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| Bibliafarm - 2013-12-15 8:21 PM The livestock and horses will die .. in the heat here.. its winter but not cold down south. its clearly in the 80's.. coming from northern states with their winter coats and acclimated to cold.. it will be very hard on them here.. bad decision .. stay in cold climates.
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Expert
Posts: 1488
| syoung - 2013-12-16 11:23 AM
CheckItOut - 2013-12-15 8:35 PM Pump the breaks... and realize this press release was issued by the Las Vegas Event's coordinator, not the PRCA. Before you go bashing the PRCA, the truth is a lot different than what you might think. Las Vegas low balled us and we declined, this is the PRCA standing up for it's members! This is not over and for the revenue that the NFR brings to Vegas for 2 weeks in December, their low ball offer was offensive. They think we need them, but they need us more. Stand up for the cowboys. Don't jump to conclusions or fall for some fancy written social media ploy to get people riled up.
With no official word about this from the PRCA, we can only conclude from what's been published in writing at this point. Advocates, such as you, representing the PRCA say this is all in consideration of the contestants. I have two questions: Where is the loyalty to the sponsors and fans? How much money do the contestants need? As a fan that has attended the NFR in Las Vegas for the last 20 years, from the outside looking in - isn't a $60,000 per go, per event payoff enough?
They need as much as they can get.
Signed
Capitalism Rocks
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Holy Fruit Loops!
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Location: Colorado | dhdqhllc - 2013-12-16 11:15 AM BamaCanChaser - 2013-12-16 11:12 AM ozcancrasher13 - 2013-12-16 10:24 AM The PRCA has gotten greedy. I'm not sure how much money they think they deserve. The PRCA thinks they should get some of the money from the trade shows, the after rodeo parties, etc. too.
Yes, Las Vegas profits from the Finals. Reports of how much money is generated is astonomical. However, consider the costs of building, running and maintaining a casino.
I am all for the cowboys and cowgirls, but just how much money do you really think you deserve for one round? $18K is a lot of money. Sherry won more in 10 days than most people make in a year, working a 40 hour week. I'm not saying she didn't deserve or earn it, but put it into perspective. This money is being GIVEN by LVE.
Year after year after year, through the recession, LVE has always come through. If the PRCA moves the Finals, I sure hope where ever they move it can prove this kind of money will always be there.
If what I was told is true, the PRCA's greed is why the Colorado Springs rodeo is now invitational. But Sherry is not "most people" she is a professional athlete. And our sports' professional athletes don't make a fraction of what other sports' professional athletes make. How could any true fan of rodeo see our elite competitiors making more money as a bad thing?
Yeppers. This is all about fan base. Or should be.
A ten year contract gives the PRCA no way out if this does not work. At least one if not two years of a temporary arena doesn't make "good ground" a priority.
How many actual rooms are available in that area during Dec.? Orlando is pretty darn expnsive at Christmas time. Air fare to Vegas is cheap. Not so much to Orlando.
The last time a Commisioner sold off television rights to a "sports venue" and started trying to compare the money made by contestants to the other major sports he darned near bankrupted the PRCA. Hope the current board takes a look at history and does not repeat the mistakes that were made. I seriously doubt the PRCA could recover again.
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 Tried and True
Posts: 21185
Location: Where I am happiest | dhdqhllc - 2013-12-16 11:15 AM BamaCanChaser - 2013-12-16 11:12 AM ozcancrasher13 - 2013-12-16 10:24 AM The PRCA has gotten greedy. I'm not sure how much money they think they deserve. The PRCA thinks they should get some of the money from the trade shows, the after rodeo parties, etc. too.
Yes, Las Vegas profits from the Finals. Reports of how much money is generated is astonomical. However, consider the costs of building, running and maintaining a casino.
I am all for the cowboys and cowgirls, but just how much money do you really think you deserve for one round? $18K is a lot of money. Sherry won more in 10 days than most people make in a year, working a 40 hour week. I'm not saying she didn't deserve or earn it, but put it into perspective. This money is being GIVEN by LVE.
Year after year after year, through the recession, LVE has always come through. If the PRCA moves the Finals, I sure hope where ever they move it can prove this kind of money will always be there.
