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 Career in Looney Tune Land
Posts: 1717
  
Location: the high desert | If a horse lands toe first is that a sign of "its the beginning of the end"?
Edited by Iwish 2014-07-21 4:54 PM
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 I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
  
Location: In the Hills of Texas | The horse I have now was landing toe first on all 4 feet and is why our daughter sent him to me to get his feet fixed. My Certified Natural Balance farrier fixed him. |
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Career in Looney Tune Land
Posts: 1717
Location: the high desert | What did he do to fix him? |
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 Certified Snake Wrangler
Posts: 1672
Location: North MS | pics would help but typically it involves lowering heels to gain frog contact to ground and shortening toe if it is too long. Balanced trim from side to side and no obvious length differences in hoof wall. Lots more involved if there are flares, infections, bruising, rotation etc. |
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Career in Looney Tune Land
Posts: 1717
Location: the high desert | So its fixable depending on why they are doing it. |
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I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | Iwish - 2014-07-21 12:41 AM What did he do to fix him?
Balanced his foot. |
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I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | Can you take a picture of his feet and post them?
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 Serious Snap Trapper
Posts: 4275
Location: In The Snow, AZ | The mustang pony we picked up last week lands toe first. We are having our farrier come to work on him soon. But his feet are a mess in my opinion. Heels are very under run. Toe seems long. Unbalanced all the way around. A balanced foot is a healthy foot. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| If they are landing toe first it could be caudal heel pain, navicular, or arthritis.
I would take the horse to a lamness expert, and make sure the horse doesn't have contracted heels. If a horse has contracted heels long term it can cause navicular changes.
No landing toe first doesn't have to mean the beginning of the end if you get the proper diagnosis and treatment. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 330
| Toe landing = discomfort in the heel for SOME reason.
Those reasons could include:
Thrush
Navicular changes
Contracted heels
underrun heels
underrun heels/long toes
Contracted and underrun heels
Overgrown bars
A shoe that's too small
Take a good hard look at feet.
Are they balanced?
Nice short toe, supportive heel?
No evidence of thrush?
Are the frogs healthy and clean?
I love this website, my farrier apprenticed with this woman. I know many of you shoe, and that's fine, but the foot above the shoe is what matters. If you're putting a shoe on a foot that needs work, just shoes aren't going to fix the issue.
www.heikebean.com
http://heikebean.com/OO/hh-tot.htm#start
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 Veteran
Posts: 268
| When they land on the toe they are generally sore in the heel. Especially if they are somewhat balanced. Often navicular horses do this. However you would want to have the foot balanced then go from there |
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Veteran
Posts: 185
| I would thinking depending on the situation that this should be quite fixable. I'm recommending barefoot again. Its way easier to address problems without the shoe in the way. You can then gradually lower heels, shorten toes, address flare, thoroughly clean/treat a hoof for thrush... You will get more blood circulation and much improved shock absorption too. It all about making the hoof function as it was intended too. All the structures play an important role so its about letting them play there part.
Its kinda a circular problem if you think about it......toe first causes problems heel pain and heel pain causes toe first - chicken and egg thing
I agree please post some pictures! It could be something as "simple" as thrush/central sulcus thursh
Frog stimulation is key, like mentioned above. If heels are high and contracted the trick will be to lower them gradually and get the frog working. Hoof boots with frog stimulation will help. You can buy cheap spongy floor pieces, cut them and duct tape them. They will form too the hoof and help stimulate the frog. Obviously take them off everyday and replace with new. They will probably fall off by themselfs first. But don't leave anything on your horses hooves for days without checking! Thrush can thrive in that environment too.
Like already said balanced the hooves. Remove/kill infection. Check that bars aren't too long/laid over but don't over trim them either, just above/at sole. I would suggest rolling the edge "mustang roll". Address breakover accordingly, goes with balancing. Don't touch the sole, sole could be thin, let it build. Don't over trim frogs, only if infected or to remove flaps/prevent infection. Make the hooves function like they should and they way they should for that particular horse. Every structure has a part to play! |
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Career in Looney Tune Land
Posts: 1717
Location: the high desert | I will try and get some pictures but they wont be wonderful as there is not a very good spot to take side views without someone holding him. I would love to have a natural balance farrier do his feet but I dont know of any in my area. The horse in question is a yearling. Planning on having the vet do a lameness exam/x rays next week. |
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Veteran
Posts: 185
| A lot of the times shoes cause and/or help these problems worsen(navicular, thrush, arthritis...) Because they interfear with how the hoof was meant to function. No wonder you get heal pain, shoe in the way, causes less frog stimulation and as a result less blood flow. Frogs become little unused things/reseed, heels contract....heal pain......WAM Navicular!. Perfect unused sick frog for thrush to eat away at! Decreased blood flow/decreased shock absorption - stress on joints - BAM ARTHRITIS or at least causes more harm helping arthritis along.
The more I read and learn about hooves the more I believe shoes just flat out suck. IMO anyone else or I'm I to be stoned by the shoe people!  |
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Veteran
Posts: 185
| With a yearling you still have the time to correct problems with proper trimming. Your on the right track with the vet radiographs will be very helpful for a trimmer. Hopefully its just an issue you can correct with proper hoof balance.
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Career in Looney Tune Land
Posts: 1717
Location: the high desert | here are some terrible pictures. He is currently living in a flood irrigated pasture so maybe thats making his feet soft? He is very ouchy when he steps on rocks, so maybe he is thinned soled as well? Aside from needing a trim, are his feet that bad? Not sure you will even be able to see anything because i had to make the pictures so tiny. That was the only "good" straight on side picture i was able to get.
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  Ms. Manners
Posts: 1820
Location: Oklahoma | One can't really tell the angles his foot is at by just looking at the sole. Any side and rear pics of his hoof on the ground? |
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Career in Looney Tune Land
Posts: 1717
Location: the high desert | none for today, i will try and get some tomorrow. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| Iwish - 2014-07-21 4:55 PM
here are some terrible pictures. He is currently living in a flood irrigated pasture so maybe thats making his feet soft? He is very ouchy when he steps on rocks, so maybe he is thinned soled as well? Aside from needing a trim, are his feet that bad? Not sure you will even be able to see anything because i had to make the pictures so tiny. That was the only "good" straight on side picture i was able to get.
It looks like her heel is contracted on the inside for sure. Contraction can happen from many natural things such as too long of toes, and dry conditions.
It also looks like she may have thrush, I know some barefoot trimmers would hang me but I would clean up the frog and treat for thrush till the vet appointment. If you have hoof testers and know how to use them I would test his foot and see where he is sore, this will tell you if it is thrush, heel or something else. I would make sure you vet uses hoof testers.
From the one side view it does look like he has underslung heels, not that bad, but this can also cause contracted heel pain. His hair line is also frowning by his heels which is an indicator something is wrong, but you already knew that the way he was landing.
He looks like he is due for a trim, after the vet appointment, I would make sure he goes onto a 4-5 week trim schedule since he is so young and is already having problems. |
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Career in Looney Tune Land
Posts: 1717
Location: the high desert | Never heard of a frowning hair line around the heels could mean problems. Learn something new everyday. What kind of problems would that suggest? |
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