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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
  
Location: West Texas | OregonBR - 2015-09-22 12:33 PM
OregonBR - 2015-09-22 10:28 AM cavyrunsbarrels - 2015-09-22 7:02 AM I like oats because they are very digestible, unlike corn and barley. My horses get 2lbs whole oats a day with 2lbs Progressive Nutrition grass balancer, .5lbs renew gold, grass hay, alfalfa, and SmartPaks. As long as the corn and barley are rolled, they are more digestible than oats.  They are also more dense (more energy per # than oats) and must be fed in moderation.  In order of calorie and energy content, corn comes before barley and oats are the least of the major grains.  Oats have more fiber and are least likely to cause digestive problems in horses.  They have been a staple of the horse industry for many years.  But when fed in large meals, all cerial grains cause digestive upset and ulcers. Â
http://animalscience.tamu.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/14/2012/04/n...
Â
Processing corn and barley do not make them more digestible than oats. One of the issues around corn, and barley to some extent, is that type of carbohydrates they posses are not as easily digested. That is why oats have a tendency and reputation of making horses hot. The starch is so easily digested that it gets into the bloodstream very quickly. This also makes oats safer because there is less risk and chance of the starch making it to the hindgut.
The reason to process corn is because it has a hard kernel that makes it less digestible. This increases the digestibility of the corn, but does not change the digestibility of the starch it contains.
Barley must be processed due to the hardness of the outer hull. Barley has a very strong following from those that feed it. We are currently looking more into barley and the research for barley as a horse feed.
Edited by Tdove 2015-09-25 3:33 PM
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| Tdove - 2015-09-22 2:09 PM
OregonBR - 2015-09-22 12:33 PM
OregonBR - 2015-09-22 10:28 AM cavyrunsbarrels - 2015-09-22 7:02 AM I like oats because they are very digestible, unlike corn and barley. My horses get 2lbs whole oats a day with 2lbs Progressive Nutrition grass balancer, .5lbs renew gold, grass hay, alfalfa, and SmartPaks. As long as the corn and barley are rolled, they are more digestible than oats.  They are also more dense (more energy per # than oats) and must be fed in moderation.  In order of calorie and energy content, corn comes before barley and oats are the least of the major grains.  Oats have more fiber and are least likely to cause digestive problems in horses.  They have been a staple of the horse industry for many years.  But when fed in large meals, all cerial grains cause digestive upset and ulcers. Â
http://animalscience.tamu.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/14/2012/04/n...
Â
Processing corn and barley do not make them more digestible than oats. One of the issues around corn, and barley to some extent, is that type of carbohydrates they posses are not as easily digested. That is why oats have a tendency and reputation of making horses hot. The starch is so easily digested that it gets into the bloodstream very quickly. This also makes oats safer because there is less risk and chance of the starch making it to the hindgut.
The reason to crack corn is because it has a hard kernel that makes it less digestible. This increases the digestibility of the corn, but does not change the digestibility of the starch it contains.
Barley must be processed due to the hardness of the outer hull. Barley has a very strong following from those that feed it. We are currently looking more into barley and the research for barley as a horse feed.
Would love to hear your results on the barley study. I used to cook barley for one of my don's show heifers. It was the only thing that put weight on her. It really shined her coat up to. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 396
| I love whole oats!!!! Feed them. Local mill sells them for $9 bag here. I feed each horse 1 lb a day. Feed with alfalfa and grass hay and some pasture.
Thank you all for clarifying the mineral issue. I was raised that horses didn't need alot of extra mineral but lately I've fallen to looking at all the extra supplements and they are expensive. We always just put salt and trace mineral out. In our new location we have put salt and a local milled 12:12 block out. They really go after the mineral in the spring and this fall they've started to go after it again. Love the idea of a block, they lick it when they need it and I'm not feeding it when they don't need it spending $$$$. |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
Location: North Dakota | hoofs_in_motion - 2015-09-22 10:27 AM FLITASTIC - 2015-09-22 10:24 AM cavyrunsbarrels - 2015-09-22 7:02 AM I like oats because they are very digestible, unlike corn and barley. My horses get 2lbs whole oats a day with 2lbs Progressive Nutrition grass balancer, .5lbs renew gold, grass hay, alfalfa, and SmartPaks. 5 pounds of Renew Gold??? THats about 4x regular suggested feeding. I would be looking at what the hind gut is doing.
