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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1118
 
Location: The South | I will admit, I do not know enough about hooves and angles and horse shoes in general. Please help me learn! Our farrier is 70 something years old and seems very knowledgeable, but I want to learn more so I can make sure I'm doing right by my horses. Is there a book you would recommend? Now about my horse...early this summer his toes were getting way too long and his heels were too low and it strained the tendons in his front legs. We had a talk about it and the farrier said he's going to work on it but my horse doesn't grow hardly any heel.
I took some pictures so hopefully someone that knows about this stuff can say if they look decent or not. If not, what would you change? What do I need to ask the farrier to do differently?
He got shoes this Wednesday and I took these pictures today (Saturday). Let me know if I need to take different pictures. Front left:  Rear left:  Rear right:  Front right: 
Edited by LindsayJordan84 2013-12-14 6:06 PM
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 "Drank the Kool Aid"
Posts: 5496
 
Location: Iowa, LA | Best money I ever invested was Pete Ramey's book and Under The Horse Videos. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1118
Location: The South | annemarea - 2013-12-14 6:57 PM Best money I ever invested was Pete Ramey's book and Under The Horse Videos.
Thank you so much! I'm headed over to Amazon right now!
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 It Goes On
Posts: 2262
Location: Muskogee, OK | annemarea - 2013-12-14 6:57 PM Best money I ever invested was Pete Ramey's book and Under The Horse Videos.
Do you have his newer book? I have the old (thin, black and white) book. Wondering if the newer, 300+ page one is worth the money. Seems to go a lot more in depth? |
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"Drank the Kool Aid"
Posts: 5496
Location: Iowa, LA | barrelracingchick16 - 2013-12-14 8:07 PM annemarea - 2013-12-14 6:57 PM Best money I ever invested was Pete Ramey's book and Under The Horse Videos. Do you have his newer book? I have the old (thin, black and white) book. Wondering if the newer, 300+ page one is worth the money. Seems to go a lot more in depth?
Yes. I actually bought the new book first. It has lots of great info...not just about feet, but everything that can affect the feet, also. It was a little difficult for me to read, but afterwards I bought the DVDs and those really made everything come together for me! I'll never look at feet the same after being what I've been through. |
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  Potato Soup Queen
Location: Alabama | That second to the last photo you posted, is that a nail up that high (last nail) OMG if it is it's a little too high and I have plenty of other things to say too...LOL
Go to www.hopeforsoundness.com and purchase the DVD's off of Gene's site...easy to watch and understand. He has one on trimming and on shoeing. It teaches you a lot about hoof mechanism, which, once you understand that, you understand why.
Your horse has too much heel in these photos so I'm not sure why he says your horse has no heel...it does grow forward, but, most farrier work done in this fashion produces the same result. He's not trimming the feet down to live sole first of all and no matter what I say he needs to do (or what I would do to fix it) he's not going to understand it, nor will he do it. Let's be honest...if he could see what I see, he'd already know how to fix it or he'd know not to do it in the first place. Toes are too long also, but, again, trying to tell you what to tell him to correct it, will not work. I imagine when your horse is due for a shoeing, the heels are starting to curl under themselves...next time he pulls the shoes ask to look at the heels before he trims any off to see what I'm talking about. |
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 Double Standards Don't Fly
Posts: 1283
Location: At the barn | Long toes and underrun heels. |
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 Northern Chocolate Queen
Posts: 16576
Location: ND | Farrierlady - 2013-12-14 11:04 PM That second to the last photo you posted, is that a nail up that high (last nail) OMG if it is it's a little too high and I have plenty of other things to say too...LOL
Go to www.hopeforsoundness.com and purchase the DVD's off of Gene's site...easy to watch and understand. He has one on trimming and on shoeing. It teaches you a lot about hoof mechanism, which, once you understand that, you understand why.
