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Member
Posts: 16
| We have a great little 10 y/o QH sorrel mare that we use for barrel racing. She has a very sound mind, good speed and great bloodlines. We've won a lot of races with her. The big problem is tho, she is a dead head. I have never seen a horse as lazy as she is. We've tried just about everything we know to try to give her some pep in her step. but nothing is working.
Currently, she is on 4 scoops of Omelene 200 per day, 1 scoop of Ultium, 2 ounces of liquid 747, and 2 cups of Farnam Weight Builder, a little bit of alfalfa (plus regular hay and all day grazing) and she's STILL a dead head.
We've had her blood checked, we've had her worm checked (and went ahead and followed up with a power pack even tho the results were negative), we've had her teeth checked, we've had her scoped, we've had her back checked.... I don't think there's much of any stone we've left unturned. There's just nothing wrong with her that any vet can find.
When we got her, we knew she was a "push style" horse, but good lord. I've never seen a horse run a barrel race and then come out and want to go to sleep. Our other horses are all "amped up" after a race and their eyes are wide and all that good stuff. She just comes out and is like "Ok, that's over, time for a nap"...... One thing I might note is that her original owner found us on FB and was telling us about her and how she was from a colt up until she sold her around age 6 or 7.... rambunctious, liked to run and buck (playing), etc... and we were like "Are you SURE we are talking about the same horse???"
We've tried so many (safe and all natural) concoctions that everyone SWORE would get the dead head out of her, and nothing works. The gentleman who helps my daughter train has been training probably longer than I've been alive, and came up with our current feed routine and swore it would 'bring her to life'. NOPE!!!! After several months of this regiment, STILL no change. Even he is baffled.
I've seen a lot of people worried on these boards about trying supplements for fear of making their horses "hot". At this point I don't think shooting her up with speed would make her "hot" (even tho I would NEVER do that!).
You can see in her eyes that she's a happy horse, We've had her checked from stem to stern and can find no sore spots or anything that seems to bother her. No ovary problems, no tenderness anywhere. So we're at our wits end. I will not give her anything unsafe (drugs or whatever), but I could sure use some recommendations from someone who has dealt with a horse like this. She has so much more to give, if only we could find a way to get her to kick it in to high gear.
I have absolutely NO clue if this might have anything to do with it, but all of our horses are mares, and as it turns out, so are our neighbor's horses. Bring a male horse around and they all go nuts, EXCEPT her. In fact, I have never seen her demonstrate ANY signs of being in heat, which I find a little odd.... (she's never been bred either, by the way).
Thanks in advance for your consideration!
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  Sock eating dog owner
Posts: 4557
 
Location: Where the pavement ends and the West begins Utah | Pull off her current grain. Go with straight crimped oats. Instead of 747 switch to red cell. Wheat germ oil for weight.Add vitamin E pure, bio - hesper C/ K. If not red cell add lixotinic. | |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
  
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | To me if shes healthy and sound in every way I would just leave things as is, if she runs and has speed like you say running barrels and have won barrels races then dont change I would not. Just be happy that shes a calm girl. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | Does she still clock? What kind of times is she running? | |
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Hungarian Midget Woman
Location: Midwest | If the horse is winning races and calm, count your blessings! Lol | |
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Expert
Posts: 1561
| Im not buying it... | |
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Veteran
Posts: 242
| We had a gelding just like this! Push style on barrels/poles, won a ton, but my daughter & I would fight over who had to exercise him. Great horse but so calm & lazy, but loved him. But nothing made him have "spring" in his step. | |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| I don't see a problem. Horses have different personalities just like humans. I have known at least 2 barrel horses like that. You could do pleasure horsemanship reining and English events on them and place in those events too. Be grateful you have a good minded horse. | |
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 Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | My horse is a pain to exercise. So lazy and lah-dee-dah....he can get hot if he feels like but I notice he is more energetic if I exercise outside of the arena and in a field or something. Maybe your horse needs a change of scenery? Have you tried chiropractic work? | |
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Miss Southern Sunshine
Posts: 7427
Location: South Central Florida | Maybe I am misunderstanding, but I don't understand the problem. Why do they have to be wide eyed and amped up? If she is winning, I don't really understand what you want her to do?
