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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 974
  
Location: USA | Ok, so about how far back should you check your free runner to prepare them for the turn? I know it's different for each horse, but ballpark it for me. I can't seem to get the timing down on my free runner and I either rate her way too soon and we lose time, or I check her too close to the barrel and she goes past it a step. I think if I had a specific distance in my head I coud guage it better when running to the first. And, we're not going full throttle to the first - just a slow gallop. We've done slow work out the wazoo, we're just starting to add speed but I can't seem to get my butt with the program and get my timing where it needs to be. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks y'all! |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 357
Location: Colorful Colorado | Try checking her about 2 strides away from the barrel. You can always bump her again if you need to.
Edited by nothinbutdust 2015-09-16 9:05 PM
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 Go For It!
 
Location: Texas | IMO... You should get her to work the barrels on her honor so that you don't have to "check" her. The more she works on her own the faster she will be.
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The Resident Destroyer of Liberal Logic
Location: PNW | grinandbareit - 2015-09-16 7:23 PM
IMO... You should get her to work the barrels on her honor so that you don't have to "check" her. The more she works on her own the faster she will be.
THIS!!!!!!!
I have slowly been transitioning my free-runner from his "I need to be checked" style to my "I want you to work on your own" style. It has taken a LONG time, but oh gosh is it worth it - and we get along WAAAAAAAAY better now. In our day-to-day work, I reinforce his rate points with half-halts while keeping his hip under him and always encouraging collected, correct forward motion. I also make sure to ALWAYS ask for a downward transition or a stop with my SEAT before my hands, that way when I get to the barrel pen and sit down he thinks "Oh right, slow down, mom's butt is sitting deep."
We also practice speeding up and slowing down, and moving in or moving out on a circle using only my seat. This has helped TREMENDOUSLY.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 974
Location: USA | grinandbareit - 2015-09-16 9:23 PM IMO... You should get her to work the barrels on her honor so that you don't have to "check" her. The more she works on her own the faster she will be.
Sounds like a good plan, but I'm not sure it would work for this mare. But, I'm open to try anything. What's the best way to go about implementing this? |
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Go For It!
Location: Texas | Dreamingofcans - 2015-09-16 9:59 PM
grinandbareit - 2015-09-16 9:23 PM IMO... You should get her to work the barrels on her honor so that you don't have to "check" her. The more she works on her own the faster she will be.
Sounds like a good plan, but I'm not sure it would work for this mare. But, I'm open to try anything. What's the best way to go about implementing this?
Try to remember that those issues begin in other places. If she's pushy and ignoring you at the barrels, then chances are she's being pushy outside the arena as well. She may get that nose out, head in the air and pull on your hands when you try to get a hold of her. When you sit deep in your saddle your horse should respond to your body language by stopping or slowing down. If she isn't doing that then you need to go back to the basics and get her listening to your body... if she responds well outside the arena and the problem only exists through the pattern, then you need to get her to relax around the barrels. Two different issues... two different solutions. Which one is she doing? I'm guessing she's being pushy all the time.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 974
Location: USA | grinandbareit - 2015-09-16 10:16 PM Dreamingofcans - 2015-09-16 9:59 PM grinandbareit - 2015-09-16 9:23 PM IMO... You should get her to work the barrels on her honor so that you don't have to "check" her. The more she works on her own the faster she will be. Sounds like a good plan, but I'm not sure it would work for this mare. But, I'm open to try anything. What's the best way to go about implementing this? Try to remember that those issues begin in other places. If she's pushy and ignoring you at the barrels, then chances are she's being pushy outside the arena as well. She may get that nose out, head in the air and pull on your hands when you try to get a hold of her. When you sit deep in your saddle your horse should respond to your body language by stopping or slowing down. If she isn't doing that then you need to go back to the basics and get her listening to your body... if she responds well outside the arena and the problem only exists through the pattern, then you need to get her to relax around the barrels. Two different issues... two different solutions. Which one is she doing? I'm guessing she's being pushy all the time.
