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 Having Smokin Bandits
Posts: 4572
  
Location: Woodstown, NJ | Fairly new horse. We've had her a year-and-a-half now. Very sensitive. She's submissive but will test you. Very smart. Started refusing to load. We worked on it and got it licked. Then she started pulling back in our slant load. Couldn't get the divider closed before she started backing out. No time to tie. So I waited outside and my daughter handed me the leadrope through the window. As soon as my daughter stepped back, the mare ripped it out of my hands. I got gloves and a thick leadrope and we did it again. This time she couldn't get away before my daughter got the divider closed so it worked. She seemed to calm right down. Coming back home, we did the same thing and it worked again. Today we tried to go out in the stock trailer. She has never pulled back in the stock. But she started doing the same thing. I got the gloves and waited outside for my daughter to hand me the leadrope. She started pulling back so violently, she got away from me, reared up and almost went through the ceiling, fell on her butt, and got loose. Now we have a real problem. My daughter and I were scared to try it again. (She got a workout though!) I don't know how my daughter didn't get hurt with all of that commotion going on inside the trailer. We are really upset. We have a show on Sunday but we're scared to load her. My daughter has been working really hard to get this mare trained and we were looking forward to this race. What do we do?
I should add that we don't have any trees on the property that we could turn into a "patient tree," to tie her. She has tied okay in other places except for one time in the barn when something set her off and she pulled back so bad, she fell down. We've tied her there a hundred times since.
Edited by SmokinBandits 2016-10-14 8:24 PM
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
 
| Hook the trailer up and go for a drive with someone in the back. Listening for noises, movement, pinch points, etc. make sure there is nothing back there that could be driving her batty. I believe it was on her someone once had some loose wiring that was shocking the horses.
I suspect if she was good for so long that something has happened...
Then I would start feeding her in the stock trailer. Then closing the door on her. Then going for drives, not tied.
I don't suspect this one will be solved overnight since she's lost her trust. |
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 Dog Resuce Agent
Posts: 3459
Location: southeast Texas | check out YouTube , do a search for loading horses in trailer. Lots of videos
Edited by roxieannie 2016-09-15 6:35 AM
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| She is trying to tell you something is wrong and it is hurting her.
Some trailers vibrate or shake excessively when towed. I had one who would refuse to haul in my aunts trailer because of this, my trailer I could send him in from 100 feet away and he would load himself.
The vibration or shaking could be a structural problem, or as simple as a trailer tire separating
There could be an electrical short
Or noise as someone else said.
She may also be claustrophobic is she the only horse loaded, the first one, if so try loading her second see if that helps |
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 Expert
Posts: 2097
Location: Deep South | Something is definitely wrong, since she was fine loading then suddenly started to refuse. Like mentioned already, I would check the trailer first. Ride back there personally, and see if you notice something out of the ordinary. If that checks out then there's probably something going on with your mare. I've seen both ulcers and ovary issues cause this behavior. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Check floors make sure they are solid, check for bees nests I have to check my trailer for bees all the time. And could you be driving to rough, turning to fast? Sounds she had lost the trust of being in a trailer. |
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 Expert
Posts: 3815
Location: The best kept secret in TX | Had one set back and literally rip my hand in half. You can wear gloves when she sits back but be aware it can still hurt you.
I was 12 when I had that mare and my dad ended up looping a cotton rope around her girth area and on top of her withers. Much like a lariat surcingle. He then ran the cotton rope under her chin and through her halter ring on the bottom side and tied it in about 5 knots. The next time she sat back it cut off her air supply. She finally realized she wasn't getting away and relaxed. The rope loosened as soon as she stopped pulling back. Was it humane? Probably not. But it worked for that particular horse and kept me from being hurt ever again.
She was used to panic snaps at the track and was just being a toot.
Edited by IRunOnFaith 2016-09-15 9:41 AM
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 Lady Di
Posts: 21556
Location: Oklahoma | I would have her tested for EPM, just to rule it out. Not wanting to load in the trailer after previously doing it with no problem can be one of the first signs, as it sometimes affects their eyesight. |
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 The Worst Seller Ever
Posts: 4138
Location: Oklahoma | If it were me and I had checked the trailer to see if it was hot, I would have a rope already tied in there and snap it on her when I loaded her. She got away from you too many times and if she is smart, it is now a habit, especially since it has happened in 2 different trailer, 2 different set ups.
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 Expert
Posts: 1481
Location: TEXAS | dianeguinn - 2016-09-15 10:02 AM
I would have her tested for EPM, just to rule it out. Not wanting to load in the trailer after previously doing it with no problem can be one of the first signs, as it sometimes affects their eyesight.
That's good advise - something I would never thought of  |
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 Too Skinny
Posts: 8009
Location: LA Lower Alabama | Keeping in mind that she may have physical issues or the trailer may as well, watch a few trailer loading videos. They TELL the horse to get in alone and if they come out before asked they TELL them to get back in etc. Once the horse learns it can get out and its easier on the outside then you have to teach them that outside is hard hard work. Im big on sending them to someone qualified to fix this issue. Be Safe!
