|
|
Regular
Posts: 57
| Hello,
I recently sent a horse to a trainer. Was guaranteed 30 rides for a flat amount. Had a signed contract saying there would be additional fees for hauling to races and entry fees. Trainer did a good job with the horse but I noticed I was charged a care fee on the days the horse wasn't rode. In the past trainers I have used have had you pay the fee for the 30 rides and that was the price even if it took them 60 days to do the 30 rides. I have never had to pay additional feed charges unless feed wasn't included in the price for the rides. This has always been stated up front, if you provide feed it is this price is you don't it is this. I do not want this to turn into a negative thread I am just curious industry wide what you have all experienced. Also if there are other fees you have noticed that you were suprised about that are good to watch for. Thank you! |
|
| |
|
 Expert
Posts: 1718
  
Location: Southeast Louisiana | I thought it was normal for the trainer to charge by the month. The only other cost breakdowns I have heard of was feed provided or you provide feed, and of course fees if they haul one. First time I've heard of the thirty rides, even if it takes sixty days concept. But, I would not expect them to feed and care for them for free on the horse's days off. That sounds fair to me that they charged for it. How is the contract worded? I would think part of the fee you pay is a flat charge for care and feed, regardless. |
|
| |
|
 Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | I am completely skeptical of the 30 rides marketing tactic. I don't trust those trainers. The only way to make it work would be to charge feed separately.
We charge by the month and my biggest pet peeve is people who are concerned most with "how much will my horse be ridden?" Our price is training, plus feed and board only. That is standard practice for almost 100% of reputable trainers.
Edited by Tdove 2016-01-05 8:33 AM
|
|
| |
|
Regular
Posts: 57
| Thank you. The idea behind it at least in our area is the fact that if you send a horse for 30 days and you only get 10 rides you aren't really getting what you paid for. I know some traininers don't offer a certain number of rides which can be frustrating. The contract didn't mention anything about extra fees charges and when I had asked about it originally it was mentioned either. I let the trainer know my concerns since I have never had this come up and they acted like it was common practice so I was curious to see how many others had ran into it since I have sent to several trainers through the years and never had it come up. |
|
| |
|
Regular
Posts: 57
| Tdove - 2016-01-05 6:06 AM
I am completely skeptical of the 30 rides marketing tactic. I don't trust those trainers. The only way to make it work would be to charge feed separately.
We charge by the month and my biggest pet peeve is people who are concerned most with "how much will my horse be ridden?" Our price is feed and board only. That is standard practice for almost 100% of reputable trainers.
Thank you, I agree but also disagree because I don't think it is fair for someone to pay for a month and the horse barely gets touched. I trust that this trainer put the 30 rides on and did a good job with my horse just was suprised with an extra $100 added to my bill when she wasn't there that long. When I had asked about it the trainer made it seem like it was common but of all the years of sending out horses personally as well as through my family it has never came up so I was curious how common it was in other areas.
|
|
| |
|
 Sorry I don't have any advice
Posts: 1975
Location: Sunnyland Florida | Tdove - 2016-01-05 7:06 AM I am completely skeptical of the 30 rides marketing tactic. I don't trust those trainers. The only way to make it work would be to charge feed separately. We charge by the month and my biggest pet peeve is people who are concerned most with "how much will my horse be ridden?" Our price is feed and board only. That is standard practice for almost 100% of reputable trainers.
I'm not sure what you mean asking why people are so concerned about their horse being ridden 30 times in a month. That is my biggest concern! I'm not paying for a month for my horse to be ridden 15 or 20 times. The trainers I use ride 30 days a month, and they keep the horse extra days (free) if they didn't meet the 30-ride per month minimum. I'm not paying them to board my horse, I'm paying them to train them.
|
|
| |
|
Regular
Posts: 57
| Runaway - 2016-01-05 7:43 AM
Tdove - 2016-01-05 7:06 AM I am completely skeptical of the 30 rides marketing tactic. I don't trust those trainers. The only way to make it work would be to charge feed separately. We charge by the month and my biggest pet peeve is people who are concerned most with "how much will my horse be ridden?" Our price is feed and board only. That is standard practice for almost 100% of reputable trainers.
