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Regular
Posts: 69
 
| I have a new 5 yr old that has gate issues {{surprise}}. I really like the colt, and I would put the time and money into "fixing" the issue. BUT, I have never dealt with this and wonder if it could truly ever go away.
Background- he backs a little, turns away and pops up (kind of a rear, but mild) and then goes in.
I am going to have him fully vetted, teeth were just done, on ulcer treatment and he will not be asked to run until it is resolved.
I just don't want to commit to all of this to be back at square one.
So give me your stories and opinions!! | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 926
     
| After many 'gate' issues, 'ducking' issues, et al, I'm a firm believer that horses want to please and when they duck/refuse, they are telling you something is wrong. So when I hear 'alley issues' I hear the horse saying, 'I'M HURT'. It may take more than 5 minutes of flexing, probing, trotting off. If you have one in your area, go to an equine vet, not a general purpose. Also, make notes, think about what you are experiencing and give that info to the vet. Good Luck to you. If you've never had this, you are one lucky horse owner.
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 Expert
Posts: 1302
    Location: California | Yes, I have seen plenty fixed. I am a firm believer in pain issues as well as the previous poster, but I have also seen horses that just need some reassuring and confidence building. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 898
       Location: Idaho | Agreed with the others. I'd be looking for pain issues, but at the age of 5 it might be more than that. I have had horses that have completely come back from having issues, I've had a couple horses that were just too blown up, to not want to run at all. My last gelding I had, he was a nice barrel horse.. was fast, could turn, knew the patterns. But he was blown up bad. I rehabbed him. Had him see the chiro, the dentist, the vet etc. Treated and maintained him for ulcers. He was underweight, I put weight on him. When it came to eating, you could tell that he was probably starved at one point. He would eat his food like he didn't know when he was getting his next meal. After 6 months, he looked like a completely different horse.

But after assessing he was blown up, I literally gave him a year off from barrels. Just working cows, trails, anything else. He was an awesome trail horse, I really wish I kind of kept him as I moved to Oklahoma and man, he would have been a nice horse to trail ride on! lol But after a year off and rehab, he still didn't want to run. He was done, so I sold him to a lady who wanted a good, solid trail and cow horse.
But for yours, I'd check for pain.. because in my opinion, 5 is a little young to be refusing a pattern. There has got to be something wrong.
Edited by DashNDustem 2016-08-21 11:11 PM
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
     
| Aside from the physical pain the horse may be going through, it could be a mental problem.
Or both
If a horse is fragile minded, these horses tend to blow up and have gate issues.
If the rider is ripping and tearing on the mouth this could cause gate issues.
If the ride is kicking the wind out of them or whipping excessively this can cause gate issues.
Reasons being is a horse associates the arena is pain | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 898
       Location: Idaho | cheryl makofka - 2016-08-22 9:01 PM
Aside from the physical pain the horse may be going through, it could be a mental problem.
Or both
If a horse is fragile minded, these horses tend to blow up and have gate issues.
If the rider is ripping and tearing on the mouth this could cause gate issues.
If the ride is kicking the wind out of them or whipping excessively this can cause gate issues.
Reasons being is a horse associates the arena is pain
Yes, this especially!!! | |
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
      
| Yes, my trainer has fixed several. One was the worst I have ever seen, took an army to get him in and then he would tour the arena or run to the first and go back to the alley. Young, fragile mind, pushed too hard and pain. She took her time and turned him into a 1D winning horse that competed for years and never hesitated a step going in. She had a routine with him, kept him calm and quiet, made sure the alley was clear once they started, etc. She has turned down many 6 figure offers for him. | |
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Expert
Posts: 1543
   Location: MI | rodeomom3 - 2016-08-22 7:43 AM
Β Yes, my trainer has fixed several. Β One was the worst I have ever seen, took an army to get him in and Β then he would tour the arena or run to Β the first Β and Β go back to the alley. Β Young, fragile mind, pushed too hard and pain. Β She took her time and turned him into a 1D winning horse that competed for years and never hesitated a step going in. Β She had a routine with him, kept him calm and quiet, made sure the alley was clear once they started, etc. Β She has turned down many 6 Β figure offers for him.Β
I haven't dealt with a lot of blown up horses, but I really agree with the 'routine'. I think it's really important to have a quick and super consistent 'this is what to expect' before running that prepares them, something they c an settle into and helps breed confidence.
For my horse this is a walk to our start position, then 1 circle, where we pick up the correct lead on the backside, then go. He also uses this when my 7yo daughter rides him - she doesn't circle, and he trots the pattern gently with her, no fuss, never gets strong. He's 5. | |
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
    
