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Rad Dork
Posts: 5218
 
Location: Oklahoma | rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-03 9:52 AM
Hocks were injected a week ago.
Haven't checked any higher up than stifles, haven't checked feet. Have not x-rayed back, tested for lyme disesase or anything else. Team of vets were all seeing hocks, and felt confident that injecting them would fix the barrel problems. I switched from left to right barrel first to help get over the mental hurdles, and the horse can clock equally well either direction but was running left because I could not drive him past second barrel when running right. Now I'd be happy if he'd just turn!
How do you check suspensories? I was wondering about them because I'd heard years ago they could look like hock problems.
Dang rodeo horses are going to make me crazy with all their issues!
Suspensories are ultrasounded and kissing spine is detected from back x rays.... schedule a bone scan if you really want to drop some coin and see everything that is inflammed. My only regret with a bone scan was that I didn't do it months earlier.
Sorry, I'm not much help!! Good luck! |
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 Veteran
Posts: 274
| look at all sesmoids also...may have some lesions of chips floating around... |
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 Thick and Wavy
Posts: 6102
Location: Nebraska | my mare had a strained suspensory last year in þe back. she wasn't finishing her barrels well and had started refusing the gate. my vet thought hocks as well as she showed all the signs. after injecting he had me run a week later and she was back to normal. he said that happens because some of the steroids can leak down into the suspensory. after 2 weeks she was back to refusing. we diagnosed the suspensory via blocking and ultrasound. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 618
| Have you had your horses front end checked? A lot of hind end lameness is secondary to a front end problem. |
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | since you only injected a week ago Id see in another week or 2.. after I injected Hocks it took longer then a week for 100% but I would xray to..
Edited by Bibliafarm 2016-03-03 5:36 PM
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 Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | mruggles - 2016-03-03 9:04 AM Id xray...knees down and go from that point...m
Ditto this. Plus SI. |
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 Am I really the Weirdo?
Posts: 11181
Location: Kansas | Thanks for the ideas. I really needed to hear similar stories to ease my frustration. Maybe I will try another run before I give up. It sucks to spend the money fixing one and end up with the same results you'd been getting, but that seems to be life with barrel horses. |
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 Did I miss the party?
Posts: 3864
| Did the lameness exam show nothing at all in front? Like 0 out of 5 in a circle on hard ground? If hocks were injected, depending on the steroid used, it could take up to 10 days to take full effect. Others act as quick as 3 days. If he's not greatly improved in 10 days, it's something else. Proximal hind suspensory injuries can present like hocks. Some stifle issues also are hard to differentiate from hocks and could also be sacrum.
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Am I really the Weirdo?
Posts: 11181
Location: Kansas | barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-04 12:47 AM Did the lameness exam show nothing at all in front? Like 0 out of 5 in a circle on hard ground? If hocks were injected, depending on the steroid used, it could take up to 10 days to take full effect. Others act as quick as 3 days. If he's not greatly improved in 10 days, it's something else. Proximal hind suspensory injuries can present like hocks. Some stifle issues also are hard to differentiate from hocks and could also be sacrum.
I assume the vets saw nothing in the front end. He was trotted in many circles on asphalt and the only thing they mentioned was hocks. I can't remember what they injected with and don't have my receipt with me, but that makes me feel better to hear the 10 day timeline. Maybe there's hope for Sunday's NBHA. (I still want to make my run with no one in the building in case it goes badly again LOL) |
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Member
Posts: 36
| I would be checking front feet and front suspensorys. |
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Did I miss the party?
Posts: 3864
| rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-04 7:45 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-04 12:47 AM Did the lameness exam show nothing at all in front? Like 0 out of 5 in a circle on hard ground? If hocks were injected, depending on the steroid used, it could take up to 10 days to take full effect. Others act as quick as 3 days. If he's not greatly improved in 10 days, it's something else. Proximal hind suspensory injuries can present like hocks. Some stifle issues also are hard to differentiate from hocks and could also be sacrum.
I assume the vets saw nothing in the front end. He was trotted in many circles on asphalt and the only thing they mentioned was hocks. I can't remember what they injected with and don't have my receipt with me, but that makes me feel better to hear the 10 day timeline. Maybe there's hope for Sunday's NBHA. (I still want to make my run with no one in the building in case it goes badly again LOL)
Hope he's doing better and if you're running tomorrow good luck! |
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Sock Snob
Posts: 3021
| epm ? |
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Veteran
Posts: 154
| I had a horse that would run up the fence at the first after a few runs, give a few weeks off and we were good to go, then he would start running back up the fence.
