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 Extreme Veteran
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Location: USA | I have a gelding that was running in the 1-d - 2-d consistently a year ago. Now, he has stopped wanting to turn the first barrel. Sometimes he'll run in like he's going to commit, then on the back side where he should start to straighten out and push off for the 2nd barrel, just stops and comes up. Other times, he is reluctant to even run to the barrel, he will fade left, and not stride out and run. I have had him checked for lameness issues, and had his hocks injected. No improvement.
I am thinking ulcers, so I started him on Ulcergard 3 days ago, in hopes I see an improvement. I have read to treat them intstead of spending that money to get them scoped.
my question is how do I know if its hind gut, versus gastric ulcers? I don't want to be giving him this expensive stuff if it's not doing any good. Can I or should I treat him for both at one time? What is recommended for hind gut? PLEASE HELP!!
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 Expert
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Location: IL | I'd start with the omerprazole and see where it goes. My mare was showing signs of being better in 48 hours. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2457
| THE Gastroplus.
Nothing better out there for ulcers. |
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Expert
Posts: 2531
Location: WI | Could be bleeding, may be best to have him scoped. It's really not that expensive. |
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Veteran
Posts: 112
| My mother in law has been struggling with an outside horse that has the same issue. got his guts scoped last week and it turns out he had ulcers but they were caused by a HUGE wad of bot fly eggs! We were told to treat him with zimmectrin |
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Expert
Posts: 1531
Location: Oklahoma | IME I would think bleeding before ulcers as generally ulcers means cinchy , nervous , not liking being brushed, not blooming from feed , alley sour, crowhopping at canter ... But as my vet said treat and maintain w feed as it is sooo common.
Bleeding usually wo physical signs of blood and or coughing : run off to 1st , or shut down after 3rd , up and down speed : sometimes firing sometimes not , nervousness and alley sour also. Scope n find out . |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 346
Location: USA | He did have phenomonia last summer. I had him scoped after we treated for that and the vet said he looked great. Can they tell if they are bleeders if they scope them at rest?
I thought he quit working cause of the pneumonia, but he still has the same issue now. He does get a little irritated when I saddle, cross fires a lot and just seems mad and irritated all the time.
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 999
Location: Sunny So Cal | THE GastroPLUS |
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  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | THE GastroPLUS, gastric and hing gut ulcers. $118 for 30 scoops shipped. That lasts roughly a month. Then you can usually go to their Performance Formula or Muscle Mass and have ulcer prevent added as a special blend. Those run $60 and $70 respectively for 80 scoop bags (2 1/2 months worth). |
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Expert
Posts: 3514
| Oakley - 2016-04-18 11:49 AM
He did have phenomonia last summer. I had him scoped after we treated for that and the vet said he looked great. Can they tell if they are bleeders if they scope them at rest?
I thought he quit working cause of the pneumonia, but he still has the same issue now. He does get a little irritated when I saddle, cross fires a lot and just seems mad and irritated all the time.
They need to scope for bleeding after running. Does he cough after running? Is his breathing out of the ordinary? Go to Walmart and buy Aloe Vera Juice. Give 30 ccs about 15 minutes before he eats morning and night. If it is ulcers, you should be able.to see a difference in about 48 hours. The aloe Vera calms the stomach. What are you feeding? I would get him on Vitalize High Performance . It is 125.for a 50 lb bag.and last a horse about 90 days. It has both a prebiotic and Probiotic. I also.feed Kool
Speed Plus.
Edited by readytorodeo 2016-04-18 2:22 PM
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 Owner of a ratting catting machine
Posts: 2258
| A lot of times issues with first barrel, especially on the back side, can be front end issues. I'd certainly ask the vet to scope and do a BAL looking for bleeding, but first I'd ask to have an ultrasound done on front suspensories. Looking for lung bleeding is always a good idea on any horse, I've discovered. Checking for ulcers is a great idea, especially if a horse is in pain somewhere, it will sometimes be expressed with ulcer issues.
