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 Namesless in BHW
Posts: 10368
  
Location: At the race track with Ah Dee Ohs | barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:58 PM komet. - 2014-06-04 2:45 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:22 PM Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2. Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont: Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position Post Winners 1 23 2 11 3 13 4 9 5 13 6 7 7 11 8 5 9 3 10 2 11 2 I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out? There was nobody inside of Big Red... He drew #1 but started in the #2 slot.. I think it's the other way around drew 2 but started in 1? He ran with the number 2 on his blanket. You are right he didn't have anyone inside of him either way.
I just went back and watched the race...he was the #2 horse in the 2 hole. The one hole in the gates was empty. |
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 Works Hard For The Money
Posts: 4469
Location: Memphis, TN | total performance - 2014-06-04 3:16 PM
barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:58 PM komet. - 2014-06-04 2:45 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:22 PM Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2. Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont: Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position Post Winners 1 23 2 11 3 13 4 9 5 13 6 7 7 11 8 5 9 3 10 2 11 2 I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out? There was nobody inside of Big Red... He drew #1 but started in the #2 slot.. I think it's the other way around drew 2 but started in 1? He ran with the number 2 on his blanket. You are right he didn't have anyone inside of him either way.
I was going off this video
http://youtu.be/vfCMtaNiMDM
Commentator says as they are loading he drew 2 but was running from 1. |
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Namesless in BHW
Posts: 10368
Location: At the race track with Ah Dee Ohs | barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 3:48 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:16 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:58 PM komet. - 2014-06-04 2:45 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:22 PM Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2. Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont: Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position Post Winners 1 23 2 11 3 13 4 9 5 13 6 7 7 11 8 5 9 3 10 2 11 2 I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out? There was nobody inside of Big Red... He drew #1 but started in the #2 slot.. I think it's the other way around drew 2 but started in 1? He ran with the number 2 on his blanket. You are right he didn't have anyone inside of him either way. I was going off this video http://youtu.be/vfCMtaNiMDM Commentator says as they are loading he drew 2 but was running from 1.
Go back and watch it again. Watch to the inside of where they load him. There is an empty post there, that is the one hole. Would be my thinking that with the small field they just moved him out OR the horse in the one hole was a scratch. I will go look and see if that is the case. |
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 Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | total performance - 2014-06-04 3:53 PM
barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 3:48 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:16 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:58 PM komet. - 2014-06-04 2:45 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:22 PM Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2. Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont: Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position Post Winners 1 23 2 11 3 13 4 9 5 13 6 7 7 11 8 5 9 3 10 2 11 2 I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out? There was nobody inside of Big Red... He drew #1 but started in the #2 slot.. I think it's the other way around drew 2 but started in 1? He ran with the number 2 on his blanket. You are right he didn't have anyone inside of him either way. I was going off this video http://youtu.be/vfCMtaNiMDM Commentator says as they are loading he drew 2 but was running from 1.
I you listen to Chic Anderson' call of the race... He says Big Red drew #1 but was starting in #2.. Dunno why they did that, but it was a pretty small field.. |
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Namesless in BHW
Posts: 10368
Location: At the race track with Ah Dee Ohs | komet. - 2014-06-04 5:00 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:53 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 3:48 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:16 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:58 PM komet. - 2014-06-04 2:45 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:22 PM Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2. Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont: Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position Post Winners 1 23 2 11 3 13 4 9 5 13 6 7 7 11 8 5 9 3 10 2 11 2 I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out? There was nobody inside of Big Red... He drew #1 but started in the #2 slot.. I think it's the other way around drew 2 but started in 1? He ran with the number 2 on his blanket. You are right he didn't have anyone inside of him either way. I was going off this video http://youtu.be/vfCMtaNiMDM Commentator says as they are loading he drew 2 but was running from 1. I you listen to Chic Anderson' call of the race... He says Big Red drew #1 but was starting in #2.. Dunno why they did that, but it was a pretty small field..
Edited by total performance 2014-06-04 5:16 PM
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 The best bad guy on the internet
Posts: 3519
 
Location: Arizona | barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 1:22 PM
Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2.
Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont:
Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position
Post Winners
1 23
2 11
3 13
4 9
5 13
6 7
7 11
8 5
9 3
10 2
11 2
I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out?
