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 Veteran
Posts: 227
 
Location: Soon to be outta here:) | I have a crazy fast little mare. She's pretty. Those are her good things lol. She's broke to death off barrels, I ride her in a snaffle, she works like a charm. She's off the track and the girl who bought her started her too fast too soon so I bought her quite a bit blown up. Anyone who has any sort of advice at all, please share. We do tons of slow work, rate every single time we get to a barrel (in drills or on a pattern) work on keeping her shoulders up and hip under her.
I'm going to try and attach some videos here, hopefully I can figure it out lol
Seriously any advice, please share. I'm 90% sure its all my that's causing her to run off, however I'm not sure what I should be doing instead to keep her from running off. So mostly advice on my riding would be great! Thanks!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZ5vhYywgBU
This is about three weeks ago, I ran her in a long shank cervi and a German martingale
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdaaSILNPiI
This was this Wednesday (7/1), I ran her in a long shank Charmayne James ported bit. A 15.7 won it and she ran a 16.5.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIHF_Kr6yPQ
This was earlier this year, in an ed and Martha Wright with a German
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2Tx5GzlKQc
Also earlier this year, same bit as the video above it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=za5FUYLd-V4
Last fall, same set up as videos above
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CspBnugIJE
Last summer, back to the cervi and the German
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sOjCtTq63o
Last summer, cervi and German
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Rt0j-ZZ3P8
Fall of the first year I bought her, in a d ring
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Rt0j-ZZ3P8
Last summer, in the Charmayne James bit again I believe
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xq-Vst3pO9M
Last summer, in the cervi *I think* (start at 1:00)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUoskLbISkc
And my personal favorite, the first run I ever made on her.
I know some of the videos are probably blurry but anything you can see would be helpful! I'm desperate, this horse has so much potential, I just want to get her to work good!
Suggestions on bits too would be good.... the only barrel race we've ever won was in a million dollar bit. She does not like tie downs. She hits them coming out of barrels and stops. We do the German but I'm not sure I like her in it. She feels stiff and like she doesn't want to get down and work in it. (the first video I posted was right after she had her hocks done, chiroed, and went and saw a vet down in OK to work on her a little). So the first two videos are after she had all that work done. But I feel like she maybe needs something to keep that face down? Unless its my riding which is causing her to put it up. Which is very possible. Help please haha.
Thanks!!
I've been doing a ton of rate work with my horse, and I've been riding her in a different bit for everyday riding. I took her to a barrel race, and she's been working so good I decided to give her one more shot to run with nothing on her face.
This was the result of that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juzvSktN31o
So that was fun. She has never in her life done anything like that, she's usually comes in the arena very nice. So, any suggestions for that? I was so caught off guard I'm sure I didn't react right, but Ive never had a horse do that that bad and I didn't know what to do. She wasn't refusing to go in... she wanted to take off and reared when she went to take off. I don't know what happened on third, but she reared again.
I was unimpressed with that so I ran her in the second open and added a martingale:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpUk1D-gfpU
She went in like a champ but I really don't like her first in it. When I went to finish first I felt the martingale resist on how far I could move my hand to get her to come around. And second was my fault I finished her too hard.
I've decided we are for sure over running for a while until I figure this out more. She was working so amazing at home I was thinking it had maybe clicked. Clearly it hasn't.
What in the world do I do about that rearing? I'm not big inn almost flipping over backwards going in the gate.