Is this some kind of scam post?
Edited by Swannranch 2015-04-04 8:25 PM
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| I will take a deadhead every time. I can always get them to run. | |
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Member
Posts: 16
| Why would this be a scam post. That's dumb.
She's currently running 16 flat pretty consistently. Why mess with it? Cuz she has the capability of doing way better. it's kind of like saying "well, my car runs ok, why try to make it run great?" Not to mention, if she is as tired as she acts, I would think she would be a lot happier if she got to feeling more peppy.
The other reason I'd like to see her have more prep is so we can lay off the spurs and whip a little.
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Miss Southern Sunshine
Posts: 7427
Location: South Central Florida | First you said you have won lots of shows on her. . .if a horse is winning, why do you want it wide eyed? But now, "running 16's" doesn't even make sense. If she ran a 16 at Perry Ga, she might qualify in the 4d or 5d, other places it could win a show by a full second? So that doesn't give much information either. I have seen 1D, Open horses that walk other horses in and out of the pen, walk in, and walk out. I've seen wild eyed hyped up horses on the muscle that could not get out of their own way. . .so I just don't buy it. | |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | You say that you are winning barrel races on her, but now you are saying she could do alot better?!! How much better can you do even when you win?
You got lots of nice adivce on here from us that were being nice and now you sound a bit pi$$ for the advice that was giving. Your saying you can see that shes a happy horse threw her eyes, so why do you want to make her hyper?
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2015-04-04 11:24 PM
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Member
Posts: 16
| Ok, let me clarify so we can move on.... she is winning 2D races and 3D races. I guess I should have elaborated more...... my bad. I overlooked the obvious and people kind of took it a bit to the extreme.
That's why we want her to speed up. She's taking home money in the lower classes on a regular basis, but she's not even trying. Week after week I'm watching her beat horses that seem to be giving it their all when she's only giving it a half-hearted effort. So yes, a 16 flat (and for those who want to be extremely literal about me saying 16 flat, I'm rounding numbers; Sometimes she runs wayyyyy faster, sometimes slower, depending on how lazy she feels) is NOT going to win 1D races. And that's the problem. The horse has a h*ll of a lot more to give, but she's just not. I've seen what she can do when she's "in the mood", but that is few and VERY far between. Once in a blue moon she'll go in and blow the doors off the place, but doing that once in a blue moon drives a person nuts. I mean, she might run a hell of a race and finish in the 1D.... and then for months she'll be like "meh, I ain't in the mood" and she'll finish in the 2D or 3D.
So to add more details... we have 3 barrel horses, and we are rotating them enough that they don't get out of shape, but enough that they do get some good time off and get to do some trail riding and things to keep them from burning out in the arena. And to add to that, our horses are always turned out... other than at feeding times, at which point they are locked up just long enough to eat so that they don't fight.
I might also note that the arena we run in the MOST around here, the best time I have seen in there is low 15's. Now then, there are some other arenas around here that I've seen the same horses/riders come in with much faster times (as have we). But I'm going strictly off of the main arena we run at. No, I don't know the measurements, I don't know the set-back on the eye, and I don't know the soil composition. All I know is that the best time I have ever seen at this particular arena is a low 15. And our horse can get there in this arena, IF she wanted to...
Oh, and another problem.... 2-day events... oh heck no, this horse has none of that. On day 2 she won't run to save her life.
And yes, I am very thankful for the horse she is, because she is very level headed, has no gate/alley issues, isn't spooky (for the most part), isn't crazy, etc, and I trust her about as much as any person could with my daughter. That's a heck of a lot to be thankful for. And because of that, I don't want to give up on her when I know how dang good of a horse she is. (So that's why I'm here posting). But at the same time, she is capable of doing way better than what she is. And that's why I came in here; to see if someone has dealt with a deadhead horse that had ton's of potential (and wasn't living up to it) and to see what, if anything, they did to help cure the issue. We are at a crossroads with this horse; she's awesome in so many ways and we love her to death, but she's just not living up to her potential. Sooner or later we will have to make a decision with her. But as I already said, we are trying to exhaust every avenue first.
