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 I Don't Brag
Posts: 6960
    
| A friend called me this morning saying her horse had been kicked in the face. I got there and do not think it was a kick but it IS ugly!
He is face has been scalped. About 8-9" long and close to 5" wide at the widest point. Since the whole skin flap was held on by less than an inch at the top and there was no blood flow or feeling in the (and irritating the crap out fof the horse), the vet cut it off. He got a tetanus booster and started on Penicillin, hosed the wound, sprayed it with Vetricyn and dusted with furacin powder. After a few days, he said to switch to Furazone ointment. Anyone ever use the EMT gel for a wound like this?? I like the idea of the collagen helping to give a matrix for new skin to generate faster?? I have tried it with a different kind of wound and one not SO large. In the meanwhile I have advised her to get the Vetricyn gel to help keep it clean and moist.
Also have some Underwoods but no longer have the directions. We want some granulation tissue to develop and I can't remember if it helps prevent granulation tissue??? And how often should it be applied? I would like to find something that would provide a protective barrier yet not be a magnet for dirt, hay chaff and other crap. The edge of one side is quite close to his eye so we have to be careful there.
Right now the vet on one hand would like to see it covered but we can also see this horse trying to rub anything off that we might try to cover it with. Right now a spray it much more tolerable to him than trying to smear ointment on it. Thank goodness its cooling down and the flies are dying off.
Leave it to horses. I have *ahem* more years of experience than I'd like to admit but they still seem to find ways to get hurt that confound us. (and yes, we checked high and low and cannot figure out how or where he got injured.)
Thanks for any input y'all might have. |
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  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | rodeoveteran - 2017-10-15 1:32 PM A friend called me this morning saying her horse had been kicked in the face. I got there and do not think it was a kick but it IS ugly! He is face has been scalped. About 8-9" long and close to 5" wide at the widest point. Since the whole skin flap was held on by less than an inch at the top and there was no blood flow or feeling in the (and irritating the crap out fof the horse), the vet cut it off. He got a tetanus booster and started on Penicillin, hosed the wound, sprayed it with Vetricyn and dusted with furacin powder. After a few days, he said to switch to Furazone ointment. Anyone ever use the EMT gel for a wound like this?? I like the idea of the collagen helping to give a matrix for new skin to generate faster?? I have tried it with a different kind of wound and one not SO large. In the meanwhile I have advised her to get the Vetricyn gel to help keep it clean and moist. Also have some Underwoods but no longer have the directions. We want some granulation tissue to develop and I can't remember if it helps prevent granulation tissue??? And how often should it be applied? I would like to find something that would provide a protective barrier yet not be a magnet for dirt, hay chaff and other crap. The edge of one side is quite close to his eye so we have to be careful there. Right now the vet on one hand would like to see it covered but we can also see this horse trying to rub anything off that we might try to cover it with. Right now a spray it much more tolerable to him than trying to smear ointment on it. Thank goodness its cooling down and the flies are dying off. Leave it to horses. I have *ahem* more years of experience than I'd like to admit but they still seem to find ways to get hurt that confound us. (and yes, we checked high and low and cannot figure out how or where he got injured.) Thanks for any input y'all might have. I'm not sure if you are on facebook but I have a gelding that did a real number to his lower pastern with barb wire. I tried a lot of things and still mix it up depending on what I see when I unwrap it. I bought some of the EMT gel and it was a real booger to put on. Just a ball of goop and I couldn't get it to spread over the wound so I put it on the non stick bandage and it was like trying to smear honey and just as sticky.
I started with Wonderdust to help stop the bleeding, then used sugardine for a few days and really liked it. Then every now and again meat tendersizer spice to keep the proud flesh away and now Vetrycin which I have never thought was "all that" but so far it is good to have for what he has left of the cut. 30 days out and it is nearly healed.
Of all I tried though, when it was needed, the sugardine was the most impressive. I think if you want granulation it is the way to go. Just mix iodine and sugar until it is like peanut butter...
Folklore made sugardine a household word and science explains why it works. Sugar can help restore a proper pH balance in tissue, and has antibacterial properties. In 1981, the results of a five-year study on sugardine were published in Southern Medical Journal: "The use of sugardine seems to accelerate granulation tissue and epithelial tissue production, thereby covering wounds, burns or ulcers with skin."
Researchers noted how wounds treated with sugardine responded differently from those treated with antibiotics. "Unlike (wounds) treated with antibiotics, sugardine-treated wounds clean up rapidly; sugardine reduces edema, nourishes surface cells and has no fetid odor. We also found it effective on coronary band lacerations, burns, and thrush."
http://holistichorse.com/hoof-care/hoof-care-sugardine/
Edited by wyoming barrel racer 2017-10-15 3:03 PM
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I Don't Brag
Posts: 6960
| I forgot about sugardine but I see no way to keep it ON the wound. I agree with the spreading of the EMT gel, except even HARDER to spread then honey! One of the things I warned her about, so she has opted for the Vetricyn gel for now. I wish I had more experience with the Underwoods and knew which situations it is best for.