If what I was told is true, the PRCA's greed is why the Colorado Springs rodeo is now invitational. But Sherry is not "most people" she is a professional athlete. And our sports' professional athletes don't make a fraction of what other sports' professional athletes make. How could any true fan of rodeo see our elite competitiors making more money as a bad thing?
Exactly what I was thinking. Also, if this doesnt work out and Florida wants out in 10 years because the fan base numbers arent there, then what? Go begging Vegas to take it back after they have moved on with a different venue???? | |
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 Toastest with the Mostest
Posts: 5712
Location: That part of Texas | justcruzin - 2013-12-16 11:11 AM Red Raider - 2013-12-16 9:06 AM This is what makes me laugh the most (as taken from the press release):
Christenson said NFR fans will have to pay about 40 percent more for tickets in central Florida than they have paid for the 10 days of rodeo at the sold-out Thomas &Mack Center at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas.
The average NFR ticket is about $75 each for a lower bowl seat and about $55 for an upper bowl seat, Christenson said.
I don't know what world this guy is living in but I know I haven't been paying $75 for a lower-level seat or even $55 for the upper (but we come late and take what we can get). I'm lucky if we can find lower level seating and pay $150-250 a ticket if we can find them.
So please, I would love to pay $105 a ticket and actually know that I'm going to get to watch the rodeo at that price and without having to do some back room deal with a guy in Vegas just to get my hands on decent seats. That's why so many people watch it from the casinos because it's hard to actually get a ticket. I know I don't like flying 4 hours (or driving 15 hours) to go to a rodeo to watch it on a screen but you do what you have to do.
I've also seen a lot my friends say they won't go if it's in Florida. All I can say is more beach for me my friends. I'd love to go to the NFR and come back with a tan. I'd miss Vegas but I'd still go wherever they have it.
I'd have more of a shot at getting my hands on tickets without having to go through any 2nd party dealer/scalper in Florida than Vegas. | |
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 Googly Goo
Posts: 7053
| bocephus's mama - 2013-12-16 10:51 AM TXBO - 2013-12-16 10:35 AM yellowhorse1 - 2013-12-16 10:12 AM TXBO - 2013-12-16 10:05 AM yellowhorse1 - 2013-12-16 8:33 AM TXBO - 2013-12-16 8:28 AM I'd be very surprised if Vegas doesn't have a very attractive counter offer. I don't kno......I thought that to. But go on the Internet and read about it. This thing has already progressed farther than what I would have thought. Honestly. It sounds like to me it's just formality of "signing the papers" now unless Las Vegas does something pretty quick. But your talking about a pretty big disparity in dollars. So I'm not sure they will pony it up.
When I left Vegas in 2002, we had estimated the nongaming economic impact of the NFR around $75 Million. $4 million is a drop in the bucket. I just read that last year they estimated it to be 90 million. I agree it is a drop in the bucket, but how much leeway do they have as far as adding money? And I read another deal that said Orlando is wanting to have it sewed by feb so they can make a big announcement at their silver spurs rodeo. It said they took a vote on a live video feed in front of the prca yesterday and all seven of their commissioners voted to move forward on this.
And $4 million *is* a decent amount when you're talking about $75 million. Like I said before, I wonder what the $4 million would be in terms of an increase in costs to LVE.
It also doesn't isolate the incremental impact of the NFR but that's also significant. $5 million per casino time 23 casinos come up to $115 million. That also is a fraction of the total gaming revenues for the week.... that's just 23 of the biggest. My only point is that with numbers like these, $4 million is not a big number.
Edited by TXBO 2013-12-16 11:51 AM
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Posts: 1409
| Does anyone have the numbers of when the NFR first moved to Vegas how the attendance was compared to OKC? ANyone remember that far back?
This discussion so reminds me of the move from OKC to Vegas............ 
Little girls wanted to run down the alley at the Myriad Convention Center and the OKC Fairgrounds before that.
Edited by TyE 2013-12-16 11:51 AM
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Googly Goo
Posts: 7053
| No but attendance is one area that Vegas has made a mistake. They had 30 years to come up with a solution to increase attendance but never made the investment. There was good evidence 10 years ago that NFR attendance could average 25,000 per night if a facility would support it.
