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Elite Veteran
Posts: 631
  
Location: Somewhere in N.C. | My 3 month old has been biting since he was born. I have tried everything to stop it. using my elbow, pinching etc. Nothing Works. Now when you ask him to do something he doesn't want to do, he rears up. I've tried using Clinton Anderson's technique by disingaging the hind end and moving the shoulder, but he thinks its a game. When I go to disingage the rear, he chases me with his mouth. He is my 7th foal that I have brought along and I have never run into these kind of problems. He is eating good and could be weaned anytime. My vet said weaning would help this, but if it doesn't, then what? Thanks.
Edited by nccowgirl 2014-07-09 8:22 PM
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 Chasin my Dream
Posts: 13651
  
Location: Alberta | My now 4 year old gelding, was a biting, kicking, throw fits baby...bottom line CONSISTANT discipline and handling is all that's worked for him....
ETA: I weaned my guy at 4 months didn't make a difference.....I always had a small whip in my hand anytime I handled him....get in my space it was used....
Edited by dream_chaser 2014-07-09 8:48 PM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 631
Location: Somewhere in N.C. | I am at a loss as to how to even handle him. I am so scared if I don't handle things right, he is going to be a monster. I've tried everything I know. Should I go ahead and wean then see how he acts?
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 437
| Do they make muzzles that small? if so put one on and go to your ground work. Remember John Lyons said if a horse bites to you have 60 seconds to kill him with your bare hands |
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 Coyote Country Queen
Posts: 5666
| Sounds like he has become disrespectful and doesn't see you as an alpha but rather as a playmate. He's spoiled and you need to fix it now. If a horse tries to bite another horse do you think they stand there and take it? Absolutely not! That is how they determine their pecking order. Right now your colt is just playing, but the foundation is being set for him to not see you as a leader. Get after him when he bites and mean it. You're not going to scar him for life if you give him a good pop in the mouth. But if you don't get this fixed now you're going to have a real problem on your hands in the future. I hate "working" with babies like because they are just that, babies. Do the work that needs done and then let them be a horse. We don't do much with ours as far as training goes until they are weaned and then build on that throughout the following couple of years and our babies are respectful and easy to start. I know others have different programs and that certainly works too, but I've seen babies get over-handled and become disrespectful, over-desensitized, and spoiled. Weaning will help in the sense that you will be taking away his security blanket, but you're still going to have to fix the lack of respect issue. Treat him like his momma would if he bit her!
Edited by Jenbabe 2014-07-09 8:51 PM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 631
Location: Somewhere in N.C. | I have tried to not over handle him. only a few basics....halter, leading picking up feet.
I use my knee in his shoulder when he pushes on me. I am hiting him as hard as I can with my elbow when he bites. I have not been easy on him, but he is super strong and doesn't seem to mind the hard licks. Thanks for the advice and any more you can give.
what shouldl I do when he Rears?
Edited by nccowgirl 2014-07-09 9:23 PM
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 Mature beyond Years
Posts: 10780
Location: North of the 49th Parallel | I had a month old colt come at me on two legs. He got a stall fork to the face. The second time he did that, I threw the first thing I could think of, a halter at him and actually connected. The third time he did it to me, I basically shoved the wheelbarrow at him and his two feet landed in it. Never tried it again to me but tried it to every other person that tried to clean his stall. After the third attempt, we came to an understanding and he was the sweetest colt to me. My boss saw the wheelbarrow episode and just shook his head when I could handle the colt, but nobody else could. Unfortunately we never got to see what he turned out to be (bred out of the nines reining bred colt) as he was chased into a fence as a long weanling by a cougar; found him dead :(
Bottom line- do what you need to do to discipline him. |
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Veteran
Posts: 111
| I raise a few babies to sell each year and there is always one that tries me. The colt this year got wrestled to the ground once and totally changed his attitude. Recently his behavior was to pull back and rear up when i asked him to lead forward - i never let go of tension on the lead rope so that he had no chance to fall and hurt himself but instead i used pressure to get him off balance. I never ended a session with him winning as he always got scared and tired of falling. The first day he pulled this crap he must have gone down 5 or more times. Second day 3-4 and by third day once. He learned it was easier to go forward and not fight pressure. I doubt this colt will ever pull back when i start tying him up. Another colt wanted to bite me or at least mouth me with his lips whenever i was in his pen. You have to be persistent and i use the flick-a-finger on their nose from the earliest chance. Always remember not to just desensitize but to sensitize your colt. Mine are about 2 months old and very respectful. Consistency and then rubbing them after a lesson will give you great results. |
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Coyote Country Queen
Posts: 5666
| I like to be very careful with necks at a young age. I never tie them solid until they are older because I don't want to risk injury. And that is also why I want to be careful of fighting them when they try to rear with a halter on. I want them to learn to give to the pressure but I don't want to yank. Just use your best judgement when dealing with this. Maybe you could back off and go back to minimal handling that focuses on him behaving in short lessons. Look at quality of the time spent with him instead of quantity. Try to prevent the bad behavior before it happens. Five minutes of good work without a fight is better than 15 minutes where you are having to pick a fight. |
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Fire Ant Peddler
Posts: 2881
| Snip snip---as soon as possible. Amazing attitude adjustment. |
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| nccowgirl - 2014-07-09 8:36 PM
I am at a loss as to how to even handle him. I am so scared if I don't handle things right, he is going to be a monster. I've tried everything I know. Should I go ahead and wean then see how he acts?