I've been reading the updates and they mention that Ride On Curlin hasn't had good workouts lately...he seems tired..it's making me think about my picks now...hmmm..... |
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  Damn Yankee
Posts: 12390
Location: Somewhere between raising hell and Amazing Grace | I'm going to stand by the facts.....it shouldn't matter what post position he draws. If he is truly Triple Crown material, then he should be able to win it from anywhere :) That is part of the challenge of the Triple Crown. Three races, close together, three different post draws, three different distances, and three different tracks. Only the best horses in history can pull it off. That's what makes them legends. So we shall see......
Quite honestly, win or lose, I don't think there is a Thoroughbred alive today, or in the past ten years, and probably not in the next ten years, that can hold a candle to the Triple Crown winners. They just don't breed them like they used to...... |
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Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | total performance - 2014-06-04 5:14 PM
komet. - 2014-06-04 5:00 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:53 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 3:48 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:16 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:58 PM komet. - 2014-06-04 2:45 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:22 PM Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2. Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont: Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position Post Winners 1 23 2 11 3 13 4 9 5 13 6 7 7 11 8 5 9 3 10 2 11 2 I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out? There was nobody inside of Big Red... He drew #1 but started in the #2 slot.. I think it's the other way around drew 2 but started in 1? He ran with the number 2 on his blanket. You are right he didn't have anyone inside of him either way. I was going off this video http://youtu.be/vfCMtaNiMDM Commentator says as they are loading he drew 2 but was running from 1. I you listen to Chic Anderson' call of the race... He says Big Red drew #1 but was starting in #2.. Dunno why they did that, but it was a pretty small field..
LOL!!! He was wearing 2 and he did load into 2.. But Anderson clearly said he drew the number 0ne post but was loading into 2.. I've watched it 110+ times.. |
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Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | komet. - 2014-06-04 8:01 PM
total performance - 2014-06-04 5:14 PM
komet. - 2014-06-04 5:00 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:53 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 3:48 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:16 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:58 PM komet. - 2014-06-04 2:45 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:22 PM Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2. Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont: Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position Post Winners 1 23 2 11 3 13 4 9 5 13 6 7 7 11 8 5 9 3 10 2 11 2 I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out? There was nobody inside of Big Red... He drew #1 but started in the #2 slot.. I think it's the other way around drew 2 but started in 1? He ran with the number 2 on his blanket. You are right he didn't have anyone inside of him either way. I was going off this video http://youtu.be/vfCMtaNiMDM Commentator says as they are loading he drew 2 but was running from 1. I you listen to Chic Anderson' call of the race... He says Big Red drew #1 but was starting in #2.. Dunno why they did that, but it was a pretty small field..
LOL!!! He was wearing 2 and he did load into 2.. But Anderson clearly said he drew the number 0ne post but was loading into 2.. I've watched it 110+ times..
I'm sorry... I'm wrong.. Anderson says his number is 2 but he is moving into the number one post.... But I can see another gate to his inside.. |
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 Queen Bee Cat Owner
Posts: 3629
Location: Way up North | missroselee - 2014-06-04 5:30 PM
 I'm going to stand by the facts.....it shouldn't matter what post position he draws.  If he is truly Triple Crown material, then he should be able to win it from anywhere :)  That is part of the challenge of the Triple Crown.  Three races, close together, three different post draws, three different distances, and three different tracks.  Only the best horses in history can pull it off.  That's what makes them legends.  So we shall see......
Quite honestly, win or lose, I don't think there is a Thoroughbred alive today, or in the past ten years, and probably not in the next ten years, that can hold a candle to the Triple Crown winners. Â They just don't breed them like they used to......
Is it that or is it we are breeding to have a better field in general? Sec. was a freak and I don't think there will be another to rival him for a long time if ever but I do think the fields are getting tougher. I think there are more horses that can step up and win the race which makes it even more difficult to win all three. |
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Damn Yankee
Posts: 12390
Location: Somewhere between raising hell and Amazing Grace | AllAroundRider - 2014-06-04 10:18 PM missroselee - 2014-06-04 5:30 PM I'm going to stand by the facts.....it shouldn't matter what post position he draws. If he is truly Triple Crown material, then he should be able to win it from anywhere :) That is part of the challenge of the Triple Crown. Three races, close together, three different post draws, three different distances, and three different tracks. Only the best horses in history can pull it off. That's what makes them legends. So we shall see......
Quite honestly, win or lose, I don't think there is a Thoroughbred alive today, or in the past ten years, and probably not in the next ten years, that can hold a candle to the Triple Crown winners. They just don't breed them like they used to...... Is it that or is it we are breeding to have a better field in general? Sec. was a freak and I don't think there will be another to rival him for a long time if ever but I do think the fields are getting tougher. I think there are more horses that can step up and win the race which makes it even more difficult to win all three.
