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Rad Dork
Posts: 5218
 
Location: Oklahoma | Any suggestions?? Called a local vet and they had never done one before. Said they could send the blood work off, but it wouldn't be 100% accurate.
I'm not sure if I'm dealing with ulcers, him just looking/moving this way from his injury and being on stall rest or if it's EPM. Just wanting to rule it out!
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
  
Location: Texas | There is no definitive test that absolutely tells you that your horse has EPM. Unless you are doing a necropsy. Blood tests give you an idea of exposure... A good way to test is to take a titer, and then do a second titer several weeks later to see if the number is rising, falling, or staying constant. A rising titer indicates active infection because they are making more antibodies... a falling titer indicates clearance of infection. But horses can mount a low immune response in the presence of infection if they are just not good at fighting it.. on the flip side horses can have a huge immune response over a small infection. EPM is a PITA to diagnose.
If you want to test for EPM, I would do a blood titer and have a qualified vet perform a neuro exam on the horse to see if there are signs of EPM- such as ataxia, muscle atrophy, etc... |
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 Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | Go to Dr. Gary White in Sallisaw. He draws blood on site and has a test of his own, but also sends blood to Florida to be tested by www.pathogenes.com for the Orogin 10 treatment. I have an appointment with him on Wednesday to have a couple of mine checked out.
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Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | EPM is evident way before any of the neurological signs show up if you know your horse. One of the horses that I'm testing on Wednesday is a super nice 3 yr old cutter. We bought him for a fraction of what he's worth because he was super flighty on the ground and no one wanted to deal with it. I brought him home and did all of the normal maintenance on him, but also started him on ReBalance just to see if it helped him....By day 5 on the ReBalance he was like a different animal. It seemed like he changed over night. I couldn't even brush his tail when we first brought him home...and now I can lift his tail straight up and pick up all of his feet. No extra training...no extra attention. The only thing I did was give him ReBalance. Since ReBalance does not kill the protozoa I am having him tested now so that I can treat him with Orogin 10. I just completed an Orogin 10 treatment on my 27 yr old mare and it has helped her tremendously. No amount of feed would add the weight that she has gained with that treatment. Her levels were still very high after two bottles of ReBalance. |
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Rad Dork
Posts: 5218
Location: Oklahoma | Thank you both for the info! Just got an appointment with Dr. White on Wednesday afternoon to scope and do EPM!
He has given me problems with picking up feet before, but I attributed that to him being out everywhere. Got him chiro'd and he was better. Then started giving me issues (trims, resisting alley way) and we found suspensory inflammation. Been on stall rest, but looks awful! He looked great when he was on alfalfa, but I switched to grass hay (he's on a round bale, so I somewhat don't think it's ulcers) once he was stalled. |
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Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | This is my old mare that just finished her treatment. She's going to be 28 this year and has no teeth in the back. The 3 yr old I mentioned has gained so much weight from just being on the ReBalance that he doesn't look like the same horse. EPM can cause so many problems that you don't realize that it was the problem all along. I fought lameness issues and injuries on my rodeo horse for over a year before I got him to Dr. White and he diagnosed it immediately.
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1092
Location: OK | My horse would blow off the first like a madman but was gentle. Once in awhile, when he was trotting I would see his legs swing kinda funny. I thought he had a stifle problem or something but Dr. White wanted to test him for EPM. He tested positive. We did the Orogin. After this treatment he told me to ride him and wait 3 weeks to see how much he improved. He said some horses will have some kind of immune or inflammatory response later, it's not necessarily a relapse but a side effect I guess and at that point, we will treat with something else. It all comes from the place in FL. In total, the whole thing is less than $500.
