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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
         Location: North Dakota | My horse is perfect on his right lead. He lopes along at a nice pace and responds well to neck reining with a couple half halts here and there if he does get a little quick. But his left lead is the opposite. He wants to lean in on the corners and constantly tries to speed up. No matter what I do to slow him down and rebalance him, he doesn't seem to "get" it. I know this can just be a strength issue, but have you heard of it being caused by any other physical issues? If it is just strength, is there anything other than just cantering around and around that helps strengthen both sides equally? |
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 Expert
Posts: 1482
        Location: on my horse | cavyrunsbarrels - 2015-09-25 12:29 PM
My horse is perfect on his right lead. He lopes along at a nice pace and responds well to neck reining with a couple half halts here and there if he does get a little quick. But his left lead is the opposite. He wants to lean in on the corners and constantly tries to speed up. No matter what I do to slow him down and rebalance him, he doesn't seem to "get" it. I know this can just be a strength issue, but have you heard of it being caused by any other physical issues? If it is just strength, is there anything other than just cantering around and around that helps strengthen both sides equally?
my mare was bad for that but to the right, physically I'd done what I needed to do to get her balanced and so I started from the training point of view.
What I did for her was really work on pushing her shoulders and hips around, I would bring her nose in and lift her shoulders and push her hip out while loping then tip her nose to the outside and push her hip in and lift/move her shoulder out. I started at a trot to make sure we both understood the mechanics of what I was asking so think loping to the right our body shape was this / then I would change it to be this \ lol. From there I would work on loping with straightness while still making sure I had her shoulders lifted and her hind end engaged and would work on loping squares instead of circles, basically picking 4 points where I would really stand her up straight and ask her to move her shoulders.
The other thing I did a lot of was "unity circles" to steal Nicole Aichele's term, where I loped her "C" shaped with both front and hind following the same bend and shoulders elevated. That helped a bunch too.
Finally counter cantering! it seems counter productive (teehee see what I did there) but I've found that when they are physically and mentally ready it helps balance them out. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
     
| How much training has the horse had, is the horse broke?
Is this a new thing?
How long have you been riding the horse?
How old is the horse?
When was the last vet check? |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
         Location: North Dakota | cheryl makofka - 2015-09-25 1:55 PM How much training has the horse had, is the horse broke? Is this a new thing? How long have you been riding the horse? How old is the horse? When was the last vet check?
He's pretty well broke. I wouldn't say COMPLETELY finished but he has a good understanding of the basics. He's 7, I bought him a year ago. I only rode him a few times (and I did not notice the issue then) before he got strangles, then an abscess, then the back pain which turned out to be kissing spine. So he was not ridden until mid july and I've been slowly getting him in shape since then. He was last seen by the vet in May but in march or april we were still trying to figure out the back thing so did flexion tests and x-rayed his hocks. The vet said he had very very minor changes in his rt hock but that it was so minor injections would be a waste of money at this point. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
     
| On the flexion test what was his graded lameness on the right?
I don't know much about kissing spine, but I would be asking the vet if kissing spine could be causing pain and causing him to drop his shoulder.
From what I have been told if they are not turning circles a certain direction it is the opposite hind leg.
So this would make sense if he has arthritic changes on the right he has worse circles to the left.
A lot can change in a few months, just because the horse has minor changes doesn't mean the horse is not in pain, it is like people everyone has a different pain tolerance.
I would also have chiro and massage work on him, if this doesn't resolve the issue, I would be heading back to the vet |
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The Resident Destroyer of Liberal Logic
   Location: PNW | I would check his left stifle. Stifle issues usually present on the outside of circle and are usually a VERY good suspect in horses not picking up a lead. Good luck! |
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 Jr. Detective
      Location: Beggs, OK | cavyrunsbarrels - 2015-09-25 2:26 PM cheryl makofka - 2015-09-25 1:55 PM How much training has the horse had, is the horse broke? Is this a new thing? How long have you been riding the horse? How old is the horse? When was the last vet check? He's pretty well broke. I wouldn't say COMPLETELY finished but he has a good understanding of the basics. He's 7, I bought him a year ago. I only rode him a few times (and I did not notice the issue then) before he got strangles, then an abscess, then the back pain which turned out to be kissing spine. So he was not ridden until mid july and I've been slowly getting him in shape since then. He was last seen by the vet in May but in march or april we were still trying to figure out the back thing so did flexion tests and x-rayed his hocks. The vet said he had very very minor changes in his rt hock but that it was so minor injections would be a waste of money at this point.
