LIVE2RUN - 2013-11-06 3:57 PM

So, PSSM can be passed to offspring? 

bingo - 2013-11-06 6:23 PM Annemarea- I am so sorry it took me so long to get back to you. I just haven't been on BHW for a while and simply missed your post asking me to relay what I was told about RER. I posted it on the response right before this one.

ampratt - 2013-11-10 7:46 PM Can PSSM type 2 cause soreness in front feet? Has anyone had this as an issue? Back feet do not appear to be bothering her. She is ouchy on front feet and they are much softer in the sole than a normal hoof. My mare tested n/n for PSSM 1 but I am having her tested for PSSM 2 tomorrow via the muscle biopsy. For the last month I have had her on a low starch pelleted feed, grass hay, DMG and rice brand and have really noticed no improvement and her front feet seem worse now. I understand if she is PSSM 2 positive I may have to do some tweaking to find out what works for her but I am just curious if the front feet issue could be PSSM related. Thanks

ampratt - 2013-11-10 7:46 PM

Can PSSM type 2 cause soreness in front feet? Has anyone had this as an issue? Back feet do not appear to be bothering her. She is ouchy on front feet and they are much softer in the sole than a normal hoof. My mare tested n/n for PSSM 1 but I am having her tested for PSSM 2 tomorrow via the muscle biopsy. For the last month I have had her on a low starch pelleted feed, grass hay, DMG and rice brand and have really noticed no improvement and her front feet seem worse now. I understand if she is PSSM 2 positive I may have to do some tweaking to find out what works for her but I am just curious if the front feet issue could be PSSM related. Thanks

CarrieH77 - 2013-11-22 8:39 AM So I have a question - I am going to be selling my PSSM mare.  She is easily managed with diet/exercise is still a competative barrel horse and started roping.  How much does this issue decrease her value do you think?  She was diagnosed 4 years ago and I have owned her for 6.   

Barnmom - 2013-11-14 9:18 AM


Let us know how the biopsy results turn out.  I am having my mare tested next week, been putting it off but I need to go ahead and do it.

I did see on the PSSM forum that some vets think foot issues are related but no one has said why.  I would be interested to know because my mare has really crappy front feet, lucky for me my husband shoes her or keeping her sound would be very expensive. 

mtcanchazer - 2014-01-01 11:46 PM My mare has several of the symptoms of PSSM (I'm only discovering this today   ) except that she is a VERY easy keeper...in other words, she looks at a bale of hay and puts on weight. I notice that in the list that they are hard(er) keepers, I'm sure PSSM is still a possibility for her, right? 

ampratt - 2013-12-20 7:39 PM


Well have finally finished all the testing. My mare tested negative for both PSSM 1 & 2, she also tested negative for Insulin Resistance and PPID (which are well known for causing soreness in feet). Ruled all this out and still have sore, soft front feet. She is just going to be turned out for a while and see if nature can heal her.

annemarea - 2014-01-03 5:21 AM


 I would not consider either of mine hard keepers. My mare does battle ulcers when she is hurting, which will cause her to not eat all of her feed at once and also causes her to decrease her hay consumption, but she still holds weight. You have to keep in mind that all horses will show differently to some degree. Neither of mine tie up. My mare has only tied up once in 9 years.

Cashbaby - 2014-01-02 8:46 AM Mine was an easy keeper. I think I read some where that has to do with type 1 or type 2??? Mine actually lost weight once she started the diet.

Cashbaby - 2014-01-02 7:46 AM Mine was an easy keeper. I think I read some where that has to do with type 1 or type 2??? Mine actually lost weight once she started the diet.

appycowgirl - 2013-07-07 12:30 PM

When people are asking about bloodlines in the barrel horses, we just aren't quite sure as we don't have a ton of positive pedigrees to try to figure out possible sources. I have my suspicions of some lines like the mare FL Lady Bug an I have suspected Moon Deck.

I'm not sure how many people are familiar with the mare Ms Wahini Bug? She, herself is positive for PSSM and has 3 foals out there that I know of, Ms Shoo Bug, Ms Perky Bug and Wahini Cash that are positive for PSSM. This mare goes back onto those lines that I suspect. Then, I also know of 2 positive horses from the stallion AR Star and he also goes back onto that Moon Deck and FL Lady Bug line and then on the PSSM Forum we had another barrel horse reported as positive and it was through his sire as the dam tested negative and that sire goes back on Moon Deck.

The University of MN did pedigree research and listed the initials of EC, SDB and PI. We believe the EC to be Eddie Cinco, the SDB to be Sonny Dee Bar and PI to be Pretty Impressive. With the positive pedigrees that we have on the Forum, which is over 250, these names have definitely shown up in many of the positives when it comes to QHs, Paints and Apps. Now, in the Apps, the stallion Dreamfinder is a major suspect as we have numerous sons and daughters and ancestors of his that are coming up positive.

Now, for Dreamfinder, he goes back on a stallion named Roan Hancock who is appearing in numerous positive pedigrees and seems to be the main player in the foundation QHs that are turning up positive. Personally, I do not suspect Joe Hancock himself as there are several other horses with him in their pedigree that are NOT coming up positive, so we suspect that the PSSM probably came through on his dam.

Now, with mentioning Roan Hancock, we have had numerous positives show up that have Two Eyed Jack in their pedigree. I will say that both the Pitzer Ranch manager's wife along with other numerous TEJ owners do not believe that he is not the PSSM problem and they think it is the mares instead that he was bred to. Now, there was a lady who did talk to the ranch manager's wife and she did state that they were breeding P1/P1 mares to their studs that are n/P1 and they do list those positive studs on their website and have listed them in their catalouges. I highly commend Pitzer Ranch for being open and honest on their stud's statuses.

Back here about a month or so ago, I had a lady who shared with me a 199 page dissertation that was written by Dr. Molly McCue and on page 77 it states that most of their PSSM1 positive horses in the research herd, went back onto the stallion WRD and he went back to YJ. Now, we believe that WRD stands for Waggoners Rainy Day and of course he goes back on Yellow Jacket.

Back about a year or so ago, several of the folks on the PSSM Forum, who have been studying these positive pedigrees came out with the thoughts that most of this is coming from three horses, which of course has been mentioned before from the researchers. Those 3 horses are Yellow Jacket, Yellow Wolf and Midnight and all 3 of these horses goes back on the mare Mittie Stephens.

Lately, we have started to have positive pedigrees that have been reported that don't have SDB, PI, EC or even Roan Hancock, but they definitely have one or two or even all 3 of those three suspects that many people on the Forum feel are sources.

The main thing in all of this is that every time we look at any of these pedigrees prior to them being tested, we can see where there is a chance for the horse to test out positive, so the biggest thing is to get people educated about PSSM and to get folks to request testing before purchasing or breeding to someone's stud and to test their mares as well.

Right now, the researchers state that anywhere between 6 to 12% of the QH and QH related breeds are positive for PSSM and out of that, anywhere between 90 to 75% are positive for PSSM Type 1 and the other 10 to 25% are positive for Type 2.
So, it is just best to DNA test and know and if you are having problems with your horse and it does come back negative for Type 1, have your vet do a blood panel and have them specifically test the CK and AST levels. If those are elevated, your next step would be to do a muscle biopsy to check for Type 2.

CarrieH77 - 2013-11-22 6:39 AM

So I have a question - I am going to be selling my PSSM mare.  She is easily managed with diet/exercise is still a competative barrel horse and started roping.  How much does this issue decrease her value do you think?  She was diagnosed 4 years ago and I have owned her for 6.