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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 387
 
| This could just be my frustration talking, but when do you call it quits and move on, she aint gonna make you a barrel horse??
I bought this Filly last fall, she is cowbred on the top shining spark/Docs Jack Frost and Captial Flight and Streakin La Jolla on the mares side.
I know the full history on this Filly, she was mostly left untouched till i got her, I sent her away to my trainers and then i got her back.
and I have taken her to the vets, I have her on omeprazole just as a precaution and to ensure she does not have ulcers. she is in great shape, shiny slick coat, nice round back and perfect shape! shes on a great feed program.
but here's my problem with her, even since the trainers he couldn't get by her, and I've been riding her steady and I'm just working on getting her quiet and to be able to lope/trot a cirlce without losing her mind!
I have never had a horse this fragile minded, she is by far the most athletic horse I've stepped foot on, she is so quick and catty on her feet, but some days a roll back is too much for her to handle. I am a quiet rider, too quiet most times, she has never been beaten or pushed too hard by anyone in her life, but for some reason her mind is just wanting to be 50 steps ahead of me.
she is 5 this year and nominated up, but I know that dream is out the window, she would be fried if I pushed her! we have a nice little amateur rodeo association up here and Ideally that would be my goal with her, but when she crawls out of her skin when I brush her with my spur I don't know if its gonna happen
In the last months my big accomplishments with her are being able to lope a cirlce with her picking up the correct lead and having her nice and relaxed. she is dramatic, if I ask her to stop shes making 11's even if i ask her at a walk, if i ask her to move her shoulders she drops and spins to far, Im just asking for a step or too. I know these arnt bad traits to have, but her mind is just so fragile.
is it worth it to me to keep taking her slow and hoping one day shes gonna be able to handle being pushed, going to rodeos? or should I be thinking about letting her go. I know this post doesn't sound like shes hard to get by, but I cant explain it better.
has anyone gotten by a fragile minded horse? or are they always stuck in their way? | |
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 Straight Shooter
Posts: 5725
 
Location: SW North Dakota | If you really love her, do you have somewhere to send her where she could have a real job? Like feedlot, ranch, etc? Not to be tortured, just to do an honest day's work, get tired, learn patience and work ethic? If you love her, that's definitely where I'd go with her. A 10 hour day of finding and moving cows tends to encourage them to be less reactive (meaning OVER reactive) and teaches them to save their energy for a long day.
If you are thinking you don't like her, I'd cut my losses now. In my old age, if I decide I don't like them, they are gone, even if they're really nice and have all the potential in the world. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 264
| I would look into some diet changes.
I had a cow bred colt that was very similar to yours. He was amazing and at the same time a liability. I was at the point of sending him down the road, so I pulled him off all the commercial grains and expensive supplements. It was about a week later when I noticed he was starting to relax and not try to crawl out of his skin. Rice bran and a vitamin was all I needed.
What feed program is she on? | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 672
| I have one like that, or she used to be. She has gotten better with age, she is 14 now and will still lose her sh!t if not handled right or gets overwhelmed. I raised her from a baby & my dad broke her so I know nothing ever bad happened to her, she's just like that. I kind of like them like them a little nutty! Lots of confidence & patience 
What are you feeding her? Might be diet related.
Edited by veintiocho 2016-01-29 10:05 AM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 512
| ND3canAddict - 2016-01-29 9:52 AM
If you really love her, do you have somewhere to send her where she could have a real job? Like feedlot, ranch, etc? Not to be tortured, just to do an honest day's work, get tired, learn patience and work ethic? If you love her, that's definitely where I'd go with her. A 10 hour day of finding and moving cows tends to encourage them to be less reactive (meaning OVER reactive) and teaches them to save their energy for a long day.
If you are thinking you don't like her, I'd cut my losses now. In my old age, if I decide I don't like them, they are gone, even if they're really nice and have all the potential in the world.
Great advice! My thoughts too.. We actually bought a horse like this. He was 6 and green. My husband was also just learning and insisted he wanted that horse. After 4 years I can say he is a heck of a nice horse! He eventually grew out of it-lots of wet saddle pads and patience! | |
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 Cute Little Imp
Posts: 2747
Location: N Texas | Every horse is different, but here's the story on mine. I got him as a coming three-year-old, with about 6-7 months of training. The guy who trained him specializes in reined cowhorses and rodeo horses. His wife was telling me that he trains his horses to where if he asks something, he wants a response NOW. So my gelding was super reactive. I would try to flex him and he'd go into this hurried spin. He was basically always on edge, waiting for me to give him his next cue, so that he didn't get in trouble for not responding fast enough.