I never said I wanted to make the horse "hyper" (so please don't put words in my mouth) ; I said I'd like to get more pep in her step and get more out of her. I never said I wanted her wide eyed and acting nuts. I said she is a dead head, and I have nicely asked for assistance from anyone who has dealt with this. In return, there HAVE been some good responses, and then there has been the typical "Here, let me see if I can pick apart this person's story and try to make him look dumb" responses too. But again, my bad for not clarifying from the get-go that it is 2D and 3D races she's winning, and not the NFR. So there's nothing "to buy" or "not to buy". I left out a critical detail; yes, my bad. So anyway, if you've dealt with this type of horse/situation and have had some success, I would really appreciate any insight you are willing to share. If you're just here to pick holes in someone's story or change what they're saying, I'm guessing you're just bored?
And no, I'm not p*ssed off. I'm just answering questions so that maybe someone can help answer my questions. AND I was responding from my cell phone which I hate doing (especially going down bumpy roads....) so I tend to keep it short when I do that, and save more "elaborate" responses for an actual computer. ;)
And yes, I do appreciate the thoughtful and helpful responses we have gotten thus far. I really appreciate the response from "cow pie" about the diet suggested. Speaking of which, I would like to talk more about the Red Cell vs 747. I'm in no way arguing here.... the vet we use has been racing/training horses for a long time, and suggested 747 OVER the Red Cell. I'm NOT saying he is right; I'm just saying I'd like to know more about your experience and the advantages/disadvantages you've seen between the two and why you rate Red Cell above 747?
Last but not least, NO, this horse on her best day would NOT win the national finals. She's not THAT kind of horse. But locally, for the rodeos and barrel races we compete in the most, YES, she SHOULD be hitting at or near the top of her class. So please don't misinterpret what I'm saying and think that I somehow believe I have the wonder horse of the year, if ONLY she'd try a little harder. I'm also not trying to turn her in to some kind of "schizoid" horse by giving her some kind of whacked out drug-filled concoction. I'm just trying to find something (natural) that will make her feel a little more peppy and want to go out and try a little harder. I'm not trying to inject her with "nitrous" and trying to run her till her heart explodes. If I had to compare her to tools (sine I'm a man), I'd compare her to a cordless drill whose battery is better than 3/4 dead by the way she acts. So if I can do something with her feeding regiment that will help her feel better, enjoy life more thoroughly, and inject a little pep in her step, and at the same time help her turn in better times, dang right I'm going to try! I know I have those days where I wake up and feel like I could conquer the world, and then there are those days when you wake up and don't feel like doing jack. She seems to wake up most days feeling like the latter. If something changed to her diet can help her change that, I'm all for it.
Edited by whammo77 2015-04-05 1:37 AM
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | whammo77 - 2015-04-05 12:07 AM
Ok, let me clarify so we can move on.... she is winning 2D races and 3d races. I guess i should have elaborated more...... my bad.
That's why we want her to speed up. She's taking home money in the lower classes on a regular basis, but she's not even trying. So yes, a 16 flat (and for those who want to be extremely literal about me saying 16 flat, I'm rounding numbers; Sometimes she runs faster, sometimes slower, depending on how lazy she feels) is NOT going to win 1D races. And that's the problem. The horse has a h*ll of a lot more to give, but she's just not. I've seen what she can do when she's "in the mood", but that is few and far between. Once in a blue moon she'll go in and blow the doors off the place, but doing that once in a blue moon drives a person nuts.
So to add more details... we have 3 barrel horses, and we are rotating them enough that they don't get out of shape, but enough that they do get some good time off and get to do some trail riding and things to keep them from burning out in the arena.
Oh, and another problem.... 2-day events... oh heck no, this horse has none of that. On day 2 she won't run to save her life.
And yes, I am very thankful for the horse she is, because she is very level headed, has no gate/alley issues, isn't spooky (for the most part), isn't crazy, etc, and I trust her with my daughter. That's a heck of a lot to be thankful for. And because of that, I don't want to give up on her when I know how dang good of a horse she is. (So that's why I'm here posting). But at the same time, she is capable of doing way better than what she is. And that's why I came in here; to see if someone has dealt with a deadhead horse that had ton's of potential (and wasn't living up to it) and to see what, if anything, they did to help cure the issue.