Had him to the vet after several episodes and nothing would show, flexed okay ,x Rays were good. Finally did scintigrqphy on the horse and he had a very small fracture of the coffin bone (medial wing)
This was a long time ago- X-rays actually were on film. I am sure that digital pictures would be able to diagnose a lot better than film from back in the day
We placed bar shoes and he never ran up the fence again. Went back to regular shoes at 3 months . Never had any other issues with them either. |
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Am I really the Weirdo?
Posts: 11181
Location: Kansas | barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-05 2:35 PM rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-04 7:45 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-04 12:47 AM Did the lameness exam show nothing at all in front? Like 0 out of 5 in a circle on hard ground? If hocks were injected, depending on the steroid used, it could take up to 10 days to take full effect. Others act as quick as 3 days. If he's not greatly improved in 10 days, it's something else. Proximal hind suspensory injuries can present like hocks. Some stifle issues also are hard to differentiate from hocks and could also be sacrum.
I assume the vets saw nothing in the front end. He was trotted in many circles on asphalt and the only thing they mentioned was hocks. I can't remember what they injected with and don't have my receipt with me, but that makes me feel better to hear the 10 day timeline. Maybe there's hope for Sunday's NBHA. (I still want to make my run with no one in the building in case it goes badly again LOL)
Well he walked in calmly, inhaled his first barrel and never switched to the left lead so he made a big arc to the right instead of turning the second barrel. Apparently his brain just disappears when I get aggressive and try to hustle him to a left turn. I'm going to try a different ulcer product that my boyfriend swears will fix everything, switch back to the left and just ease into it for a while until he realizes that he can turn left at a higher speed. So frustrating, but no one can see any pain indications now when he's running......just a lack of mental focus.
On the bright side, my other two horses worked GREAT yesterday and I even won the 3D on my 23 year old. :) |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 672
| rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-07 9:55 AM
barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-05 2:35 PM rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-04 7:45 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-04 12:47 AM Did the lameness exam show nothing at all in front? Like 0 out of 5 in a circle on hard ground? If hocks were injected, depending on the steroid used, it could take up to 10 days to take full effect. Others act as quick as 3 days. If he's not greatly improved in 10 days, it's something else. Proximal hind suspensory injuries can present like hocks. Some stifle issues also are hard to differentiate from hocks and could also be sacrum.
I assume the vets saw nothing in the front end. He was trotted in many circles on asphalt and the only thing they mentioned was hocks. I can't remember what they injected with and don't have my receipt with me, but that makes me feel better to hear the 10 day timeline. Maybe there's hope for Sunday's NBHA. (I still want to make my run with no one in the building in case it goes badly again LOL)
On the bright side, my other two horses worked GREAT yesterday and I even won the 3D on my 23 year old. :)
You don't think the cause of him not switching to his other lead is not pain related? I'm just asking, because the only time I've had an older horse who knows where his feet are not switch is either because of pain or my missed/bad cues. |
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Expert
Posts: 1409
Location: Oklahoma | Does he happen to stand with one leg behind him? My horse blocked out at hocks Come to find out he pulled the ligament that connectos to the hock on the backside. Dr. Hornas found it by xray and ultrasound. Usually soft tissue doesnt show on xrays but there is already calcium deposits and that is what showed. Dr. Hornas says as far as kissing spine you can send him xrays and he will tell you if bad or not but he says alot of horses has it and bout 3% is bad enough that it effects performances Good luck by the way I also injected a few times, I wish I had dug further and not just inject I just thought it as a maintenance. |
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Am I really the Weirdo?
Posts: 11181
Location: Kansas | veintiocho - 2016-03-07 10:08 AM rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-07 9:55 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-05 2:35 PM rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-04 7:45 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-04 12:47 AM Did the lameness exam show nothing at all in front? Like 0 out of 5 in a circle on hard ground? If hocks were injected, depending on the steroid used, it could take up to 10 days to take full effect. Others act as quick as 3 days. If he's not greatly improved in 10 days, it's something else. Proximal hind suspensory injuries can present like hocks. Some stifle issues also are hard to differentiate from hocks and could also be sacrum.
I assume the vets saw nothing in the front end. He was trotted in many circles on asphalt and the only thing they mentioned was hocks. I can't remember what they injected with and don't have my receipt with me, but that makes me feel better to hear the 10 day timeline. Maybe there's hope for Sunday's NBHA. (I still want to make my run with no one in the building in case it goes badly again LOL)
On the bright side, my other two horses worked GREAT yesterday and I even won the 3D on my 23 year old. :) You don't think the cause of him not switching to his other lead is not pain related? I'm just asking, because the only time I've had an older horse who knows where his feet are not switch is either because of pain or my missed/bad cues.
