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  Whack and Roll
Posts: 6342
   
Location: NE Texas | The one thing we have to remember is that Mr. Coburn is a newbie to horse racing and in their first try they breed a horse for $10,000 that wins two of the most pretigious races of all time. To say one gets emotionally caught up in that was an understatement. Heck, I got caught up in mine running in a $5000 claimer and finishing 9th. HAHA Horse racing is an emotional thing and if you've never owned one, it's like nothing else seeing your horse come down the race track. I can't imagine someone shoving a camera in your face right after that. Yes, he knew the deal when he paid the entry fee, and I agree with NONE of what he said and certainly don't want or think anything needs to be changed in the campaign for the Triple Crown. All I can say is that he was emotional, exhausted, heart broken, and loves his horse.....but most of all he's human and made a mistake. It's my understanding he and his wife just appeared on Good Morning America and he delivered the most sincere, heartfelt apology. I forgive him because he's the first person i've seen in the game of horse racing in a very long time who actually loves his horse. For most owners, it's simply business and a tax write off and once the horse isn't profitable (if it ever is to start with) big time owners often don't care what happens to them, but Steve LOVES this horse, and for that I applaud him. I'm still a CC fan, I think he's a special horse and I forgive Mr. Coburn for the way he acted. The Good Lord knows I wouldn't want a camera in my face after any of those races because there is no telling what might come out of my mouth! It takes a big man to know he was in the wrong and an even bigger man to admit it with tears in his eyes! So I still say, Go Chrome!!!!!! 
Edited by Herbie 2014-06-09 9:21 AM
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Regular
Posts: 72
Location: Florida | Herbie - 2014-06-09 9:19 AM
The one thing we have to remember is that Mr. Coburn is a newbie to horse racing and in their first try they breed a horse for $10,000 that wins two of the most pretigious races of all time. To say one gets emotionally caught up in that was an understatement. Heck, I got caught up in mine running in a $5000 claimer and finishing 9th. HAHA Horse racing is an emotional thing and if you've never owned one, it's like nothing else seeing your horse come down the race track. I can't imagine someone shoving a camera in your face right after that. Yes, he knew the deal when he paid the entry fee, and I agree with NONE of what he said and certainly don't want or think anything needs to be changed in the campaign for the Triple Crown. All I can say is that he was emotional, exhausted, heart broken, and loves his horse.....but most of all he's human and made a mistake. It's my understanding he and his wife just appeared on Good Morning America and he delivered the most sincere, heartfelt apology. I forgive him because he's the first person i've seen in the game of horse racing in a very long time who actually loves his horse. For most owners, it's simply business and a tax write off and once the horse isn't profitable (if it ever is to start with) big time owners often don't care what happens to them, but Steve LOVES this horse, and for that I applaud him. I'm still a CC fan, I think he's a special horse and I forgive Mr. Coburn for the way he acted. The Good Lord knows I wouldn't want a camera in my face after any of those races because there is no telling what might come out of my mouth! It takes a big man to know he was in the wrong and an even bigger man to admit it with tears in his eyes! So I still say, Go Chrome!!!!!!
Big ditto to this we all make mistakes  | |
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Veteran
Posts: 183
| Herbie - 2014-06-09 9:19 AM
The one thing we have to remember is that Mr. Coburn is a newbie to horse racing and in their first try they breed a horse for $10,000 that wins two of the most pretigious races of all time. To say one gets emotionally caught up in that was an understatement. Heck, I got caught up in mine running in a $5000 claimer and finishing 9th. HAHA Horse racing is an emotional thing and if you've never owned one, it's like nothing else seeing your horse come down the race track. I can't imagine someone shoving a camera in your face right after that. Yes, he knew the deal when he paid the entry fee, and I agree with NONE of what he said and certainly don't want or think anything needs to be changed in the campaign for the Triple Crown. All I can say is that he was emotional, exhausted, heart broken, and loves his horse.....but most of all he's human and made a mistake. It's my understanding he and his wife just appeared on Good Morning America and he delivered the most sincere, heartfelt apology. I forgive him because he's the first person i've seen in the game of horse racing in a very long time who actually loves his horse. For most owners, it's simply business and a tax write off and once the horse isn't profitable (if it ever is to start with) big time owners often don't care what happens to them, but Steve LOVES this horse, and for that I applaud him. I'm still a CC fan, I think he's a special horse and I forgive Mr. Coburn for the way he acted. The Good Lord knows I wouldn't want a camera in my face after any of those races because there is no telling what might come out of my mouth! It takes a big man to know he was in the wrong and an even bigger man to admit it with tears in his eyes! So I still say, Go Chrome!!!!!!