| At 5 it could be a lot of things. Pain, something as simple as he's grown and the saddle no longer fits to ulcers to something more difficult to diagnose.
It could also be mental and a confidence issue. This was one thing that Chris Martkn stressed at a clinic I rode in the other weekend. Barring pain issues problems in the alley are too often confidence related when the horse isn't 100% sure what he's going to be asked to do - in his experience when you get them to the point where they know they are going to run in and run to a particular spot they start to gain confidence in themselves and gate issue subside | |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
     Location: Texas | Yes and no. I think some can be completely fixed, and the rest can be improved to varying degrees. Just depends on the individual, what's underlying, and how you fix it I guess. | |
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Expert
Posts: 1343
     Location: East Texas | My horse was older, but he had a mild case of EPM when he started refusing to go in. Treated and he went back to running good. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 678
     Location: Canada | Yes and no! Some come back and others have lost the interest/will to compete. I have on that has a gate issue it's not pain related or ulcer related (he's been cleared by a vet and treated for ulcers). His gate issue is he stalls, will back up and gets overly excited (never rears or buck) but you can feel his heart beating he's so pumped up. If you start a fight to get in the gate he gasses himself out and doesn't run well. I have found if I pony another horse with him it keeps him happy and relaxed (almost too relaxed). I pony the horse up to the gate and a friend will take her from there as I go in. He is happy to go to the gate and having his friend to cool down with keeps him happy. It works for me as I typically have to rope after so by warming up both horses together it saves me time and keeps my horse happy. I'm hoping eventually I won't need to use her to keep him happy but if I do it's certainly not the end of the world for me.
I've also had horses come to me with serious gate issues (rearing, balking, etc.) and been able to get them to enjoy it. Normally it's either pain related, stomach issues, or the horse was lacking training somewhere which caused the owners to yank or pull the horse instead of guiding them on pattern.
I've only had one that had so much performance anxiety he was MISERABLE competing. I tried treating him for ulcers, had him vet checked, injected his hocks, teeth, etc tried working everything but roping and barrels (he was blown up on roping by a previous owner so I tried moving him to barrels) but he hated competing. He'd try but his love was trail riding so that's what I sold him as.
Get a good vet check and look for suspensory injuries as well. | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 788
     
| If the only issue is the gate, then I would say after the soundness is taken care of, YES it is fixable. However, I have seen the horses (and owned one) that will get half way through the pattern and stop; these are the ones that are usually too far gone. I really hope you get it figured out and help this young horse become a super star! | |
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12837
       
| My trainer bought one that was so blown up. Horse was crazy. Well, she fixed her. I have seen her be the entire 1D. The mare got a slab fracture one her hind leg and had to be retired. She now belongs to The Meyers being bred to Frenchmans Guy every year. | |
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 Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
         Location: Louisiana | My sister's now retired gelding was blown up prior to her getting him. His original trainer had sold him, and bought him back after the girl had him pretty much ruined. She put a lot of time in him and resold him with exact instructions to my sister.
She ran him for 5-6 years before he was retired and he never refused the gate in the slightest way. But you had better have his treat in your pocket when he was done lol. | |
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Regular
Posts: 69
 
| Thanks everyone!! This gives me hope! He was futuried on and then went to a young girl. I think the problem is fairly new. He eats like he's never seen food before and is is terrified of being hurt. But he REALLY wants to trust and responds like crazy to attention. I think there is possibly an underlying pain issue and I also think he's a little fragile minded. He will have a life of royalty if I can get him through it... | |
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Member
Posts: 15

