muscle support and to relax him a bit.
That is what we do with the nervous thoroughbreds who wash out before a race especially the fillies.
THe rest may need a natural horsemanship trainer and vet support etc, may not be the answer , just trying to help you a bit.
Keep some omega threes in the diet and a cup a day milled flax will help with stomach function from my experience aside from the omega three fatty acid deal.
FYI
Good luck ,
Coastal Rider
I have a horse that used to buck during a run. I treated him for ulcers and keep him on daily supplements and also give him a small flake of alfalfa about an hour out. This has made a HUGE difference with him. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 2013
Location: Piedmont, OK | Animal Element In the Zone is excellent for anxiety. I have one that is extremely anxious and I give 10 cc before loading on the trailer to leave and then will give 20cc 1 1/2 to 2 hrs before our run. But with an anxious horse I try to keep them out of and away from the warm up pen until right before just to keep their nerves to a minimum. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 2236
Location: Sherman, TX | Herbie - 2015-10-28 10:03 AM
If he is having trouble breathing, one of two things is happening. Sometimes when a horse gets anxious and the heart rate increases, the soft palate will displace. You can initiate this during a scope by putting your hands over the horse's nostrils and see via scope if they displace due to the extra strain to breathe. If they are displacing, the question then becomes why, which leads me to the second part of why he may be having trouble breathing, even without displacement of the soft palate.....mucous/phlegm in the airways. Â
When a horse gets anxious or their heart rate increases, the airways likely constrict, which makes the air passages smaller. If there is mucous and phlegm in the airway, it constricts the airway even more and makes breathing difficult, hence the reason we often see horses cough during warm up only and then they are fine. They are clearing their airway of the mucous and phlegm so they can breathe.Â
I have dealt with an enormous amout of respiratory issues and anxiety issues due to the respiratory issues this year. My horse has always had mild breathing issues, allergies we'll call them, since he was sick as a yearling. He is now 5. I've been able to manage these issues with different supplements and keep him out of dusty situations as much as possible, which is difficult in Texas, but it was never bad enough to worry about. He ran on the track as a 3 YO drug free with no issues. Last winter as a 4 YO when we began seasoning him, his stress level increased, his breathing worsened, and we started going to vets. After 3 months, seeing 4 different vets, numorous medications at high doses, scopes, anti-biotics, nebulizers, supplements, steroids, etc, and over $5000 spent, I had a horse who was in complete respiratory distress on my hands. Last vet recommended to put him down, as we had exceeded all available treatment options.Â
Every single time we scoped him, which was 5 including the exercise scope, his soft palate was displaced. Question was why. The answer came later. This horse couldn't take a deep enough breath to cough and stood around panting taking short shallow breaths....heaving....even on 8 - 10 cc of Ventipulmin and Dex. He was pitiful. I began researching different things and a friend suggested 30 cc of French's mustard, which did help just enough to get him coughing a little bit and his nose to run. I began then researching what was in the mustard, which led me to turmeric, so I researched that, which led me to Curcurmin (http://www.curcuminforhealth.com/the-difference-between-turmeric-and-curcumin/). Then I took it a step further and educated myself on BCM-95 curcurmin (http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2007/10/report_curcumin/page-01), which led me to Dr. Schell and the Cur-OST product.
I visited with Dr. Schell for about 3 weeks and he explained to me in great detail and with great patience why no medications or therapies had been successful in treating this condition to this point. He explained to me why we were having soft palate displacement issues (due to the strain on the airways and lungs from the mucous and phlegm making the air passages smaller, as well as the glottis being vascular and heavy due to aggravation and mucous). He explained how stress and anxiety affects these issues as well due to the release of cortisol by the brain, which is also an inflammatory response, and can easily worsen an already fragile health situation. He and I emailed back and forth for about 3 weeks before I decided to try his product. I was so skeptical due to the fact that I have used almost every breathing supplement through the years on this horse and while they did help keep these issues manageable when he was healthy, he had been on them this entire time and had still gotten so sick, not to mention the fact that 4 vets hadn't been able to help. Dr. Schell asked that I give him 30 days on his product and to follow his specifications, and as a last resort I did just that. In 2 weeks I had a horse I was able to start exercising and that finally had a productive cough, and in 30 days I was back riding this horse and he was almost cough free. This was in March and i've been back to hauling this horse since June. His full story, along with others who have gone this route after seeing the changes it made in my horse, is on the Cur-OST thread on the product research forum.Â
Prior to starting this Cur-OST program, I removed my horse off of all supplements of any kind. No probiotics or prebiotics, no ulcer medicatiosn (which he'd been on for months during all of this to try to keep ulcers at bay....unsuccessfully), no joint supplements or additional breathing supplements. I took him off of all prescriptions medications as well. Clean slate. Feed, hay, cur-OST, and that's how he is today as well. I changed my diet to a whole grain (1 pound of whole oats once daily) alfalfa diet. No more processed feeds or supplements with synthetics in them anymore.Â
So many of us have no had such great success with this program, smokingirlie even had a horse who was on allergy shots due to an allergy panel she had done that showed she tested allergic to oats. Having discontinued her allergy shots and on the Cur-OST program, the same mare who was supposedly allergic to oats now eats oats twice daily without any problem.Â
It's hard to wrap one's mind around how the stomach and lower gut affects the immune system and all aspects of our, and our horse's health. If the stomach is inflamed and aggravated, then the immune response will become over active and will begin affecting other areas of our and our horse's health from allergies, COPD, ulcers, chronic joint and body soreness, etc.Â
I use the Total Support with the Adapt & Calm now that i'm past the first 90 days. Prior to that I used the Total Support, the Immune & Repair, and the Adapt & Calm. This has been an amazing journey for me and one that has been very eye opening and educational. I know some are tired of reading my story and seeing these results.....some assume i'm a dealer or work for the company, which I am not and do not.....I only hope that by sharing this information I can help others to not go through what I did and to help get our horses healthy from the inside out. There is a great deal of information from other folks and from Dr. Schell on www.secondvet.com as well. I encourage you to reat the Trusth & Transparency post as well, as it's very informative and IMO speaks volumes as to what kind of company this is. https://www.secondvet.com/index.php/kunena/equine/81-discussion-truth-transparency Â
You are feeding that much Magnesium everyday? Or just when running? Will it unbalance their diet if fed ever day? I have a horse that was rescued from being starved and beaten so probably has ulcers and has a lot of anxiety. He already gets alfalfa cubes as his hay source but does need something for anxiety while riding as he still fears being beaten I think.
Edited by newbie 2015-10-28 2:56 PM
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 I hate cooking and cleaning
Posts: 3310
Location: Jersey Girl | I have been giving my horse Vita Calm and it does wonders to get rid of his anxiety. He goes from a nudge that won't stand still on cross ties to standing still and relaxed. I haven't tried taking him to a race after a dose so I don't know if it will wash one out but he seemed no different when I did my dry work with him. | |
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 Schnoodle Lover
Posts: 2987
Location: **Cactus Country down in South Texas*** | For one of my horses I use a mix I make of doterra essential oils, I have it in a roller. Its all naturel, works wonders, and I swear by it. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 148
| Yes we did feed change and did help. Just looking for the last finished to settle him up | |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | I liked useing the B1 crumbles on this one gelding I use to run. | |
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I AM being nice
Posts: 4396
Location: MD | The Pozzi Relax paste doesn't work so well for anxiety as it does for one who merely gets "up". The Oxy-Zen works wonders for these sorts of horses. | |
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