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 Owner of a ratting catting machine
Posts: 2258
  
| Honestly, you need to get online and read about bleeders until your eyes are cracking and peeling.
Cross reference and reference everything until you have a solid understanding of the current research, medications, fitness programs, etc.
Don't just go off what everyone tells you, including vets, because every vet will give you a different answer. If the vet you're using told you what you currently believe about bleeders, omg stop, just stop.
Do make sure you go and do a BAL and check for infection, do a full scope to ensure you know where the blood came from, and during the scope, ensure that the veterinarian checks the flappers several different times to ensure they are fully functional.
Learn about the importance of maintaining the correct type of environmental conditions, and tricks and hacks for taking care of your bleeder. | |
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 To the Left
Posts: 1865
 
Location: Florida | I had a bleeder and I was told an old remedy. As you rest your horse start putting cremora on her feed. It will thicken her blood. Just a few tablespoons per feeding. It did work for me. But you really need to rest her for 3 months or more. Plus watch for respiratory proplems. Environmental problems can contribute. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 110
| Swannranch - 2016-09-26 2:43 PM Lasix does not last 12 hours. I can't believe a vet told you that. We have has 2nruns in a day over the years. If the second run was more than 6 hours out, we gave half a dose again at 4.5 hours. PER VET. If it was more than 8 hours out, give a full dose again. After the first run, totally rehydrate before the second run. Also we gave OTC Jug after the day was over, but I can't find it any more. We now give Animal Element In The Zone and she will drink a ton of water in a short time.Many horses need more than 5cc, but the sounds like it's possible that is not your issue. I would also look into some mineral supplements to HELP the Lasix, not eliminate it.
I was able to speak to a track vet and this is exactly what he told me!! So we are giving her time off again and fixing what I was doing wrong in my routine. I'm disappointed a vet gave me such incorrect information but at least I know and I can fix it! | |
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 Namesless in BHW
Posts: 10368
Location: At the race track with Ah Dee Ohs | stjelde - 2016-09-26 11:53 AM
The dose for lasix is 10cc 2-4 hours before you run, no water and no food. Never run twice and once you allow them to drink the lasix doesn't work.
I would give her a month off since she bled and do 10cc and no second run ever.
Just my opinion. I have 3 horses that bleed, I have had to give up double runs and do things quite different now, but they run hard for me and do very well and have had zero bleeding since :) Good luck!
I don't know anyone that gives 10cc of lasix. Our dose on the track is only 2cc IV 4 hours out. Pull hay and water. | |
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Miss Southern Sunshine
Posts: 7427
Location: South Central Florida | the I have known others that gave 8nand 10 cc's. I have never had to go over 5. But the horses I knew that gave high doses were 16+ hand massive muscled horses. They had been bleeding for many years with gradual increases in the doseage. Both horses ran into their late teens still winning Open rodeos and 1D times and both lived.long healthy lives. They had excellent care and fitness. So they can not be the only ones. I say see how this new program works, I do give b12 with the Lasix also, but I don't think that has anything to do with the bleeding outcome, just helps keep energy up with the loss of fluids. Good luck! | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 964
Location: Alberta, Canada | I was at a race a few weeks ago where first run was early in the morning (10am) and second run was late at night (I think my mare ran about 8pm). I had never run her twice in one day since I've had her on lasix so I called my vet between runs (we tipped first run so had to take second run to have a chance at the big added money). She told me because she had such a long wait between runs to let her drink and then top up with 2cc ONLY because I have my mare on a very strong electrolyte program. My mare holds on 4cc, 2hrs out and I actually ended up taking a chance and not topping up and she didnt bleed... but I also nebulize helichrysum oil the morning of a run. I ran her last weekend 3 days in a row with just the helichrysum oil and no lasix and she didnt bleed either. | |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 547
Location: Greencastle PA | I have been running on Lasix now for 2 years and no problem. Vet told me to give 3cc, 2hrs out. Good luck I hope you find the answer. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 226
| Interesting, I have spoke to a few different vets and have told me that the dose for lasix is 10cc. I find for me personally that 3 hours out works best, or I feel that they run the best.
I have heard a lot of people disagree with that and say 2cc or 5cc or 4cc or whatever the dose may be. I guess I went with 10cc becuase that is what I had read is the actual recommended dose for a bleeder and that is what the vets have told me. But you are right, I have heard many different doses.
This regiment seems to work for me and I haven't had a horse bleed out, I also only run once per day, twice per weekend at most, have 3 horses so I can rotate through them and they get plenty of time off between runs. And also picky at where I run them, make sure the runs count, added money, bigger barrel races, unless of course we need a tune up run or haven't ran in awhile.
Anyway, inteersting hearing everyones thoughts and dosages :)
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Miss Southern Sunshine
Posts: 7427
Location: South Central Florida | My take on dosages and time out to give it. It is going to be different for every horse. I have owned 2 Champions. One horse had what I call a sweet spot at 2.5 hours and 4 ccs. It was not a bad thing if we were off some, but if her run hit right in there, she was going to run harder, and probably win.
Second horse runs on 5cc, and has no sweet spot. I aim for 2.5 hours out but it doesn't really matter as long as it's over 1.5 hours. I would say for her going longer is better than having to run earlier.
Most fast horses that run on lasix, if they have a long running careear, their doseage will increase with time. Our current mare is 16 plus hands, weighs in the 1150 weight range when fit and started with 3 cc's.
Most vets start with the lowest possible dose with minor increases until the correct doseage is found. The only totally sure way to do that would be to scope the horse after every single run.
That's just not realistic for most people. In our area, there are not that many vets that even have the equipment, so besides the obvious financial issue, having a vet on hand with equipment to test after every run is a difficult if not impossible thing to do.
So we are left with truly knowing your horse and paying close attention to everything.
We scope a couple times a year and look for new blood, old blood or any other issues that might be going on. It is usually done 30 min after a run.
Although 10 cc's is not unheard of, I would probably not start with that doseage but that's just me. I prefer to start lower, pay attention and move up. I have read, but no idea for sure, that 10cc is the maximum safe doseage. So starting with that, kind of leaves no where to go but everyone, bets and trainers will have a different opinion on that.
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