Edited by TXBO 2013-12-16 11:57 AM
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 Wishing I were a Wildcat
Location: 'Hawk Country | ThreeCorners - 2013-12-16 11:32 AM dhdqhllc - 2013-12-16 11:15 AM BamaCanChaser - 2013-12-16 11:12 AM ozcancrasher13 - 2013-12-16 10:24 AM The PRCA has gotten greedy. I'm not sure how much money they think they deserve. The PRCA thinks they should get some of the money from the trade shows, the after rodeo parties, etc. too.
Yes, Las Vegas profits from the Finals. Reports of how much money is generated is astonomical. However, consider the costs of building, running and maintaining a casino.
I am all for the cowboys and cowgirls, but just how much money do you really think you deserve for one round? $18K is a lot of money. Sherry won more in 10 days than most people make in a year, working a 40 hour week. I'm not saying she didn't deserve or earn it, but put it into perspective. This money is being GIVEN by LVE.
Year after year after year, through the recession, LVE has always come through. If the PRCA moves the Finals, I sure hope where ever they move it can prove this kind of money will always be there.
If what I was told is true, the PRCA's greed is why the Colorado Springs rodeo is now invitational. But Sherry is not "most people" she is a professional athlete. And our sports' professional athletes don't make a fraction of what other sports' professional athletes make. How could any true fan of rodeo see our elite competitiors making more money as a bad thing?
I know I don't sound like it, but I truly love rodeo.
I just know that it does not rank with other professional sports. (I believe they are all getting paid way too much to play a game!!!) Those of us who rodeo, or follow it even if we don't, are a small number compared to the world.
If Tuf Cooper, Kevin Durant and Tom Brady walk down the street together, almost everyone will know Kevin and Tom. Most won't know Tuf.
Older guys, Michael Jordon, Brett Farve, and Joe Beaver. Who are people going to recognize?
That is why it is so hard to sell to people outside rodeo. I wish everyone in the world loved rodeo as much as they do baseball, soccer, basketball, football or hockey.
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 Strong Willed Woman
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Location: Prosser, WA | So is there a better time of year than December to have the finals in Orlando? They've changed the regular season dates so many times I don't know why they couldn't change the dates of the finals. | |
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 Always Off Topic
Posts: 6382
Location: ND | TXBO - 2013-12-16 11:53 AM No but attendance is one area that Vegas has made a mistake. They had 30 years to come up with a solution to increase attendance but never made the investment. There was good evidence 10 years ago that NFR attendance could average 25,000 per night if a facility would support it.
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Wishing I were a Wildcat
Location: 'Hawk Country | EnterUp - 2013-12-16 10:41 AM ozcancrasher13 - 2013-12-16 10:24 AM The PRCA has gotten greedy. I'm not sure how much money they think they deserve. The PRCA thinks they should get some of the money from the trade shows, the after rodeo parties, etc. too.
Yes, Las Vegas profits from the Finals. Reports of how much money is generated is astonomical. However, consider the costs of building, running and maintaining a casino.
I am all for the cowboys and cowgirls, but just how much money do you really think you deserve for one round? $18K is a lot of money. Sherry won more in 10 days than most people make in a year, working a 40 hour week. I'm not saying she didn't deserve or earn it, but put it into perspective. This money is being GIVEN by LVE.
Year after year after year, through the recession, LVE has always come through. If the PRCA moves the Finals, I sure hope where ever they move it can prove this kind of money will always be there.
If what I was told is true, the PRCA's greed is why the Colorado Springs rodeo is now invitational. You might want to do a little research. This isn't about the PRCA being greedy. This is about the PRCA listening to its membership and doing what they want. Everyone makes a pretty darn good living off of the backs of the cowboys out in Vegas off of the NFR. Casino's, vendors at the trade shows, stock contractors, but yet the ones who have put out the most during the year are offered the least. I would be willing to bet that over 50% of the timed event contestants run up in the red at the end of the year. But yet you expect them to just continue to take the short end of the stick. If you believe in the rodeo cowboy, then you should be standing behind them and agreeing that they deserve to be paid better.
I know what it cost for my husband to win the rookie of the year title. I know what it costs to just haul to make circuit finals.
I also know cowboys/cowgirls are choosing to rodeo as a living. This is one of the few "professional" sports that you get to play if you want to.
If I wanted to play in the NBA, I can't just buy a permit and "enter" a game.