And no, I'm not p*ssed off. I'm just answering questions so that maybe someone can help answer my questions. AND I was responding from my cell phone which I hate doing (especially going down bumpy roads....) so I tend to keep it short when I do that, and save more "elaborate" responses for an actual computer. ;)
And yes, I do appreciate the thoughtful and helpful responses we have gotten thus far.
I don't have any answers but if she's trustworthy enough to take care of your daughter, maybe just be happy with the times she's running and leave her be?? | |
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Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | Does she maybe just not have the heart for it anymore? | |
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Member
Posts: 16
| Chandler's Mom - 2015-04-05 12:17 AM
whammo77 - 2015-04-05 12:07 AM
Ok, let me clarify so we can move on.... she is winning 2D races and 3d races. I guess i should have elaborated more...... my bad.
That's why we want her to speed up. She's taking home money in the lower classes on a regular basis, but she's not even trying. So yes, a 16 flat (and for those who want to be extremely literal about me saying 16 flat, I'm rounding numbers; Sometimes she runs faster, sometimes slower, depending on how lazy she feels) is NOT going to win 1D races. And that's the problem. The horse has a h*ll of a lot more to give, but she's just not. I've seen what she can do when she's "in the mood", but that is few and far between. Once in a blue moon she'll go in and blow the doors off the place, but doing that once in a blue moon drives a person nuts.
So to add more details... we have 3 barrel horses, and we are rotating them enough that they don't get out of shape, but enough that they do get some good time off and get to do some trail riding and things to keep them from burning out in the arena.
Oh, and another problem.... 2-day events... oh heck no, this horse has none of that. On day 2 she won't run to save her life.
And yes, I am very thankful for the horse she is, because she is very level headed, has no gate/alley issues, isn't spooky (for the most part), isn't crazy, etc, and I trust her with my daughter. That's a heck of a lot to be thankful for. And because of that, I don't want to give up on her when I know how dang good of a horse she is. (So that's why I'm here posting). But at the same time, she is capable of doing way better than what she is. And that's why I came in here; to see if someone has dealt with a deadhead horse that had ton's of potential (and wasn't living up to it) and to see what, if anything, they did to help cure the issue.
And no, I'm not p*ssed off. I'm just answering questions so that maybe someone can help answer my questions. AND I was responding from my cell phone which I hate doing (especially going down bumpy roads....) so I tend to keep it short when I do that, and save more "elaborate" responses for an actual computer. ;)
And yes, I do appreciate the thoughtful and helpful responses we have gotten thus far.
I don't have any answers but if she's trustworthy enough to take care of your daughter, maybe just be happy with the times she's running and leave her be??
As I state above, she's not a national finals horse. We accept that. But my daughter wants to work her way up and someday ride professionally. This horse will never be the horse to go pro on. We know that. But at the same time, you have to work your way up, and this horse can take her a long way if we could just get her to try. We're not blessed with more riches that we know what to do with, so to some degree we have to make the most of what we have. We know, eventually, we're going to have to make a change to be able to reach that next level. But for now, we've climbed a few steps on the ladder, and if this lil mare can just reach her potential, we can make another step or two. So for now, we could really stand for her to be running at least close to what she's capable of. | |
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | whammo77 - 2015-04-05 1:51 AM
Chandler's Mom - 2015-04-05 12:17 AM
whammo77 - 2015-04-05 12:07 AM
Ok, let me clarify so we can move on.... she is winning 2D races and 3d races. I guess i should have elaborated more...... my bad.
That's why we want her to speed up. She's taking home money in the lower classes on a regular basis, but she's not even trying. So yes, a 16 flat (and for those who want to be extremely literal about me saying 16 flat, I'm rounding numbers; Sometimes she runs faster, sometimes slower, depending on how lazy she feels) is NOT going to win 1D races. And that's the problem. The horse has a h*ll of a lot more to give, but she's just not. I've seen what she can do when she's "in the mood", but that is few and far between. Once in a blue moon she'll go in and blow the doors off the place, but doing that once in a blue moon drives a person nuts.
So to add more details... we have 3 barrel horses, and we are rotating them enough that they don't get out of shape, but enough that they do get some good time off and get to do some trail riding and things to keep them from burning out in the arena.
Oh, and another problem.... 2-day events... oh heck no, this horse has none of that. On day 2 she won't run to save her life.