Amen sister! | |
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 No Fear
Posts: 5089
Location: TN | illlookup - 2014-06-09 9:23 AM Herbie - 2014-06-09 9:19 AM The one thing we have to remember is that Mr . Coburn is a newbie to horse racing and in their first try they breed a horse for $10,000 that wins two of the most pretigious races of all time. To say one gets emotionally caught up in that was an understatement. Heck, I got caught up in mine running in a $5000 claimer and finishing 9th. HAHA Horse racing is an emotional thing and if you've never owned one, it's like nothing else seeing your horse come down the race track. I can't imagine someone shoving a camera in your face right after that. Yes, he knew the deal when he paid the entry fee, and I agree with NONE of what he said and certainly don't want or think anything needs to be changed in the campaign for the Triple Crown. All I can say is that he was emotional, exhausted, heart broken, and loves his horse.....but most of all he's human and made a mistake. It's my understanding he and his wife just appeared on Good Morning America and he delivered the most sincere, heartfelt apology. I forgive him because he's the first person i've seen in the game of horse racing in a very long time who actually loves his horse. For most owners, it's simply business and a tax write off and once the horse isn't profitable (if it ever is to start with) big time owners often don't care what happens to them, but Steve LOVES this horse, and for that I applaud him. I'm still a CC fan, I think he's a special horse and I forgive Mr. Coburn for the way he acted. The Good Lord knows I wouldn't want a camera in my face after any of those races because there is no telling what might come out of my mouth! It takes a big man to know he was in the wrong and an even bigger man to admit it with tears in his eyes! So I still say, Go Chrome!!!!!! Amen sister!
I totally agree Herbie! You said it wonderfully! | |
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 Angel in a Sorrel Coat
Posts: 16030
Location: In a happy place | Herbie - 2014-06-09 9:19 AM The one thing we have to remember is that Mr. Coburn is a newbie to horse racing and in their first try they breed a horse for $10,000 that wins two of the most pretigious races of all time. To say one gets emotionally caught up in that was an understatement. Heck, I got caught up in mine running in a $5000 claimer and finishing 9th. HAHA Horse racing is an emotional thing and if you've never owned one, it's like nothing else seeing your horse come down the race track. I can't imagine someone shoving a camera in your face right after that. Yes, he knew the deal when he paid the entry fee, and I agree with NONE of what he said and certainly don't want or think anything needs to be changed in the campaign for the Triple Crown. All I can say is that he was emotional, exhausted, heart broken, and loves his horse.....but most of all he's human and made a mistake. It's my understanding he and his wife just appeared on Good Morning America and he delivered the most sincere, heartfelt apology. I forgive him because he's the first person i've seen in the game of horse racing in a very long time who actually loves his horse. For most owners, it's simply business and a tax write off and once the horse isn't profitable (if it ever is to start with) big time owners often don't care what happens to them, but Steve LOVES this horse, and for that I applaud him. I'm still a CC fan, I think he's a special horse and I forgive Mr. Coburn for the way he acted. The Good Lord knows I wouldn't want a camera in my face after any of those races because there is no telling what might come out of my mouth! It takes a big man to know he was in the wrong and an even bigger man to admit it with tears in his eyes! So I still say, Go Chrome!!!!!!