Yes indeed 1/2lbs. My horses would look like very sad baloon animals on 5lbs of RG! |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
Location: North Dakota | Tdove - 2015-09-22 2:09 PM OregonBR - 2015-09-22 12:33 PM OregonBR - 2015-09-22 10:28 AM cavyrunsbarrels - 2015-09-22 7:02 AM I like oats because they are very digestible, unlike corn and barley. My horses get 2lbs whole oats a day with 2lbs Progressive Nutrition grass balancer, .5lbs renew gold, grass hay, alfalfa, and SmartPaks. As long as the corn and barley are rolled, they are more digestible than oats. They are also more dense (more energy per # than oats) and must be fed in moderation. In order of calorie and energy content, corn comes before barley and oats are the least of the major grains. Oats have more fiber and are least likely to cause digestive problems in horses. They have been a staple of the horse industry for many years. But when fed in large meals, all cerial grains cause digestive upset and ulcers. http://animalscience.tamu.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/14/2012/04/nutrition-selection-and-use-of-feedstuffs-in-horses.pdf Processing corn and barley do not make them more digestible than oats. One of the issues around corn, and barley to some extent, is that type of carbohydrates they posses are not as easily digested. That is why oats have a tendency and reputation of making horses hot. The starch is so easily digested that it gets into the bloodstream very quickly. This also makes oats safer because there is less risk and chance of the starch making it to the hindgut. The reason to crack corn is because it has a hard kernel that makes it less digestible. This increases the digestibility of the corn, but does not change the digestibility of the starch it contains. Barley must be processed due to the hardness of the outer hull. Barley has a very strong following from those that feed it. We are currently looking more into barley and the research for barley as a horse feed.
Edited by cavyrunsbarrels 2015-09-23 9:19 AM
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| Tdove - 2015-09-22 10:36 AM We utilize whole oats in our Omnis Complete. I like oats, but not all oats are created equal. The heavier the oat the better. We use 38-40lb oats in our products. I would advise on buying a quality whole oat. I have used and think that Woody's line of oats are quality. Whole oats have the most nutrition. Rolled or crimped oats are not necessary as they provide only a minimum increase in digestibility while having less fat and nutrients, due to oxidation. The increase in energy is offset by a higher cost as well.
Very true sometimes Oat availbility in my area changes and we are forced to get the ones from TSC and I swear they will drop muscle mass and a lil bloom after just a week of TSC brand or whatever that generic oat is that they sale. The co-op has "heavy crimped race horse oats", and that bag also says non-GMO but I dunno if I believe that lol
Oats have been a huge difference in our program since quitting commerical feeds we put forage first with buying the best alfalfa we can pick and feeding alfalfa pellets or beet pulp along with oats. The difference is their condition and ulcer symtoms DROPPED big time. After speaking with vets from not just the east coast but out west as well the new consesus is oats are helping hingut ulcers. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 669
Location: Central Texas | I switched to Whole Oats from concentrated feed a few months ago when there was a thread about it on here. I had been debating for some time and finally did the deed. I couldn't be happier with the way my horses look and act. My vet has commented on how good they look each time they've been there. Fellow racers as well. I feed whole oats, a complete min/vit supplement and all the high quality grass hay they can eat. I will NEVER feed a concentrated feed again.
EDITED: the min/vit supplement also addresses the cal/phos ratio while on the grass hay.
Edited by ampratt 2015-09-23 9:50 AM
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9991
Location: Kansas | How can you tell how "heavy" an oat is? The oats I get from the local feed store are mixed with corn...which I do not like. They do not sell just whole oats without corn. Orschelns sells whole oats in 40lb bags...but not sure how to tell how heavy an oat is? |
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 Hugs to You
Posts: 7551
Location: In The Land of Cotton | Tdove - just wondering since you produce your cubes in Canada - do you get and use Scandinavian Oats? We can get them here in the South. We actually haul and get them unloaded straight from the ships at the Ports in Brunswick and Panama City Beach. They are some nice oats. Always true to the 32 lbs/bushel or more.