Your horse has too much heel in these photos so I'm not sure why he says your horse has no heel...it does grow forward, but, most farrier work done in this fashion produces the same result. He's not trimming the feet down to live sole first of all and no matter what I say he needs to do (or what I would do to fix it) he's not going to understand it, nor will he do it. Let's be honest...if he could see what I see, he'd already know how to fix it or he'd know not to do it in the first place. Toes are too long also, but, again, trying to tell you what to tell him to correct it, will not work. I imagine when your horse is due for a shoeing, the heels are starting to curl under themselves...next time he pulls the shoes ask to look at the heels before he trims any off to see what I'm talking about.
Yep, exactly what FarrierLady said. Your farrier is 70+ years old, you are not going to change him or make him understand what needs to be done when he's probably been shoeing this way forever. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1526
Location: Texas | Long toes, to much heel and the she isn't shaped right. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1118
Location: The South | annemarea - 2013-12-14 10:04 PM barrelracingchick16 - 2013-12-14 8:07 PM annemarea - 2013-12-14 6:57 PM Best money I ever invested was Pete Ramey's book and Under The Horse Videos. Do you have his newer book? I have the old (thin, black and white) book. Wondering if the newer, 300+ page one is worth the money. Seems to go a lot more in depth?
What is the name of the book? I looked his name up on Amazon but he had a few different ones, which one is your favorite and I'll start with that one. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1118
Location: The South | Farrierlady - 2013-12-15 12:04 AM That second to the last photo you posted, is that a nail up that high (last nail) OMG if it is it's a little too high and I have plenty of other things to say too...LOL
Go to www.hopeforsoundness.com and purchase the DVD's off of Gene's site...easy to watch and understand. He has one on trimming and on shoeing. It teaches you a lot about hoof mechanism, which, once you understand that, you understand why.
Your horse has too much heel in these photos so I'm not sure why he says your horse has no heel...it does grow forward, but, most farrier work done in this fashion produces the same result. He's not trimming the feet down to live sole first of all and no matter what I say he needs to do (or what I would do to fix it) he's not going to understand it, nor will he do it. Let's be honest...if he could see what I see, he'd already know how to fix it or he'd know not to do it in the first place. Toes are too long also, but, again, trying to tell you what to tell him to correct it, will not work. I imagine when your horse is due for a shoeing, the heels are starting to curl under themselves...next time he pulls the shoes ask to look at the heels before he trims any off to see what I'm talking about.
Thank you so much Farrierlady!
I'm not for sure which spot you're talking about that might be a nail, but if it's the spot I'm looking at it's just dirt or grass. His hooves were covered in mud so I sprayed them off and led him up to the house, I didn't think about bringing a brush with me.
I am determined to educate myself so I can know what I need from a farrier. Ours is a personal friend so it will be hard to quit using him, but it's necessary for the health of my horses so it has to be done. I just hope I can find a knowledgeable one to replace him, I think good farriers are hard to find around here.
I wish Alabama wasn't so far away, I could ask you to shoe my boys for me. I think I've known deep down that our farrier wasn't the best since I was in college, but I wasn't in the position to do anything about it. Now they are under my care, at my house, and I'm ready to take charge! I don't even know what a proper shoed hoof should look like, it's ridiculous. I was shocked to read that he has too much heel, because when he went lame this summer the vet said his heels were too low. So he talked with our farrier and he said he hasn't been trimming any heel off of him since then. Sheesh I have so much to learn.
Thank you all so much for helping me, I really appreciate it! I promise this isn't like those conformation threads where the owner gets all butt hurt when someone points out something that's wrong. I've had a suspicion that things weren't where they should be and y'all helped confirm that. I need education and I'm determined to work on that. I'm going shopping online to get the books and DVD's y'all suggested, I'm excited to learn and not be intimidated by this any longer.
Thank you! |
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Northern Chocolate Queen
Posts: 16576
Location: ND | I'm pretty sure this is the nail FL is asking about.....
