|
|
Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
    
Location: sunny california | maybe he does maybe he doesn't. I paid $1500 for a prepurchase from a university vet. what a waste the horse was a cripple. my vet just shook his head. it was out of state and as soon as she stepped off the trailer it was obvious. and no it did not happen in transit. |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 4766
Location: Bandera, TX | kwanatha - 2015-04-06 6:19 PM Zanadoo88 - 2015-04-06 4:11 PM casualdust07 - 2015-04-06 6:03 PM I would remove the lesions. what happens is, healthy cartilage gets defects in them when they are foals.. either from genetics, nutrition(over or under), lack of exercise (usually a big combination of all of it).. the bad cartilage forms the cysts and then you can get flaps of good cartilage over that defective cartilage... then, if it ends up vascularizing, you will get mineralization and bony like tissue where cartilage is supposed to be. I had a mare with an OCD lesion that had a big mineralized chip in there. We removed it arthroscopically. There's no way injections would have touched that long term. So what do I do when the surgeon says he doesn't think it is necessary? If anything shouldn't he know what should and shouldn't be done??
I agree, if you can forward the x-rays to Dr. Jeffrey Watkins or Dr Dabareiner at Texas A&M they may help you with your decision. Dr. Watkins has done this for me several times. You should be able to get his email on the site. |
|
| |
|
 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 540
Location: My own little world :) | uno-dos-tres! - 2015-04-06 7:19 PM
kwanatha - 2015-04-06 6:19 PM Zanadoo88 - 2015-04-06 4:11 PM casualdust07 - 2015-04-06 6:03 PM I would remove the lesions. what happens is, healthy cartilage gets defects in them when they are foals.. either from genetics, nutrition(over or under), lack of exercise (usually a big combination of all of it).. the bad cartilage forms the cysts and then you can get flaps of good cartilage over that defective cartilage... then, if it ends up vascularizing, you will get mineralization and bony like tissue where cartilage is supposed to be. I had a mare with an OCD lesion that had a big mineralized chip in there. We removed it arthroscopically. There's no way injections would have touched that long term. So what do I do when the surgeon says he doesn't think it is necessary? If anything shouldn't he know what should and shouldn't be done??
Thank you :) This is an excellent idea! |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 4766
Location: Bandera, TX | casualdust07 - 2015-04-06 6:03 PM I would remove the lesions. what happens is, healthy cartilage gets defects in them when they are foals.. either from genetics, nutrition(over or under), lack of exercise (usually a big combination of all of it).. the bad cartilage forms the cysts and then you can get flaps of good cartilage over that defective cartilage... then, if it ends up vascularizing, you will get mineralization and bony like tissue where cartilage is supposed to be. I had a mare with an OCD lesion that had a big mineralized chip in there. We removed it arthroscopically. There's no way injections would have touched that long term.
So glad you mentioned the exercise portion in the triad. Have you heard what is the best way to exercise QH yearlings. I've read a little on the TB studies but not seen much for QH. I'm very old school and will soon put my yearlings in the round pen. I have a incline tredmill and my smart Firewater Ta Fame colt has been on it a few times. I'm just not wanting to go over board with this so looking for guidance. OP hope you don't mind me asking but since we have the future Vet online here I had to ask... |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 540
Location: My own little world :) | uno-dos-tres! - 2015-04-06 7:28 PM
casualdust07 - 2015-04-06 6:03 PM I would remove the lesions. what happens is, healthy cartilage gets defects in them when they are foals.. either from genetics, nutrition(over or under), lack of exercise (usually a big combination of all of it).. the bad cartilage forms the cysts and then you can get flaps of good cartilage over that defective cartilage... then, if it ends up vascularizing, you will get mineralization and bony like tissue where cartilage is supposed to be. I had a mare with an OCD lesion that had a big mineralized chip in there. We removed it arthroscopically. There's no way injections would have touched that long term.
So glad you mentioned the exercise portion in the triad. Have you heard what is the best way to exercise QH yearlings. I've read a little on the TB studies but not seen much for QH. I'm very old school and will soon put my yearlings in the round pen. I have a incline tredmill and my smart Firewater Ta Fame colt has been on it a few times. I'm just not wanting to go over board with this so looking for guidance. OP hope you don't mind me asking but since we have the future Vet online here I had to ask...
