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 Member
Posts: 40
Location: Laramie, WY | I have a horse who is being ridden by someone since I'm pregnant...This horse has lots of speed and is ratey. He should be clocking 1/2D times, but gets slowed down in his turns because of the problems were having, so is about 1 second off. We have also struggled with which bit to use on him. We were using a mule bit turned backwards and that was working some, but not enough...I was running him in a Dennis Moreland Sliding gag snaffle mouth piece made for the more sensitive horse, since he is so light mouthed and doesn't like much done with his face...but he seems to be really bendy with this on. Body position and hand position is key with this horse, but sometimes that is easier said than done...Any suggestions would be appreciated. |
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 Don't Wanna Make This Awkward
Posts: 3106
  
Location: Texas | Personally, I would probably put a long shanked hack on him. Or maybe a cg pickup dr bristol, the cg bits are awesome!
As for actually correcting the problem: If you make practice runs at home, on the second barrel run all the way to the fence. Even if you walk the first and the third, do this 4-5 times and I bet he won't fight it anymore. You can also position him correctly around the barrel working a large circle and make sure to keep his shoulder up. My favorite of the 2 is running past the barrel though, it seems to work on every horse I've needed it on. |
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  Queen Boobie 2
Posts: 7521
 
| Check for soreness. I had one who would scotch, drop his shoulder and hit the second barrel because his hocks needed injected. |
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 Good Grief!
Posts: 6343
Location: Cap'n Joan Rotgut.....alberta | im a bit confused..........you said hes light mouthed but yet your using a backwards mule bit...... .........lameness vet visit and id try him in a s-cheek or a quick stop.....
m |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1028
| Like others have said, I'd rule out lameness first. Then I'd put a little-S hackamore on him and do the Connie Combs square drill with him. Here's a link an article talking about it: http://www.conniecombs.com/DrilloftheMonth[1].pdf |
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 Experienced Mouse Trapper
Posts: 3106
Location: North Dakota | One of the best tips I got (I think it was from this forum) is that a ratey horse needs to (sometimes) be run directly at the next barrel. I consciously try to line up my horse directly in front of the 2nd and 3rd and kick and usually things go pretty well. The more pocket you give the more they dive.
I really like the goostree simplicity OR cg bit for my ratey horse.
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 Living within my means
Posts: 5128
Location: Randolph, Utah | As long as no soreness my suggestion ride your ass off into that barrel, don't let up hustling until you're where you want the horse to turn. If my horse feels me start to sit or let up even a little she starts to shut down.
My ratey horse runs in a draw bit with a lifesaver mouths, but a hack would probably work too.
Edited by JcNhEmI 2014-09-16 3:42 PM
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 Saint Stacey
| When you do slow work, instead of stopping at the rate point, make the horse go faster where you rate. In other words if you are walking, when you get to your rate point, kicked the horse up to a jog around the barrel. Once you finish the Bartel go back to the walk. |
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 Balance Beam and more...
Posts: 11511
Location: 31 lengths farms | Sometimes a light bit just allows them to be dead footed too...I have a really ratey mare that the lighter I went on the bit the harder she was to get around a barrel, put the Ed Pretzel on her and got her feet lightened up and moving again number one and then did the Break Off drills as well as the drill that SKM explained. Went from mid 3D to pulling checks in the 2D in about 2 weeks. |
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 Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| run n rate - 2014-09-16 3:47 PM
Sometimes a light bit just allows them to be dead footed too...I have a really ratey mare that the lighter I went on the bit the harder she was to get around a barrel, put the Ed Pretzel on her and got her feet lightened up and moving again number one and then did the Break Off drills as well as the drill that SKM explained. Went from mid 3D to pulling checks in the 2D in about 2 weeks.
My horse is the same way... he's just a lazy dud in a snaffle or other nicer bits. I throw my Sherry Cervi lifter on him for runs and hes a charm (not that its a harsh bit either).
Is the horse shouldering in? Causing the knock? My gelding did this to me and I tried every exercise known and nothing seemed to work. Took him to a clinic and she said he takes the rein from you halfway around the turn. I had never realized because he turned on a loose rein so when he pulled on me I gave in and I guess I was being to timid. We practiced slow work and fast work where when he grabbed that rein from me, I corrected him hard and when he stayed light he was rewarded. Hasnt been nearly as much of a problem since (knock on wood). |
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 Am I really the Weirdo?
Posts: 11181
Location: Kansas | SKM - 2014-09-16 3:36 PM When you do slow work, instead of stopping at the rate point, make the horse go faster where you rate. In other words if you are walking, when you get to your rate point, kicked the horse up to a jog around the barrel. Once you finish the Bartel go back to the walk.
This drill works wonders with my ratey horses. Easiest drill ever and you can do it with one barrel or with all 3. I've even done it at a slow walk/fast walk on grass when I don't want to haul to town. It will get them thinking about moving their feet through the turn which is usually what you need a ratey horse to do. |
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 Party Girl
Posts: 12293
Location: Buffalo, Wyoming | This may not be your case but Fred Hunter has an article out there that says something along the lines of some people think they have a ratey horse but in fact they have a horse that is shouldering the barrel.