I'm not sure what you mean asking why people are so concerned about their horse being ridden 30 times in a month.  That is my biggest concern! I'm not paying for a month for my horse to be ridden 15 or 20 times. The trainers I use ride 30 days a month, and they keep the horse extra days (free) if they didn't meet the 30-ride per month minimum.  I'm not paying them to board my horse, I'm paying them to train them.
  Â
I completely agree! This was why I was asking the question because I have never heard of this before and said trainer acted like it was common practice. |
|
| |
|
  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | crashlyashley - 2016-01-04 11:29 PM Hello, I recently sent a horse to a trainer. Was guaranteed 30 rides for a flat amount. Had a signed contract saying there would be additional fees for hauling to races and entry fees. Trainer did a good job with the horse but I noticed I was charged a care fee on the days the horse wasn't rode. In the past trainers I have used have had you pay the fee for the 30 rides and that was the price even if it took them 60 days to do the 30 rides. I have never had to pay additional feed charges unless feed wasn't included in the price for the rides. This has always been stated up front, if you provide feed it is this price is you don't it is this. I do not want this to turn into a negative thread I am just curious industry wide what you have all experienced. Also if there are other fees you have noticed that you were suprised about that are good to watch for. Thank you!
That is how the good one works that I have used this summer. She puts 30 days on them and it took her nearly 2 1/2 months. I was only charged what she charges for 30 days, plus extra for farrier. I truly think she works more on where she thinks a horse should be in 30 rides vs just riding them 30 days, because she kept them longer when she thought they needed more fine tuning and what I got back were excellent horses. |
|
| |
|
 Maine-iac
Posts: 3334
Location: Got Lobsta? | I have a couple different experiences. One trainer was a flat $700 fee - included everything but shoeing. However I was not guaranteed how many times being ridden. I have a horse at a trainers now, I pay a daily rate depending on if the horse is ridden or not. My bill is broken down to number of rides = x amount$ and than just board for the days not ridden. |
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | I expected to ruffle a few feathers there, but there are some things you should consider:
1. No trainer rides a horse 30 days in a month.
2. It's not good for a horse to be worked that much, especially on a long term basis
3. You should be more concerned with the results and quality of training a horse receives in a months time.
4. Your trainer can only work so much, no different than you...
Reputable trainers know this, and the people that all they care about is number of rides, really don't have the best interest of their horse or their trainer in mind. It's usually a good indicator of a bad customer. If you are so concerned about a potential trainer not riding your horse enough, then you need to find a different trainer or reevaluate your expectations.
We have had only one client that pulled her horse out of training because 5 rides a week (Once only 4) was robbery to her. However, she was thrilled at well her horse was doing. No one that has this position has ever been a professional horse trainer. If your horse does not get ridden enough, a reputable professional will let you know and reduce your charges accordingly. Industry standard is 5 days a week and sometimes that is not always achieved. I do not know of any top trainer that charges by number of rides. If there are, they are very, very, very few.
Edited by Tdove 2016-01-05 8:37 AM
|
|
| |
|
 Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | Tdove - 2016-01-05 8:28 AM 1. No trainer rides a horse 30 days in a month. 2. It's not good for a horse to be worked that much, especially on a long term basis 3. You should be more concerned with the results and quality of training a horse receives in a months time. Reputable trainers know this, and the people that all they care about is number of rides, really don't have the best interest of their horse or their trainer in mind. It's usually a good indicator of a bad customer. If you are so concerned about a potential trainer not riding your horse enough, then you need to find a different trainer or reevaluate your expectations. We have had only one client that pulled her horse out of training because 4-5 rides a week was robbery to her. However, she was thrilled at well her horse was doing. No one that has this position has ever been a professional horse trainer. If your horse does not get ridden enough, a reputable professional will let you know and reduce your charges accordingly. Industry standard is 5 days a week and sometimes that is not always achieved. I do not know of any top trainer that charges by number of rides. If there are, they are very, very, very few. ^^ this. I don't know any that rides very many horses that keeps up with the exact number of days they're riden. I wouldn't ever want a young horse riden every single day for a month. 4-5 days a week is perfectly fine. It's a set monthly rate plus farrier and vet costs.