Do you have access to a vet with a lameness locator? It's worth traveling for on issues that aren't obvious to the human eye. We can't see a hitch that's 1/8 of an inch difference, but a locator will pick it up. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 639
Location: God's country...aka TEXAS | I would scope for bleeding as well. The symptoms can be similar to ulcers. I would go ahead and treat for ulcers as well tho. I use OxyUlcer by oxygen. Its a 15 day treatment that heals both front and hind gut ulcers. Its only $250 and works awesome. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 507
Location: Lost in the corn of Iowa. | I've never tried it myself so I am not sure of the accuracy of the test, but you can get a fecal test through SUCCEED, it's a fairly inexpensive test that your vet can get. You grab a fresh sample and take it back to your vet to be sent in and analyzed. The way I understand it is that it tells you if you have hindgut or foregut ulcer. Scoping is the most definitive way to see about ulcers, but if you're not wanting to spend the money on the scope then this might be a cheaper alternative and a place to start. Good luck.  |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 899
Location: Idaho | Oakley - 2016-04-19 6:02 AM
I have a gelding that was running in the 1-d - 2-d consistently a year ago. Now, he has stopped wanting to turn the first barrel. Sometimes he'll run in like he's going to commit, then on the back side where he should start to straighten out and push off for the 2nd barrel, just stops and comes up. Other times, he is reluctant to even run to the barrel, he will fade left, and not stride out and run. I have had him checked for lameness issues, and had his hocks injected. No improvement.
I am thinking ulcers, so I started him on Ulcergard 3 days ago, in hopes I see an improvement. I have read to treat them intstead of spending that money to get them scoped.
my question is how do I know if its hind gut, versus gastric ulcers? I don't want to be giving him this expensive stuff if it's not doing any good. Can I or should I treat him for both at one time? What is recommended for hind gut? PLEASE HELP!!
This sounds like a gelding that I had. He was a 2D barrel horse and solid pole horse, but when I bought him it was from a friend of a friend and when I started running him.. I found out he was blown up. Not to mention had a bunch of stuff wrong with him.. probably why I got him so cheap. He was an awesome trail horse though.. good cow horse.. anything else he did wonderful. But something about that pattern.
Anyway, I got him readjusted, gave him some time off, got his teeth floated, did everything else but barrels.. gave him a year to mentally recover before I started him again. I eventually got him checked out for ulcers, and he did have them. I treated them, and he was a completely different horse. But he still didn't want to run barrels. He would literally set up for a barrel, come off the back set and literally come to dead stop. Then if you made him finish the run, he wouldn't stop and literally try and run into a fence. It ruined him really, and I just don't think he enjoyed them anymore. So I sold him as a trail horse.
For the vet, you don't have to get them scoped.. take a fecal sample to your vet and get it checked out for blood. It costs like $30. If it is positive, then your horse probably has ulcers. Mind you, I know people say just treat and not check.. but treating and maintaining a horse for ulcer's is not a 30 day thing. It is maintenance, it is consistent and for them to HEAL you need to have a LEAST 60-90 days of omeprazole, following by maintenance of 1 cup of aloe vera juice a day which is prevention of reforming ulcers, otherwise it would be all for nothing. So you would be wasting your money to a "what if" rather than a "Yes he does." |
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Member
Posts: 36
| I use a compounded paste from my vet that's Omeprazole and Sulcrafate. Sulcrafate treats the hind gut ulcers. $165 for 30 day treatment. then do preventive stuff. you don't need to treat for 60-90 days. this came straight from my vet. |
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 Hog Tie My Mojo
Posts: 4847
Location: Opelousas, LA | classicpotatochip - 2016-04-18 3:12 PM A lot of times issues with first barrel, especially on the back side, can be front end issues. I'd certainly ask the vet to scope and do a BAL looking for bleeding, but first I'd ask to have an ultrasound done on front suspensories. Looking for lung bleeding is always a good idea on any horse, I've discovered. Checking for ulcers is a great idea, especially if a horse is in pain somewhere, it will sometimes be expressed with ulcer issues. Do you have access to a vet with a lameness locator? It's worth traveling for on issues that aren't obvious to the human eye. We can't see a hitch that's 1/8 of an inch difference, but a locator will pick it up.