I am in total agreement with everything you said Herbie. Mr. Coburn needs our forgiveness. And it is so true he really loves his horse. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 830
Location: Paradise , tx | I think something that most people are not considering is that steroids were not illegal in the 70's. I'm not saying that the TC winners would or would not have won with or without drugs or that any of them were on steroids, but I'm saying that could very well make a difference in how horses in that decade handled 3 close races as compared to now. Look at how Big Brown's speed changed when he was pulled off Equipoise. Everyone is saying that the quality of horses has declined. I don't think that's so. I just don't think that racing is the same as it was in 70's, and I think that there's just so many quality horses and they have to run to run totally on their heart w/no medicinal help....I'm not saying that the former TC winners were on anything, but I do know that it was widely used in racing back then.
You make an excellent point I had not thought about | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 830
Location: Paradise , tx | Herbie - 2014-06-09 9:19 AM The one thing we have to remember is that Mr. Coburn is a newbie to horse racing and in their first try they breed a horse for $10,000 that wins two of the most pretigious races of all time. To say one gets emotionally caught up in that was an understatement. Heck, I got caught up in mine running in a $5000 claimer and finishing 9th. HAHA Horse racing is an emotional thing and if you've never owned one, it's like nothing else seeing your horse come down the race track. I can't imagine someone shoving a camera in your face right after that. Yes, he knew the deal when he paid the entry fee, and I agree with NONE of what he said and certainly don't want or think anything needs to be changed in the campaign for the Triple Crown. All I can say is that he was emotional, exhausted, heart broken, and loves his horse.....but most of all he's human and made a mistake. It's my understanding he and his wife just appeared on Good Morning America and he delivered the most sincere, heartfelt apology. I forgive him because he's the first person i've seen in the game of horse racing in a very long time who actually loves his horse. For most owners, it's simply business and a tax write off and once the horse isn't profitable (if it ever is to start with) big time owners often don't care what happens to them, but Steve LOVES this horse, and for that I applaud him. I'm still a CC fan, I think he's a special horse and I forgive Mr. Coburn for the way he acted. The Good Lord knows I wouldn't want a camera in my face after any of those races because there is no telling what might come out of my mouth! It takes a big man to know he was in the wrong and an even bigger man to admit it with tears in his eyes! So I still say, Go Chrome!!!!!!
You are so right. He asks for forgiveness, time to forgive and forget. He has a wonderful horse and should be proud of CC. We all make mistakes. No one can ever take away that CC won the Kentucky Derby. | |
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Location: California | The quality of TB's has gone down. Go to the track and look at the lack of bone on alot of the horses. I remember years ago, looking at a filly of D. Wayne's in the paddock and gasped when I looked at her chicken bone legs. We just breed for speed now. No double tough horses around for a long time. Breeding and training methods have given us fragile TBs. My husband has been doing this all his life and he agrees.
Edited by NonaY 2014-06-09 11:26 AM
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 Midget Lover
Location: Kentucky | NonaY - 2014-06-09 12:24 PM The quality of TB's has gone down. Go to the track and look at the lack of bone on alot of the horses. I remember years ago, looking at a filly of D. Wayne's in the paddock and gasped when I looked at her chicken bone legs. We just breed for speed now. No double tough horses around for a long time. Breeding and training methods have given us fragile TBs. My husband has been doing this all his life and he agrees.
I was at Churchill a few days after Derby and saw horses in the paddock with these chicken legs. They looked like they could snap at any moment. | |
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 I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | They just played Coburn's apology on Fox News. | |
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 Husband Spoiler
Posts: 4151
Location: North Dakota | Murphy - 2014-06-09 11:28 AM NonaY - 2014-06-09 12:24 PM The quality of TB's has gone down. Go to the track and look at the lack of bone on alot of the horses. I remember years ago, looking at a filly of D. Wayne's in the paddock and gasped when I looked at her chicken bone legs. We just breed for speed now. No double tough horses around for a long time. Breeding and training methods have given us fragile TBs. My husband has been doing this all his life and he agrees. I was at Churchill a few days after Derby and saw horses in the paddock with these chicken legs. They looked like they could snap at any moment.