See I think it's the exact opposite. I think the fields are getting softer. I think we see some stand out horses because the competition isn't that tough. I remember a time when you would have 3-6 horses in these races that were 2-1, 3-5, etc etc..... |
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 Whack and Roll
Posts: 6342
Location: NE Texas | missroselee - 2014-06-04 5:30 PM I'm going to stand by the facts.....it shouldn't matter what post position he draws. If he is truly Triple Crown material, then he should be able to win it from anywhere :) That is part of the challenge of the Triple Crown. Three races, close together, three different post draws, three different distances, and three different tracks. Only the best horses in history can pull it off. That's what makes them legends. So we shall see......
Quite honestly, win or lose, I don't think there is a Thoroughbred alive today, or in the past ten years, and probably not in the next ten years, that can hold a candle to the Triple Crown winners. They just don't breed them like they used to...... Have to disagree with you here....we breed them just as good as always, but we don't train them like we used to. Humans and "less is more" training theories along with the bigger barns and more horses, but less work is the culprit of weaker, less durable horses, not genetics. That being said, Go Chrome! 
Edited by Herbie 2014-06-04 9:48 PM
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Works Hard For The Money
Posts: 4469
Location: Memphis, TN | komet. - 2014-06-04 8:10 PM
komet. - 2014-06-04 8:01 PM
total performance - 2014-06-04 5:14 PM
komet. - 2014-06-04 5:00 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:53 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 3:48 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:16 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:58 PM komet. - 2014-06-04 2:45 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:22 PM Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2. Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont: Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position Post Winners 1 23 2 11 3 13 4 9 5 13 6 7 7 11 8 5 9 3 10 2 11 2 I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out? There was nobody inside of Big Red... He drew #1 but started in the #2 slot.. I think it's the other way around drew 2 but started in 1? He ran with the number 2 on his blanket. You are right he didn't have anyone inside of him either way. I was going off this video http://youtu.be/vfCMtaNiMDM Commentator says as they are loading he drew 2 but was running from 1. I you listen to Chic Anderson' call of the race... He says Big Red drew #1 but was starting in #2.. Dunno why they did that, but it was a pretty small field..
LOL!!! He was wearing 2 and he did load into 2.. But Anderson clearly said he drew the number 0ne post but was loading into 2.. I've watched it 110+ times..
I'm sorry... I'm wrong.. Anderson says his number is 2 but he is moving into the number one post.... But I can see another gate to his inside..
I'm wondering if maybe he meant he drew 2 but was loading into the first hole as in first open hole we were looking at not necessarily the number one hole. Does that make any sense? |
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Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 9:48 PM
komet. - 2014-06-04 8:10 PM
komet. - 2014-06-04 8:01 PM
total performance - 2014-06-04 5:14 PM
komet. - 2014-06-04 5:00 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:53 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 3:48 PM total performance - 2014-06-04 3:16 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:58 PM komet. - 2014-06-04 2:45 PM barrelracin85 - 2014-06-04 2:22 PM Fun fact. Chrome has drawn the same post numbers as Secretariat in all 3 of the triple crown races. 5, 3, now 2. Here are the stats on post position in the Belmont: Belmont Stakes Winners By Post position Post Winners 1 23 2 11 3 13 4 9 5 13 6 7 7 11 8 5 9 3 10 2 11 2 I honestly don't know why Curly's odds dropped so much with his post. Can anyone help me figure that out? There was nobody inside of Big Red... He drew #1 but started in the #2 slot.. I think it's the other way around drew 2 but started in 1? He ran with the number 2 on his blanket. You are right he didn't have anyone inside of him either way. I was going off this video http://youtu.be/vfCMtaNiMDM Commentator says as they are loading he drew 2 but was running from 1. I you listen to Chic Anderson' call of the race... He says Big Red drew #1 but was starting in #2.. Dunno why they did that, but it was a pretty small field..
LOL!!! He was wearing 2 and he did load into 2.. But Anderson clearly said he drew the number 0ne post but was loading into 2.. I've watched it 110+ times..
I'm sorry... I'm wrong.. Anderson says his number is 2 but he is moving into the number one post.... But I can see another gate to his inside..
I'm wondering if maybe he meant he drew 2 but was loading into the first hole as in first open hole we were looking at not necessarily the number one hole. Does that make any sense?
