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 Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
    
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | This isnt in effect until December 2016 but a lot of people may not know it is coming. It will effect a lot of beef producers but chicken farmers too. No medicated feed without a vet prescription.
http://beefmagazine.com/blog/do-new-antibiotic-regulations-challenge-herd-expansion
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Blessed 
Location: Here | I am hearing wormers are included |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | I hadnt heard that but I wouldnt doubt it. While I think we need some regulation for safety, I hesitate to think what will be next.
So far it seems like it will be a big headache for all involved. Typical government red tape. But I guess we will see. |
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 Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | Hopefully it will bring regulation to those that aren't licensed by the FDA and are producing medicated livestock/horse feed.
State Representatives in Oklahoma are very interested in sponsoring legislation that would make feeding our horses safer. |
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Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | Here's an article that actually outlines what some of the implications will be. It's going to be more of a headache for some people and won't likely change much, but at least someone is finally paying attention and that's a step in the right direction.
http://igrow.org/livestock/beef/vfd-rule-finalized-insights-on-changes-in-feed-grade-antibiotic-use/ |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | I am unaware of unlicensed mills making medicated feeds but I am sure there are some. So far it is antibiotics that are going to have to have a vet script. Not too much in the way of contamination issues with ctc in horses but it may very well be a step in the right direction?
But again, could be in the wrong direction if it goes to wormers, then vaccine, then alternative supplements like adequan. We may have to hire a vet every time we give those items, like they do right now at the race tracks. Which means we pay not only administration costs and farm call fee but also the vet retail prices on those items. |
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Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | "CTC" or Chlortetracycline is a HUGE issue when it gets into horse feed. I will see about getting a veterinary toxicologist to come and speak on this subject here. The problem lies in the fact that people don't know that they should even be concerned. They buy the best feed they can afford for their horses trusting that it's safe to feed them...that it's not contaminated by ANY type of medications or that ingredients have been substituted for something lower cost for the mill, but still magically meets the guaranteed analysis.
You know as well as I do that licensing is very subjective. Is the mill where you work licensed? Do they produce medicated feeds? I don't see them on the FDA list. Only mills that use certain medications at certain levels are required to hold a license, thus they are the only ones that are subject to FDA inspection. http://www.fda.gov/downloads/AnimalVeterinary/Products/AnimalFoodFeeds/MedicatedFeed/UCM089534.pdf
Adequan already requires a prescription. I buy my vaccinations from my vet so that I can feel better about how they were handled. I feel like wormers need to be better regulated anyway, they are used incorrectly by the majority of the people who are administering them.
Education is the only thing that is going to help keep horse owners protected and horses safe. Ridiculous counterproductive statements like you have posted only have one purpose....to draw attention to yourself.
Edited by rachellyn80 2015-09-02 1:41 PM
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Blessed
Location: Here | TurnLane - 2015-09-02 1:23 PM I am unaware of unlicensed mills making medicated feeds but I am sure there are some. So far it is antibiotics that are going to have to have a vet script. Not too much in the way of contamination issues with ctc in horses but it may very well be a step in the right direction?
But again, could be in the wrong direction if it goes to wormers, then vaccine, then alternative supplements like adequan. We may have to hire a vet every time we give those items, like they do right now at the race tracks. Which means we pay not only administration costs and farm call fee but also the vet retail prices on those items.
It is very common place. And quite honestly if a mill is making a medicated feed they don't need to be making horse feed. And to continue to do so after they have been made aware of an issue is just irresponsible. |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | rachellyn80 - 2015-09-02 1:39 PM "CTC" or Chlortetracycline is a HUGE issue when it gets into horse feed. I will see about getting a veterinary toxicologist to come and speak on this subject here. The problem lies in the fact that people don't know that they should even be concerned. They buy the best feed they can afford for their horses trusting that it's safe to feed them...that it's not contaminated by ANY type of medications or that ingredients have been substituted for something lower cost for the mill, but still magically meets the guaranteed analysis.
You know as well as I do that licensing is very subjective. Is the mill where you work licensed? Do they produce medicated feeds? I don't see them on the FDA list. Only mills that use certain medications at certain levels are required to hold a license, thus they are the only ones that are subject to FDA inspection. http://www.fda.gov/downloads/AnimalVeterinary/Products/AnimalFoodFeeds/MedicatedFeed/UCM089534.pdf
Adequan already requires a prescription. I buy my vaccinations from my vet so that I can feel better about how they were handled. I feel like wormers need to be better regulated anyway, they are used incorrectly by the majority of the people who are administering them.
Education is the only thing that is going to help keep horse owners protected and horses safe. Ridiculous counterproductive statements like you have posted only have one purpose....to draw attention to yourself.
We are inspected regulary as you know and meet all state and national law requirements. Licensing is for Category I and Type A drugs- none of which we use but I would think you would know this. This is not only about the beef industry that we serve but others, such as a huge poultry issue.
I know CTC isnt good horse horses. I just know the hot button has been ionophores. Much more harmful to horses, as you know.