If he wasn't being ridden much if at all when he was last seen by the vet, the issue may not have been apparent at that time. Now that you're trying to use him it's starting to cause him problems. |
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| Forget running barrels on him and make him into
a good trail and family horse to sell ..
and stay out of the arena ..
Now go buy you a healthy horse
that is worth spending your time and money on!!
Your ongoing vet bills should make this easy to happen!!
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
           Location: Florida.. | Now that your working him his hock and or stifle can be hurting and alot can change in months.. also xrays can show minor but horse can be fusing and be in pain.. so I disagree with vet .. |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
         Location: North Dakota | cheryl makofka - 2015-09-25 3:02 PM
On the flexion test what was his graded lameness on the right?
I don't know much about kissing spine, but I would be asking the vet if kissing spine could be causing pain and causing him to drop his shoulder.
From what I have been told if they are not turning circles a certain direction it is the opposite hind leg.
So this would make sense if he has arthritic changes on the right he has worse circles to the left.
A lot can change in a few months, just because the horse has minor changes doesn't mean the horse is not in pain, it is like people everyone has a different pain tolerance.
I would also have chiro and massage work on him, if this doesn't resolve the issue, I would be heading back to the vet
No lameness at all. She just saw it on the x-ray. And just to clarify, he has NO trouble picking up or maintaining either lead. |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
         Location: North Dakota | BARRELHORSE USA - 2015-09-25 6:25 PM
Forget running barrels on him and make him into
a good trail and family horse to sell ..
and stay out of the arena ..
Now go buy you a healthy horse
that is worth spending your time and money on!!
Your ongoing vet bills should make this easy to happen!!
He is not, nor will he ever be a barrel horse. I'm no speed demon so he and I stick to trails, western dressage, and low level mounted shooting. He's a wonderful horse and I love him to death and if it turns out he needs surgery on his back or hock injections or whatever I'm happy to do it because he's very special to me and worth it. The plan is in a year or so to be working in the career I want, and then maintaining any physical issues will not be an issue financially. |
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  Sock eating dog owner
Posts: 4553
     Location: Where the pavement ends and the West begins Utah | Sore hocks and bad shoeing could cause this. But you can use a correction bit and running martingale while making a circle put left hand forward with a slightly shortened rein and lift your hand toward the moon.place your left leg on his side and your right leg off his side. You should feel him come up under himself . |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
         Location: North Dakota | cow pie - 2015-09-25 9:40 PMSore hocks and bad shoeing could cause this. But you can use a correction bit and running martingale while making a circle put left hand forward with a slightly shortened rein and lift your hand toward the moon.place your left leg on his side and your right leg off his side. You should feel him come up under himself . He is prone to stone bruises and tenderness because he has thin soles but he's shod now (and they do an awesome job) and he hasn't had any more issues. I do exactly what you described but just with a snaffle and I have to work REALLY hard. Especially if he's had a couple days off or it's windy and cool and he's got some extra energy. Also, can I ask why a correction bit? I'm just curious, I know what they are but know nothing beyond that.
Edited by cavyrunsbarrels 2015-09-26 8:04 AM
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  Twin Sister to Queen Boobie
Posts: 13315
       Location: East Tennessee but who knows?! | Every colt that I've ever started and most horses I've legged back up have been fast on one lead and have wanted to drop a shoulder or cut. I usually do a ton of transitions on the ground and under saddle and that helps quite a bit. I also work a whole lot on lateral work loosening up the shoulders and hips so I can move them over if I need to too. I do a lot of work on making circles bigger and smaller. Counter canter will help strengthen one too. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 396
     
| Was he previously roped on? Have a horse been roped on 15 years. I am always up in arms on the left lead. For 2 years we've been working on it. |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
         Location: North Dakota | oranges - 2015-09-26 6:57 AM Was he previously roped on? Have a horse been roped on 15 years. I am always up in arms on the left lead. For 2 years we've been working on it.