Edited by LDH 2015-07-09 11:50 PM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 618
| Have you tried just riding her outside the arena ie trail rides or pushing cattle on a ranch, if you can? No barrels, no drills! | |
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Veteran
Posts: 227
Location: Soon to be outta here:) | Yep! She only gets worked on barrels or drills once a week, at most two. We go on trail rides or I just lightly ride her to keep her in shape. If I do too much on barrels she gest hot so I avoid that. She works great off barrels, and she does beautiful slow work. Its just when we run which makes me think its just how I'm riding in a run | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 725
| I have a horse that used to do the same thing! He was a roping horse that I switched to barrels. I think for a period of time when I first started, even though we did hours and hours of slow work, that when we ran into the arena, he was still looking for his steer. One thing that I might suggest is really emphasizing that sit, a stride before each barrel. Really sit hard, think that you need to slam your rear into the saddle and stay glued to your seat, your body language really really affects your horse. From what I saw in a couple of your runs is that your body language says "go" and you never really sit. Sit hard, and about a stride before you even get to the barrel, believe it or not, your horse will feel that and will rate.
Don't add speed too soon!! Don't push to first until your horse is confident, even if you have to lope to first for a year, do it!! Don't add too much speed until your horse is confident enough to handle it. I was in your shoes this winter and really sitting and taking things a little slower has made an incredible difference! I can send you my before and after videos if you'd like. Never Give Up! :)
Edited by IowaCanChaser 2015-07-03 10:19 PM
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
 
| I would quit running her. Start all over with basics. Get control of hips and shoulders. You might find a clinic near you that emphasizes basics. These are well worth the money and time. This horse has absolutely ño rate and the basics are not there. | |
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  Texas Lone Star
Posts: 5318
Location: where ever my L/Q trl is parked | streakysox - 2015-07-03 12:40 PM I would quit running her. Start all over with basics. Get control of hips and shoulders. You might find a clinic near you that emphasizes basics. These are well worth the money and time. This horse has absolutely ño rate and the basics are not there.
I agree,,, I know you said when you slow her down she rates and turns....but she's a runaway freight train with speed.
I suggest getting professional help and I suggest Ed Wright- he's personable and will work with you and the horse till you get results.
Everyone here can give you suggestions, but imo you need pro help, not what we think might or might not work. If you like her enough and she looks like she has plenty of speed then the money you put towards help would be well worth it. Good luck
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 Angel in a Sorrel Coat
Posts: 16030
Location: In a happy place | Aqhaczy - 2015-07-03 12:56 PM streakysox - 2015-07-03 12:40 PM I would quit running her. Start all over with basics. Get control of hips and shoulders. You might find a clinic near you that emphasizes basics. These are well worth the money and time. This horse has absolutely ño rate and the basics are not there. I agree,,, I know you said when you slow her down she rates and turns....but she's a runaway freight train with speed.
I suggest getting professional help and I suggest Ed Wright- he's personable and will work with you and the horse till you get results.
Everyone here can give you suggestions, but imo you need pro help, not what we think might or might not work. If you like her enough and she looks like she has plenty of speed then the money you put towards help would be well worth it. Good luck
I agree. | |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | That one video where you run past the barrels theres no rate you dont help her at all and on the other videos I see a sore horse. | |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| When I went back and finally watched the last video, I can see that this horse is not nearly ready to run this fast. As I said before, horse needs to be slowed down and taught fundamentals before you even think of running this speed.
Take a look at things you are doing. Jodi Nelson is a fantastic trainer and has had huge success in futurities. She had a horse that would work like world champion at home but not at a barrel race. She told me she asked herself what she did differently at home. She used split reins at home. The next barrel race she ran with split reins and placed in the 1D. Personally, I do not know how she ran in split reins. I am not saying run in split reins but do what works. I still think this horse needs fundamentals though.
Edited by streakysox 2015-07-03 10:05 PM
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 Total Germophobe
Posts: 6443
Location: Montana | Southtxponygirl - 2015-07-03 3:30 PM That one video where you run past the barrels theres no rate you dont help her at all and on the other videos I see a sore horse.