I am sorry you think I want attention on this subject or that my statements are ridiculous, I am only trying to share knowledege just like you have. It is a step in the right direction. I would think you might be happy to hear about it.
Yes adequan requires a presciption but it does not require that a vet give it. Regulations like this can lead to things such as that. That was my point. I know this group has been highly political and not liking government intervention. I was simply stating my opinion on both sides of how it could come down.
And SG, I might agree with you but when customers continue to purchase not only horse feed but feed creep to their winning horses- someone is going to sell it to them. Even if it is not labeled for horses. Changes have been made for the good and again, I would think that is a positive. All from the national headlines of ADM. Something good from the bad.
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  Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | rachellyn80 - 2015-09-02 1:39 PM "CTC" or Chlortetracycline is a HUGE issue when it gets into horse feed. I will see about getting a veterinary toxicologist to come and speak on this subject here. The problem lies in the fact that people don't know that they should even be concerned. They buy the best feed they can afford for their horses trusting that it's safe to feed them...that it's not contaminated by ANY type of medications or that ingredients have been substituted for something lower cost for the mill, but still magically meets the guaranteed analysis.
You know as well as I do that licensing is very subjective. Is the mill where you work licensed? Do they produce medicated feeds? I don't see them on the FDA list. Only mills that use certain medications at certain levels are required to hold a license, thus they are the only ones that are subject to FDA inspection. http://www.fda.gov/downloads/AnimalVeterinary/Products/AnimalFoodFeeds/MedicatedFeed/UCM089534.pdf
Adequan already requires a prescription. I buy my vaccinations from my vet so that I can feel better about how they were handled. I feel like wormers need to be better regulated anyway, they are used incorrectly by the majority of the people who are administering them.
Education is the only thing that is going to help keep horse owners protected and horses safe. Ridiculous counterproductive statements like you have posted only have one purpose....to draw attention to yourself.
That was kind of rude...... I think that this could be a very productive discussion....no need for that kind of statement is there? |
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Blessed
Location: Here | TurnLane - 2015-09-02 4:55 PM .
And SG, I might agree with you but when customers continue to purchase not only horse feed but feed creep to their winning horses- someone is going to sell it to them. Even if it is not labeled for horses. Changes have been made for the good and again, I would think that is a positive. All from the national headlines of ADM. Something good from the bad.
But many of us buy "HORSE FEED" and in that we have blindly (or used to) place our trust in feed mills to sell us a Safe horse feed. So to say people buy creep feed for their winning horses isn't fair. What about the mills that continue to produce toxic feed labeled for horses? That is what bothers me the most. They know they are risking a horse's health, they have labeled it horse feed, yet it is not safe. |
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 Tough Patooty
Posts: 2615
Location: Sperry, OK | SG. - 2015-09-02 8:31 PM TurnLane - 2015-09-02 4:55 PM .
And SG, I might agree with you but when customers continue to purchase not only horse feed but feed creep to their winning horses- someone is going to sell it to them. Even if it is not labeled for horses. Changes have been made for the good and again, I would think that is a positive. All from the national headlines of ADM. Something good from the bad.
But many of us buy "HORSE FEED" and in that we have blindly (or used to) place our trust in feed mills to sell us a Safe horse feed. So to say people buy creep feed for their winning horses isn't fair. What about the mills that continue to produce toxic feed labeled for horses? That is what bothers me the most. They know they are risking a horse's health, they have labeled it horse feed, yet it is not safe. |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | SG. - 2015-09-02 8:31 PM TurnLane - 2015-09-02 4:55 PM .
And SG, I might agree with you but when customers continue to purchase not only horse feed but feed creep to their winning horses- someone is going to sell it to them. Even if it is not labeled for horses. Changes have been made for the good and again, I would think that is a positive. All from the national headlines of ADM. Something good from the bad.
But many of us buy "HORSE FEED" and in that we have blindly (or used to) place our trust in feed mills to sell us a Safe horse feed. So to say people buy creep feed for their winning horses isn't fair. What about the mills that continue to produce toxic feed labeled for horses? That is what bothers me the most. They know they are risking a horse's health, they have labeled it horse feed, yet it is not safe.
What I can say is I dont know any mill personally that produces toxic feed on purpose. But because of the reports in the last year, changes are being made in testing and education. Everyone should be happy about bringing awareness. Even if others choose to ignore it. |
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Blessed
Location: Here | ACEINTHEHOLE - 2015-09-03 9:08 AM SG. - 2015-09-02 8:31 PM TurnLane - 2015-09-02 4:55 PM .
And SG, I might agree with you but when customers continue to purchase not only horse feed but feed creep to their winning horses- someone is going to sell it to them. Even if it is not labeled for horses. Changes have been made for the good and again, I would think that is a positive. All from the national headlines of ADM. Something good from the bad.
