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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
  
| I am curious which one it is, and have messaged the op.
I do believe ours are different up here as the total 60 as a rule of thumb will include all fees such as sanctioning, arena fees, admin fees, and timer fees.
The things that wouldn't be included are stalling, timed onlies, exhibitions. |
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| What is a timer fee??? We don't have those down here. Only fees we may pay in addition to entry is an office fee. Small local races, 125+ entries, don't have any fees, larger shows may have $20 office fee/rider.
Edited by rodeomom3 2016-02-03 8:36 PM
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| rodeomom3 - 2016-02-03 8:34 PM
 What is a timer fee??? We don't have those down here.  Only fees we may pay in addition to entry is an office fee.  Small local races, 125+ entries,  don't have any fees, larger shows may have $20 office fee/rider.Â
Timer rental.
One association brought this in years ago to help cover the costs of their timers as they had to supply 10-20 province wide.
Other associations rent the timers from people who own their own. |
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 Straight Shooter
Posts: 5725
Location: SW North Dakota | I wish more barrel racers would figure out what the total payout is on their fees. Add the office fees, payout%, tie out... whatever tack on fee isn't paid out, then calculate what % of your money that you'll get back. There have been some nice big local jackpots where the total return on investment is only around 50%. No thanks, I'll stay home.
I do produce jackpots, too- so I know the time, expense, PITA of it all. I just think you should be able to run for at least 65-70% of your total fees. I think the BBR has a pretty fair PO schedule, and considers added money. |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| cheryl makofka - 2016-02-03 9:07 PM rodeomom3 - 2016-02-03 8:34 PM What is a timer fee??? We don't have those down here. Only fees we may pay in addition to entry is an office fee. Small local races, 125+ entries, don't have any fees, larger shows may have $20 office fee/rider. Timer rental. One association brought this in years ago to help cover the costs of their timers as they had to supply 10-20 province wide. Other associations rent the timers from people who own their own.
Thanks, all our associations have their own. How many do your races draw up north? A weekend local jackpot, no added money, $35 entry fee, usually has 150 or more. I guess we have enough entries to cover all the costs. There are usually a few hours of exhibitions at $4/5 each that brings in a lot of $$. WrapN3, a local producer who always has added money will draw over 300-they have a $5 office charge per entry. There would be a mutiny down here if associations started tacking on extra fees. |
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 Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | ND3canAddict - 2016-02-04 8:10 AM I wish more barrel racers would figure out what the total payout is on their fees. Add the office fees, payout%, tie out... whatever tack on fee isn't paid out, then calculate what % of your money that you'll get back. There have been some nice big local jackpots where the total return on investment is only around 50%. No thanks, I'll stay home.
I do produce jackpots, too- so I know the time, expense, PITA of it all. I just think you should be able to run for at least 65-70% of your total fees. I think the BBR has a pretty fair PO schedule, and considers added money. The BBR schedule is great....but I don't like it for higher fees races. If you're putting more than $100 up per run - it should payback better than 75%.
One of the races in Fort Worth is following their schedule - $250 EACH run and only 75% payback. That seems rather extreme to me.
Edited by MS2011 2016-02-04 8:35 AM
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Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | rodeomom3 - 2016-02-04 8:26 AM cheryl makofka - 2016-02-03 9:07 PM rodeomom3 - 2016-02-03 8:34 PM What is a timer fee??? We don't have those down here. Only fees we may pay in addition to entry is an office fee. Small local races, 125+ entries, don't have any fees, larger shows may have $20 office fee/rider. Timer rental. One association brought this in years ago to help cover the costs of their timers as they had to supply 10-20 province wide. Other associations rent the timers from people who own their own.
I wish the WrapN3 would come to north Texas a bit. Love the format of those races. |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| MS2011 - 2016-02-04 8:34 AM rodeomom3 - 2016-02-04 8:26 AM cheryl makofka - 2016-02-03 9:07 PM rodeomom3 - 2016-02-03 8:34 PM What is a timer fee??? We don't have those down here. Only fees we may pay in addition to entry is an office fee. Small local races, 125+ entries, don't have any fees, larger shows may have $20 office fee/rider. Timer rental. One association brought this in years ago to help cover the costs of their timers as they had to supply 10-20 province wide. Other associations rent the timers from people who own their own.
Edited by rodeomom3 2016-02-04 9:22 AM
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| rodeomom3 - 2016-02-04 8:26 AM
cheryl makofka - 2016-02-03 9:07 PM rodeomom3 - 2016-02-03 8:34 PM  What is a timer fee??? We don't have those down here.  Only fees we may pay in addition to entry is an office fee.  Small local races, 125+ entries,  don't have any fees, larger shows may have $20 office fee/rider. Timer rental. One association brought this in years ago to help cover the costs of their timers as they had to supply 10-20 province wide. Other associations rent the timers from people who own their own.