This...I definitely saw no rate, and you kept pushing her, not rating her when you get to the barrels. As far as soreness, I'm not a good one at seeing it, especially in a video, unless a horse is three legged lame...I can feel it better when I'm on a horse than I can by seeing it...well, my own horses any ways. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 227
Location: Soon to be outta here:) | Thanks for all of the help! The very last video is the first run I ever made on her two years ago. The first video I posted is from this last week. She honestly has been working on fundamentals for two years, since I bought her. At home I ride her in a snaffle and she is light and responsive and works beautiful. I'm not saying that I have control of her hips and shoulders in her runs, because don't, she's a runaway for sure, but I do have it going slow. It just doesn't translate to our runs. One reason I wouldn't want to sell her is because she's so easy to ride outside the barrel arena. She doesn't ever get hot, she does exactly what I ask no questions asked, she can go on trail rides in south Dakota and flat footed walks the whole time. She is awesome to ride when not running a pattern. However, like someone said I really do think its me. Only a handful of other people have ran her, but one girl did amazing on her, had about a perfect pattern, and the other did pretty well too. But neither one of them was really able to tell me what they had done and what I need to do to run her.
As for her being sore, she just had her hocks injected less than two months ago, and has only had 4 runs since then, she gets chiroed every few months, she was just down to Oklahoma to a very well known vet who pretty much goes over them with a fine toothed comb. She had a few other minor things injected. She has had three complete lameness exams, with xrays in the last three months, and has had massages. She has a magnetic blanket, a back on track, and gets sore no more put on religiously. I live with an equine dentist and she has her teeth worked on regularly. I have gone through lots of saddles and am currently borrowing a Caldwell until I can afford one of my own (I'm 19 and in college). She has back on track hock wraps and leg wraps and has a very very talented farrier. She is on ulcers meds and is given them before we ride, before we go anywhere, practically every day. I'm lucky if I get to go to even three barrel races a month because I'm working so much to pay for her to have all of this stuff she needs so its not like she's having her legs run off her. She is ridden 5-6 days a week but 9/10 its just long trotting and loping her down to keep her in shape, so its not like I'm working her crazy hard at home. If she's still too sore to work after I religiously do all of this for her, she probably just needs to be turned out as a broodmare because hundreds of horses get way less preventative care than she does and still manage to work. I 110% agree to make sure that there is no soreness issues when looking at problems with runs, but I honestly don't know how much more I can do for her and still be able to afford to pay my rent let alone feed myself. I'm not saying that she couldn't be sore (and most of this work was done just prior to the first two videos that I posted, so in some of the early ones I could easily see her beings sore yes) but in the recent ones, I am saying that if, after the thousands of dollars I pour into keeping her not sore, she's still sore, she maybe just isn't meant to be a barrel horse because I'm literally running out of options to try for her to keep her not sore lol | |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 499
Location: ARKANSAS | IMHO- an everyone has one..lol i would take this horse back to basics, yes it is BORING, but WELL WORTH IT in the long run. Start by just WALKING your pattern and when your leg gets EVEN with the barrel SIT DOWN and say WHOA. Continue to do this till you feel her start doing this on her own, DO NOT go to the trot till you feel her doing it on her own at EVERY BARREL. When she starts rating herself then you can move up to the trot and DO NOT MOVE YOUR RATE POINT, continue to SIT when your leg gets EVEN with the Barrel,then WALK around the barrel picking up the trot again on the back side and continue onto the next barrel, continue this till she is RATING ON HER OWN, at every barrel, then go to the Slow lope and trot around the barrels. Continue to do this at this speed till she is rating EVERY barrel with almost NO HELP from you other than you sitting in the saddle at the turns and your both doing so in a smooth and relaxed manner ,When you go back to running, the excitement the adreniline,you will find you need to sit just a little sooner than waiting till your leg gets even with the barrel as with speed everything speeds up and by the time you sit it will give her time to say OH moma just sit down and i am supposed to rate, you will find your exact spot adjusting it a foot or two of where you need to sit in a run at each barrel. By Starting all my young horses this way, i NEVER have dropped shoulder issues or anticipation of turning the barrels and running over them, and by the time they are running i can run them bridleless...good luck!!
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 Good Grief!