You see them in the cutting pen as well. | |
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Whack and Roll
Posts: 6342
Location: NE Texas | NonaY - 2014-06-09 11:24 AM The quality of TB's has gone down. Go to the track and look at the lack of bone on alot of the horses. I remember years ago, looking at a filly of D. Wayne's in the paddock and gasped when I looked at her chicken bone legs. We just breed for speed now. No double tough horses around for a long time. Breeding and training methods have given us fragile TBs. My husband has been doing this all his life and he agrees. I'm going to disagree with you, Nonay, that the integrity of the horse has been decreased resulting in a lack of bone. The size of the bone has nothing to do with the strength of the horse, or lack therof. I think what you should be referring to is the lack of BONE DENSITY, which is built and increased by work and ground pounding exercise, not heredity. Smaller/finer bone does not represent weak bone and conversely bigger/heavier bone does not represent strong bone. You have have a large bone and there be a huge lack of bone density due to lack of work, a nurtition deficiency, or both. In fact, it has been proven by several top equine university programs that big heavy bone when stressed will result in catastrophic breakdown more ofthen that it's counterpart. Big/heavy bone also takes alot longer to develop into strong bone and become dense simply due to the size of the bone.
Smaller/finer bone on the other hand is more tensile and more forgiving, and under the same amount of pressure, it has shown that while there still can be injury to the bone, it is less likely to be catastrophic injury. Smaller bone also takes less time to build density because it is smaller in size/circumference. Another thing that makes smaller/finer bone and smaller feet more desireable in a performance/race horse is that it requires less energy to perform the same motion that of it's big boned/big footed counterpart, meaning that more energy can be stored and left in the tank for other actions like that final kick, running home from the third barrel, getting across the pen to make that final cut. What we have with our current exercise/training regimes are locomotives running on toothpics. That's a scary thought isn't it.
The difference in the horses today from what they used to be in the 70's and before is the horse trainer himself. The old trainers would work a horse and prepare them to perform the task that was being asked of them. They would do more race specific training instead of more jogging and slow gallops. About the early 80's QH trainers began moving over the the TB side bringing along their "less is more" training practices and their "more is more" stable size. Also during this time lasix became an allowable race day medication. In that time, people saw horse racing change.....for the worst in my opinion.
Yes, Secretariat was a freak.....but he was trained and prepared to go a full mile and a half. He was not rested and wrapped in bubble wrap and placed in a stall....they worked him harder and faster than most other people were working their horses....it's true....and documented. I don't understand why so many horsemen continue to ignore science and the other aspects of simple phsyiology. Take a human distance runner and put him in his closet every day. Take him out for 30 mintues a day and let him jog around, maybe get a quick half a ss sprint in of about 1/4 of his race distance once a week, maybe once every other week. Feed him the best food and supplements money can buy. Then ask him to come and run a race once a month and see how fit he is, see how many injuries he gets in a race, so how much longevity he has, how much endurance he has, and how long it takes him to break down with these training methods.
Until we have some trainers who are willing to step outside the box and prepare a horse a little differently, try something new, go the extra mile, i'm afraid that things will never change. Every trainer does basically the same thing, so they are relying on that heart to carry them through. But what if a horse had the heart and the body and was actually prepared to go the distance. It can be done, it is being done by a very select few, but it is time consuming and can't be done in barns where there are 30 head to get worked in the morning.
Edited by Herbie 2014-06-09 12:48 PM
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Whack and Roll
Posts: 6342
Location: NE Texas | Murphy - 2014-06-09 11:28 AM NonaY - 2014-06-09 12:24 PM The quality of TB's has gone down. Go to the track and look at the lack of bone on alot of the horses. I remember years ago, looking at a filly of D. Wayne's in the paddock and gasped when I looked at her chicken bone legs. We just breed for speed now. No double tough horses around for a long time. Breeding and training methods have given us fragile TBs. My husband has been doing this all his life and he agrees. I was at Churchill a few days after Derby and saw horses in the paddock with these chicken legs. They looked like they could snap at any moment.