Depending on weather and right now we are inside 24/7 we can get 20-150 on a weekend. It also depends on the arena too. |
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Nut Case Expert
Posts: 9305
Location: Tulsa, Ok | You have always got to look deeper than the "stated payback" when you figure the true percentage of return. A hefty office charge can take the true payback down by double digit percentage in a blink so that only a lot of added money can make the fees palatable. |
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Straight Shooter
Posts: 5725
Location: SW North Dakota | SC Wrangler - 2016-02-04 9:42 AM You have always got to look deeper than the "stated payback" when you figure the true percentage of return. A hefty office charge can take the true payback down by double digit percentage in a blink so that only a lot of added money can make the fees palatable.
Exactly the point I was trying to make! |
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Expert
Posts: 1531
Location: Oklahoma | 75 or 80, plus office fees( even when the producer owns the facility) |
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Expert
Posts: 2531
Location: WI | To the OP - are there other fees? If not, this isn't too bad.
If I pay $35 entry @ 80% plus $10 office charge my total fees are $45. $28 goes in the jackpot and $17 to the producer. They are ultimately holding back 37% of my money. They are paying out 63% of my money.
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 Hugs to You
Posts: 7550
Location: In The Land of Cotton | Want to stir the pot a little more - what about when the owner of a facility charges barrel racers tie out fees - per horse - and stall fees more. And doesn't charge cutters tie out fees and his stall fees are less.
Oh, he doesn't charge cutters a timer fee either. But does charge a timer fee to barrel racers.
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 Expert
Posts: 1857
| 3canstorun - 2016-02-04 11:12 AM
Want to stir the pot a little more - what about when the owner of a facility charges barrel racers tie out fees - per horse - and stall fees more. And doesn't charge cutters tie out fees and his stall fees are less. Â
Oh, he doesn't charge cutters a timer fee either. But does charge a timer fee to barrel racers.Â
Â
We ran into the same thing.... Told us he didn't care for barrel racers-his words not mine. Tried charging us an outrages amount, I bugged him for a months and negotiated a really nice deal with him but it took a lot of work and even then he wasn't willing to do anything for us. Wouldn't work the arena before events, no tractor available unless we paid $100/hour, no lights, no stalls, nothing to help. We paid the fee to use the arena and then did everything ourselves. |
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Expert
Posts: 2531
Location: WI | FlyingJT - 2016-02-04 11:34 AM 3canstorun - 2016-02-04 11:12 AM Want to stir the pot a little more - what about when the owner of a facility charges barrel racers tie out fees - per horse - and stall fees more. And doesn't charge cutters tie out fees and his stall fees are less.
Oh, he doesn't charge cutters a timer fee either. But does charge a timer fee to barrel racers.
We ran into the same thing.... Told us he didn't care for barrel racers-his words not mine. Tried charging us an outrages amount, I bugged him for a months and negotiated a really nice deal with him but it took a lot of work and even then he wasn't willing to do anything for us. Wouldn't work the arena before events, no tractor available unless we paid $100/hour, no lights, no stalls, nothing to help. We paid the fee to use the arena and then did everything ourselves.
Sorry, but his place his rules. Buy your own place and host events if it miffs you so much.
Charging different amounts to disciplines at the same facility is nothing new, barrel racers usually pay the least out of anyone - usually half as much as AQHA, NRHA, etc. |
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 Poor Cracker Girl
Posts: 12150
Location: Feeding mosquitos, FL | Most are 70, some are 75, very very occasionally we have an 80%.
I don't generally go if I feel like I'm being nickled and dimed by fees - an office fee, a grounds fee, etc. I'll usually pay one if it's under $10 or so.
And, this may just be me being ornery, but I will place my butt firmly on my shoulders and stay home if they charge me a tie out fee for a one day jackpot. Call it absolutely anything else please. Something about paying a fee to tie my horses to my trailer that I have bought and paid for once already just chaps my behind. |
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Expert
Posts: 1857
| linds - 2016-02-04 11:46 AM
FlyingJT - 2016-02-04 11:34 AM 3canstorun - 2016-02-04 11:12 AM Want to stir the pot a little more - what about when the owner of a facility charges barrel racers tie out fees - per horse - and stall fees more. And doesn't charge cutters tie out fees and his stall fees are less. Â
Oh, he doesn't charge cutters a timer fee either. But does charge a timer fee to barrel racers.Â
 We ran into the same thing.... Told us he didn't care for barrel racers-his words not mine. Tried charging us an outrages amount, I bugged him for a months and negotiated a really nice deal with him but it took a lot of work and even then he wasn't willing to do anything for us. Wouldn't work the arena before events, no tractor available unless we paid $100/hour, no lights, no stalls, nothing to help. We paid the fee to use the arena and then did everything ourselves.
Charging different amounts to disciplines at the same facility is nothing new, barrel racers usually pay the least out of anyone - usually half as much as AQHA, NRHA, etc.Â
Wow! bad day?? little cranky aren't you.... |
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 Good Grief!
Posts: 6343
Location: Cap'n Joan Rotgut.....alberta | Glad i came across this..i was planning on going but now im going to read the small print.....M....p.s.there is a place up here that charges a haul in fee but only during certain events....its 9 dollars a horse.... |
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Location: Not Where I Want to Be | I don't usually look at % of payback.
I just make sure it's equal payback, only way it's equitable.
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