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 Elite Veteran
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| Help me solve the mystery please!
7 year old gelding with a light work load. He wasn't picking his leads up correctly and was riding around short and choppy at a lope. Took him to vet #1 and he felt like it was just sore hocks & injected them. Give the horse a week off and get back on and there is no improvement. I felt like the vet didn't take me too seriously so take him to a more specialized lameness vet for another check up. Vet #2 says he has fluid on his stifles and Si and injects both. Come back one month later after only walking and trotting straight lines and doing lots of backing up. Vet #2 says the fluid and swelling are gone and his tendons are back tight again. He also treats him for subclinical EPM. Bring the horse back to work and he is still not wanting to pick his right lead up but his left lead seems better. He is ****y acting and swishing his tail still.
Trailered we him to a team roping to ride around and see the sights and a few minutes after unloading he starts kicking out both back feet. I fly spray him and make sure there's nothing biting or messing with him but he continues to kick out. He quit after about thirty minutes so I saddled him up. He was ****y acting and popped up in the front end. Generally this horse is very willing so I got off of him.
I'm not sure where to go from here.
His signs are : random kicking fits, always has hip cocked and weight off his back feet, general ****y attitude under saddle, not wanting to catch leads correctly, sometimes he eats well and other days acts uninterested in food.
I have had had his teeth checked, treated for ulcers, treated for EPM, had hocks stifles and SI injected and has passed several flexion tests, and has had chiropractor work on him.
Chiro said his poll was out and hips were out and adjusted them.
Any ideas or thoughts? I'm at my wits end.
Edited by sourkiss378 2016-06-03 7:27 AM
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 494
| First thought was ulcers but since you had them treated...not sure. Have you had blood drawn? I had a friend's gelding who had those type of kicking fits and was ****y when he had a kidney infection. I'd say you ruled a lot out already, other than a CBC to see if anything internally is going on. |
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 Did I miss the party?
Posts: 3864
 
| Kicking out makes me think of three things; PSSM, kissing spine and SI. Which I know you said you had injected and hopefully they did ultrasound guided.
I've never had one with EPM or lyme disease (that I know of).
I hope you get it figured out.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 936
| epoh - 2016-05-24 10:04 PM First thought was ulcers but since you had them treated...not sure. Have you had blood drawn? I had a friend's gelding who had those type of kicking fits and was ****y when he had a kidney infection. I'd say you ruled a lot out already, other than a CBC to see if anything internally is going on.
Do you know what they did to treat the kidney infection?
I've thought of taking him to a vet with a lameness locator and see if they can find anything. Will definitely add having blood drawn to the list! |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 936
| barrelracinbroke - 2016-05-24 10:10 PM Kicking out makes me think of three things; PSSM, kissing spine and SI. Which I know you said you had injected and hopefully they did ultrasound guided.
I've never had one with EPM or lyme disease (that I know of).
I hope you get it figured out.
I am going to have the vet draw blood to check for PSSM1. Should I also be having a biopsy done for PSSM2? Or wait for the results of the type 1? Also for the kissing spine their back would be sore correct? I can run my hand down his back and push pretty hard and he does not flinch or act bothered at all. |
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | Id not lean to EPM at all.
did you check for beans?
sounds like hocks did you xray them? I know he was injected.. all joints ? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 936
| Bibliafarm - 2016-05-25 8:13 AM Id not lean to EPM at all.
did you check for beans?
sounds like hocks did you xray them? I know he was injected.. all joints ?
Yes we checked for beans and he did have one and it was removed and he seems to be urinating ok now.
Hocks were last x-rayed in september when I purchased him. I almost wonder if his hocks fusing could cause this? All joints were injected yes. |
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Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | when was his hocks injected?
have you tried giving him BUTE for 3 days and seeing how he was? that may rule out the hock pain. meaning if he is acting better then it can point to hock pain.Id also check for deep thrush
Edited by Bibliafarm 2016-05-25 8:54 AM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 936
| He had his hocks injected in February.
I had put thrush medication on his front feet a few months ago but it cleared up pretty quickly. How would you tell if it would be deep thrush? The farrier thought his feet looked good.