I'll take all the chikcen legged horses you'll send to me. In the right program, they'll stay sounder longer and be quicker footed than those big, heavy boned, slow footed horses if they are conditioned properly and prepared to perform the job we are asking them to do! Send em my way....I love chicken legs! LOL  | |
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I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | Herbie - 2014-06-09 9:19 AM The one thing we have to remember is that Mr. Coburn is a newbie to horse racing and in their first try they breed a horse for $10,000 that wins two of the most pretigious races of all time. To say one gets emotionally caught up in that was an understatement. Heck, I got caught up in mine running in a $5000 claimer and finishing 9th. HAHA Horse racing is an emotional thing and if you've never owned one, it's like nothing else seeing your horse come down the race track. I can't imagine someone shoving a camera in your face right after that. Yes, he knew the deal when he paid the entry fee, and I agree with NONE of what he said and certainly don't want or think anything needs to be changed in the campaign for the Triple Crown. All I can say is that he was emotional, exhausted, heart broken, and loves his horse.....but most of all he's human and made a mistake. It's my understanding he and his wife just appeared on Good Morning America and he delivered the most sincere, heartfelt apology. I forgive him because he's the first person i've seen in the game of horse racing in a very long time who actually loves his horse. For most owners, it's simply business and a tax write off and once the horse isn't profitable (if it ever is to start with) big time owners often don't care what happens to them, but Steve LOVES this horse, and for that I applaud him. I'm still a CC fan, I think he's a special horse and I forgive Mr. Coburn for the way he acted. The Good Lord knows I wouldn't want a camera in my face after any of those races because there is no telling what might come out of my mouth! It takes a big man to know he was in the wrong and an even bigger man to admit it with tears in his eyes! So I still say, Go Chrome!!!!!!
I agree and I did own one TB race horse in my lifetime and I couldn't handle the stress...LOL
Great post. | |
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I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | Herbie - 2014-06-09 11:55 AM Murphy - 2014-06-09 11:28 AM NonaY - 2014-06-09 12:24 PM The quality of TB's has gone down. Go to the track and look at the lack of bone on alot of the horses. I remember years ago, looking at a filly of D. Wayne's in the paddock and gasped when I looked at her chicken bone legs. We just breed for speed now. No double tough horses around for a long time. Breeding and training methods have given us fragile TBs. My husband has been doing this all his life and he agrees. I was at Churchill a few days after Derby and saw horses in the paddock with these chicken legs. They looked like they could snap at any moment.
I couldn't agree more. I owned a chicken legged horse years ago and almost didn't buy her because of it and she was the soundest horse I have ever owned while the biggest boned mare I owned was a walking cripple. | |
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Expert
Posts: 4652
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Being involved with California Chrome and as the company that has been supplying his nutritional formula I could not have said it any better. The two owners are down to earth and every day people like us. The emotional ups and downs would take a toll on anyone put in that situation.
Do I agree with him? No. The Triple Crown is set up to make it hard to win, that's why it has not been won in 36 years.
But we all should keep in mind that to win two out of three ain't bad.
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| Can I forgive him for his atrocious attitude and comments even as furious as both made me? Yes. However, I will say this on the subject of his apology: I don't think he had much choice - he made a fool of himself, I am sure upset and totally embarrassed all of the connections; along with his wife not to mention 99% of the people in the TB racing industry. Do I think he's truly sorry? Yes. Do I think he apologized because he softened his attitude? No.
