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 Uh....never mind
Posts: 2696
   
Location: Midwest Farmer's Daughter: Central Illinois | AAAHHHHH!
Okay, that's a little better. This is really a vent more than anything but helpful hints are always appreciated & taken into consideration.
My boss is a micro-manager. She works from home so the disconnect from the office helps & hurts different situations. My co-worker & I are 100% capable of doing our jobs (running the office) without interference, & we are a great team, but my boss is constantly trying to 'help'. This 'help' is rarely as helpful as she seems to think it is; usually it makes things either more difficult for us &/or makes more work in the long run as well as adding more stress. She has a 'panic' mode that she goes into when one of us is going to be out of the office for any reason, as if we are not going to be able to function properly or things aren't going to get done. We get bombarded with emails & calls about who is going to be handling what & how & when, etc. etc. etc. Overplanning isn't a complaint I usually have in regular life but it gets old after one day of PTO means a conference call about who can manage what for that 8 hours someone is going to be gone. She is also quick to jump to conclusions & not find out our side of a story if any of the other departments talk to her about an 'issue'.
I have noticed that her "WFH" schedule can be questionable. The company policy is that WFH people should not allow home life - ie: children - become a work hinderance. She will let us know when something comes up with taking her daughter to a doctor or the babysitter or whatever else, which is fine, those things happen & are completely acceptable. BUT there are times where we don't get a response from her for a few hours, or we will call her for something & hear her daughter in the background (when she is supposed to be at daycare, not at home)...& then as soon as she's available again we are bombarded with emails, phone calls, requests, follow-ups, etc. It's very apparant that she is turning the focus back to us because she was not available when she was supposed to be or had her daughter at home when she was supposed to be working.
I have worked for manipulators, womanizers, chauvenists & a$$-kissers over the years at different jobs. My mom says that I will never move up the ladder because I resist the lemming mentality. I cannot blindly follow orders without looking for a better way to do things, or asking why things are done a certain way or why things have to be done period, so I would have never made it in the military. When I ask why, or have a complaint, it is generally answered with something along the lines of "because so&so needs it/wants it", not a reason why.
One instance: our timesheet checklist included adding up OT hours for hourly employees. This didn't make sense to me, since payroll is done through a software that has the ability to seperate hours on its own, so one time I didn't add up the hours. Turns out the financial manager who requested these hours be done had to have them to manually change the pay rate because she didn't know how to tell the software how to do it on its own. I got a big lecture on what 'priorities' means & how I caused the FM extra work because I didn't send her the hours & how lucky we were that she caught it before she submitted payroll. After all of that my take is that the FM, being the payroll software 'expert', should know how to tell the program to automatically calculate OT pay instead of making other people do more work because she's incompetent. That is something my boss wouldn't DREAM of bringing up in a supervisor meeting; to her, I should just do the extra work to make things flow smoothly for everyone else.
Another instance that will forever bother me: she called a meeting with our team & brought it up that we, as a team, had used the most PTO of any group in the company that year & it had been noticed. We all just stared at her, we couldn't believe we were being 'talked to' about using our EARNED, APPROVED PTO. What had NOT been taken into consideration is that we are the ONLY group who is paid HOURLY so if we didn't use PTO on vacation or sick time, we didn't get paid. Every other position in the company is salaried, so they can work as many hours as they want, any day they want, & still get paid the same whether they use PTO or not. They are also allowed comp time, which we are not. So instead of thinking about that & going to bat for us in the first place, she just automatically turned around & slammed us with a BIG HR no-no.
Sigh. I am a blunt person, I have a very thin filter & my mouth gets me in trouble a LOT. I have a hard time vocalizing my thoughts without offending people in situations like this. Review time is coming up & I know I'll get dinged for things that make me want to bang my head against a wall. Last year my review was average but my raise was on the extremely low end of the company median. This year I've taken on more work, more difficult work, more work outside my comfort zone & I have a sinking feeling that she'll find more things to be unhappy about just because it's easier than saying 'good job' & going on.