Edited by sourkiss378 2016-05-25 9:14 AM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 494
| sourkiss378 - 2016-05-25 7:09 AM
epoh - 2016-05-24 10:04 PM First thought was ulcers but since you had them treated...not sure. Have you had blood drawn? I had a friend's gelding who had those type of kicking fits and was ****y when he had a kidney infection. I'd say you ruled a lot out already, other than a CBC to see if anything internally is going on.
Do you know what they did to treat the kidney infection?
I've thought of taking him to a vet with a lameness locator and see if they can find anything. Will definitely add having blood drawn to the list!
I'm not sure... I'd assume antibiotics if it was an infection, but I'm not sure if that's the sole thing they use. Kidney stones would also be something to look at. You'll know all of this after you get the CBC back |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 415
| Sounds like my mare who tested positive for pssm type 2, if you want to wait a few months for the hair test to come out you can try a diet change of HIGH protein, added vit e (Natural), and join the forum on fb. Every horse reacts differently to pain but that sounds a lot like my mare. Is he touchy? Like if you were to walk up to him and place your hand on him does he shudder like he's trying to get a fly off? |
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Elite Veteran
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| cheeka77 - 2016-05-25 12:42 PM Sounds like my mare who tested positive for pssm type 2, if you want to wait a few months for the hair test to come out you can try a diet change of HIGH protein, added vit e (Natural), and join the forum on fb. Every horse reacts differently to pain but that sounds a lot like my mare. Is he touchy? Like if you were to walk up to him and place your hand on him does he shudder like he's trying to get a fly off?
No he is not touchy at all. You can rub all over him, brush him, clip, bathe etc.. He loves attention.
He just started the kicking and it has only happened once but he does pick his front foot up and holds it and paws in the air while eating. Don't know if thats a nervous quirk or something related to pain. |
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 Elite Veteran
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Location: Sunny So Cal | Have you tried giving him bute for a few days? If he doesn't get better than you can rule pain as being an issue. Also you can send a CBC and Chemistry to Bob at THE and see if he can figure anything out. He usually finds things in the bloodwork that are often over looked. I would also check for PSSM. Kind of sounds like a candidate. |
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 Sock eating dog owner
Posts: 4553
Location: Where the pavement ends and the West begins Utah | ???? may be hoof abcess and tick on belly. |
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Sock Snob
Posts: 3021
| i still say epm send to dr ellerison |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 936
| He has already been treated for EPM and there were no signs of improvement.
I put his BOT hock boots on him for 3 hours while he was in the stall tonight & when I took them off and let him out he seemed stiff. His back legs seemed straight and stiff and looked like it went up into his hips.
Could it possibly be stifles?? Had those and his SI injected and for a week or so he seemed like he improved but then went back to how he was. The vet doesn't think he needs blistered though. |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8552
Location: sunny california | could be sticky stifles for even an ocd. did you have them xrayed? |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8552
Location: sunny california | put him in a deep sand roundpen and have him trot and lope both directions while videoing the hind end. sometimes you can see it catch |
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Go Get Em!
Posts: 13503
Location: OH. IO | What was the EPM TREATMENT ? ALSO HAVE PELVIS PALPITATED? |
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Did I miss the party?
Posts: 3864
| sourkiss378 - 2016-05-25 5:23 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-05-24 10:10 PM Kicking out makes me think of three things; PSSM, kissing spine and SI. Which I know you said you had injected and hopefully they did ultrasound guided.
I've never had one with EPM or lyme disease (that I know of).
I hope you get it figured out.
I am going to have the vet draw blood to check for PSSM1. Should I also be having a biopsy done for PSSM2? Or wait for the results of the type 1? Also for the kissing spine their back would be sore correct? I can run my hand down his back and push pretty hard and he does not flinch or act bothered at all.
A lot of the barrel horse breeding leans toward type 2. But, I personally think it's worth sending in the $40 and hair sample to rule out type 1 just in case. For type 2, there's a blood test through equi-sec that was part of a study and a hair test is expected soon. Or, yes, you can muscle biopsy. |
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