So I spent a lot of time doing slow stuff, taught him to flex without thinking he had to go into a spin, and he learned to relax because he realized I wasn't going to get after him every single time I asked him to do something.
So my suggestion is to be really soft with your cues and spend a lot of time doing slow stuff. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 1857
| I prefer a horse to be more reactive than not. Take the spurs off, take the bit out of her mouth, keep it simple. How much time was spent desensitizing her? Not just to bags and sounds but to touch and pressure? | |
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Expert
Posts: 1226
| I had one like this and I rode in the round pen for a year. Yes it was boring but it built his confidence. I also put him on a ulcer program. It helped tremendously and he turned out to be a great horse | |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 575
| This is obviously NOT the case with them all, but this sounds like a typical Shining Spark thing. They are 'sensitive souls' for sure. | |
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BHW's Simon Cowell
Location: The Saudia Arabia of Wind Energy, Western Oklahoma | I wouldn't want to put a lot of time into a horse like that because usually running barrels on them makes them that much worse if they are fragile minded. Very few of those make in my opinion. I'm sure there are some that medicate horses like that but I don't care for ones you have to do that with. | |
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 Miss Laundry Misshap
Posts: 5271
| It sounds like she really wants to work. I don't see where that is a bad thing.
Take off the spurs, she obviously doesn't need them, put her in a chain snaffle or some kind of side pull, and let her relax.
Take her out and trail ride, take her to the local sorting and let her look at a cow, teach her something more than w/t/c - cavalettis, walk-trot the pole pattern, drag logs, whatever that isn't picking at her going in a circle all the time.
She's gotten so used to being picked on in a circle, she probably thinks she's going to get in major trouble if she doesn't stop on a dime, doesn't lope off perfect, takes a step out of a rollback. Major trouble doesn't have to be beating her with a stick. It can be loping for hours trying to get that perfect level headed calm lope. Let her be a little more free. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 807
Location: New Mexico | Give her something to do and let her work. Perhaps the fragile mind is yours... 
I have a one that's similar, very dramatic, an overachiever. I treat her like any of my others and try not to overthink it. If I do, she becomes very insecure, which is not what you want, ever. | |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Give her a chance, take off your spurs change her feed and make sure bit is not to much for her and check saddle fit, treat for uclers, if this was my horse I would be checking for everything under the sun befor I threw the towel in. Ok I saw that she was treated for uclers but I would still be checking for everything, but not all horses are made for running barrels. Good luck with her. | |
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 pressure dripper
Posts: 8696
Location: the end of the rainbow | I wish I had the room and the money for her. I want her so bad I can taste it. I would love to try a shining spark. It take me so long to get a horse going & patterned & hauled that horses like this suit me, mostly because I am super lazy. Lol. By the time.most of my colts are ready to go they have the patience of saint just from having to pack my fat old lazy butt around. And they are usually around 7 or 8. Lol. | |
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 Balance Beam and more...
Posts: 11493
Location: 31 lengths farms | My little mare CC was always what everyone called fragile minded, even Ed Wright would ask "hows your fragile minded mare doing?" WAsn't until she got hurt in 2011 at 8 years of age, fractured her patella and we spent literally 10 months on the ground handwalking on flat ground, then over cavelettis, then up hills, then ponying her for the last 2 months of that time that I realized she is not fragile minded at all but really did process thing completely differently than any thing else I'd ever ridden. She was terrified of being in trouble, got scared of being scared, obsessed over everything, the dog, the rope, the butterflies. When she'd get scared she would try the flight mode, when you pulled on her to keep her from fleeing, if you grabbed her face with both reins and got your legs into her she flat broke in half as in her mind you you were stopping her forward movement with your hands yet your legs were telling her go and she had one way to go and that was up. The 10 months on the ground with her was the best thing that ever happened, I figured her mind out and realized how hard she really was trying to absorb the lessons but she was also scared the whole time that she was going to be wrong and it came out as her being bi-polar where really it was more a Type A personality with a side ofADHD. Once we got that figured out and I changed my approach to how we went about things and she has been a rock star for the most part since. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 929
| I also have a Shining Spark...and this seems to be the case with them. However, mine is older and when I got her I am now the 8th owner on her registration papers. got in contact with one of her old owners as well as looking up her name. Did the cutting futurities at 3, didn't make the "cut," got sent to a barrel horse trainer and did barrel futurities at 5. Now she's even more blown out and got sent to a team roper...some more people, and then my friend who sold her to me cheap because I was the only person who could stay on her.
it took me 3 months just to get this horse to stand still while riding. Seriously. We would saddle up, go into the arena and stand there doing nothing for 15 minutes. She would flip her head, fidget, swing her hips, and dance in place the whole time and I would just have to sit there and pet her. Barrels and poles were out of the question as she would go NUTS if they were even in an arena. Now I have had her 2 years, and after lots of trail rides and just hanging out, we have won the 4D with me not pushing her and just kind of taking it easy as she is a true free runner.
