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Veteran
Posts: 110
| I have owned my mare for almost 2 years. Last year she was hitting the 1D regularly and this year she's been 2/3D. We found a TMJ issue and I contributed most of our issues to that being the root cause. Last weekend she bled out both nostrils for the first time. Not gushing, like some have seen but it was right after her barrel run. She had run poles before so this was her second go of the day. It was 90+ so her heavy breathing wasnt a flag (it should have been). It was super hot!
Obviously, I will get her on antibiotics and investigate using Lasix. My concern is more with long term.
I see a lot of pros/cons of a nebulizer. Thoughts? Is this just a fad? Which one do you recommend?
Amount of time off? some say 10 days, i'm leaning toward 4 weeks.
Daily supplements?
I'm now starting to wonder if this has been going on for a while. Anyone see these issues with a bleeder?
Ducking the second
Twisting her head around the barrels
Acting like she has a bug up her nose
Dragging her nose on the ground
Slower runs
Thanks in advance
Edited by allaboutme2 2016-06-14 9:25 AM
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Location: Not Where I Want to Be | allaboutme2 - 2016-06-14 9:20 AM I have owned my mare for almost 2 years. Last year she was hitting the 1D regularly and this year she's been 2/3D. We found a TMJ issue and I contributed most of our issues to that being the root cause. Last weekend she bled out both nostrils for the first time. Not gushing, like some have seen but it was right after her barrel run. She had run poles before so this was her second go of the day. It was 90+ so her heavy breathing wasnt a flag (it should hev been). It was super hot!
I see pros/cons of a nebulizer. Thoughts? Is this just a fad?
Amount of time off? some say 10 days, i'm leaning toward 4 weeks.
Daily supplements?
I'm now starting to wonder if this has been going on for a while. Anyone see these issues with a bleeder?
Ducking the second
Twisting her head around the barrels
Acting like she has a bug up her nose
Dragging her nose on the ground
Slower runs
Thanks in advance
everyone one of those could be a symtom of bleeding.
30 days off, antibiotics, and then make sure she is conditioned well.
Work with vet for treatment and prevention protocol. Supplements may help a little, but they are not going to stop it.
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 639
Location: God's country...aka TEXAS | Yes, those are all symptoms. Some develop ulcers also from the anxiety of running while bleeding. When they bleed they feel like they are drowning. She needs to have a month off to allow her lungs to heal properly with antibiotics. Breathing treatments will help a lot. I use equi resp. I also use bleeder stop and oxygen 2X and I don't have to use lasix. But mine was not a bad bleeder. It just depends on the horse and the severity.
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 999
Location: Sunny So Cal | I like THE Pulmon-EZ, has worked wonders on my horse and definitely something too look into. Also I would do it during those 30 days off. I give my horse 1 scoop a day and then 2 days before the event I go back to 2 scoops and then go back to 1 scoop the day after the event is over. Just my protocal 
edited to add no lasix needed
Edited by Cowgirl Kat 2016-06-14 10:28 AM
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Regular
Posts: 68
| I REALLY like THE products!
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 Saint Stacey
| I would take a more aggressive stance than just adding a neubulizer or breathing product. Like 1DSoon said, antibiotics and a month off. While this might be an isolated case, you have to be really careful that you don't turn the horse into a true bleeder.
Did the horse cough prior to expelling the blood? I'd start on Lasix for a few months along with the supplement you go with. Make sure it is under control and stopped first. Then gradually work down the Lasix and hopefully you won't have a problem. |
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Veteran
Posts: 110
| SKM - 2016-06-14 9:21 AM I would take a more aggressive stance than just adding a neubulizer or breathing product. Like 1DSoon said, antibiotics and a month off. While this might be an isolated case, you have to be really careful that you don't turn the horse into a true bleeder. Did the horse cough prior to expelling the blood? I'd start on Lasix for a few months along with the supplement you go with. Make sure it is under control and stopped first. Then gradually work down the Lasix and hopefully you won't have a problem.
I am doing the antibiotics and time off. I was trying to see what people think are the best long term treatment options. She never coughed and gave no indication she was "off" in a significant way. This is one of those horses that would run 3 legged if you asked her to. She is a tough cookie. |
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 Owner of a ratting catting machine
Posts: 2258
| Lasix, a good nutritional program, a good mineral supplement high in potassium, and keep in shape as well as possible.
Also, have flappers scoped before, during, after exercise.