And yes, I am very thankful for the horse she is, because she is very level headed, has no gate/alley issues, isn't spooky (for the most part), isn't crazy, etc, and I trust her with my daughter. That's a heck of a lot to be thankful for. And because of that, I don't want to give up on her when I know how dang good of a horse she is. (So that's why I'm here posting). But at the same time, she is capable of doing way better than what she is. And that's why I came in here; to see if someone has dealt with a deadhead horse that had ton's of potential (and wasn't living up to it) and to see what, if anything, they did to help cure the issue.
And no, I'm not p*ssed off. I'm just answering questions so that maybe someone can help answer my questions. AND I was responding from my cell phone which I hate doing (especially going down bumpy roads....) so I tend to keep it short when I do that, and save more "elaborate" responses for an actual computer. ;)
And yes, I do appreciate the thoughtful and helpful responses we have gotten thus far.
I don't have any answers but if she's trustworthy enough to take care of your daughter, maybe just be happy with the times she's running and leave her be??
As I state above, she's not a national finals horse. We accept that. But my daughter wants to work her way up and someday ride professionally. This horse will never be the horse to go pro on. We know that. But at the same time, you have to work your way up, and this horse can take her a long way if we could just get her to try. We're not blessed with more riches that we know what to do with, so to some degree we have to make the most of what we have. We know, eventually, we're going to have to make a change to be able to reach that next level. But for now, we've climbed a few steps on the ladder, and if this lil mare can just reach her potential, we can make another step or two. So for now, we could really stand for her to be running at least close to what she's capable of.
Then I hope she gets some pep in her step and picks up the pace some for your daughter! | |
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Member
Posts: 16
| hammer_time - 2015-04-05 1:35 AM
Does she maybe just not have the heart for it anymore?
That's a legitimate question. However, this horse has the same attitude about everything in life. Even at feeding time, we go out and the other horses come running because they know what time it is, but she's just like "Ok, I'll be there when I get there" and she just meanders her way up to the barn. Once she's there. she's all about her feed... She dives in!
We jokingly call her Eeor because of her hum-drum I-don't-give-a-crap attitude.
I guess the most perplexing thing about it all is having this conversation with her original owner who described a horse that is completely opposite of the horse she is now. That's why I am very interested in her diet, because we just can't find anything else to explain it (after hundreds upon hundreds of dollars spent with the vet, chiropractor, etc), especially if what her original owner tells us is true. And yes, the horse has a VERY loving home. She's not being beaten or abused. My daughter does most all of the work with the horses, and she has the patience of 'Jobe'. I've seen people who beat their horses into submission, and that's just not the case here. My daughter is completely against "abusive training", and is so patient and diligent in her work. She has no training, she is just one of these people that have a 'knack' for horses. I've seen her (all the way back when she was 13) take horses that had extreme trailer issues and within an hour or so have them loading like there was never a problem. I mean heck, we have a 2 y/o horse that we just rescued, and that horse was yanked from her mother prematurely and put out on a 20 acre pasture by itself and NEVER got handled at all. We got it 1.5 months ago, it was emaciated, underweight, undersized, and scared of the world. My daughters have been working with her non-stop and this horse is now so trusting. She'll load in a trailer, pick up her feet, and do just about anything you ask of her now. The vet came out earlier this week and was amazed at just how happy and friendly she is, when just over a month ago she trembled and lashed out when someone got near her.
So getting back to the point, our horse's attitude isn't because of mistreatment or lack of love. She's just a dead head.
As much as I hate to say it, she reminds me of my brother. The man is as lazy as the day is long. He's a very happy person, doesn't drink, smoke, do drugs, or anything like that. Loves to joke, tell stories, etc etc. And likewise, he was/is very athletic and never pursued his potential. All he wants to do is eat and sleep. We've often kidded that if there were a job for just being a "mattress tester" (aka: Just sleep on it and tell us what you think), it would be too much effort for him. :D
But.... according to the original owner, the horse wasn't this way originally (unlike my brother who was ALWAYS this way). So we're just trying to find something that will help her out. I'm hoping if we can help her feel 'better' and more energetic, she will be more peppy and happy and likewise will perform better. ...
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