Long live corporate America, where we don't want to hurt feelings or step on toes unless it's someone who gets paid less than you. Then it's fine to hand off work & skip along your way. Thanks for the vent space. Back to the grind.
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 Midget Lover
 
Location: Kentucky | Two things:
1.) The work from home thing is killer. People who do so usually do it for their own benefit and those stuck in the office take on the extra work load. Then the WFO people also feel disconnected and tend to "bother" those at the office just to feel some type of human connection.
2.) I would call HR and discuss with them about her behavior. | |
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| Corp. America is and always will be a giant run around with a lot of dead weight. My best advice is to learn to let go. That is a hard concept coming from a minor control freak but I have learned to stick to my cube and just plug my time and leave it all when I go home. I absolutely would use my PTO! It is accrude time that is yours and I would check your policy about paying it out upon quiting/firing, if they don't pay it out I wouldn't just let it sit there or if it disappears after so long of not beign used. I would take a good long look and see if you want to do what it takes to move up in that type of organization or if you should keep an eye on the job market and look for a better fit. | |
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 Balance Beam and more...
Posts: 11493
Location: 31 lengths farms | OMG, do we work in the same office??? LOL!!!
I got a "concerned" email about my absence 1 day. I had texted from the emergency room to my x-boss who got demoted to Salesmen and my co-worker who is a delivery driver part time desk help at my work to tell them I wouldn't be in the next day, my mom had had a stroke. Didn't call because it was 12:30 AM. I get a paniced call the next morning at 8:30 because I wasn't in yet, told the what had happened etc. Was not made to feel like I was okay in missing anymore than that day, got to work the next day to an email basically stating the same. One of those "IF you are going to be missing anymore time.."type emails. This from a man that regularly didnt' check in for months at a time when he was the Manager, I do mean months. We are understaffed at our division so if my co-worker or I are missing for a few days it can get hectic for sure, I don't deny that at all but in this case it couldn't really be helped. And we have had the same PTO discussion too...taking too much time off. Too much time off only because we are severely understaffed in the first place which is Corporates choice also, and we've already earned it. | |
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Uh....never mind
Posts: 2696
Location: Midwest Farmer's Daughter: Central Illinois | Murphy - 2014-01-08 11:42 AM Two things:
1.) The work from home thing is killer. People who do so usually do it for their own benefit and those stuck in the office take on the extra work load. Then the WFO people also feel disconnected and tend to "bother" those at the office just to feel some type of human connection.
2.) I would call HR and discuss with them about her behavior. Thanks Murphy. I agree that full-time WFH is a racket & we all know it. Part-time, flex-schedule WFH is the only thing that actually works. And as for the 'bothering' people in the office - her social life WAS the office when she worked out of here & now she has zero people to talk to except her in-laws, so we can just keep adding to the chit-pile there.
I work for a small company, & have been burned by HR in past positions, so HR is tippy-toes to me. For the last two years we've been working with an outside HR firm who has audited our policies & procedures, so I would feel safer talking to a rep there than the PT HR person who actually works directly for my company. I don't really know how to go about it though, as her management & personality style is really the problem & she doesn't actually do anything wrong, per se. The other departments I work with, mainly finance, also have major issues with managerial 'styles' or lack thereof. In the overall scheme of things it's because we went from a good ol' boy small company to a corporate-style in the matter of a few years. Growing pains & the 'old' way of doing things aren't meshing well. Low-productivity is frowned upon but not really addressed , unless you're me & you didn't answer an email re: a credit card statement one time. (Seriously, I got an official verbal warning for not answering an email.) As long as people seem to be working hard, even if they're causing triple work & then pushing it off onto someone else, they're rewarded.
Do we have any HR people on here who have suggestions as to how to handle any of this? Or maybe I'm just being whiny. I don't know. I have major cabin fever that has me more on edge than usual.
Edited by RLB 2014-01-08 12:03 PM
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 Dog Resuce Agent
Posts: 3459
Location: southeast Texas | Blunt observation here. You know how your boss is. And yes, if someone is going to be absent for what ever reason, their work should be done before they leave or an action plan on how it will be covered. You boss has other people that they have to report to. When they ask these questions, they expect answers. And when your boss doesn't have an answer, it reflects poorly on your boss.