Honestly, I think it's just his brain fizzing out when I get him out of a high lope. He turns it fine when he has his head on straight, and this time we were looking OK until I started hustling him out of the first barrel. We ran a really nice exhibition when I checked his speed leaving first and kept him at 3/4 speed going to second. I let him open up going to third and he ducked off away from the barrel then didn't want to stop. I'm going to try the Excel ulcer stuff, more slow work - mainly walking around the left barrel and pausing after every step to get him to relax in that spot - and hopefully that will bring it back together. I don't think his hocks were super bad and no one that watches him can see any soreness either. I can PM the link to the video but don't want to post it publicly because of some prior nastiness on this forum. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 926
| classicpotatochip - 2016-03-03 10:30 AM
I know you've been bringing this horse on for a while. I would definitely rule out kissing spine and si pain next. Is there a vet with a lameness locator near you?
It's now estimated that 40%+ horses have some degree of kissing spine. JMHO, I'd go with ruling out the the SI and KS first. You'll need to go to a vet with the big clinic based xray machine to get a good KS diagnosis. From where I think you live, there should be some near you. Also, I would not have a chiro, DVM or not, start poking around until you rule out KS.
I'm sorry you're in the 'guess what's wrong with the barrel horse' he!!, it's not fun. I've just started to excercise my KS horse after surgery in December. I've been off him for almost 2 years going through all the conservative treatement, EPM, just a mess. Best of luck to you. |
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Location: Not Where I Want to Be | rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-07 1:39 PM veintiocho - 2016-03-07 10:08 AM rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-07 9:55 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-05 2:35 PM rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-04 7:45 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-04 12:47 AM Did the lameness exam show nothing at all in front? Like 0 out of 5 in a circle on hard ground? If hocks were injected, depending on the steroid used, it could take up to 10 days to take full effect. Others act as quick as 3 days. If he's not greatly improved in 10 days, it's something else. Proximal hind suspensory injuries can present like hocks. Some stifle issues also are hard to differentiate from hocks and could also be sacrum.
I assume the vets saw nothing in the front end. He was trotted in many circles on asphalt and the only thing they mentioned was hocks. I can't remember what they injected with and don't have my receipt with me, but that makes me feel better to hear the 10 day timeline. Maybe there's hope for Sunday's NBHA. (I still want to make my run with no one in the building in case it goes badly again LOL)
On the bright side, my other two horses worked GREAT yesterday and I even won the 3D on my 23 year old. :) You don't think the cause of him not switching to his other lead is not pain related? I'm just asking, because the only time I've had an older horse who knows where his feet are not switch is either because of pain or my missed/bad cues.
don't you just hate spiteful bitties?
Like they could do any better
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Am I really the Weirdo?
Posts: 11181
Location: Kansas | 1DSoon - 2016-03-08 9:49 AM rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-07 1:39 PM veintiocho - 2016-03-07 10:08 AM rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-07 9:55 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-05 2:35 PM rodeowithjoker - 2016-03-04 7:45 AM barrelracinbroke - 2016-03-04 12:47 AM Did the lameness exam show nothing at all in front? Like 0 out of 5 in a circle on hard ground? If hocks were injected, depending on the steroid used, it could take up to 10 days to take full effect. Others act as quick as 3 days. If he's not greatly improved in 10 days, it's something else. Proximal hind suspensory injuries can present like hocks. Some stifle issues also are hard to differentiate from hocks and could also be sacrum.
I assume the vets saw nothing in the front end. He was trotted in many circles on asphalt and the only thing they mentioned was hocks. I can't remember what they injected with and don't have my receipt with me, but that makes me feel better to hear the 10 day timeline. Maybe there's hope for Sunday's NBHA. (I still want to make my run with no one in the building in case it goes badly again LOL)
On the bright side, my other two horses worked GREAT yesterday and I even won the 3D on my 23 year old. :) You don't think the cause of him not switching to his other lead is not pain related? I'm just asking, because the only time I've had an older horse who knows where his feet are not switch is either because of pain or my missed/bad cues.
Like they could do any better
Yes, the ugliness is frustrating, but I'm just going to try and avoid feeding those folks. They're the reason I don't post much anymore. This horse in particular is not for the faint of heart - he's strong, fast and very quirky - and many of my friends say they would never be brave enough to run him. I just keep focusing on the talent he has and reminding myself that it will be worth the blood, sweat and tears when he starts laying down smoking fast runs on a regular basis. |
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