On the flip side, in rodeo, you only get paid if you win.
I actually have the cowboys/cowgirls best interests in my thoughts. What happens, like someone already said, if this doesn't grow/expand the way it is being promised? Ask Las Vegas to take it back? Do you think they will offer more money then? The cowboys/cowgirls could end up with less money.
No one can tell the future. I would rather stay with someone who has provided and taken care of the Finals for so long.
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Toastest with the Mostest
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Location: That part of Texas | ozcancrasher13 - 2013-12-16 12:10 PM
I actually have the cowboys/cowgirls best interests in my thoughts. What happens, like someone already said, if this doesn't grow/expand the way it is being promised? Ask Las Vegas to take it back? Do you think they will offer more money then? The cowboys/cowgirls could end up with less money. No, they won't beg for it to be back. Vegas has already given it's "counter-offer" on this deal and it's in the press release. Their offer is to take the loyalty of the fans to Vegas, the atmosphere and use it to jump-start a new series that will be theirs to run and control. The PRCA is banking that it can make it without Vegas and Vegas is doing the same.
Edited by Red Raider 2013-12-16 12:24 PM
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 Veteran
Posts: 224
Location: La Belle, Mo | kickincans - 2013-12-15 9:36 PM Well everyone has an opinion and I may be the odd one but I think it does need to move, it's time to find an arena that will make this a RODEO again, room for the team roping,instead of a sling out of the box with no where to go strap em out and watch a real roping, a bigger barrel pattern let em really run, and not so much about the glitz of Vegas more about the Rodeo, it may not be Florida but I think it's time for a change so why not move it to South Point if it stays in Vegas thats a nice arena
Edited by horsecrazy45 2013-12-16 12:37 PM
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Wishing I were a Wildcat
Location: 'Hawk Country | Red Raider - 2013-12-16 12:22 PM ozcancrasher13 - 2013-12-16 12:10 PM
I actually have the cowboys/cowgirls best interests in my thoughts. What happens, like someone already said, if this doesn't grow/expand the way it is being promised? Ask Las Vegas to take it back? Do you think they will offer more money then? The cowboys/cowgirls could end up with less money. No, they won't beg for it to be back. Vegas has already given it's "counter-offer" on this deal and it's in the press release. Their offer is to take the loyalty of the fans to Vegas, the atmosphere and use it to jump-start a new series that will be theirs to run and control. The PRCA is banking that it can make it without Vegas and Vegas is doing the same.
I know what Las Vegas has planned if the Finals leave. I was just throwing out what the PRCA would do if they happened to need another home in a few years.
Maybe both will be ok and the cowboys will have 2 big "finals" to enter.
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 Voice of Reason
Location: NOT at Wal Mart | Red Raider - 2013-12-16 9:33 AM justcruzin - 2013-12-16 11:11 AM Red Raider - 2013-12-16 9:06 AM This is what makes me laugh the most (as taken from the press release):
Christenson said NFR fans will have to pay about 40 percent more for tickets in central Florida than they have paid for the 10 days of rodeo at the sold-out Thomas &Mack Center at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas.
The average NFR ticket is about $75 each for a lower bowl seat and about $55 for an upper bowl seat, Christenson said.
I don't know what world this guy is living in but I know I haven't been paying $75 for a lower-level seat or even $55 for the upper (but we come late and take what we can get). I'm lucky if we can find lower level seating and pay $150-250 a ticket if we can find them.
So please, I would love to pay $105 a ticket and actually know that I'm going to get to watch the rodeo at that price and without having to do some back room deal with a guy in Vegas just to get my hands on decent seats. That's why so many people watch it from the casinos because it's hard to actually get a ticket. I know I don't like flying 4 hours (or driving 15 hours) to go to a rodeo to watch it on a screen but you do what you have to do.
I've also seen a lot my friends say they won't go if it's in Florida. All I can say is more beach for me my friends. I'd love to go to the NFR and come back with a tan. I'd miss Vegas but I'd still go wherever they have it.