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Having Smokin Bandits
Posts: 4572
Location: Woodstown, NJ | IRunOnFaith - 2016-09-15 10:40 AM Had one set back and literally rip my hand in half. You can wear gloves when she sits back but be aware it can still hurt you.
I was 12 when I had that mare and my dad ended up looping a cotton rope around her girth area and on top of her withers. Much like a lariat surcingle. He then ran the cotton rope under her chin and through her halter ring on the bottom side and tied it in about 5 knots. The next time she sat back it cut off her air supply. She finally realized she wasn't getting away and relaxed. The rope loosened as soon as she stopped pulling back. Was it humane? Probably not. But it worked for that particular horse and kept me from being hurt ever again.
She was used to panic snaps at the track and was just being a toot.
What are panic snaps? This mare is off the track. |
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Having Smokin Bandits
Posts: 4572
Location: Woodstown, NJ | Thanks everyone! I will check the trailers. And take a ride. It's definitely not my driving. I drive like an old lady!
What I think caused it is my daughter's anxiety. She knows not to show it but horses are mind-readers and this mare is extremely sensitive. She must have picked up on it. I think my daughter has this anxiety because we had a trailer mishap, long story, two years ago. And I think that's been in her head. She may deny that.
So now I have to figure out how to fix it. I'm not embarrassed to say that I'm afraid to get in there with her again. It was pretty violent. She hit the ceiling, she fell on her butt, she fell out the back and got loose.... When I went back to the trailer, I was expecting to see a hole in the ceiling! We have been feeding her in there since I posted this. But the idea of attempting to leave her in it again is scary. I think I'm going to experiment with putting another horse in there first--her buddy--and see how she reacts to that. I'm going to reread everything you guys suggested. Thanks! |
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 I'm Cooler Offline
Posts: 6387
Location: Pacific Northwest | I had a really sensitive mare that I had owned since she was yearling. She never had a problem in the trailer, ever. When she was 10 years old she went on ONE trailer ride with my other mare, and suddenly she didn't want to load anymore. My other mare is an ass in the trailer, and I think she must have scared her. She started doing the same as your mare; would pull back and fly as fast as she could out of the trailer before you could do anything.
I've been in an almost-accident in the trailer already, so I'm already iffy on horses that aren't good with being loaded. It's a MUST for me, they HAVE to be well behaved. I absolutely will not go into a trailer with a horse that I think is going to do something stupid. My solution with my now-scared mare, was she learned to load herself. She already had a lot of ground work basics, so she knew the "sending"and "driving" signals for lunging and what not. I just repeatedly "sent" her into the trailer, no matter how much argument it took. If she flew out backwards, she went in again. I never led her in.
It was a process. When I finally got her to where she would load without hesitation, she would try to back out as soon as you moved to shut the divider, so then she had to learn to stand in the trailer.
Finally she got to where I could throw the lead rope over her neck, walk her up to the trailer and she would load and stand while I shut the divider. Every time I unloaded her I would unlatch the divider, pat her a little and make her stand for at least 10 seconds (she was always tense and ready to come out), and then let her back out. |
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I'm Cooler Offline
Posts: 6387
Location: Pacific Northwest | SmokinBandits - 2016-09-15 8:22 PM
IRunOnFaith - 2016-09-15 10:40 AM Had one set back and literally rip my hand in half. You can wear gloves when she sits back but be aware it can still hurt you.
I was 12 when I had that mare and my dad ended up looping a cotton rope around her girth area and on top of her withers. Much like a lariat surcingle. He then ran the cotton rope under her chin and through her halter ring on the bottom side and tied it in about 5 knots. The next time she sat back it cut off her air supply. She finally realized she wasn't getting away and relaxed. The rope loosened as soon as she stopped pulling back. Was it humane? Probably not. But it worked for that particular horse and kept me from being hurt ever again.
She was used to panic snaps at the track and was just being a toot.
What are panic snaps? This mare is off the track.
I'm assuming she means the snaps that unlock if a horse pulls hard enough. Some horses once they figure it out will just pull back when they decide they don't want to play anymore because they know they can get loose lol |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 618
| IRunOnFaith - 2016-09-15 9:40 AM
Had one set back and literally rip my hand in half. You can wear gloves when she sits back but be aware it can still hurt you.
I was 12 when I had that mare and my dad ended up looping a cotton rope around her girth area and on top of her withers. Much like a lariat surcingle. He then ran the cotton rope under her chin and through her halter ring on the bottom side and tied it in about 5 knots. The next time she sat back it cut off her air supply. She finally realized she wasn't getting away and relaxed. The rope loosened as soon as she stopped pulling back. Was it humane? Probably not. But it worked for that particular horse and kept me from being hurt ever again.
She was used to panic snaps at the track and was just being a toot.