Thanks for answering.  |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | rodeoveteran - 2017-10-15 2:34 PM I forgot about sugardine but I see no way to keep it ON the wound. I agree with the spreading of the EMT gel, except even HARDER to spread then honey! One of the things I warned her about, so she has opted for the Vetricyn gel for now. I wish I had more experience with the Underwoods and knew which situations it is best for. Thanks for answering.
I think the underwoods would be good. I used it when my pali colt tore his chest wide open. I think it helps tissue grow fast. Just might have to be super careful not to get it in the eye. |
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I Don't Brag
Posts: 6960
| It says NOT to clean the wound and to apply at least two times a day. So do you just keep spraying and dusting on top of previous layers?? |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | yep :) and it can get pretty icky looking but does work well. |
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | wyoming barrel racer - 2017-10-15 3:02 PM
rodeoveteran - 2017-10-15 1:32 PM A friend called me this morning saying her horse had been kicked in the face. I got there and do not think it was a kick but it IS ugly! He is face has been scalped. About 8-9" long and close to 5" wide at the widest point. Since the whole skin flap was held on by less than an inch at the top and there was no blood flow or feeling in the (and irritating the crap out fof the horse), the vet cut it off. He got a tetanus booster and started on Penicillin, hosed the wound, sprayed it with Vetricyn and dusted with furacin powder. After a few days, he said to switch to Furazone ointment. Anyone ever use the EMT gel for a wound like this?? I like the idea of the collagen helping to give a matrix for new skin to generate faster?? I have tried it with a different kind of wound and one not SO large. In the meanwhile I have advised her to get the Vetricyn gel to help keep it clean and moist. Also have some Underwoods but no longer have the directions. We want some granulation tissue to develop and I can't remember if it helps prevent granulation tissue??? And how often should it be applied? I would like to find something that would provide a protective barrier yet not be a magnet for dirt, hay chaff and other crap. The edge of one side is quite close to his eye so we have to be careful there. Right now the vet on one hand would like to see it covered but we can also see this horse trying to rub anything off that we might try to cover it with. Right now a spray it much more tolerable to him than trying to smear ointment on it. Thank goodness its cooling down and the flies are dying off. Leave it to horses. I have *ahem* more years of experience than I'd like to admit but they still seem to find ways to get hurt that confound us. (and yes, we checked high and low and cannot figure out how or where he got injured.) Thanks for any input y'all might have. I'm not sure if you are on facebook but I have a gelding that did a real number to his lower pastern with barb wire. I tried a lot of things and still mix it up depending on what I see when I unwrap it. I bought some of the EMT gel and it was a real booger to put on. Just a ball of goop and I couldn't get it to spread over the wound so I put it on the non stick bandage and it was like trying to smear honey and just as sticky.
I started with Wonderdust to help stop the bleeding, then used sugardine for a few days and really liked it. Then every now and again meat tendersizer spice to keep the proud flesh away and now Vetrycin which I have never thought was "all that" but so far it is good to have for what he has left of the cut. 30 days out and it is nearly healed.
Of all I tried though, when it was needed, the sugardine was the most impressive. I think if you want granulation it is the way to go. Just mix iodine and sugar until it is like peanut butter...Folklore made sugardine a household word and science explains why it works. Sugar can help restore a proper pH balance in tissue, and has antibacterial properties. In 1981, the results of a five-year study on sugardine were published in Southern Medical Journal: "The use of sugardine seems to accelerate granulation tissue and epithelial tissue production, thereby covering wounds, burns or ulcers with skin." Researchers noted how wounds treated with sugardine responded differently from those treated with antibiotics. "Unlike (wounds ) treated with antibiotics, sugardine-treated wounds clean up rapidly; sugardine reduces edema, nourishes surface cells and has no fetid odor. We also found it effective on coronary band lacerations, burns, and thrush." http://holistichorse.com/hoof-care/hoof-care-sugardine/
I got to thinking after I read this----when I had my wreck 31 years ago, this is what they used on my worst wounds. My momma always said I was part horse, so I'm sure she would find it funny that this treatment is both human and equine approved! I healed quite well---no proud flesh either. 