Really good advice. Not sure about barrel racing, but with race horses, feet problems can cause a horse to bleed because of the pain causing more exertion due to the difference in how they stride out at full speed. Of course pain and bleeding issues can cause ulcers due to the extra stress involved in a competition run. It is all tied together one way or another, rarely does a performance horse have one single issue, look at the whole horse always. |
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Expert
Posts: 3514
| Barnmom - 2016-04-18 9:18 PM
classicpotatochip - 2016-04-18 3:12 PM A lot of times issues with first barrel, especially on the back side, can be front end issues. I'd certainly ask the vet to scope and do a BAL looking for bleeding, but first I'd ask to have an ultrasound done on front suspensories. Looking for lung bleeding is always a good idea on any horse, I've discovered. Checking for ulcers is a great idea, especially if a horse is in pain somewhere, it will sometimes be expressed with ulcer issues. Do you have access to a vet with a lameness locator? It's worth traveling for on issues that aren't obvious to the human eye. We can't see a hitch that's 1/8 of an inch difference, but a locator will pick it up.
Really good advice. Not sure about barrel racing, but with race horses, feet problems can cause a horse to bleed because of the pain causing more exertion due to the difference in how they stride out at full speed. Of course pain and bleeding issues can cause ulcers due to the extra stress involved in a competition run. It is all tied together one way or another, rarely does a performance horse have one single issue, look at the whole horse always.
I agree with the feet issues. I've dealt with feet issues because of shoers,for over a year. The pain can cause bleeding and ulcers. So yes check the whole horse. |
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Expert
Posts: 2335
Location: IL | miss_n_cinch13 - 2016-04-18 11:09 AM
My mother in law has been struggling with an outside horse that has the same issue. got his guts scoped last week and it turns out he had ulcers but they were caused by a HUGE wad of bot fly eggs! We were told to treat him with zimmectrin
After the zimmectrin did the vet say what you should do next? I have a horse that was loaded with worms and I'm still struggling with stomach issues with her. I know BOTS don't show up in a fecal. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | merdth6 - 2016-04-19 7:49 AM miss_n_cinch13 - 2016-04-18 11:09 AM My mother in law has been struggling with an outside horse that has the same issue. got his guts scoped last week and it turns out he had ulcers but they were caused by a HUGE wad of bot fly eggs! We were told to treat him with zimmectrin After the zimmectrin did the vet say what you should do next? I have a horse that was loaded with worms and I'm still struggling with stomach issues with her. I know BOTS don't show up in a fecal.
When I was having issues with my show horse, we even thought it was EPM. We had him checked by a blood test and sent it in and it came back as he had inflammation somewhere but not EPM. They had me treat him for worms. I can't remember the dewormer they had me use, and then do a heavy round of ulcer meds. I can't say if it made a difference, he was still off so we kicked him to pasture and forgot about him all winter/spring. Then sent him off to be re-started and he is a dream. Point of the story is I think worms/ulcers can cause strange things, a horse to be off but not really lame. |
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Veteran
Posts: 112
| merdth6 - 2016-04-19 8:49 AM
miss_n_cinch13 - 2016-04-18 11:09 AM
My mother in law has been struggling with an outside horse that has the same issue. got his guts scoped last week and it turns out he had ulcers but they were caused by a HUGE wad of bot fly eggs! We were told to treat him with zimmectrin
After the zimmectrin did the vet say what you should do next? I have a horse that was loaded with worms and I'm still struggling with stomach issues with her. I know BOTS don't show up in a fecal.
We turned in a fecal sample on Monday for testing and he will update us from there how to continue based on the results. |
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