I did this with my gelding and it worked the first 2x, 3rd time he wouldn't give to pressure and instead panicked and it cut into him causing lacerations and burns before I could cut it loose. He will tie but you just have to know he will sit back. I've learned to managea nd really learn his triggers. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 618
| livexlovexrodeo - 2016-09-16 1:19 PM
SmokinBandits - 2016-09-15 8:22 PM
IRunOnFaith - 2016-09-15 10:40 AM Had one set back and literally rip my hand in half. You can wear gloves when she sits back but be aware it can still hurt you.
I was 12 when I had that mare and my dad ended up looping a cotton rope around her girth area and on top of her withers. Much like a lariat surcingle. He then ran the cotton rope under her chin and through her halter ring on the bottom side and tied it in about 5 knots. The next time she sat back it cut off her air supply. She finally realized she wasn't getting away and relaxed. The rope loosened as soon as she stopped pulling back. Was it humane? Probably not. But it worked for that particular horse and kept me from being hurt ever again.
She was used to panic snaps at the track and was just being a toot.
What are panic snaps? This mare is off the track.
I'm assuming she means the snaps that unlock if a horse pulls hard enough. Some horses once they figure it out will just pull back when they decide they don't want to play anymore because they know they can get loose lol
I wonder if they used a flipping rig on her??? They did on my gelding off the track and he has tying issues. He did have trailer issues as well but we've worked through that, still don't tie him short and leave him unattended. |
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Having Smokin Bandits
Posts: 4572
Location: Woodstown, NJ | livexlovexrodeo - 2016-09-16 2:10 PM I had a really sensitive mare that I had owned since she was yearling. She never had a problem in the trailer, ever. When she was 10 years old she went on ONE trailer ride with my other mare, and suddenly she didn't want to load anymore. My other mare is an ass in the trailer, and I think she must have scared her. She started doing the same as your mare; would pull back and fly as fast as she could out of the trailer before you could do anything. I've been in an almost-accident in the trailer already, so I'm already iffy on horses that aren't good with being loaded. It's a MUST for me, they HAVE to be well behaved. I absolutely will not go into a trailer with a horse that I think is going to do something stupid. My solution with my now-scared mare, was she learned to load herself. She already had a lot of ground work basics, so she knew the "sending"and "driving" signals for lunging and what not. I just repeatedly "sent" her into the trailer, no matter how much argument it took. If she flew out backwards, she went in again. I never led her in. It was a process. When I finally got her to where she would load without hesitation, she would try to back out as soon as you moved to shut the divider, so then she had to learn to stand in the trailer. Finally she got to where I could throw the lead rope over her neck, walk her up to the trailer and she would load and stand while I shut the divider. Every time I unloaded her I would unlatch the divider, pat her a little and make her stand for at least 10 seconds (she was always tense and ready to come out), and then let her back out.
THAT sounds like my scenario. Very sensitive. Same age too. She loaded perfectly fine when we got her. I even contacted her previous owner to find out if he had any problems with this. He did not. He has no motivation to lie to me as I didn't purchase her from him. I did find out he didn't have to try to close a divider and back out. He has one of those two-horse trailers where he would lead her in, tie her, and then exit out that little escape door in front. He also told me he was also trailering a pony. So she had company. As far as her experiences further back on the track, I don't know her experiences there, whether someone flipped her like a poster suggested, whether they used panic snaps, etc. But she went to this owner I was talking to with no problems. I think it started here at my house.
We do do round pen work with her and can send her around at different speeds, change directions, etc. and she is very submissive and responsive and will follow us out of the round pen, all the way down to the barn with no lead rope, stop when we stop, go when we go, etc. But I can't imagine being able to get her to load in the trailer by herself! I agree with you--I don't like going in there either! I especially don't like my daughter going in there! I will have to try to find some videos on this and see exactly how it's done.
We've been feeding her on there. My daughter has to stand there with her. If she doesn't try to leave her, the mare stands there relatively quietly, backs out pretty quietly. We also put my horse (her buddy) in the front half of the stock, closed the divider, and led the mare up into the back half. But didn't make an attempt to tie her and leave her.
Thanks for all your help! |
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12842
| People's driving often causes problems. |
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Having Smokin Bandits
Posts: 4572
Location: Woodstown, NJ | I don't think it's anyone's driving in the past that caused this because we've had her for over a year before it started. And it's definitely not our driving. But SOMETHING scared her and started this and once she got away with it by getting out and later even getting loose, it was in her head. We've been loading her continuously since I posted this. Hop on, hop off, hop on, hop off. Actually, she will drag you on now. She jumps right on. But she won't go on herself and she won't stay on if we try to leave. If we make any kind of motion to tie her or or to just step back with the plan to close the divider, she gets anxious and starts backing up. We've let her, staying calm, and reloaded her. Let her and reloaded her. A couple of times I put her buddy in front (this is the stock trailer with the divider in the middle), closed the divider because that's just the way I always travel with that trailer, and she kept stepping off the back because she was so close to the edge. I think I have to leave the divider open so she can move up more. I'm still trying to find some time to watch the videos. Today was the first show we missed because of this! We now have the mare ready for a real run and we can't get to the race! |
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