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Expert
Posts: 1561
  
Location: North of where I want to be | I have ridden several male trained horses and several female trained horses and consistently I find myself having to soften up the ones that have been trained by men. I can say I have one exception and it was a gelding trained by a futurity trainer out of OH.
I have a gelding right now, that I LOVE but he has been almost a year into "reprogramming" to be a bit softer. He is a great gelding, who is bred to the sky and fast as all get out.
My questions are..
1.Have any other women riders experienced this and can you offer some advice?
2. How long do you give one that was " running and ready" before you accept that you bought a very expensive project horse and need to move on?
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 Expert
Posts: 1718
Location: Southeast Louisiana | I'd say, when you're looking at a horse to buy, go ride it and pick one that is trained the way you like. Same thing when you're looking at trainers. Go ride with them, or watch them work a few, and go with one who trains a softer mouth. I don't think it has so much to do with male or female and you might miss out on a good one by lumping everyone together like that.
If you don't get along with one, I wouldn't necessarily say it's just an expensive project horse. Just that you didn't click. You can always find someone whose riding style matches the horse's training. |
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 Saint Stacey
| We have one now that went through two top male trainers. He finally quit on the second one and came undone. But his owner was smart. She turned the horse out for a year. I picked him up in October know I g he was a rehab project. My daughter ended up running him at Odessa. He wasn't that far off on a run that was anything but pretty. We'll see how Denver goes.
I think our horse came back as quick as he did for two reasons. First, his owner saw how miserable the horse was and that he was hating his job. Her turning him out for a year had him in a good mental state when I got him. Second, he is very happy here and loves my daughter. Barrels are no longer work. Yes, he sees them almost everyday, but only at a walk. We've allowed him to be a horse. He's had a total personality change from when we got him.
If your horse is as nice as ours is, I would take the time and just kick him out in a pasture for 8-12 months. Then bring it back and figure out where you are. If your horse is hating its job, you will only make it worse by picking on it to soften and change. If youddon't get the mind right, the rest won't fall into place. JMHO. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| I don't think it's a woman vs. man trainer thing. It's more of a method/mind set thing. We had a filly at a woman trainer's and she almost ruined this filly. Sent her to a man and he never had a problem with her and we haven't either. The woman trainer had broke several horses for my sister that I really liked to ride but for some reason she and the filly did not work well together. The guy I sent her to does an excellent job with colts that have been messed up. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 331
Location: Loma Linda, CA | I use a male reining trainer and don't have any issues. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 926
| I agree with those that say it isn't really a man vs woman thing. I have had experience with a male trainer in the TX/OK area, and you'll get back the softest horse ever. However, I call his horses the 'point and kick' horses, cuz they are automatic. Not so good for some folks, but for me it's perfect. |
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Expert
Posts: 1561
Location: North of where I want to be | I guess I should have given a bit more back story.
The trainer I bought him from does not ride quite like I do. I have ridden several horses this trainer turns out and I know the issues that are usually there. I knew he needed a few issues addressed, I guess I just was not expecting the one I am dealing with.
I gave him a full 6 wks off then had him thoroughly vetted,chiro, feet & teeth. We all agreed another 4 1/2 months off, new saddle that fits, a d ring and slow work......LOTS of slow work.
We are now, 3 months into the slow work and a major mental block for him seems to remain......saddle related pain......I believe his bloodlines are just a touch on the fickle side....this boy is SMART!!
I have had horses trained by females who have the similar issues, but again I know the issues that come from this trainer....I am not throwing in the towel just yet.
Today was a good day though.... |
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 Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | I've seen women be just as rough as anyone, but IMO men are more likely to fall back on their strength than a woman. The #1 reason I picked the colt breaker I use is because he has a great feel for a horse and I knew I would be able to ride behind him just watching the way he handled a colt. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | KRJ1791 - 2016-01-17 1:30 PM I guess I should have given a bit more back story. The trainer I bought him from does not ride quite like I do. I have ridden several horses this trainer turns out and I know the issues that are usually there. I knew he needed a few issues addressed, I guess I just was not expecting the one I am dealing with. I gave him a full 6 wks off then had him thoroughly vetted,chiro, feet & teeth. We all agreed another 4 1/2 months off, new saddle that fits, a d ring and slow work......LOTS of slow work. We are now, 3 months into the slow work and a major mental block for him seems to remain......saddle related pain......I believe his bloodlines are just a touch on the fickle side....this boy is SMART!! I have had horses trained by females who have the similar issues, but again I know the issues that come from this trainer....I am not throwing in the towel just yet. Today was a good day though....