I asked him about Marquis and other treatments and he recommended this. |
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Rad Dork
Posts: 5218
Location: Oklahoma | Good to hear!!! I'll have to look into the ReBalance! He looked fine and worked fine during the middle of May to about middle of June, then Dr. White found stifle issue and injected. Worked fine for a little bit and I've had different vets find a multitude of things...chipped/sore feet, never been chiro'd before, did accupuncture, and finally took him to lameness locator and found the suspensory inflammation. I'm not doubting that was the biggest problem of all....but I'm wondering if this could finally be my real problem. |
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 Lady Di
Posts: 21556
Location: Oklahoma | I agree....I have found that if you start having behavior issues that you didn't have before (not wanting to load in the trailer when they know how, not letting you pick up their feet, depressed attitude or super nervous and flighty), that is one of the first signs of EPM. Later signs are loss of topline, atrophy over the hips, loss of body condition, possibly acting like they don't see well, one or both ears drooping, constant trouble with stifles, unexplained body soreness, random bucking when they are warmed up and typically not a bucker....all these can point to EPM. I feel like it is way more prevalent than most people think and it's going to be the new worms....it's going to be something that we have to stay on top of all the time (if you have a competition horse that's regularly stressed)....thankfully, the treatments are getting more affordable all the time, but after all, it IS a parasite. |
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Rad Dork
Posts: 5218
Location: Oklahoma | jojammer - 2014-12-01 11:16 AM My horse would blow off the first like a madman but was gentle. Once in awhile, when he was trotting I would see his legs swing kinda funny. I thought he had a stifle problem or something but Dr. White wanted to test him for EPM. He tested positive. We did the Orogin. After this treatment he told me to ride him and wait 3 weeks to see how much he improved. He said some horses will have some kind of immune or inflammatory response later, it's not necessarily a relapse but a side effect I guess and at that point, we will treat with something else. It all comes from the place in FL. In total, the whole thing is less than $500. I asked him about Marquis and other treatments and he recommended this.
Thank you! Glad to hear two reviews on Dr. White! |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1092
Location: OK | I have also read some studies that mentioned side effects when healing. Depending on how much neuro damage was done, as it comes back, it can cause sensations in the legs etc. One said that as the nerves healed, the horse would kick at nothing, presumably from pins nad needles feeling. Just something to keep in mind. It also said it affected some horses' eyesight for awhile.
My horse had a terrible topline and he is not old. I switched feed, then doubled feed and he lost weight. I tried ulcer treatment etc. No improvement. Then he started coughing when he would eat. He was having a hard time swallowing. In just the 10 day treatment and the 2 weeks after, he looks a little better. I've already started riding him and he feels better. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1092
Location: OK | I'd like to know more about the ReBalance. What does it do?
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Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | ReBalance is the old treatment. It's cheap and helps, but it doesn't last. I've been told that it only suppresses and does not kill the protozoa. Everything that I have treated with ReBalance we have gone back and treated with (previously we used Diclazuril I.V. and now) Orogin 10.
My rodeo gelding that was the first that I treated had very subtle symptoms. By the time I got him to Dr. White he had been turned out for about 4 months because I couldn't keep him sound. Dr. White was looking him over and ran his hand down the horse's left back leg and asked me to do the same....it was cold as ice. He had lost circulation in that leg, but regained normal bloodflow by day 4 on the Diclazuril drip.
If I have one that starts acting a little off, EPM is the first thing I rule out now. |
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12838
| Just for curiosity do you have barn cats? |
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Rad Dork
Posts: 5218
Location: Oklahoma | Nope, no cats. Would they help? |
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Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | (Re: Barn Cats) Everyone is trying to do their own investigation on where it's coming from. It's not likely that we will ever be able to prevent it, we will have to educate others on how to spot it...or start treating all horses in training prophylactically.
Muscle atrophy as well as many of the other "symptoms" that people attribute to EPM evolve over time... You have to be tuned into your horse and recognize when something is off. |
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Rad Dork
Posts: 5218
Location: Oklahoma | rachellyn80 - 2014-12-01 2:03 PM (Re: Barn Cats) Everyone is trying to do their own investigation on where it's coming from. It's not likely that we will ever be able to prevent it, we will have to educate others on how to spot it...or start treating all horses in training prophylactically.
Muscle atrophy as well as many of the other "symptoms" that people attribute to EPM evolve over time... You have to be tuned into your horse and recognize when something is off.
Ohh, okay. I thought maybe a cat would ward off a possum.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1092
Location: OK | We used to get coons and stuff in our barn but now that my dog lives there full time, no animals are getting in there! or anywhere near the arena, or the pasture, or pond, or yard lol. He's a soldier. We do however have alot of birds right now. I have to wonder if birds can carry it ?? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1092
Location: OK | I think fall is when skunks reproduce too, so maybe them...
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Rad Dork
Posts: 5218
Location: Oklahoma | Ugh. My lab stays down at the barn almost all the time, but he's more there for the companionship... I don't think he's gonna pose a big threat. Lol.
My barn butts right up against some woods... I'm sure anything and everything comes around. |
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