A lot of people will look at the picture of your horses foot & say he has no heel. That is simple lack of education as he truly has way to much heel & it's crushed under/underrun. The heel should be trimmed back to the widest part of the frog.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1118
Location: The South | SaraJean - 2013-12-15 11:36 AM I'm pretty sure this is the nail FL is asking about.....
A lot of people will look at the picture of your horses foot & say he has no heel. That is simple lack of education as he truly has way to much heel & it's crushed under/underrun. The heel should be trimmed back to the widest part of the frog.
That is the spot I was thinking she might be looking at too, thanks Sara! Yea it's just crud I should've brushed off before I took the picture.
I am kicking myself for not learning about all of this sooner, but I'm going to be like a sponge from now on!
Thanks for helping a fellow shooter out  |
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Northern Chocolate Queen
Posts: 16576
Location: ND | LindsayJordan84 - 2013-12-15 11:25 AM
SaraJean - 2013-12-15 11:36 AM I'm pretty sure this is the nail FL is asking about.....
A lot of people will look at the picture of your horses foot & say he has no heel. That is simple lack of education as he truly has way to much heel & it's crushed under/underrun. The heel should be trimmed back to the widest part of the frog.
That is the spot I was thinking she might be looking at too, thanks Sara! Yea it's just crud I should've brushed off before I took the picture.
I am kicking myself for not learning about all of this sooner, but I'm going to be like a sponge from now on!
Thanks for helping a fellow shooter out
I was really thinking it looked like a nail too.
Very few people know what they should when it comes to hoof care. I learned when I could no longer keep my good all around horse sound. Sadly, had I decided to learn sooner he'd probably still be competing instead of retired.
Gotta stick together.....shooters are family! |
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Member
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| You cant critique a farriers work just by looking at a medial/lateral view of the hoof with a shoe on. The only way to judge shoe fit is from a solar view with the shoe off. If you are worried about your farriers work and are not confident in him you should probably consider finding a new one. An experienced farrier will instill confidence in you as soon as he pulls up. |
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Member
Posts: 6
| You cant critique a farriers work just by looking at a medial/lateral view of the hoof with a shoe on. The only way to judge shoe fit is from a solar view with the shoe off. If you are worried about your farriers work and are not confident in him you should probably consider finding a new one. An experienced farrier will instill confidence in you as soon as he pulls up. |
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Member
Posts: 6
| You cant critique a farriers work just by looking at a medial/lateral view of the hoof with a shoe on. The only way to judge shoe fit is from a solar view with the shoe off. If you are worried about your farriers work and are not confident in him you should probably consider finding a new one. An experienced farrier will instill confidence in you as soon as he pulls up. |
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Member
Posts: 6
| You cant critique a farriers work just by looking at a medial/lateral view of the hoof with a shoe on. The only way to judge shoe fit is from a solar view with the shoe off. If you are worried about your farriers work and are not confident in him you should probably consider finding a new one. An experienced farrier will instill confidence in you as soon as he pulls up. |
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Potato Soup Queen
Location: Alabama | ^^^ I can, and do it all the time |
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"Drank the Kool Aid"
Posts: 5496
Location: Iowa, LA | My farrier would always say my horses weren't growing any heel! LOL That was incorrect! They were growing heel but it was folded under so it appeared to not be growing. Once you learn about feet it will all make sense! I'm on my phone or I would mark up some before and after shots of my guy so you can see what we mean. His heels were long and LOW so it appeared as though he had no heel. But an educated eye can see that. Farrier Lady knows her stuff! If I think about it tomorrow, I'll upload some pics to show you what we mean. I'm at work until 6 am!
On the book of Pete Ramey's, it's the only one that's currently in print, I believe. It's called Care And Rehibilitation of The Equine Foot.
Here is a link:
http://www.hoofrehabstore.com/care-and-rehab-of-the-equine-foot/ |
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