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Hugs to You
Posts: 7551
Location: In The Land of Cotton | hoofs_in_motion - 2015-09-23 10:53 AM How can you tell how "heavy" an oat is? The oats I get from the local feed store are mixed with corn...which I do not like. They do not sell just whole oats without corn. Orschelns sells whole oats in 40lb bags...but not sure how to tell how heavy an oat is?
A standard measurement for oats is 32 lbs per bushel. |
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Hugs to You
Posts: 7551
Location: In The Land of Cotton | 3canstorun - 2015-09-23 10:55 AM hoofs_in_motion - 2015-09-23 10:53 AM How can you tell how "heavy" an oat is? The oats I get from the local feed store are mixed with corn...which I do not like. They do not sell just whole oats without corn. Orschelns sells whole oats in 40lb bags...but not sure how to tell how heavy an oat is? A standard measurement for oats is 32 lbs per bushel. That being said - at the beginning of harvest our oats straight out of the bin are usually heavier. We do throughout the feeding season measure our "can" to make sure we are still feeding our desired amount per horse.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | We use local Canadian oats grown in Saskatchewan. They are 38lb oats on average. We feel Canadian oats are some of the best in the world.
To the other question, they are not usually marked. The heavier the oat, the more nutrients and energy are in it. Oats are priced based on quality. The cheap TSC type oats are much less cost than #1 oats. It is very similar to hay. The better quality the more nutrients and energy, resulting in overall better value in the long run.
Most of the grain mixes use low quality grains. Top quality stuff is not sold to be mixed and molasses added. That is why grain mixes and sweet feeds, many times are actually cheaper than their straight grain top quality counterparts. |
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Hugs to You
Posts: 7551
Location: In The Land of Cotton | Tdove - 2015-09-23 11:11 AM We use local Canadian oats grown in Saskatchewan. They are 38lb oats on average. We feel Canadian oats are some of the best in the world. To the other question, they are not usually marked. The heavier the oat, the more nutrients and energy are in it. Oats are priced based on quality. The cheap TSC type oats are much less cost than #1 oats. It is very similar to hay. The better quality the more nutrients and energy, resulting in overall better value in the long run. Most of the grain mixes use low quality grains. Top quality stuff is not sold to be mixed and molasses added. That is why grain mixes and sweet feeds, many times are actually cheaper than their straight grain top quality counterparts.
My thought process is that the Canadian and Scandinavian are top quality maybe because of the "cold". It is so hard to grow oats here in the south. They are just not the quality you have access to. Thus, the reason we pay so much for them. I bet if you took the TSC or other "cheaper" brands and measured them by bushel people would be surprised at the quanitty they received. |
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Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9991
Location: Kansas | 3canstorun - 2015-09-23 9:57 AM 3canstorun - 2015-09-23 10:55 AM hoofs_in_motion - 2015-09-23 10:53 AM How can you tell how "heavy" an oat is? The oats I get from the local feed store are mixed with corn...which I do not like. They do not sell just whole oats without corn. Orschelns sells whole oats in 40lb bags...but not sure how to tell how heavy an oat is? A standard measurement for oats is 32 lbs per bushel. That being said - at the beginning of harvest our oats straight out of the bin are usually heavier. We do throughout the feeding season measure our "can" to make sure we are still feeding our desired amount per horse.
what are you normally feeding per horse? I feed 2lbs each feeding, but lately it's been 1 feeding per day |
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 Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | Tdove - 2015-09-22 12:09 PM OregonBR - 2015-09-22 12:33 PM OregonBR - 2015-09-22 10:28 AM cavyrunsbarrels - 2015-09-22 7:02 AM I like oats because they are very digestible, unlike corn and barley. My horses get 2lbs whole oats a day with 2lbs Progressive Nutrition grass balancer, .5lbs renew gold, grass hay, alfalfa, and SmartPaks. As long as the corn and barley are rolled, they are more digestible than oats. They are also more dense (more energy per # than oats) and must be fed in moderation. In order of calorie and energy content, corn comes before barley and oats are the least of the major grains. Oats have more fiber and are least likely to cause digestive problems in horses. They have been a staple of the horse industry for many years. But when fed in large meals, all cerial grains cause digestive upset and ulcers. http://animalscience.tamu.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/14/2012/04/nutrition-selection-and-use-of-feedstuffs-in-horses.pdf Processing corn and barley do not make them more digestible than oats. One of the issues around corn, and barley to some extent, is that type of carbohydrates they posses are not as easily digested. That is why oats have a tendency and reputation of making horses hot. The starch is so easily digested that it gets into the bloodstream very quickly. This also makes oats safer because there is less risk and chance of the starch making it to the hindgut. The reason to crack corn is because it has a hard kernel that makes it less digestible. This increases the digestibility of the corn, but does not change the digestibility of the starch it contains. Barley must be processed due to the hardness of the outer hull. Barley has a very strong following from those that feed it. We are currently looking more into barley and the research for barley as a horse feed.