Edited by MS2011 2016-01-05 8:39 AM
|
|
| |
|
Sorry I don't have any advice
Posts: 1975
Location: Sunnyland Florida | Tdove - 2016-01-05 9:28 AM I expected to ruffle a few feathers there, but there are some things you should consider: 1. No trainer rides a horse 30 days in a month. 2. It's not good for a horse to be worked that much, especially on a long term basis 3. You should be more concerned with the results and quality of training a horse receives in a months time. 4. Your trainer can only work so much, no different than you... Reputable trainers know this, and the people that all they care about is number of rides, really don't have the best interest of their horse or their trainer in mind. It's usually a good indicator of a bad customer. If you are so concerned about a potential trainer not riding your horse enough, then you need to find a different trainer or reevaluate your expectations. We have had only one client that pulled her horse out of training because 5 rides a week (Once only 4) was robbery to her. However, she was thrilled at well her horse was doing. No one that has this position has ever been a professional horse trainer. If your horse does not get ridden enough, a reputable professional will let you know and reduce your charges accordingly. Industry standard is 5 days a week and sometimes that is not always achieved. I do not know of any top trainer that charges by number of rides. If there are, they are very, very, very few.
Maybe it's the state I'm in (Florida), but most full-time trainers I know ride 30 days a month. All of mine have come back sound, and much progress is made in repetition - 30 days in a row. I do know a few who take Sundays off. Barrel horse trainers (not colt-breakers, but trainers putting barrel patterns on) who compete in barrel racing may skip competition days.
|
|
| |
|
Maine-iac
Posts: 3334
Location: Got Lobsta? | I like the fact I receive the two different rates. I know my horse is ridden by him only and when he is doing a clinic or competition for a few days, I'm not being charged for that. |
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | How much does a trainer charge that rides a horse 25-30 rides a month charge?
You do realize that a considerable amount of training fees make up feed and board? This means if a horse has to be kept longer, because of missed riding days, it costs the trainer more money to do so. Why would anyone expect not have to pay for those days?
How many hours do you work a week? A professional trainer, putting even 6 days a week on every horse, would be working 60-65 hours a week (every week).....and hard work to boot. Seems to me like if a person expects that, they are a unreasonable boss who cares very little about their trainer, especially making the statement, "I am paying them to train, not board my horse".
Now if a trainer charges you for a month of training and rides them 7 times.....then you have a big beef for sure, and you need to find a different, and honest trainer. That happens "a lot". Usually, by cheap and fly-by-night trainers.
Edited by Tdove 2016-01-05 9:29 AM
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 2685
| so not to steal the thread or anything but I do have a question/ scenario. Say you pay your trainer in full at the beginning of the month (Ex $800 for 4 weeks of training) and 1 week in, the horse gets hurt while turned out at the trainers house and has to be on 2 weeks of stall rest for stitches. The injury did not cause any lameness that requires time off but vet wants the horse immobilized to let the laceration (skin deep) heal and so the stitches hold well. What do you expect to pay the trainer for those 2 weeks? Full training? ($200/wk) or discounted or what? |
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | Good question, I think it would depend on the amount of work involved in the recovery. Here is how I would handle:
We charge $400/month for training and $400/month for board for a total of $800/mo. We do not charge up front, but after the training has occurred. I can see both sides of the "when to pay" issue. In a different circumstance of being on our own, I would probably do prepay.
If the horse was injured in your scenario and required just normal boarding for those two weeks, I would charge you $600 for the month, assuming the horse returned to training at week 3. However, if the horse's recovery required a lot of attention for bandages, doctoring, etc. Then I would charge additional to the normal prorated board, appropriate to the amount of work and care involved.
