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Location: my own little world | What do you all think about the new broodmare incentive program, Mare Power? |
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 Midget Lover
    
Location: Kentucky | I think there was a thread about this last week? You may want to do a search.
http://forums.barrelhorseworld.com/forum/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=439814&posts=10&mid=6855694&highlight=mare+power&highlightmode=1&action=search#M6855694
Edited by Murphy 2013-11-04 1:38 PM
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Location: Planet Earth.... | http://www.marepowerllc.com
Edited by ibsmokinfast 2013-12-04 2:25 PM
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  That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| I was actually thinking about it this morning. I wish this program the best, but ... |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9992
Location: Kansas | I think it's a great idea, boooooo to all the haters |
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Location: Planet Earth.... | hoofs_in_motion - 2013-12-04 2:14 PM I think it's a great idea, boooooo to all the haters
There are always haters. Saw they have another 5k for Ft Smith, something must be working. |
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Location: my own little world | Whiteboy - 2013-12-04 2:13 PM
I was actually thinking about it this morning. I wish this program the best, but ...
So, elaborate please... what are your thoughts? |
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| allaboutheart - 2013-12-04 2:52 PM Whiteboy - 2013-12-04 2:13 PM I was actually thinking about it this morning. I wish this program the best, but ... So, elaborate please... what are your thoughts?
I'm going to pay devils advocate here, and I will do my best to make it coherent. I dont want to discredit the work these people are putting into this program. However, by the numbers it is difficult to see the benefit. It takes a very long time for a program like this to be broad enough to cover enough events, to draw enough mare owners to make the program profitable enough to sustain itself. So there needs to be mare owners willing to continue to pay in for years without any benefit.
Before I go on I would like you to answer some questions for me:
1. What percentage of mares produce money earning offspring?
2. What is the average money earned by those money earning offspring in the barrel racing world? |
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 Bulls Eye
Posts: 6443
Location: Oklahoma | If you are in town for BFA, Mare Power LLC will have a booth there... she will be available to answer questions |
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 Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | I paid a few mares into it. I am keeping 3 foals out of these 3 mares and one filly is for sale and I have had interest in the program for prospective buyers for her. I paid the mares in, will pay my 3 "keepers" in and the sale filly. From there it depends if I keep paying the mares in or not. I waited on Future Fortunes and look how big it has gotten. I still don't think it would have paid for me because we don't breed enough mares to our stallion, only live cover, so it wasn't cost effective. |
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| These are just a few questions I would like a program to be able to answer. If it is a losing proposition it won't last. If it won't last why would I invest in it?
Here is my math.
The best producing stallions have about a 30% rate of money earners. We will assume that nice mares would be similar to that production rate. Then we will take DTF's average money earned per money earner at $10,000.
So if a mare has 10 foals 3 might be successful enough to garner $10,000 each. (this is being very generous and assuming all mare are great producers)
3 X 10,000 = $30,000
This program would have to match 35% (or $5.7 million)of all futurity money paid in the united states(I would bet for at least the first several years it would be difficult to match 1%), resulting in $10,500 available, the owner of the mare who must also be the breeder to receive the 30% payback of $3,150.
The mare owners cost of 15 years in the program of $1500 and 10 foals nominated at $150 each = another $1,500. Total cost to mare owner is $3,000.
Total income available to mare owner of the 3 $10,000 earners is $3,150 total less your costs of $3,000 means you pocket $150.
So if every mare was a top producing mare, and only entered races that every dollar was matched by at least $.35 then it would at least break even.
The only thing unaccounted for is if you are the owner of the nominated foal also, but most breeders breed to sell.
Edited by Whiteboy 2013-12-04 4:42 PM
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| Which means they only need 22,725 mares enrolled. Oh... give it few years, it should take off....right? |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | Whiteboy - 2013-12-04 3:35 PM These are just a few questions I would like a program to be able to answer. If it is a losing proposition it won't last. If it won't last why would I invest in it?
Here is my math.
The best producing stallions have about a 30% rate of money earners. We will assume that nice mares would be similar to that production rate. Then we will take DTF's average money earned per money earner at $10,000.
So if a mare has 10 foals 3 might be successful enough to garner $10,000 each. (this is being very generous and assuming all mare are great producers)
3 X 10,000 = $30,000
This program would have to match 35% of all futurity money paid in the united states(I would bet for at least the first several years it would be difficult to match 1%), resulting in $10,500 available, the owner of the mare who must also be the breeder to receive the 30% payback of $3,150.
The mare owners cost of 15 years in the program of $1500 and 10 foals nominated at $150 each = another $1,500. Total cost to mare owner is $3,000.
Total income available to mare owner of the 3 $10,000 earners is $3,150 total less your costs of $3,000 means you pocket $150.