I have learned that for this type of horse you CAN'T get angry or frustrated as you may as well just get off. You have to be quiet yet firm in the fact that their "hotness" won't get them out of doing something. You just have to stop, let them settle, and go back to it. Even if it takes a while. Of course, like someone else said, if you don't have this kind of time it would be best to send her on down the road to someone who has more time. She might make an awesome open rodeo horse, but if my mare's story is anything...a futurity will probably blow her out completely. Just my $0.02 | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 672
| run n rate - 2016-01-29 2:17 PM
My little mare CC was always what everyone called fragile minded, even Ed Wright would ask "hows your fragile minded mare doing?" WAsn't until she got hurt in 2011 at 8 years of age, fractured her patella and we spent literally 10 months on the ground handwalking on flat ground, then over cavelettis, then up hills, then ponying her for the last 2 months of that time that I realized she is not fragile minded at all but really did process thing completely differently than any thing else I'd ever ridden. She was terrified of being in trouble, got scared of being scared, obsessed over everything, the dog, the rope, the butterflies. When she'd get scared she would try the flight mode, when you pulled on her to keep her from fleeing, if you grabbed her face with both reins and got your legs into her she flat broke in half as in her mind you you were stopping her forward movement with your hands yet your legs were telling her go and she had one way to go and that was up. The 10 months on the ground with her was the best thing that ever happened, I figured her mind out and realized how hard she really was trying to absorb the lessons but she was also scared the whole time that she was going to be wrong and it came out as her being bi-polar where really it was more a Type A personality with a side ofADHD. Once we got that figured out and I changed my approach to how we went about things and she has been a rock star for the most part since.
Haha! That is what he said about my mare! He helped me to realize she always needed a way out of the pressure (any) or she would blow. She didn't always use the way out, but mentally needed to know it was there. | |
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Member
Posts: 49
| Glad to hear someone who barrel races would be interested in a shining spark bred horse. I've got a daughter of twice as shiney ( son of shining spark) who I've bred to my Frenchmans Guy stud. The filly will be a year old this spring. She's a sweetie with people, but I can tell she has ambitions of being a future boss mare with the other horses. She seems like she will be quick to react and sensitive, probably not going to be a dead head. I think she will be fun to ride. | |
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 Veteran
Posts: 274
| Ever thought of trying something to keep her steady? Something like Fluphenazine?
Edited by Warriors Mom 2016-01-29 2:40 PM
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Straight Shooter
Posts: 5725
Location: SW North Dakota | Not saying this is the case with anyone here, but sometimes riders work way too hard to "get around" a fragile minded horse, and they end up worse. That's why I think a real, blue-collar job is the best bet. They have to focus on the task at hand. They have to work through getting tired. They have to figure out how to deal with their "disability." If the rider is patient, but firm and helps them focus and gain confidence, the might always defaut to being sensitive, but they have some life-skills built up to function. Plus, if they've worked for a living, they might find barrel racing to be a pleasant reward- rather than stressful.
I had a mare that was super sensitive, she'd puff up and want to buck if she was overwhelmed. I'd squeeze half a buttcheek and she'd be finished with her 4th spin before I could unclench. Luckily, we ranch in some rough badlands country, so I used her for checking water and moving pairs in 17,000 acres. The first few days weren't fun for either of us, but I loved her, so I kept taking her. Most of what we did was power walking up and down hills on a loose rein- for hours on end. After a couple of weeks, and a lot of tight spots, she learned that it was easier to relax and wait for a command than over-react 9000 times a day. On the off days, we'd work the barrels for a little bit and she'd get pampered. If she'd get wadded up, we'd get past it by doing "brain engage" drills like half-passing, hip yields, etc- but it was never a big deal. Once the wad cleared, we'd carry on like nothing happened. I'm sure no one gives a hoot about this story, but the moral is: She turned out to be a ton of fun. Once she quit wigging out, I allowed compromises with her. I chose my battles, and we understood each other. In addition to becomming a pretty decent barrel horse, she was also my very favorite ranch horse. She still had her quirks, but we understood and trusted each other. | |
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