I would have a Chiro go over him to be sure that hes not out somewhere thats still causing pain.
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 509
| everyone's opinion of lightness isn't always the same and the degree of how broke the previous owner of my horse thinks I'm nuts I'm not running my horse..... I think he is nuts for running a horse lacking in the basics. I like fingertips he pulls just a difference in styles i don't mind putting in the time he likes to go down the road every week end |
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 Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | I don't think it is always a male/female thing but I have noticed horses being lighter when I used female instead of male trainers. Again not universal but I do think there may be something to it. |
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 Regular
Posts: 96
Location: Rocky Mountains | Ok totally out of what you want to hear but made me think of what happned?? So this new foreign guy started working at my current employment and a tried telling him about my training and he said and I quote" REALY!!!! I've NEVER seen a woman train a horse before!" All shocked and everything! Lol throughout the next week I realized this guy is a super blunt sexist manXD |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| KRJ1791 - 2016-01-17 7:44 AM
I have ridden several male trained horses and several female trained horses and consistently I find myself having to soften up the ones that have been trained by men. I can say I have one exception and it was a gelding trained by a futurity trainer out of OH.
I have a gelding right now, that I LOVE but he has been almost a year into "reprogramming" to be a bit softer. He is a great gelding, who is bred to the sky and fast as all get out.
My questions are..
1.Have any other women riders experienced this and can you offer some advice?
2. How long do you give one that was " running and ready" before you accept that you bought a very expensive project horse and need to move on?
My old barrel horse bought him when he was two, he was started by a man, and he turned out to be a man hater. I was 10 when we bought him he was 2. The guy saddled him up, he bucked, the guy got on him, he bucked. I got on him and we clicked. He is now 24 retired at 18, during that time my father could not catch him, nor load him in a horse trailer, my mom could, any female could. He just didn't like men.
I now have a 6 yr old who I bought as 30 days trail broke bad with farrier. Sent him to a male trainer, and the trainer and the horse had a mutual hate. The trainers helper also male could not get though to this horse, after 45 days he was a trail horse no buttons. He has been more challenging then others due to lack of knowledge, but he is completely safe with me. I used him at an auction mart the trainer was flabbergasted I dared use him at the auction as his experience with him at the auction was bad. It wasn't till he seen me push cows on him he believed me that he was safe. We even got into a bind where a cow cornered me and started headbunting him in the chest, instead of freaking out, he took the beating, and actually pushed the cow back into the alley.
Point of my long winded story is I do believe some horses do prefer certain genders as like people, I prefer working with mares.
As for how long would I spend on a horse to reprogram it. As long as it takes, but I like the challenge, not in a rush, and I don't only have one horse, I generally have one that is coming up I can have fun on.
If personalities clash, I have practically gave one away as I didn't like him, athletic as all can be, but no self confidence. I found someone who I thought would fit him and begged them to buy him. That individual was able to get though to him.
You will need to ask yourself what your goals are, your timeline, if you can financially afford to keep the horse, do you have another horse you can have fun on, do you have fun on this horse? Then decide for yourself what the best decision is for you. |
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| Similar to having bloodline or turning style preferences, I think everyone has preferences with how a horse is started. I'm really enjoying starting my cow bred/cutting started horse on the pattern, I will likely look for a similar bred and started prospect when my older gelding sells.
There are some rough trainers out there, and that's why at this time I prefer to buy prospects and sell horses working the pattern so I can work it on my own timeline vs trying to please a client with where they think a horse should be after 30 or 60 days. Some people are very reasonable and some are very unreasonable.
As for the softness issue, if everything vets out okay I have had extremely good luck with lunging in a surcingle and bungee training rig to let them figure out how to travel using their hind end and being soft. My gelding had a string of issues from chiro to saddle fit and then epm and this helped rebuild muscle evenly and work through his resistance issues. |
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Expert
Posts: 1561
Location: North of where I want to be | Tin Can, the trainer I bought this horse from & I are kind of on the same page as you. He goes down the road every weekend, I want the horse solid.
I like this gelding, A LOT. I like the challenge of fixing the small issues most of the time. The gelding & I seem to get a long pretty well which is why I bought him. The trainer liked him but was not getting along with him.
I am in the phase of my life after spending 2 yrs off dealing and recovering from a major riding accident, some issues are not tolerable.