Actually this is a really good question! I my horses are pretty much always turned out...I don't have stalls or small pens under the size of an acre or so. Is the average amount of movement throughout a pasture enough exercise or do you need to make sure you take them out and exercise them?? |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 4766
Location: Bandera, TX | Zanadoo88 - 2015-04-06 7:48 PM uno-dos-tres! - 2015-04-06 7:28 PM casualdust07 - 2015-04-06 6:03 PM I would remove the lesions. what happens is, healthy cartilage gets defects in them when they are foals.. either from genetics, nutrition(over or under), lack of exercise (usually a big combination of all of it).. the bad cartilage forms the cysts and then you can get flaps of good cartilage over that defective cartilage... then, if it ends up vascularizing, you will get mineralization and bony like tissue where cartilage is supposed to be. I had a mare with an OCD lesion that had a big mineralized chip in there. We removed it arthroscopically. There's no way injections would have touched that long term. So glad you mentioned the exercise portion in the triad. Have you heard what is the best way to exercise QH yearlings. I've read a little on the TB studies but not seen much for QH. I'm very old school and will soon put my yearlings in the round pen. I have a incline tredmill and my smart Firewater Ta Fame colt has been on it a few times. I'm just not wanting to go over board with this so looking for guidance. OP hope you don't mind me asking but since we have the future Vet online here I had to ask... Actually this is a really good question! I my horses are pretty much always turned out...I don't have stalls or small pens under the size of an acre or so. Is the average amount of movement throughout a pasture enough exercise or do you need to make sure you take them out and exercise them??
The TB horses are going into a "light" forced exercise program on their first birthdays. They have the $ behind the research and have several papers out on the changes (for the positive) to the colts.
I'm all for a horse being raisded in a big pasture. I sure have noticed a diffrence in the colts I've raised the last few years in the small traps vs several hundred acre pastures. Those outside roaming just know where to put their feet. They also seemed to be sounder. I want what's best for the horse so I'm looking for research on QH's in forced light exercise that are going into performance not halter. |
|
| |
|
 Saint Stacey
| Zanadoo88 - 2015-04-06 5:35 PM
Ok so my vet suggested the surgery then had the x-rays reviewed by the hospital's surgeon and he said he didn't feel the lesions warranted surgery at this time. So my vet went on to say he would like to at least inject her to make her more comfortable. I am located in the Pacific northwest and the surgeon that reviewed the x-rays was Dr. Schneider if anyone is familiar with him. He was also a teaching vet at the Washington State University College of Veterinary Medicine. I get where you guys are coming from but I also kind of feel like he knows what he is talking about??
Vets make mistakes just like all humans. I saw a vet recommended "chip removal surgery" on an old slab fracture on a 15 year old gelding once. Had a 4th year top of the class vet student not be able to see what, to me, was clearly a lameness in a yearling colt with OCD's in the hocks. Had a long time practicing vet tell me that he didn't see anything wrong with Sidekick when he was becoming neurological. Had one if the best surgical facilities in the nation send a colt home on a gram of bute and 5 isoxiprine tablets when he had a bone infection they had done surgery on. Too bad they didn't take the time to culture Hus open wounds and take xrays prior to sending him home after having him for a month. My point is that second opinions are never a bad thing. |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1611
| SKM - 2015-04-07 8:21 AM
Zanadoo88 - 2015-04-06 5:35 PM
Ok so my vet suggested the surgery then had the x-rays reviewed by the hospital's surgeon and he said he didn't feel the lesions warranted surgery at this time. So my vet went on to say he would like to at least inject her to make her more comfortable. I am located in the Pacific northwest and the surgeon that reviewed the x-rays was Dr. Schneider if anyone is familiar with him. He was also a teaching vet at the Washington State University College of Veterinary Medicine. I get where you guys are coming from but I also kind of feel like he knows what he is talking about??
Vets make mistakes just like all humans. I saw a vet recommended "chip removal surgery" on an old slab fracture on a 15 year old gelding once. Had a 4th year top of the class vet student not be able to see what, to me, was clearly a lameness in a yearling colt with OCD's in the hocks. Had a long time practicing vet tell me that he didn't see anything wrong with Sidekick when he was becoming neurological. Had one if the best surgical facilities in the nation send a colt home on a gram of bute and 5 isoxiprine tablets when he had a bone infection they had done surgery on. Too bad they didn't take the time to culture Hus open wounds and take xrays prior to sending him home after having him for a month. My point is that second opinions are never a bad thing.
Exactly!
People do not realize vets have off days. Another thing is they don't realize that most vet schools teach them nothing of practice concerning equines so unless they take an externship or get placed with an equine practitioner their 4th year they have very little experience starting out. My best friend is coming straight outta UT with the highest grades in the class and VERY little equine experience. |
|
| |
Folks on-line