No roping, just lightly started on barrels (like just loping) before I bought him. But I see where that could happen to a rope horse. Another thing, when I was taking pics of his back for saddle fitting I noticed his shoulders ARE uneven so he definitely has a strong side/weak side. I think I'll try seeing if it gets better with more work as he's finally remembering that he knows how to do lateral work and if it doesn't improve/gets worse I'll have the vet take another look. She's over an hour away and I don't have a trailer so getting there is kind of a big ordeal (I don't trust the local vet for anything remotely related to lameness). |
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
           Location: Florida.. | Fairweather - 2015-09-26 7:21 AM Every colt that I've ever started and most horses I've legged back up have been fast on one lead and have wanted to drop a shoulder or cut. I usually do a ton of transitions on the ground and under saddle and that helps quite a bit. I also work a whole lot on lateral work loosening up the shoulders and hips so I can move them over if I need to too. I do a lot of work on making circles bigger and smaller. Counter canter will help strengthen one too. Agree... if no pain issue. I thought she said he was sore I Might have read it wrong. Id still do a Flex test and go from there.. but I agree with the exercises. Since hes been down for so long start over basics and do these exercises to build him up..He is leaning running because he cant hold the balance or he is sore. How is he on a lunge line? can he hold it then? hes still a bit young in his training if hes been off for awhile.. rebuild him.. also make sure your balance isnt throwing him off..alot of riders Barrel racers I see tend to lean to that side.. you need to Pick him up with your hip pelvis and leg on that side and put your weight more center outside.
Edited by Bibliafarm 2015-09-26 8:25 AM
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
         Location: North Dakota | Bibliafarm - 2015-09-26 8:22 AM Fairweather - 2015-09-26 7:21 AM Every colt that I've ever started and most horses I've legged back up have been fast on one lead and have wanted to drop a shoulder or cut. I usually do a ton of transitions on the ground and under saddle and that helps quite a bit. I also work a whole lot on lateral work loosening up the shoulders and hips so I can move them over if I need to too. I do a lot of work on making circles bigger and smaller. Counter canter will help strengthen one too. Agree... if no pain issue. I thought she said he was sore I Might have read it wrong.
Id still do a Flex test and go from there.. but I agree with the exercises. Since hes been down for so long start over basics and do these exercises to build him up..He is leaning running because he cant hold the balance or he is sore. How is he on a lunge line? can he hold it then? hes still a bit young in his training if hes been off for awhile.. rebuild him.. also make sure your balance isnt throwing him off..alot of riders Barrel racers I see tend to lean to that side.. you need to Pick him up with your hip pelvis and leg on that side and put your weight more center outside.
He has never shown one iota of soreness with the flexion tests both when I bought him a year ago or in the spring. He always picks up the correct lead and has no trouble holding it under saddle, on the lunge, or at liberty. We do a LOT of transitions especially on the lunge, and they're getting smoother. We've been doing more and more lateral work. He was rusty at first but he is having more "OMG I KNOW THIS!" moments every ride. I don't *think* I'm leaning at all. I need to drag my sister out to video me so I can see myself, but I'm very conscious of my position. I'll confess, despite being a member on here I have competed in barrel racing exactly one time but have done dressage for years and years, so while I'm out of shape, I KNOW how I need to sit and ride. Hopefully in the spring I'll start lessons with my old dressage instructor again, just for some backup and continuing education for both Cash and I. |
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
           Location: Florida.. | cavyrunsbarrels - 2015-09-26 12:07 PM Bibliafarm - 2015-09-26 8:22 AM Fairweather - 2015-09-26 7:21 AM Every colt that I've ever started and most horses I've legged back up have been fast on one lead and have wanted to drop a shoulder or cut. I usually do a ton of transitions on the ground and under saddle and that helps quite a bit. I also work a whole lot on lateral work loosening up the shoulders and hips so I can move them over if I need to too. I do a lot of work on making circles bigger and smaller. Counter canter will help strengthen one too. Agree... if no pain issue. I thought she said he was sore I Might have read it wrong.