I did just have him rechecked by vet & chiro to see if something was out of sorts.....nothing. My vet said the same thing I do...its a mental thing .....work him thru it.
Yesterday, we had major progress.
Thanks for all the input folks. |
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 Total Germophobe
Posts: 6443
Location: Montana | cheryl makofka - 2016-01-17 10:56 PM KRJ1791 - 2016-01-17 7:44 AM I have ridden several male trained horses and several female trained horses and consistently I find myself having to soften up the ones that have been trained by men. I can say I have one exception and it was a gelding trained by a futurity trainer out of OH.
I have a gelding right now, that I LOVE but he has been almost a year into "reprogramming" to be a bit softer. He is a great gelding, who is bred to the sky and fast as all get out.
My questions are..
1.Have any other women riders experienced this and can you offer some advice?
2. How long do you give one that was " running and ready" before you accept that you bought a very expensive project horse and need to move on?
My old barrel horse bought him when he was two, he was started by a man, and he turned out to be a man hater. I was 10 when we bought him he was 2. The guy saddled him up, he bucked, the guy got on him, he bucked. I got on him and we clicked. He is now 24 retired at 18, during that time my father could not catch him, nor load him in a horse trailer, my mom could, any female could. He just didn't like men. I now have a 6 yr old who I bought as 30 days trail broke bad with farrier. Sent him to a male trainer, and the trainer and the horse had a mutual hate. The trainers helper also male could not get though to this horse, after 45 days he was a trail horse no buttons. He has been more challenging then others due to lack of knowledge, but he is completely safe with me. I used him at an auction mart the trainer was flabbergasted I dared use him at the auction as his experience with him at the auction was bad. It wasn't till he seen me push cows on him he believed me that he was safe. We even got into a bind where a cow cornered me and started headbunting him in the chest, instead of freaking out, he took the beating, and actually pushed the cow back into the alley. Point of my long winded story is I do believe some horses do prefer certain genders as like people, I prefer working with mares. As for how long would I spend on a horse to reprogram it. As long as it takes, but I like the challenge, not in a rush, and I don't only have one horse, I generally have one that is coming up I can have fun on. If personalities clash, I have practically gave one away as I didn't like him, athletic as all can be, but no self confidence. I found someone who I thought would fit him and begged them to buy him. That individual was able to get though to him. You will need to ask yourself what your goals are, your timeline, if you can financially afford to keep the horse, do you have another horse you can have fun on, do you have fun on this horse? Then decide for yourself what the best decision is for you.
I completely agree with Cheryl on this. I had a gelding that I tried so hard to get along with, such a pretty horse and friendly horse, loved everyone, would let men or women ride him. However, he clicked with men. I ended up selling him to a guy who wanted to turn him into a rope horse, and you could tell from the moment that guy got on him, the horse was happy. I could ride him, it just wasn't as fun as it should have been. And I gave this horse several months before I sold him because I liked him a lot and he was nice and built well. He wasn't finished, but sometimes you just don't click. |
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 Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | Three 4 Luck - 2016-01-17 1:40 PM I've seen women be just as rough as anyone, but IMO men are more likely to fall back on their strength than a woman. The #1 reason I picked the colt breaker I use is because he has a great feel for a horse and I knew I would be able to ride behind him just watching the way he handled a colt.
I think the reason we take more note of the guys is simply bc there aren't as many. There are usually more women in any given area "training" barrel horses.
Yes guys are stronger. My husband tries his best to have soft horses, but the fact is he's just heavier handed than I am. So he thinks they're soft, and I get on them and complain about their hard mouths lol. Not that he snatches or jerks on them, he definitely doesn't. But he just pulls a little harder without realizing it. He likes to get them gentle, and then let me ride to get a nice feel on them.
My main man was trained start to finish by a man. He is the softest horse I've ever ridden. It just depends on the rider. |
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | Chasin97canz - 2016-01-17 11:34 PM Ok totally out of what you want to hear but made me think of what happned?? So this new foreign guy started working at my current employment and a tried telling him about my training and he said and I quote" REALY!!!! I've NEVER seen a woman train a horse before!" All shocked and everything! Lol throughout the next week I realized this guy is a super blunt sexist manXD
we had a Argentina guy come in that was exactly like that.lol.. and he was the roughest trainers I have witnessed. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 966
Location: Loco,Ok | A good horseman is a good horseman. Doesnt make a difference. If you cant read a horse. Think like one. Have patience and good deal of humor. Humility works well also. Good old hand told me once. That horse has been trained to death. Not tought a thing. |
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