No, she's not pushy all the time at all - it's only in the arena - and only certain ones at that. She is never relaxed in this specific indoor arena, but I'm bound and determined to get her past whatever issue she has it. She knows to turn the barrel, but if I let her do it on her "honor", it wouldn't be smooth or pretty. She still needs guidance, she's far from being a finished horse. She does respond to my body language and verbal commands - too bad I'm apparently a mute when running the pattern   |
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Go For It!
Location: Texas |
Post a video. We may have different ideas of pushy. ;)
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 974
Location: USA | grinandbareit - 2015-09-16 11:39 PM Post a video. We may have different ideas of pushy. ;)
Video of a run or just flat work in the arena?
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Go For It!
Location: Texas | Dreamingofcans - 2015-09-17 12:06 AM
grinandbareit - 2015-09-16 11:39 PM Post a video. We may have different ideas of pushy. ;)
Video of a run or just flat work in the arena?
Both, if you can.
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Expert
Posts: 4766
Location: Bandera, TX | I had a horse about 10 years ago that fits your ?
He could fly and lose his brain in the vacuum of the alley if anything blew his confidence. If I could keep him in the zone watch out. I resorted to a quick stop a few times in the very big outdoor pens to have him capture the inside leg at the perfect timing point. He was a big horse and the only horse I've ever run that could go consistently under 17 on standard. However, he was deadly inside in small pens like San Antonio, San Angelo and Abilene when he had a wall to run into. He actually would run real good in an outdoor pen if he made several runs in the smaller indoors. I would have to take him to places to get his confidence up when he started to dread me getting on to him if he didn't respond to my seat. He had a very very sensitive mouth and I to this day I say he was the hardest horse I ever rode due to his mouth. He didn't like a hack but was fine in the quick stop. I just had to touch him with about 2-5 lbs of pressure and he would swap ends. I sat about two strides out when he was running on his own. As I began to kick him his junior year of running I had to quit kicking about three strides away and sit real deep about a stride and a half. If he didn't respond by shortening his stride I would do a small check. But just as the others have stated before me the more they can do on their own the smoother and the faster he was.
Concentrate on the spot that you want her to set her inside hock and build her up into the frame necessary to get the hindend engauged. Go back to fundamentals practice your half haults at speed and if they are falling apart in the dry work don't take her to the barrels till she's getting 80% or better on them. I worked on me and it sure helped him to get his rate point to first. first things first you be totally assured that you have a lock on the position to sit and the position you need her to be in her athletic frame. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 966
Location: Loco,Ok | Problem strarted when you added speed.The horse is running through the turn.The ones I get and com ehere for help.As the horse speeds up the rider is most times not ready for that speed.Speed disrupts everything All horses work slow It only when speed is added the problem start.
What most all do is the horse speeds up the rider starts to set up a bit straighter and pull a little more.The faster they go most always the rider pulls a bit more along.You cant push and pull at the same time.The horse is fine with speed its the rider.Espically if this is the first horse had that can and does step up to that level.There is speed and oh s***t speed.
What I have found here they are out of their comfort zone.And trying to pull the horse back to speed they are comfortable with.
A horse will run into pull.Then they squeeze with their leg to keep their balance on the horse.Thats push.And pull with the rein.
Then you quit breathing Anxious with make you do that.Then you cant judge distance and loose focus.
Send him hard to first barrel set him hard about 15ft from it and set still Let the horse settle right there and both of you get still and quiet for a bit Pet him rub his mane.Turn the switch off for just a bit.Then walk the turn.Get your body in the run and turn position.Dont start the turn untill your both in postion to make it smooth.Untill the plane of the barrel is behind your knee.
Do this at all three You relax bend your back dont pull so much.Use your feet more.You support your feet with your hands.A horse can turn with foot pressure.
Make sure your not setting up to straight and squeezing with leg and pulling with your hand.If your gripping the reins with your fist and squeezing so hard your elbos are against your side you make your upper body stifff that will make your horse stiff.