So if every mare was a top producing mare, and only entered races that every dollar was matched by at least $.35 then it would at least break even.
The only thing unaccounted for is if you are the owner of the nominated foal also, but most breeders breed to sell.
This is the reason I wanted to try it for my 3. The owners of these mares previous foals are also going to nominate (although that won't help me out much).
I was a little lost on your % matched at the barrel races that will offer Mare Power monies. Won't the fees paid in to nominate mares and foals go towards pay out? |
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 Shipwrecked and Flat Out Zapped
Posts: 16390
Location: DUMPING CATS AND PIGS IN TEXAS :) | Whiteboy - 2013-12-04 4:35 PM These are just a few questions I would like a program to be able to answer. If it is a losing proposition it won't last. If it won't last why would I invest in it?
Here is my math.
The best producing stallions have about a 30% rate of money earners. We will assume that nice mares would be similar to that production rate. Then we will take DTF's average money earned per money earner at $10,000.
So if a mare has 10 foals 3 might be successful enough to garner $10,000 each. (this is being very generous and assuming all mare are great producers)
3 X 10,000 = $30,000
This program would have to match 35% (or $5.7 million)of all futurity money paid in the united states(I would bet for at least the first several years it would be difficult to match 1%), resulting in $10,500 available, the owner of the mare who must also be the breeder to receive the 30% payback of $3,150.
The mare owners cost of 15 years in the program of $1500 and 10 foals nominated at $150 each = another $1,500. Total cost to mare owner is $3,000.
Total income available to mare owner of the 3 $10,000 earners is $3,150 total less your costs of $3,000 means you pocket $150.
So if every mare was a top producing mare, and only entered races that every dollar was matched by at least $.35 then it would at least break even.
The only thing unaccounted for is if you are the owner of the nominated foal also, but most breeders breed to sell.
I'm with Whiteboy for now. It isn't a proven program yet and too risky of an investment currently, imo. |
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Expert
Posts: 1561
| Sounds like some like to play politics...Keep saying it wont happen or work and stick with the status quo.
Ron Paul...  |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | There is something on the website that if it doesn't work, you will be refunded, less interest (so they may make a little dough off my nominations in the meantime).
I will get money (if I am lucky and one wins some ) for being the breeder and mare owner on all the ones I have people paying their foals in.Who gets paid? 70% to MP owner of nominated foal (on registration papers) 20% to MP Dam owner (registered) 10% to MP Breeder (listed on the registration papers)
Edited by wyoming barrel racer 2013-12-04 5:03 PM
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| You have to assume that all the money a horse wins, will also make the 35% from mp. to be profitable.
yes the nomination money is what the payout would come from in additon to any donations they can get. Less their administrative cost, which i'm sure they will keep minimal. But they still need enough mares re-nominating and nominating at least 1 foal each year. Like I say they need lots of mares to make it beneficial to the breeder.
Also I'm not trying to discredit this program. Only, hoping they can modify it to better benefit the breeder. My suggestion is to swap the payout so the mare owner & breeder get something like 80% and the foal owner get 20%, that would help alot. That change would only require a match of 13% of winnings and only require about 8500 mares.
Edited by Whiteboy 2013-12-04 5:10 PM
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| wyoming barrel racer - 2013-12-04 5:01 PM There is something on the website that if it doesn't work, you will be refunded, less interest (so they may make a little dough off my nominations in the meantime).
I will get money (if I am lucky and one wins some ) for being the breeder and mare owner on all the ones I have people paying their foals in.
Who gets paid?
70% to MP owner of nominated foal (on registration papers)
20% to MP Dam owner (registered)
10% to MP Breeder (listed on the registration papers)
It will help you by having the foal owners pay their own nomination for sure. But if you ran your own horses also, then it would be even better for you. |
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 Saint Stacey
| I seem to remember a few years ago when someone had this really dumb idea of a new incentive program that many said would never work because of the limited number of stallions that could enroll. You might have heard if it? It's called Future Fortunes.... |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | Whiteboy - 2013-12-04 4:08 PM
wyoming barrel racer - 2013-12-04 5:01 PM There is something on the website that if it doesn't work, you will be refunded, less interest (so they may make a little dough off my nominations in the meantime).
I will get money (if I am lucky and one wins some ) for being the breeder and mare owner on all the ones I have people paying their foals in.
Who gets paid?
70% to MP owner of nominated foal (on registration papers)
20% to MP Dam owner (registered)
10% to MP Breeder (listed on the registration papers)
You have a lot of good points. And yes, the decision to nominate mares was because I have the 3 I plan to run myself. A 3yr, 2yr and yearling. Of course all have to be out of different mares. |
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