As far as oats making a horse hot, as oppose to what? Corn will make them hot as well if fed in equal weight to oats.
Edited by OregonBR 2015-09-23 10:28 AM
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Hugs to You
Posts: 7551
Location: In The Land of Cotton | hoofs_in_motion - 2015-09-23 11:17 AM 3canstorun - 2015-09-23 9:57 AM 3canstorun - 2015-09-23 10:55 AM hoofs_in_motion - 2015-09-23 10:53 AM How can you tell how "heavy" an oat is? The oats I get from the local feed store are mixed with corn...which I do not like. They do not sell just whole oats without corn. Orschelns sells whole oats in 40lb bags...but not sure how to tell how heavy an oat is? A standard measurement for oats is 32 lbs per bushel. That being said - at the beginning of harvest our oats straight out of the bin are usually heavier. We do throughout the feeding season measure our "can" to make sure we are still feeding our desired amount per horse.
My horses get - get 1 lb of whole oats, 1/2 lb max e glo rice bran, and 1 small flake of perinneal peanut hay twice a day. They are out 24/7 on bermuda pasture. THe working animals get THE joint formula. If they are getting worked harder they will get the oats upped, but our pasture has been so good that I haven't had to do that. Free minerals and salt too. |
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 Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | Please be very careful with locally milled mineral, loose or blocks. Mineral is just as likely to be contaminated in a mill that produces medicated feed as the feed is...maybe more. Monensin looks like many of the minerals and supplements that we feed horses. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2457
| hoofs_in_motion - 2015-09-23 9:53 AM How can you tell how "heavy" an oat is? The oats I get from the local feed store are mixed with corn...which I do not like. They do not sell just whole oats without corn. Orschelns sells whole oats in 40lb bags...but not sure how to tell how heavy an oat is?
sometimes on the tags on the bag of just oats from orschlens, they will put the test weight per bu. on there .... Maybe call around to different co-ops? I know up in Riley county we can get 40 lb weight oats.
LikeTDove said, Woody's all the way. I bought a pallet here a year ago and split it with some friends so we all got what we wanted and saved on shipping. Best thing ever.
I minimalized my feeding program quite a while ago. Woody's Oats, Renew Gold, Platinum, a flake of alfalfa and all the brome they can eat.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | quote] I just don't believe that. Â Studies? Â My experience has been that corn and barley put more weight on an animal than oats if fed by weight equally. Â Â
As far as oats making a horse hot, as oppose to what? Â Corn will make them hot as well if fed in equal weight to oats. Â
Here are a couple of articles, explaining my posts about starch digestibility and grain processing:
http://www.equinews.com/article/carbohydrate-digestibility-horses
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=...
Edited by Tdove 2015-09-23 11:08 AM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | As far as making horses high. Here is why:
http://equusmagazine.com/article/nutrition011903
"However, horses fed oats will have increased blood sugar at about 1.5 - 3 hours after the meal, followed by decreased blood sugar. This effect is similar to that seen in people eating high starch or sugary foods. Some horses are very sensitive to increased blood sugar, and exhibit a "grain-high" attitude, which can interfere with your training and performance schedule."
This is why I don't recommend feeding a large amount of oats at one time. Also, in the Omnis formula, since the oats are mixed throughout. They are eaten very slowly, so this blood sugar spike does not occur. This, along with the right amount of oat inclusion, Omnis does not make a horse hot because of this.
Edited by Tdove 2015-09-23 11:09 AM
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