I do know some trainers that charge full training, regardless. Their reasoning is that you pay for a training stall. If your horse is using that stall, for whatever reason, then you are taking up space that another horse could be in training. So even if you took your horse home for a couple of weeks, you would be charged full training. I don't personally think that is correct, but I can still see their point of doing so, especially if they have a waiting list.
Edited by Tdove 2016-01-05 9:44 AM
|
|
| |
|
 Coyote Country Queen
Posts: 5666
| It seems like each trainer has different billing methods, so it would seem wise to ask for specifics about billing. Communication is the key, and it should be the responsibility of both parties to make sure that there is no confusion about expenses and expectations. I don't train for a living, but will occasionally take in an outside horse. I do not get 30 rides on a horse in 30 days. I feel like they need a day or two off throughout that time to recover physically and mentally. And sometimes life and the weather don't cooperate. I want the owners to get what they are paying for, but I have to cover expenses. So I came up with a rate that works for me, which is to charge per ride, plus a daily feed charge. I suppose that if I trained for a living I would come up with a monthly rate to make the billing process much easier. |
|
| |
|
Good Ole Boys just Fine with Me
Posts: 2869
Location: SE Missouri | I've been the owner and the trainer.
I charged a monthly fee and it MOST OF THE TIME it was 5x's/week riding and feed, that was the standard. If it was a ground work day, that counted as a training day.
The trainer (well known and awesome, lol) that I sent my gelding too was also a monthly feed that included riding and feed. I wasn't guaranteed anything nor did I expect to be. Maybe he needed 4 days a week and one day was just biting up,, maybe he did get rode 5x's a week. Don't know don't care. I got my moneys worth, he looked great, worked good, and I spent a couple hours (they insisted) riding him before I brought him home.
I don't work 7 days a week, I do my job efficiently and effectively. I expect the same for anyone providing services to me as well.
|
|
| |
|
 Expert
Posts: 2128
| If you pay for 30 days of riding and believe those rides are done consecutively, you may be naive. Not directing that at the OP just stating in general.
My husband rides 5 days per week, sometimes 6. So in reality a horse is with him 5-6 weeks to get 30 rides.
He charges feed separate. Stall/ feed/care is 5$ a day, which is about what someone pays to care for their horse at home (if kept in a stall).
The way he bills benifits both parties. If it storms/for whatever reason the horse is not ridden, the customer is not charged a ride fee for those days. You only pay for what has been completed.
Customers are given these details prior to bringing a horse, and recieve a detailed invoice at the end of each billing period.
Someone said "we arent paying a trainer to board a horse, just to ride it". Ok, so a trainer is supposed to eat the cost of feeding, grooming, trimming, cleaning stalls caring for your horse? I think not. Would you rather haul your horse daily to a trainer for sessions? You are leaving your horse for someone else to care for, and ride.
Edited by scwebster 2016-01-05 2:51 PM
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 2685
| scwebster - 2016-01-05 2:34 PM
 If you pay for 30 days of riding and believe those rides are done consecutively, you may be naive. Not directing that at the OP just stating in general.
My husband takes horses in on 30 ride incriments. He rides 5 days per week, sometimes 6. So in reality a horse is with him 5-6 weeks to get 30 rides.
He charges feed separate. Stall/ feed/care is 5$ a day, which is about what someone pays to care for their horse at home (if kept in a stall).
The way he bills benifits both parties. If it storms/for whatever reason the horse is not ridden, the customer is not charged a ride fee for those days. You only pay for what has been completed.
Customers are given these details prior to brining a horse, and recieve a detailed invoice at the end of each billing period.
Someone said "we arent paying a trainer to board a horse, just to ride it". Ok, so a trainer is supposed to eat the cost of feeding, grooming, trimming, cleaning stalls caring for your horse? I think not. Would you rather haul your horse daily to a trainer for sessions? You are leaving your horse for someone else to care for, and ride.
Â
$5/ day is cheap for stall maintenance, feed & hay! |
|
| |
Folks on-line