Not to me.... But I was thinking.... Was there another horse that drew #1 and scratched? Or did Red Draw it and load where he did ? I'll have to look into this.... I always casually wondered why they did that.... |
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 Hog Tie My Mojo
Posts: 4847
Location: Opelousas, LA | Looks like Shams connections must have entered two horses, Sham looked to be wearing the number 1A which meant he was a coupled entry. Who ever 1B was must have actually drawn the 1 hole and then scratched, who knows?
Just noticed that the Belmont was not listed on Shams PP, the 2nd place finish in the Preakness was officially his last race. Did he not finish or pull up or what? Poor guy, he was certainly born in the wrong year.
Just wanted to add that in a full field they would drop down and fill the very inside gate but in a very short field they will often leave the 1 hole open.
Edited by Barnmom 2014-06-05 1:34 AM
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Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | Barnmom - 2014-06-05 1:26 AM
Looks like Shams connections must have entered two horses, Sham looked to be wearing the number 1A which meant he was a coupled entry. Who ever 1B was must have actually drawn the 1 hole and then scratched, who knows?
Just noticed that the Belmont was not listed on Shams PP, the 2nd place finish in the Preakness was officially his last race. Did he not finish or pull up or what? Poor guy, he was certainly born in the wrong year.
Just wanted to add that in a full field they would drop down and fill the very inside gate but in a very short field they will often leave the 1 hole open.
I never looked up Sham's stats... But to give him credit... Secretariat was the 1st horse in history to finish the Derby in under 2 mins... Sham (right on his butt) was the 2nd horse to do it.... |
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 Making the post season
Posts: 7288
Location: your guess is as good as mine | Barnmom - 2014-06-05 12:26 AM Looks like Shams connections must have entered two horses, Sham looked to be wearing the number 1A which meant he was a coupled entry. Who ever 1B was must have actually drawn the 1 hole and then scratched, who knows?
Just noticed that the Belmont was not listed on Shams PP, the 2nd place finish in the Preakness was officially his last race. Did he not finish or pull up or what? Poor guy, he was certainly born in the wrong year.
Just wanted to add that in a full field they would drop down and fill the very inside gate but in a very short field they will often leave the 1 hole open.
I'd have to look it up at home to be sure, but if I remember right after Secretariat's front running victory in the Preakness Sham's connections entered a "rabbit" in the Belmont, hoping to soften up Secretariat for a closing kick from Sham. I can't remember who said something after the draw - the media or Secretariat's connections - but it ticked Martin off & he scratched the other horse. Something to the effect of that was the only hope Sham had of beating Big Red lol...
I always felt sorry for Sham - he would've been a TC Champion any other year but 1973, and I've always felt Martin's pride broke Sham's heart in the Belmont. I don't think he ever won another race did he? |
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Hog Tie My Mojo
Posts: 4847
Location: Opelousas, LA | Shams official PP on equibase doesn't even list the Belmont, just wondering if he was pulled up and it never counted as an official out? He never ran officially again after that, its like that race broke his heart. Had he been born any other year he would have most likely been a household name. |
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 Thread Killer
Posts: 7545
| Barnmom - 2014-06-05 4:58 PM Shams official PP on equibase doesn't even list the Belmont, just wondering if he was pulled up and it never counted as an official out? He never ran officially again after that, its like that race broke his heart. Had he been born any other year he would have most likely been a household name.
Sham suffered a hairline fracture, and that's what sent him to retirement.
What's really cool is that, after he died and during the autopsy, his heart was large too. (18lbs, and they estimated that Secretariat's heart was about 22lbs).
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Whack and Roll
Posts: 6342
Location: NE Texas | Just Plain Lucky - 2014-06-05 4:10 PM Barnmom - 2014-06-05 4:58 PM Shams official PP on equibase doesn't even list the Belmont, just wondering if he was pulled up and it never counted as an official out? He never ran officially again after that, its like that race broke his heart. Had he been born any other year he would have most likely been a household name. Sham suffered a hairline fracture, and that's what sent him to retirement.
What's really cool is that, after he died and during the autopsy, his heart was large too. (18lbs, and they estimated that Secretariat's heart was about 22lbs).
Interesting thing to consider.....the large heart theory is interesting to me. Being that it is a muscle, the most vital muscle in the body actually, do you think the sheer size of the heart can be increased and the mass can be increased due to work load, and the amout and viscosity of blood being pumped through it? Be an interesting study to perform I think.
GO CHROME!!!!!!! |
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