They got this down to a science, wont matter where the event is held. Those tickets will be sold out and you/me will be paying top dollar for them. | |
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Googly Goo
Posts: 7053
| justcruzin - 2013-12-16 12:44 PM Red Raider - 2013-12-16 9:33 AM justcruzin - 2013-12-16 11:11 AM Red Raider - 2013-12-16 9:06 AM This is what makes me laugh the most (as taken from the press release):
Christenson said NFR fans will have to pay about 40 percent more for tickets in central Florida than they have paid for the 10 days of rodeo at the sold-out Thomas &Mack Center at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas.
The average NFR ticket is about $75 each for a lower bowl seat and about $55 for an upper bowl seat, Christenson said.
I don't know what world this guy is living in but I know I haven't been paying $75 for a lower-level seat or even $55 for the upper (but we come late and take what we can get). I'm lucky if we can find lower level seating and pay $150-250 a ticket if we can find them.
So please, I would love to pay $105 a ticket and actually know that I'm going to get to watch the rodeo at that price and without having to do some back room deal with a guy in Vegas just to get my hands on decent seats. That's why so many people watch it from the casinos because it's hard to actually get a ticket. I know I don't like flying 4 hours (or driving 15 hours) to go to a rodeo to watch it on a screen but you do what you have to do.
I've also seen a lot my friends say they won't go if it's in Florida. All I can say is more beach for me my friends. I'd love to go to the NFR and come back with a tan. I'd miss Vegas but I'd still go wherever they have it.
Who knows what demand will be at a new venue but 40% increase in supply could certainly lower prices. | |
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 The Comeback Kid
Posts: 1564
Location: lost in missouri | People who are supporting this move or a move based on more money I have a huge question to ask. Where is PRCA guaranteeing this money is going to go to the contestants? Until i see it in writing and not just lip service I am not buying that argument. I see it going in PRCA coffers not on to the contestants.
FL is so much more expensive than Vegas. Flights are expensive especially in December to there, hotels and food are way more expensive. I know how expensive it is to go to Vegas for two people and that is with them almost giving the rooms away, so how do people think a family can afford Florida?
Lets face it, this has to be about the fans to because a rodeo with out Fan participation will not last. You have to have the fans. You can price yourself out of business.
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Toastest with the Mostest
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Location: That part of Texas | ozcancrasher13 - 2013-12-16 12:43 PM Red Raider - 2013-12-16 12:22 PM ozcancrasher13 - 2013-12-16 12:10 PM
I actually have the cowboys/cowgirls best interests in my thoughts. What happens, like someone already said, if this doesn't grow/expand the way it is being promised? Ask Las Vegas to take it back? Do you think they will offer more money then? The cowboys/cowgirls could end up with less money. No, they won't beg for it to be back. Vegas has already given it's "counter-offer" on this deal and it's in the press release. Their offer is to take the loyalty of the fans to Vegas, the atmosphere and use it to jump-start a new series that will be theirs to run and control. The PRCA is banking that it can make it without Vegas and Vegas is doing the same.
Maybe both will be ok and the cowboys will have 2 big "finals" to enter.
I hope you are right on that because it looks like it's going to happen. The "marriage" is not going to be reconcilable now, especially with the new releases from today and past rumor of a big break-up.
Does South Point adding new arenas/barns come into play with the new stuff? I was just wondering because I have friends in the roping down there and have some more in the area competing right now (think just about 10 miles down the road) in ranch sorting. Vegas is doing a pretty good job of pulling a bunch of horse events together at the first of December like that. | |
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Cat Collector
Posts: 1430
| Tyson Durfey
I have seen alot of post on social media over the past 24 hours regarding the NFR and the potential move to Florida. There is a lot of very shady arrangements regarding Las Vegas and how they do their contracts. For example over the past several years they have turned down the ability to add extra money for the cowboys. As we all know the National Finals Rodeo adds a little over 6 million dollars in prize money with a 1.7% increase in the contract per year. The increase does not even keep up with inflation. There is a reason why other cities in America have offered nearly 3 times the amount to bring the NFR to other cities. Vegas has had numerous opportunities to increase their bid but just will not do it even though the NFR brings overs 200 million in gross revenue into the city. Just so everybody knows we as NFR qualifiers controlled that vote to turn down the existing contract of 6 million. So when you are mad and upset about the potential move realize that you are mad at the contestants you support. I know that Rodeo has the greatest fans in any American sport we as competitors are just trying to take the sport to the next level and make enough money to have something left when we get too old to Rodeo. Thank you.
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