Do you feel many times you are behind your horse.Thats why.Stirrups to long.Then you reach for them.Head comes back Back gets stiff and shoulders open up and pull Then behind the horse.I deal wtth runners a good deal.Not just barrel horses calf horses also.Take them out of the trap bind.Quit pulling and pushing Relax let them settle and relax and focus Most of them will respond favorably.And they see barrels just a little.They know what they are and where they are.Just need coficence built up.If the horse does fine first time We go do other things.All of them go outside on cattle and have other things to do.Barrels need to be fun and a place to rest.
Just food for thought
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 Balance Beam and more...
Posts: 11511
Location: 31 lengths farms | Clampitt....
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Go For It!
Location: Texas | clampitt - 2015-09-18 9:32 AM
Problem strarted when you added speed.The horse is running through the turn.The ones I get and com ehere for help.As the horse speeds up the rider is most times not ready for that speed.Speed disrupts everything All horses work slow It only when speed is added the problem start.
What most all do is the horse speeds up the rider starts to set up a bit straighter and pull a little more.The faster they go most always the rider pulls a bit more along.You cant push and pull at the same time.The horse is fine with speed its the rider.Espically if this is the first horse had that can and does step up to that level.There is speed and oh s***t speed.
What I have found here they are out of their comfort zone.And trying to pull the horse back to speed they are comfortable with.
A horse will run into pull.Then they squeeze with their leg to keep their balance on the horse.Thats push.And pull with the rein.
Then you quit breathing Anxious with make you do that.Then you cant judge distance and loose focus.
Send him hard to first barrel set him hard about 15ft from it and set still Let the horse settle right there and both of you get still and quiet for a bit Pet him rub his mane.Turn the switch off for just a bit.Then walk the turn.Get your body in the run and turn position.Dont start the turn untill your both in postion to make it smooth.Untill the plane of the barrel is behind your knee.
Do this at all three You relax bend your back dont pull so much.Use your feet more.You support your feet with your hands.A horse can turn with foot pressure.
Make sure your not setting up to straight and squeezing with leg and pulling with your hand.If your gripping the reins with your fist and squeezing so hard your elbos are against your side you make your upper body stifff that will make your horse stiff.
Do you feel many times you are behind your horse.Thats why.Stirrups to long.Then you reach for them.Head comes back Back gets stiff and shoulders open up and pull Then behind the horse.I deal wtth runners a good deal.Not just barrel horses calf horses also.Take them out of the trap bind.Quit pulling and pushing Relax let them settle and relax and focus Most of them will respond favorably.And they see barrels just a little.They know what they are and where they are.Just need coficence built up.If the horse does fine first time We go do other things.All of them go outside on cattle and have other things to do.Barrels need to be fun and a place to rest.
Just food for thought
In theory this sounds great, but it won't always work... We want a horse on his honor at the barrels. If you don't hold on with your legs, you are going to fall off. One of the main things that we learn in our coaching clinics is that SQUEEZE DOES NOT MEAN GO. When we squeeze with our legs we are asking our horse for collection, not speed. I get a ton of horses that are so sensitive to leg pressure that they become nervous and jiggy when you apply it. I would love to go into more detail, but I'm rushed for time... We have a clinic this weekend and I should be at the store right now, lol.
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 Coyote Country Queen
Posts: 5666
| Good advice given already. Something a clinician told me several years ago with my free-runner was to always be thinking whoa. He was going to run, I just had to help prepare him for the turn. And that meant I had to really focus on my body position and sitting deep in the saddle. I also had to find a bit that he liked. I found that he hated the curb chain touching him, and even if I had a light bit on him, he would put his nose out and brace against it. I put a rope nose combo on him, which can be a lot of bit, but then I only needed a very light touch on the rein to get him to gather up and turn. With me riding correctly and headgear that he liked, I could send him from the back of the alley and he'd find that first barrel. Honestly, I think the biggest issue was my body position, because there were several times when I got my fingers tangled in his mane and couldn't do much with the reins, but as long as I kept riding he turned the first. Really focus on where you want your horse's feet to go around the barrel, and ride to those points. Consistency is the key. Ride to the same points every time and your horse will gain confidence. I would not be asking for speed until you have the consistency. The speed will come, but if you try to go faster than you and your horse are capable of, you're setting yourself up for long-term issues. |
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