Posts: 6343
Location: Cap'n Joan Rotgut.....alberta | No barrel work no drills nadda......go chase cows.....try it for a month..and when u go back to a barrel race slow down...get her respecting you........it takes a long time to bring one back down and you have to have patience..........m | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 912
Location: Alabama | Have her vetted. Invest in a calming supplement. Get off her face. She can't tell when you're asking her to rate and turn because it looks like you have constant pressure on her face. You can work on speed transitions away from the pattern as well so she can learn that you giving her her head doesn't mean she has to hit triple A. Nice horse. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 600
Location: Oklahoma & Texas | I watched from 1st video at end to the most recent at beginning . .i can definitely see improvement but my gut says her hocks are sore....she really drags her butt around the barrels great but she goes just a little passed and hangs up...I'd give her a break maybe get her looked at by a different vet but some time off not just from barrels but turned out no heavy riding may help if she has a lot of inflammation give it a chance to heal...if you had her injected once cause they found some soreness maybe she's anticipating the pain from before and learned in her mind to travel like this around the pattern to protect herself...and if she has any lingering soreness she'll keep doing what she knows...this time of year it's hard because everything is going on and lots of races to go to...but she's a nice mare she is definitely quick n snappy and I love how she slides around em I understand why you've invested so much in her. | |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| Not trying to be ugly but this horse, but this hose horse does not have a good foundation.. You need to gradually speed up working correctly before you even think about running as fast as you are in the videos. Again a good clinic would be a good investment. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 231
Location: Nashvegas | Like others have said she needs the basics all over again on the barrels. Off the barrels you need to do rate exercises, think reining. Sit up = speed up, sit down = collection and rate. You need to work on her rate points, like the trainer that is helping me said "they need to slow down coming into the barrel, not rush through it". In other words at the walk, trot or lope they should collect up, get round and slow their pace around the barrel. Also, sometimes having someone else ride/train your horse gives much needed perspective. She is going to be nice, definitely has the speed and it sounds like the mind, so It would be well worth slowing back down to a walk/trot and working back up, I believe. Good Luck!! | |
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 Keeper of the King Snake
Posts: 7622
Location: Dubach, LA | Sell or trade her. I've been there and done that. Life is short. Get yourself a horse you can enjoy. If this was going to work for you, it'd be going by now. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 227
Location: Soon to be outta here:) | Thank you everyone for the advice! She does go work cows about once a week, and like I said we hardly run at all. She honestly does have a good foundation, she just loses it when we run. Off barrels-she rides like a million bucks. We've worked ridiculously hard to get that, when I bought her I was told not to trot her because she 'didn't like it'. So we have had to work super hard for that. I would like to invest more time in the slow work on barrels. I didn't work on the pattern from about last October until this may and just rode her, so I honestly haven't spent much time at all 'retraining' her slow on the pattern. I would love to do that with her and will start working on that! As for being sore, if her hocks are sore there are three vets out there that need a talking to. The one who injected her, and the two that told me she wasn't sore after she had them injected. Thanks though! I will get her checked again soon, but I really do think a combination between my riding and her lack of collection and rate is what's causing our problems. And I'm the person who thinks EVERYTHING is caused by horse being sore and will go to crazy measures to try and fix it.
As for selling her, not an option. One because I paid a lot of money for her and with how I've been running her I couldn't get near what I paid. So I would be paying off a loan for a horse I don't have, and still have no money to buy a different one or even lease one. And honestly, I wouldn't honestly want to sell her. I love ridin her everyday. We might argue everyonce in a while, but when it's good, it's really good. I honestly think she's a really nice horse. I just need to figure out what ican do with her and with me to bring it out I'm her!
Thank you all!! | |
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Expert
Posts: 1543
Location: MI | I would be really interested in what a clinic might do for you guys. I think you have a great mindset for learning, and with an experts eyeballs you might be amazed at how it changes your patterns. Slow work never hurts too, I've just learned so much every time I have gone to a clinic and my horses' runs have drastically changed as a result. | |
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