RV, I am certainly not making light of your friend's horse---I hope he heals easily and as quickly as possible. It's unreal how they can injure themselves with seemingly nothing at their disposal to use. . . . |
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 Saint Stacey
| Furacin has been proven to make it where wounds heal much slower. It might have been great in the 80’s, but there are MUCH better wound treatment protocols out there now. You might look into getting a MagnaCu Morgan Mask or a Hidez Mask. Might PM miss rosalee (I think that’s who it was?). Anyhow, she’s been healing a pretty severe head injury and using the Hidez Mask to hold it together with pretty good success. |
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 The Vaccinator
Posts: 3810
Location: Slipping down the slope of old age. Boo hoo. | Eclipse Wound Wash plus Eclipse Wound Cream. The best. |
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Saint Stacey
| It was missroselee that’s been using the Hidez. I bumped the thread up where she mentions it. PM her for pics of what she’s been dealing with. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1182
Location: Do I hear Banjos? | I have not used the Underwoods on a facial wound...but everywhere I have used it I have been very pleased with the results. I especially like using it for areas that just aren't going to be possible to bandage. You just spray the wound and dust it with baking powder. Twice a day.
I'm a major skeptic of most things...but this stuff just works. When my vet first suggested it I gave him the side eye...but now...it's a go to.
I recently bought a horse that had a knob of proud flesh on the outside of his fetlock joint from an old cut. It was always getting bumped/abraded. I decided to trim it off and applied the Underwoods twice a day. I wasn't going to hold a bandage...and with flies being around I wanted it protected. The dusting of baking powder really does form a barrier. Kept it clean and nice. Flies left it alone and it healed nicely with no proud flesh at all. And that has been my experience with Underwoods every time.
You would not want to get it into the eyes...so this would take careful application. |
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I Don't Brag
Posts: 6960
| Well I just got off the phone with the folks at Underwoods. The very nice lady there said that she had not heard of anyone using it on this type of wound, that obviously we would have to be careful not to get in eyes, or where he could lick it because it is poisonous. I asked if it promoted granulation and she said that it helped get rid of excess granulation tissue........At this point we WANT it to fill in with granulation tissue so maybe Underwoods later.
Is see no way to keep Sugardine on the wound and if it also discourages granulation tissue, see above.
As far as the hoods. the owner actually suggested a slinky hood to keep it covered but we don't want anything to stick to it and it needs air.....most hoods are not all that breathable.
We could mummy wrap his head....but not sure that he wouldn't try to rub it off.
I have a pic on my flip phone but have no idea how to post it or get it off my phone short of texting it to someone. OK, looked at the pic and it is NOT 5" wide at the widest but it is still an ugly, awkward wound. Poor guy...but he doesn't seem to be in a lot of pain and hasn't let it slow down his appetite one bit, thank goodness for small favors!
Thank to those who have replied.  |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | rodeoveteran - 2017-10-16 3:32 PM Well I just got off the phone with the folks at Underwoods. The very nice lady there said that she had not heard of anyone using it on this type of wound, that obviously we would have to be careful not to get in eyes, or where he could lick it because it is poisonous. I asked if it promoted granulation and she said that it helped get rid of excess granulation tissue........At this point we WANT it to fill in with granulation tissue so maybe Underwoods later. Is see no way to keep Sugardine on the wound and if it also discourages granulation tissue, see above. As far as the hoods. the owner actually suggested a slinky hood to keep it covered but we don't want anything to stick to it and it needs air.....most hoods are not all that breathable. We could mummy wrap his head....but not sure that he wouldn't try to rub it off. I have a pic on my flip phone but have no idea how to post it or get it off my phone short of texting it to someone. OK, looked at the pic and it is NOT 5" wide at the widest but it is still an ugly, awkward wound. Poor guy...but he doesn't seem to be in a lot of pain and hasn't let it slow down his appetite one bit, thank goodness for small favors! Thank to those who have replied.
"The use of sugardine seems to accelerate granulation tissue "
Might just dab it on there a few times a day? It was sure sticky enough but spread easily with the plastic spoon I used. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | I havent read all the respones but when I had a hard to doctor place and used meds that was hard to put on the horse I would just put a good dose of the med on the bandage, I love the EMP gel always had good luck with it, just smeared it on the bandage and then place it on the wound worked great this way  |
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 Ms. Poutability
Posts: 2362
Location: In my own world | Since it's a wound on the face and near the eye I would do honey. Specifically manuka honey if you can find it. It won't hurt if it gets in the eye. I used it on a large wound on a leg. She cut everything but the tendon and a few blood vessels. It helps with proud flesh. Or try SSD. You may have to use vetrycin a few days until it isn't so painful. If you decide to use a mask I would spread the honey on a Tefla(non stick) pad and stick it on then put the mask over. Keeps you from having to spread directly on wound. And the honey will stick to the wound! |
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