My mare started bleeding, and two bleeds and 6 months later, was diagnosed with left flapper full paralyzation. She's legging up now after recovering completely and successfully from tie back surgery. She was diagnosed and operated on at Texas A&M.
I'll still run her on Lasix to be safe, but her bleeding was attributed to the flapper issue. |
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 Member
Posts: 23
| It takes two weeks for the lung tissue to heal after bleeding. Two weeks off of no riding or anything. I don't know of any supplements that are proven to work. Lasix works. Give 4 ccs of lasix 3 1/2 hours before you run and take away water until after she runs. Every time. Lasix is 100% proven to work, and without it she will keep bleeding. Equi resp DOES help. My good horse bleeds bad, and he could not do it without his equi resp. Using it before and after a run helps. But most importantly GIVE LASIX! When they bleed they feel like they are drowning in their own blood and to me, letting that happen is way more inhumane than giving a shot of lasix. Good luck! |
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 Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | I gave mine 3-4 weeks off, the 4th week I would just walk or trail ride, the 5-6th week is legging them back up, the most important thing with a bleeder is keeping them in tip top shape. Write up a good exercise program and stick to it. I do a lot of long trotting and breezing, just high loping around a lake at my barn. Strengthen those lungs as muCh as you can.
Every horse is different, I have a bad bleeder, I don't run without lasix, I feel like the repercussions of not using it are far worse then using it from time to time. I try not to run her every weekend, and I always give her electrolytes for a few days after I give her lasix.
There's a million products to try, it's all trial, error and preference from there. |
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Veteran
Posts: 110
| So, my vet came out and didnt do what i was hoping for. I dont think he's convinced shes a bleeder (he seems to think its sinuses) but i am. Now, we have had a week off and it doesnt make sense to get her scoped (after a workout) at this point and undo the week of healing. He gave me the antibiotics and Lasix I requested but said to just keep riding her. Obviously i am looking for a new vet but do i continue treating her as a bleeder or do i get it diagnosed for sure? Mind you, she bled out both nostrils after a run and went from being a 1D to a 2/3D plus she is now ducking the second barrel. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| Sinus infections will cause nose bleeds. Having said that, I would definitely get a second opinion if you believe she is a bleeder. I would. |
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 Good Grief!
Posts: 6343
Location: Cap'n Joan Rotgut.....alberta | Id still get her scoped....get it tested that way you will know what your dealing with....and check her gutteral pouches as well....m |
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Veteran
Posts: 110
| mruggles - 2016-06-17 8:14 AM Id still get her scoped....get it tested that way you will know what your dealing with....and check her gutteral pouches as well....m
He did scope her but right out of the pasture. Said there was a decent amount of mucus on one side. It had been 4 days since she bled. |
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Good Grief!
Posts: 6343
Location: Cap'n Joan Rotgut.....alberta | allaboutme2 - 2016-06-18 9:23 AM mruggles - 2016-06-17 8:14 AM Id still get her scoped....get it tested that way you will know what your dealing with....and check her gutteral pouches as well....m He did scope her but right out of the pasture. Said there was a decent amount of mucus on one side. It had been 4 days since she bled.
Edited by mruggles 2016-06-17 12:14 PM
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| Another interesting tip I heard was to consider an anti anxiety/sedative if they are an anxious horse before a run.
High blood pressure causes bleeds. A jacked up on the muscle horse fighting you at the gate may bleed before he ever steps in the arena. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 338
Location: NE TX | I would seriously consider a second opinion. If it had been four days since she had bled then she probably wouldn't show unless she was like mine and had been bleeding for a while before I finally went and had her scoped recently after months of being in denial of her being a bleeder. She was so bad vet said 60 days rest not just the typical 30 days most people talk about. I would see if you could run her at home or somewhere close to a performance vet who is used to scoping for bleeders and either scope or do a BAL test or both. BAL is bronchioalveolar lavage. It is best to get them scoped right after a run at the latest the next morning to be sure.
Good luck. |
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Expert
Posts: 3514
| You need to scope right after a run. If she has been a silent bleeder then she would have had scarring on the lungs. I would do antibiotics and then look into medicine bag complete . They have great customer service. Very knowledgeble . |
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Veteran
Posts: 110
| Has anyone had a confirmed bleeder flip their head to the outside at 2 and 3? I always assumed this was something else on my horse but i have noticed several horses do this at 2 and 3. Could this be them trying to adjust to get air? I find it a very unique coincidence.... |
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