It all boils down to doing your job so your boss has confidence in their team.
As far as the OT issue. It was asked of you to report this way. It becomes part of your job. Not eyeballing someone else's incompetence.
Having a more positive cheerful presence is a must in the workplace to survive. Getting work done in a timely manner and not having negative feedback comming in from other departments will go along way to getting that larger pay raise | |
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Uh....never mind
Posts: 2696
Location: Midwest Farmer's Daughter: Central Illinois | roxieannie - 2014-01-08 12:02 PM Blunt observation here. You know how your boss is. And yes, if someone is going to be absent for what ever reason, their work should be done before they leave or an action plan on how it will be covered. You boss has other people that they have to report to. When they ask these questions, they expect answers. And when your boss doesn't have an answer, it reflects poorly on your boss.
It all boils down to doing your job so your boss has confidence in their team.
As far as the OT issue. It was asked of you to report this way. It becomes part of your job. Not eyeballing someone else's incompetence.
Having a more positive cheerful presence is a must in the workplace to survive. Getting work done in a timely manner and not having negative feedback comming in from other departments will go along way to getting that larger pay raise
Thank you for the objective viewpoint. You are 100% correct in all of your observations.
All of my reviews are sparkling in the "has a can-do, positive attitude" department, so it's hard for me to accept it when I get dinged for things that aren't important to me. But, they're important to someone else for whatever reason, so I have to find a way for them to be important to me as well, I suppose.
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Midget Lover
Location: Kentucky | I'm in HR in corporate America, but I'm on the recruiting side of things. There must be someone you can go to. I'd go to the top, maybe the Director or VP of HR. | |
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Uh....never mind
Posts: 2696
Location: Midwest Farmer's Daughter: Central Illinois | Murphy - 2014-01-08 12:09 PM I'm in HR in corporate America, but I'm on the recruiting side of things. There must be someone you can go to. I'd go to the top, maybe the Director or VP of HR.
What would you suggest are HR issues vs. my personal complaints? I have a hard time putting issues on one side or the other. For instance, her management style is annoying but is it really an HR issue?
The reprimand about our PTO was this time last year & was handled later in upper management so shouldn't happen again & therefore a moot point, I was just using it as an example of what she does in those types of situations.
I am checking with HR to see if I can submit a review on her, for the sake of constructive criticism, without her knowing. I don't want to hurt her feelings & I don't want the possibility of backlash, intentional or not.
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Midget Lover
Location: Kentucky | RLB - 2014-01-08 1:21 PM Murphy - 2014-01-08 12:09 PM I'm in HR in corporate America, but I'm on the recruiting side of things. There must be someone you can go to. I'd go to the top, maybe the Director or VP of HR. What would you suggest are HR issues vs. my personal complaints? I have a hard time putting issues on one side or the other. For instance, her management style is annoying but is it really an HR issue?
The reprimand about our PTO was this time last year & was handled later in upper management so shouldn't happen again & therefore a moot point, I was just using it as an example of what she does in those types of situations.
I am checking with HR to see if I can submit a review on her, for the sake of constructive criticism, without her knowing. I don't want to hurt her feelings & I don't want the possibility of backlash, intentional or not.