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You mentioned CA .. so you must have one of his long lead or longe lines and his stick ...
You say he leads so he knows how to give to pressure ... now get that stick and teach him how to move around you in 12-15 ft circles and not invade your personal space and get as firm as you need to be .... If you are familiar with his training method you know to whack him on in front of his shoulder to move forward and to move his front end over but be ready for colt to swing his butt over and kick your teeth in ... anticipate and whack him on the side of his rib cage to move out away from you immediately and a bigger whack on his butt .. you need to be quick and harsh to get the message across since he already has the bad idea he is boss ... ... and make him work hard in both directions ..
You have a barn brat you created by too much handling and loving on and so he is being totally disrespectful and dangerous .... carry that stick with you out in the pasture and whack his butt to get him away from you while you feed or do other things ... time to get rough and get him gelded too ... and stop giving him treats!!
Your elbow pokes, side and face slaps are a game to him right now ... you can use these silly moves on a good broke horse but not when training one to be handled ... your body language should tell him you are hacked off and coming to kill him .. that is the control CA uses in his training methods ... body language backed up by certain tactics ...
Go buy the Fundamentals Kit so you can learn what all it takes and the proper sequence to start a horse and get his respect .... it is cheaper than a visit to the ER or long term injuries ... GOOD LUCK ... LOOK AND ACT MEAN!!
Keep in mind right now you are just teaching him to respect you and not running his butt off in a round pen or otherwise and screwing up his knees and other joints that are soft and growing ...
Edited by BARRELHORSE USA 2014-07-10 1:07 AM
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 Expert
Posts: 1367
Location: mi | My current yearling was the worst colt I have ever had. His barn name for his first year was sh**head. Weaning helped alittle but getting him gelded was the key. He is now a normal yearling. I waited unitl he was 10 months in the spring I wish I had done it at 5 or 6 in the fall.
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 I Chore in Chucks
Posts: 2882
Location: MD | bite him back.  |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 631
Location: Somewhere in N.C. | Thanks for all the advice. I am going to wean him next week on his 3 month Birthday. I will only do short sessions with him until then. I would rather wait until the fall to geld is possible just because of the bugs/heat. If I can wait until September he will still only be 5 months old. |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9991
Location: Kansas | I know a good light punch/smack to the muzzle would stop that.....sorry but if a colt is coming after me, mouth agaped...I'm going to get him to stop before he takes a chunk out of my arm/body. I had a yearling that did that, I put up with it...attempted to flick him in the mouth, tell him no.....finally one day he pinned his ears, charged at me, and had his mouth wide open. One good swing, and he never tried that with me again. |
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 Midget Lover
Location: Kentucky | I have a mouthy colt now. He will nip you if you aren't watching. I pop him then he hides behind mama. Mama doesn't reprimand him when he nips on her. He is getting the snip snip was soon as the weather breaks. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1611
Location: bring on the heat, NV | Must be in the weather. My 2014 colt was born mouthy too. Stopped letting him try mouthing. I bop him on the shoulder when he does and have him turned out with momma and a 26 yo gelding who wont tolterate rude behavior but is gentle with him. The old gelding is a better trainer than I lol he isnt worried about being mean ;) |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 898
Location: Mountains of VA | Turn out 24/7 and he needs a pasture buddy to play with but one that will play back and correct him if he gets out of hand. A yearling gelding would probably work just fine. I wouldn't wean him yet, let him bond with a play buddy then wean in a month or so.
Don't handle him for a while, let him bite and play with his buddy. I have never liked having just one foal, I think they need others to bite and play with instead of humans.
Geld him over the winter.
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Coyote Country Queen
Posts: 5666
| hotpaints - 2014-07-10 11:04 AM
Turn out 24/7 and he needs a pasture buddy to play with but one that will play back and correct him if he gets out of hand. A yearling gelding would probably work just fine. I wouldn't wean him yet, let him bond with a play buddy then wean in a month or so.
Don't handle him for a while, let him bite and play with his buddy. I have never liked having just one foal, I think they need others to bite and play with instead of humans.
Geld him over the winter.
I totally agree with this.
I think that weaning early because of his behavior is not a good idea. I'm also not a member of the cut early fan-club. They are babies and they are colts and it is part of their nature to be playful. Let him be a baby. And let his momma teach him some manners. Turn him out with some other horses and you'll be amazed how fast his attitude changes. Ultimately though, you are going to have to change the way you interact with him if you want to correct this behavior. It won't matter if he is weaned or cut if you still let him get away with it. |
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Expert
Posts: 3300
| I've only had to geld one really early at 6 months because he was bad... And he was perfectly fine.. I wouldn't wean because of his attitude.. That's not a good reason.. |
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