| I have been around but not used sliding STALL doors, though my barn has a sliding door to the adjacent shelter. The sliding doors are really space economical and probably, in the long run safer with most horses. I have trained my horses to put their heads over the gates to get haltered/unhaltered, and two of my stalls are constructed from round pen panels, 3 sides + security gates | |
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 Expert
Posts: 1511
  Location: Illinois | I had gate issues for about 3 years with mine from ulcers we couldn't get under control. Started just stopping and refuisng, sttod like a statue. After a few minutes he's finally just go. Escalated to him pinning himself against the alley panels, wall, whatever there was. Then he started to try to climb the panels or walls. One place he pinned me into a truck about 100 feet behind the arena gate. Ended up with his front feet on the hood trying to climb it. He'd do all this & then just all the sudden rocket off and go. After trying what seemend like 1000 differnt things I found the magic combo that worked and kept the ulcers away. It was my last attempt, if it didn't work he was going to the pasture. The gate issues didn't immediately resolve. I gave him about 5 months off, did the treatment during that time with the daily prevention. Started the season and the gate issues were there still. After a couple weeks I had him scoped again and he was clear. So we thought, ok it's ingrained into his brain that it hurts. Slowly it got better every run until finally after maybe 2-3 months they stopped. Hasn't had a problem since, we've made 2 full seasons now going in fine. So if it is a pain issue for yours, just make sure you give his brain time to adjust and realize hey, this doesn't hurt anymore, I'm ok. If it is a fragility issue, then that's another story but also is just time. At that point it's building confidence. With mine sometimes I go to local fun shows and sign up, $3 a class, and just go in and trot a pole pattern or flag class, or just whatever isn't barrels. They kinda think, ohh well I don't have to run all the time when I go through these gates. I think if you have access to that it's good. Even for any horse. At 5 years old, he shouldn't be too far gone to fix, whatever the issue turns out to be | |
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 Expert
Posts: 1395
       Location: Missouri | Mine just about blew up years ago. Had her fully vetted, found, fixed and still maintain the issue. She's MUCH better now. That said, when she gets in certain situations as far as alley set ups, if things feel claustrophobic to her or other horses are getting out of control, she will react to it. Not near has bad as it was by any means. She will balk at the alley if it is tight and back a few steps, but as soon as I disengage her hip and nudge her forward, she will go. If I weren't properly maintaining her I'd think pain. But it's been years of proper care. I really just think mentally, certain set ups are jarring to her. I try to ignore it as much as I can and not make a big deal of it. | |
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 Reaching for the stars....
Posts: 12704
     
| I agree that if this is a new issue there is something behind it. Whether horse or rider is something to be figured out. I want to opine that we barrel racers really don't generally want our horses walking in flat footed -- we all understand that the fast twitch muscles need to be engaged at least in the alley, and most horses, over time, know that they need to get those muscles going. Thus the saying 'on the muscle.' I've not seen many, if any, 1 or 2D horses walk in flat footed for years and years. That being said, I've watched a rider start to have issues because their horse started to get on the muscle and call it an issue and go on to make it a true alley issue with wrong cueing when the horse got on the muscle. If you yank or pull back just because the horse gets on the muscle it will go backward, sometimes spin, and sometimes pop up. Holding a horse is not the same as pulling or yanking. But if a horse goes from solid forward motion, whether on the muscle or not, to turning away or popping up out of no where, then there is either a rider queing bad or a horse in pain. Sometimes the particular show set up will make one somewhat more apt to have an issue. Zan is fine except when we are in the group of 5 separated from other horses ready to go in. I can feel his heart go and he gets way sensitive to any movement of mine. Some is his feeling my nerves. But he will turn sometimes. I have worked hard on my breathing and that has helped more than any pressure added to Zan. If he turns I kiss and let him keep the motion up until we are turned back and then kiss again - giving him rein slack at the same time. Less pressure, not more. | |
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