This is exactly what you need to do. If it's a hostile work environment, hindering your work, or there are WFO issues, then that's exactly what HR is there for. | |
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 Firecracker Dog Lover
Posts: 3175
| I just completed an all day training for staff on how to manage conflict. Schedule a face to face meeting with your supervisor and ask her questions that make her think about how she is handling the situation. For instance, "I feel like the office is smooth but I get the feeling you do not feel the same given the amount of contact from home we receive. What can I do to assure you that we are meeting our deadlines and completing our assigned tasks?" :) Good luck. | |
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Queen Bean of Ponyland
Posts: 24953
Location: WYOMING | In my 20 yr management career I was a hands off style... BUT... eventually had to change to more of a micromanager due to most people NOT performing to the level needed... then it was my arse on the line as to why things werent handled. So it effected everyone on my team even those that did get their work handled. I was getting paid to ensure things were done and to a certain level and the hands off style wasnt cutting it. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 618
Location: At home with the rents, somewhere in Indiana | RLB - I read the headline and instantly knew that this was your post! lol | |
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Dog Resuce Agent
Posts: 3459
Location: southeast Texas | At work, a project was dumped in my lap. I stepped up to the plate, owned the job. A new boss came in. COMPLETLY changed around the way I was copeing with it. Made less work for me. He, being younger was making snide comments on my work, how things weren't followed thru. The second time with this type of comment, I took him aside. Asked him what it was that I wasn't completing. I wasn't a mind reader (my way of being snotty) any how, we got it sorted out, now I know what he expects, I get my Monthly work orders and structure my work to be completed by the end of the month. And my monthly reports are structured the way he needs them for his meetings with his higher ups.
He leaves me alone because I have saved his butt on audits.
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 Ima Fickle Fan
Posts: 3547
Location: Texas | I also work for a micromanager. I think mine truly believes she is helping, when she's really just a pain in the arse.
Here is what I do to cope:
- I try to head her off before she does one of her micromanaging stunts. For example, we have flex time in our office. At the end of each month, we either have to put in any out-of-office time as sick, vacation, or comp time. If we do comp time, we have to send her an email stating as such. So before she can send the lovely helpful reminder to each of us, I beat her to the punch.
- Take her with a grain of salt. If you recognize her for what she is, the reality is that others do as well.
- I do my job to the best of my ability and plot my escape to another position. I know I won't be here forever, so I just try to keep that in mind when I deal with her.
To me, what are you going to tell HR if you go and complain? Will it come off as valid points or will it sound like whining? If it is valid, then heck yes, go talk to them. But if it's just annoying behavior, it won't look good on you. If you can prove that she is abusing the WFH situation, go to HR with proof. If the WFH is causing her to be an ineffective manager, that is more valid.
Her WFH has probably made her wose as a a micromanager. She doesn't know what you are doing all day. And when we don't know something, it's human nature to assume the worst.
In the future when taking a day off, email her ahead of time about the plan for making sure things are taken care of. Cut her off before her annoying managing style can surface. Kill her with kindness, bombard her with details, and keep her in the loop. If you are always ahead of her and letting her know about things before she can ask, it helps dealing with that type of manager.
Good luck. | |
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Uh....never mind
Posts: 2696
Location: Midwest Farmer's Daughter: Central Illinois | geronabean - 2014-01-08 1:06 PM In my 20 yr management career I was a hands off style... BUT... eventually had to change to more of a micromanager due to most people NOT performing to the level needed... then it was my arse on the line as to why things werent handled. So it effected everyone on my team even those that did get their work handled. I was getting paid to ensure things were done and to a certain level and the hands off style wasnt cutting it.
Would it have helped you if your employees were up front & honest about their strengths & weaknesses? Maybe find ways to mold & improve their performance based off of that? I am a strong believer in improving weaknesses but I also believe that you improve, but not perfect, said weaknesses. My favorite quote is "everyone is born a genius but if you judge a fish on how he climbs a tree he will forever believe he is stupid."
I have been told by the VP that they want the job to fit me, but then in my reviews I hear the opposite from her. Her approach isn't helpful to me & I want to be able to work better with her without feeling the stress & negative pressure I feel sometimes. | |
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Uh....never mind
Posts: 2696
Location: Midwest Farmer's Daughter: Central Illinois | aggiejudger - 2014-01-08 1:21 PM I also work for a micromanager. I think mine truly believes she is helping, when she's really just a pain in the arse.
Here is what I do to cope:
- I try to head her off before she does one of her micromanaging stunts. For example, we have flex time in our office. At the end of each month, we either have to put in any out-of-office time as sick, vacation, or comp time. If we do comp time, we have to send her an email stating as such. So before she can send the lovely helpful reminder to each of us, I beat her to the punch.