Do I feel really bad that Chrome didn't win? Yes. I hate that Mr. Coburn got so close to one of the most glorious moments in racing history BUT I certainly hope that as he has time to reflect that he will realize just how awesome, how totally AWESOMEn it is to win the KY Derby much less the Preakness. He will always reflect back with sadness at how close they came to that TC;however, I hope he also feels immense gratitude for what that wonderful horse did accomplish and not dwell on what not what he didn't. | |
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 I'm not opinionated
Posts: 4597
Location: Online | NonaY - 2014-06-09 10:24 AM The quality of TB's has gone down. Go to the track and look at the lack of bone on alot of the horses. I remember years ago, looking at a filly of D. Wayne's in the paddock and gasped when I looked at her chicken bone legs. We just breed for speed now. No double tough horses around for a long time. Breeding and training methods have given us fragile TBs. My husband has been doing this all his life and he agrees.
I don't know anything about the TBs, but I see it in the QH racing too. They are breeding the soundness out for speed. IMO. I currently have 4 OTTQH, they all ran well, two are big, two are small. My big boned 16 hand gelding ran 97 SI, he is the most sound horse his race owners have ever had, he is from older, more foundation race breeding. The other big one is newer breeding, 101 SI big boned, had chips taken out of both knees at 2, and has terrible feet. The other two are smaller, finer boned. The one that is older breeding is 100% sound, never a problem. The newer breeding one is a chocolate mess, race career ended due to soundness and has terrible feet. Some will say that breeding has nothing to do with it, but I believe it does. They were all race trained by the same trainer. | |
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I'm not opinionated
Posts: 4597
Location: Online | Back to the Chrome saga.....
I haven't read all the comments on the thread, so I don't know if someone already brought this up, but.....
It irritated me so bad that the NBC reporters ran right to Chrome's owners. Why not the winners? Because NBC wanted drama, they knew they would get a sound bite. It's no fun to run down the owners of the winning horse and get the woohoo's and excitement - that's not going to be as memorable than drama. It's way more fun to interview the loser in hopes of getting the dramatic negative. The connections of Chrome have been living in a stressful highly emotional situation for months leading up to this moment and they got the rug pulled out from under them. Of course they are going to be emotional and say things they shouldn't. Emotions will shut off the brain to mouth filter every time. I don't like any of the NBC reporters anyway, especially Costas, they crossed the line. IMO.
Now Coburn has apologized for his emotional outburst and is getting chastized by some for that. Certain people will never be happy, they focus on the negative and can't move past it. An apology is never enough to change their view of a person. We all talk about taking responsibility for our actions, yet when someone does, it's still not good enough in the eyes of some people. It bites my butt. There. Rant over. | |
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10D Crack Champion
| rodeomom13 - 2014-06-10 9:09 AM
Back to the Chrome saga.....
I haven't read all the comments on the thread, so I don't know if someone already brought this up, but.....
It irritated me so bad that the NBC reporters ran right to Chrome's owners. Why not the winners? Because NBC wanted drama, they knew they would get a sound bite. It's no fun to run down the owners of the winning horse and get the woohoo's and excitement - that's not going to be as memorable than drama. It's way more fun to interview the loser in hopes of getting the dramatic negative. The connections of Chrome have been living in a stressful highly emotional situation for months leading up to this moment and they got the rug pulled out from under them. Of course they are going to be emotional and say things they shouldn't. Emotions will shut off the brain to mouth filter every time. I don't like any of the NBC reporters anyway, especially Costas, they crossed the line. IMO.
Now Coburn has apologized for his emotional outburst and is getting chastized by some for that. Certain people will never be happy, they focus on the negative and can't move past it. An apology is never enough to change their view of a person. We all talk about taking responsibility for our actions, yet when someone does, it's still not good enough in the eyes of some people. It bites my butt. There. Rant over.
I agree with you about NBC not going to the winning owners first too. It was for drama. I also think they knew Cogburn would be a bit outspoken just because of his general demeanor up to this point. They should have shown respect to the winning owners first. I really hated that they even asked Tonalist owner about Cogburn's rant when he was getting the trophy from the NY governor. That was tacky for sure. | |
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