But many of us buy "HORSE FEED" and in that we have blindly (or used to) place our trust in feed mills to sell us a Safe horse feed. So to say people buy creep feed for their winning horses isn't fair. What about the mills that continue to produce toxic feed labeled for horses? That is what bothers me the most. They know they are risking a horse's health, they have labeled it horse feed, yet it is not safe.
do. But those of us that choose horse feed should feel safe from the toxins. But yet we are not. Mills that handle and make cattle
feed are still contaminating horse feed. No changes have been made. The only safe change is to not produce horse feed where other medicated feeds are made |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | SG. - 2015-09-03 11:22 AM ACEINTHEHOLE - 2015-09-03 9:08 AM SG. - 2015-09-02 8:31 PM TurnLane - 2015-09-02 4:55 PM .
And SG, I might agree with you but when customers continue to purchase not only horse feed but feed creep to their winning horses- someone is going to sell it to them. Even if it is not labeled for horses. Changes have been made for the good and again, I would think that is a positive. All from the national headlines of ADM. Something good from the bad.
But many of us buy "HORSE FEED" and in that we have blindly (or used to) place our trust in feed mills to sell us a Safe horse feed. So to say people buy creep feed for their winning horses isn't fair. What about the mills that continue to produce toxic feed labeled for horses? That is what bothers me the most. They know they are risking a horse's health, they have labeled it horse feed, yet it is not safe.
do. But those of us that choose horse feed should feel safe from the toxins. But yet we are not. Mills that handle and make cattle
feed are still contaminating horse feed. No changes have been made. The only safe change is to not produce horse feed where other medicated feeds are made
And the ADM issue is being addressed internally for separate facilities. So focus on the good that is happening and the education that has been shared. Even if many choose to ignore it and buy feed made where meds are used. |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | What it boils down to is that, previously, the feed mills didn’t require safe handling of medicated feeds either through their own ignorance or greed or that of LOTS of horsemen who didn’t require it…..my opinion on Turn’s post is that, NOW, with the government stepping in, the regulations will be burdensome and very costly.....then watch the "horsemen" b*tch......... |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | I can see both sides to this. Regulations or no, I think that education of the horse industry is the most effective thing. If you want to feed cattle feed to your horse, go ahead. Most of us want the best for our horses. This means that new alternative choices will start popping up. The feed mill has become an entity that is more interested in cost than health, contamination or not. Whole ingredients are coming back because they never really should have left. |
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 BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25352
Location: Bastrop, Texas | I have two comments:
1.) Beware of unintended consequences.....you may get what you ask for, as has been suggested.
2.) If anyone posting on this thread is involved in litigation, I would think your attorney would tell you that comments on this subject on a public forum would be ill-advised. |
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Tough Patooty
Posts: 2615
Location: Sperry, OK | NJJ - 2015-09-03 12:43 PM What it boils down to is that, previously, the feed mills didn’t require safe handling of medicated feeds either through their own ignorance or greed or that of LOTS of horsemen who didn’t require it…..my opinion on Turn’s post is that, NOW, with the government stepping in, the regulations will be burdensome and very costly.....then watch the "horsemen" b*tch......... And not just horsemen.. ranchers and farmers as well. From my understanding is, if they want to feed a medicated feed.. they will need a vet script, then it will have to be sent to the feed mill to produce enough feed for the amount of cattle they have (ton/head situation). What farmer do you know will be able to afford the extra cost of having a vet involved in feeding their cattle.. not to mention extra cost at the feed mill, because they may not be able to mass produce like they do now.. they will have to have a script before they can run a batch and then just THAT specific amount for that farmer/rancher.
Edited by ACEINTHEHOLE 2015-09-03 2:52 PM
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 Saint Stacey
| TurnLane - 2015-09-03 9:52 AM
SG. - 2015-09-02 8:31 PM TurnLane - 2015-09-02 4:55 PM .
And SG, I might agree with you but when customers continue to purchase not only horse feed but feed creep to their winning horses- someone is going to sell it to them. Even if it is not labeled for horses. Changes have been made for the good and again, I would think that is a positive. All from the national headlines of ADM. Something good from the bad.
But many of us buy "HORSE FEED" and in that we have blindly (or used to) place our trust in feed mills to sell us a Safe horse feed. So to say people buy creep feed for their winning horses isn't fair. What about the mills that continue to produce toxic feed labeled for horses? That is what bothers me the most. They know they are risking a horse's health, they have labeled it horse feed, yet it is not safe.
What I can say is I dont know any mill personally that produces toxic feed on purpose. But because of the reports in the last year, changes are being made in testing and education. Everyone should be happy about bringing awareness. Even if others choose to ignore it. Back the turnip truck up. TurnLane...are you seriously justifying selling medicated cattle feed to horse owners because "if someone is going to feed creep to their horses, someone is going to sell it to them"? How many horses is your mill responsible for when it comes to ionophore intoxication? Because your statement appears to be really jacked up and just plain WRONG given the whole mess. Business as usual I guess. Wow....just.... WOW. What about all those people that bought HORSE feed on good faith, only to end up with sick and/or dead horses? While I appreciate you trying to get the info out there, please don't treat some of us like we can't put 2 and 2 together and come up with 4. I'd appreciate your info a lot more if you hadn't justified selling it like you did in that above quote. I really hope I'm misunderstanding what you said. |
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