- Take her with a grain of salt. If you recognize her for what she is, the reality is that others do as well.
- I do my job to the best of my ability and plot my escape to another position. I know I won't be here forever, so I just try to keep that in mind when I deal with her.
To me, what are you going to tell HR if you go and complain? Will it come off as valid points or will it sound like whining? If it is valid, then heck yes, go talk to them. But if it's just annoying behavior, it won't look good on you. If you can prove that she is abusing the WFH situation, go to HR with proof. If the WFH is causing her to be an ineffective manager, that is more valid.
Her WFH has probably made her wose as a a micromanager. She doesn't know what you are doing all day. And when we don't know something, it's human nature to assume the worst.
In the future when taking a day off, email her ahead of time about the plan for making sure things are taken care of. Cut her off before her annoying managing style can surface. Kill her with kindness, bombard her with details, and keep her in the loop. If you are always ahead of her and letting her know about things before she can ask, it helps dealing with that type of manager.
Good luck.
Thank you for this advice - very helpful!
I sent out emails & planned ahead before my week-long vacation before Christmas. It was a better transition than it has been in years' past but I still got calls/emails/IMs from her asking questions that I felt I had already answered in previous conversations. She wanted more details, more information than I had at the time. I chalked it up to her controlling nature & tried to sound smiley & happy in all of our conversations.
A major problem you pointed out is the WFH = her not knowing what we do & talk about all day. I mentioned that my co-worker & I are a good team, constantly communicating & have each other's backs 100%. When we tell her that we have things handled for each other when one of us is out, she wants detailed lists of who/what/when/where/why/how & then she scrambles around trying to 'help' anyway. I don't mind giving her the information she wants, if I have it, but when she tries to help it just puts another hand in the pot to stir things up.
The HR complaint is difficult for me to distinguish as well, which is why I've been hesitant to actually move forward. I know a lot of my complaints are just that, complaints, & not actual issues. Everyone deals with those regularly & I don't need to run to HR every time she bugs me for something.
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I Am a Snake Killer
Posts: 1927
Location: Golden Gulf Coast of Texas | geronabean - 2014-01-08 1:06 PM
In my 20 yr management career I was a hands off style... BUT... eventually had to change to more of a micromanager due to most people NOT performing to the level needed... then it was my arse on the line as to why things werent handled. So it effected everyone on my team even those that did get their work handled. I was getting paid to ensure things were done and to a certain level and the hands off style wasnt cutting it.
I agree. I tried the hands off style and it works with some of the employees but not all of them for sure. You cant make some people take pride in their work. Some are just collecting a paycheck. | |
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  That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| RLB - 2014-01-08 12:08 PM roxieannie - 2014-01-08 12:02 PM Blunt observation here. You know how your boss is. And yes, if someone is going to be absent for what ever reason, their work should be done before they leave or an action plan on how it will be covered. You boss has other people that they have to report to. When they ask these questions, they expect answers. And when your boss doesn't have an answer, it reflects poorly on your boss.
It all boils down to doing your job so your boss has confidence in their team.
As far as the OT issue. It was asked of you to report this way. It becomes part of your job. Not eyeballing someone else's incompetence.
Having a more positive cheerful presence is a must in the workplace to survive. Getting work done in a timely manner and not having negative feedback comming in from other departments will go along way to getting that larger pay raise Thank you for the objective viewpoint. You are 100% correct in all of your observations.
All of my reviews are sparkling in the "has a can-do, positive attitude" department, so it's hard for me to accept it when I get dinged for things that aren't important to me. But, they're important to someone else for whatever reason, so I have to find a way for them to be important to me as well, I suppose.
It is a rare thing now days to be able to accept advise and criticism! I wish I had 100 employees like you.  as far as advise from me: I wish my employees would occasionally let me know how I can improve and better assist them in their tasks. Let her know your frustrations but do it with tact (as best you can!). | |
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Regular
Posts: 90
| RLB - 2014-01-08 1:33 PM
aggiejudger - 2014-01-08 1:21 PM I also work for a micromanager. I think mine truly believes she is helping, when she's really just a pain in the arse.