Id still do a Flex test and go from there.. but I agree with the exercises. Since hes been down for so long start over basics and do these exercises to build him up..He is leaning running because he cant hold the balance or he is sore. How is he on a lunge line? can he hold it then? hes still a bit young in his training if hes been off for awhile.. rebuild him.. also make sure your balance isnt throwing him off..alot of riders Barrel racers I see tend to lean to that side.. you need to Pick him up with your hip pelvis and leg on that side and put your weight more center outside. He has never shown one iota of soreness with the flexion tests both when I bought him a year ago or in the spring. He always picks up the correct lead and has no trouble holding it under saddle, on the lunge, or at liberty. We do a LOT of transitions especially on the lunge, and they're getting smoother. We've been doing more and more lateral work. He was rusty at first but he is having more "OMG I KNOW THIS!" moments every ride. I don't *think* I'm leaning at all. I need to drag my sister out to video me so I can see myself, but I'm very conscious of my position. I'll confess, despite being a member on here I have competed in barrel racing exactly one time but have done dressage for years and years, so while I'm out of shape, I KNOW how I need to sit and ride. Hopefully in the spring I'll start lessons with my old dressage instructor again, just for some backup and continuing education for both Cash and I.
I was just giving you some opinions and advice.. glad hes getting better!!..and the fact he doesnt have issues on lunge line is a good thing..... from our past conversations via messeging last year or times before I didnt realize you have done dressage for years and years :) anyway good luck. |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
         Location: North Dakota | Bibliafarm - 2015-09-26 11:38 AM cavyrunsbarrels - 2015-09-26 12:07 PM Bibliafarm - 2015-09-26 8:22 AM Fairweather - 2015-09-26 7:21 AM Every colt that I've ever started and most horses I've legged back up have been fast on one lead and have wanted to drop a shoulder or cut. I usually do a ton of transitions on the ground and under saddle and that helps quite a bit. I also work a whole lot on lateral work loosening up the shoulders and hips so I can move them over if I need to too. I do a lot of work on making circles bigger and smaller. Counter canter will help strengthen one too. Agree... if no pain issue. I thought she said he was sore I Might have read it wrong. Id still do a Flex test and go from there.. but I agree with the exercises. Since hes been down for so long start over basics and do these exercises to build him up..He is leaning running because he cant hold the balance or he is sore. How is he on a lunge line? can he hold it then? hes still a bit young in his training if hes been off for awhile.. rebuild him.. also make sure your balance isnt throwing him off..alot of riders Barrel racers I see tend to lean to that side.. you need to Pick him up with your hip pelvis and leg on that side and put your weight more center outside. He has never shown one iota of soreness with the flexion tests both when I bought him a year ago or in the spring. He always picks up the correct lead and has no trouble holding it under saddle, on the lunge, or at liberty. We do a LOT of transitions especially on the lunge, and they're getting smoother. We've been doing more and more lateral work. He was rusty at first but he is having more "OMG I KNOW THIS!" moments every ride. I don't *think* I'm leaning at all. I need to drag my sister out to video me so I can see myself, but I'm very conscious of my position. I'll confess, despite being a member on here I have competed in barrel racing exactly one time but have done dressage for years and years, so while I'm out of shape, I KNOW how I need to sit and ride. Hopefully in the spring I'll start lessons with my old dressage instructor again, just for some backup and continuing education for both Cash and I. I was just giving you some opinions and advice.. glad hes getting better!!..and the fact he doesnt have issues on lunge line is a good thing..... from our past conversations via messeging last year or times before I didnt realize you have done dressage for years and years :) anyway good luck. No, no I appreciate it! That's what I came here for. I just like to give as many details as I can. And yes, dressage was my first love ever since I was in elementary school. At different points I tried hunter/jumper, western pleasure, some barrels, etc. but always go back to dressage because it helps my riding SO much. And of course I like the mounted shooting now too, but they're obviously not mutually exclusive.
Edited by cavyrunsbarrels 2015-09-26 12:05 PM
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