Like SKM said work him faster at your rate point or make him go all the way to the fence on that barrel turn him the opposite way and go one to the next one. |
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| You know your horse best and how this would go with him, but my boy and I got on a 2nd barrel hitting streak for a bit because he was wanting to turn early. He's most defiantly a push style horse.
Did a lot of lateral work to really get him moving off my inside leg, that still didn't work. So - I ran him up the wall a few times. Flame me if you want, but it worked. I know the horse well and as soon as he would start to drop that shoulder on me, we went the other direction. Did that a couple times. Then instead of turning we ran to the wall and stopped a couple times. Then we went back to working the barrel normally.
Ultimately I also ended up in an Ed Wright Pretzal with him, recommended by Ed himself and it's really helped with shoulder control. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 178
| I had the same problem and solved it using the Molly Powell quick turn bit, as well as doing some of her exercises. Good luck! |
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 Queen Boobie mascot
Posts: 706
Location: Mayerthorpe Alberta | I had to learn how to ride my gelding so that we would quit hitting barrels. It has taken me since April to figure it out. He goes where I put him and I was sitting too early on a very turny horse. Finally what helped me is to check with the outside rein just going into the barrel to help keep his shoulder up. It is working consistently for me now but wasnt easy to learn to do. I didnt think i could possibly let go of the horn to pick up the outside rein :) |
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Experienced Mouse Trapper
Posts: 3106
Location: North Dakota | OhMax - 2014-09-18 7:14 AM
You know your horse best and how this would go with him, but my boy and I got on a 2nd barrel hitting streak for a bit because he was wanting to turn early. He's most defiantly a push style horse.
Did a lot of lateral work to really get him moving off my inside leg, that still didn't work. So - I ran him up the wall a few times. Flame me if you want, but it worked. I know the horse well and as soon as he would start to drop that shoulder on me, we went the other direction. Did that a couple times. Then instead of turning we ran to the wall and stopped a couple times. Then we went back to working the barrel normally.
Ultimately I also ended up in an Ed Wright Pretzal with him, recommended by Ed himself and it's really helped with shoulder control.
A little reverse psychology helps a lot. They learn to listen to you and wait for you. I also learned with mine-which I forgot to mention above, that I always need to keep the rear end in the right place-if he started to turn to soon I would place a leg on the back side of my back cinch and push his outside hip back over, he would stand back up and continue on.....didn't think I'd ever be able to do that either but it's very similar to the "outside" rein check. Keeps them standing up more square....dang turny fools.....  think they're smarter than we are! |
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Member
Posts: 40
Location: Laramie, WY | Ref to:"outrundaizy"
Thank you for your advise. My rider is trying this off and on going more to fence on 2nd and going to work on it more. We have used the long shank Brittney Pozzi Hackamore and were going to try the Carol Goosetree Chain Simplicity bit this weekend.
Edited by WyodivaSS 2014-09-18 4:31 PM
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| When you slow work...speed up as you get closer to the second...NEVER ever set him at the second not at it, not past just don't set him...keep forward motion at all times...sometimes go past the barrel all the way to the fence before letting him turn...sometimes take him all the way to the fence but then pick him up in a counter arc and then go to the 3rd...never let him get comfortable with the knowledge that your going to actually turn it....make him always wait on you to decide if your going to turn it or not...keep in guessing. ALWAYS KEEP HIS SHOULDER ELEVATED...don't let him get lazy on you and cheat. |
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Member
Posts: 40
Location: Laramie, WY | Re to: "Mruggles" and others,
Yes, sounds weird to use a mule bit period...however, he likes it backwards since that side is softer and moves in his mouth. We just don't get him to work as well in it. He had some lameness on his RF fetlock, but we injected it and he's been fine, yet still does the same thing regardless...did it before that too. Believe me...we've tried a ton of different bits. We did however try some new drills recommended and that really helped.
Edited by WyodivaSS 2014-09-18 4:42 PM
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Member
Posts: 40
Location: Laramie, WY | Thank you all for taking the time to write back to us. All of your input can help in some way...especially if we've all been through similar situations.
I really like the ideas about pushing the horse into his 2nd barrel without hesitating the turn at a certain point...its just getting use to trusting him at a faster speed and doing all the right things in a run, lol. Also going to fence and doing the rollback to 3rd sounds good and I'm sure will help. I think he's gotten away with shouldering in to 2nd for awhile now and its something we'll just have to work on fixing with some drills. I honestly think you can run him in anything that isn't too harsh that's going to stay off his face and help him have more consistent speed to and from the barrels...and yet be able to lift and ask him for his turns. Like I said...he's a super nice horse, with lots of speed and we usually always have a good 1st and 3rd barrel...and just struggle with that 2nd. So now its just to build up that confidence to and from 2nd so that we get more clean runs and consistency. He's one that you MUST keep your hands down...and kind of set his body up for the turn...because if you let your hands go up past the mid point and you don't have his body arched and ready for barrel turn...he hits the barrel going in or coming out.
Edited by WyodivaSS 2014-09-18 7:10 PM
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