Here is what I do to cope:
- I try to head her off before she does one of her micromanaging stunts. For example, we have flex time in our office. At the end of each month, we either have to put in any out-of-office time as sick, vacation, or comp time. If we do comp time, we have to send her an email stating as such. So before she can send the lovely helpful reminder to each of us, I beat her to the punch.
- Take her with a grain of salt. If you recognize her for what she is, the reality is that others do as well.
- I do my job to the best of my ability and plot my escape to another position. I know I won't be here forever, so I just try to keep that in mind when I deal with her.
To me, what are you going to tell HR if you go and complain? Will it come off as valid points or will it sound like whining? If it is valid, then heck yes, go talk to them. But if it's just annoying behavior, it won't look good on you. If you can prove that she is abusing the WFH situation, go to HR with proof. If the WFH is causing her to be an ineffective manager, that is more valid.
Her WFH has probably made her wose as a a micromanager. She doesn't know what you are doing all day. And when we don't know something, it's human nature to assume the worst.
In the future when taking a day off, email her ahead of time about the plan for making sure things are taken care of. Cut her off before her annoying managing style can surface. Kill her with kindness, bombard her with details, and keep her in the loop. If you are always ahead of her and letting her know about things before she can ask, it helps dealing with that type of manager.
Good luck.
Thank you for this advice - very helpful!
I sent out emails & planned ahead before my week-long vacation before Christmas. It was a better transition than it has been in years' past but I still got calls/emails/IMs from her asking questions that I felt I had already answered in previous conversations. She wanted more details, more information than I had at the time. I chalked it up to her controlling nature & tried to sound smiley & happy in all of our conversations.
A major problem you pointed out is the WFH = her not knowing what we do & talk about all day. I mentioned that my co-worker & I are a good team, constantly communicating & have each other's backs 100%. When we tell her that we have things handled for each other when one of us is out, she wants detailed lists of who/what/when/where/why/how & then she scrambles around trying to 'help' anyway. I don't mind giving her the information she wants, if I have it, but when she tries to help it just puts another hand in the pot to stir things up.
The HR complaint is difficult for me to distinguish as well, which is why I've been hesitant to actually move forward. I know a lot of my complaints are just that, complaints, & not actual issues. Everyone deals with those regularly & I don't need to run to HR every time she bugs me for something.
You basically answered your own question by stating most of your issues are complaints, not actual problems. I ran the HR dept of the company I work for, for several years. I've dealt with and worked for/with all kinds of managers, including the micromanagers. The management has established processes for a reason. That's what works for them. There's not really a nice way to say it, but if that doesn't work for you, then perhaps you don't need to be working for them. I'm not saying that to be mean, I'm saying that in an employer/employee relationship viewpoint.
When there are issues or tasks you handle that you feel could be better done a different way, you can't just decide to not do thing the way they're supposed to be done. The best approach is to handle business as it comes up, then bring up, through the proper management chain, your suggestions or ideas for how to make improvements. Make it worth their time by making sure you explain how you are streamlining/saving money/saving time, etc. You don't want to walk in and have "I like this way better because I'm me" (i.e. The Special Snowflake excuse) be your backup for your request. Give them reasons and an outlined process and be prepared to be rejected.
In the day to day operations, unless you are aware of some kind of fraud/waste/abuse hotline or policy that affords you the chance to rat on your boss, you don't really have recourse except to suck it up and keep working. Whatever she's doing is working for her managers, as far as you know, so unless you're asked for input, it's probably best that you leave things alone. This person's micromanagement style, as annoying or flawed as it may be, doesn't seem to be hindering your ability to do the duties you are tasked, especially since as an hourly employee, you're paid for your time. I don't see how this is a hostile work environment either since "being a nag" isn't considered abuse. You need to learn how to bite your tongue and teach yourself how to be an adult and cope with the situation.
What it comes down to, is you're being paid to do a certain job a certain way. That appears to include indulging the micromanagement behaviors of your supervisor. It's not always easy and it's definitely not fun, but neither is life. | |
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