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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
    
| NJJ - 2016-06-04 9:05 AM
BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-05-29 12:43 AM Don't buy or breed a horse with cutter bloodlines for a barrel horse ... downhill withers with butt up in the air and low tail set is their specialty bred characteristics to squat the rear end and sweep with the front end ... which gives them lateral movement too but no running speed .. totally different conformation than a speed event horse ... I consider downhill a bad conformation fault for long term soundness ... since a horse with a good conformation is uniform across his topline supports 60% of his own weight with the frontend and much more with a rider and even more when he is faulted by being downhill too ... For some reason people think crossing a Volkswagen with a corvette is going to get them a horse that rides like a high powered tricycle ... lol
Perhaps you would like to contact a few of these folks and let them know that they should not be using cutting bred horses for barrel/rodeo horses...................
 Article by Tanya Randall  Photo by Ty Stockton   Sheena Robbins and Bar D Mr Dual Olena. The last thing you expect to see on the list of rodeo horse sires are the names Kit Dual, Smart Little Jerry, Smart Aristocrat, Smart Lil Highbrow, Lenas Wright On, Bet On Me 498, Dual Rey and Elans Playboy. These notable horses are known for their brilliance in the cattle classes of cutting and working cow horse as well as reining, and their ability to pass that on to their offspring in those respective disciplines. A glance at the leading sires of rodeo horses, as of September 22, you find Biebers Oakie, which crossed with a daughter of racehorse and National Finals Rodeo (NFR ) sire Judge Cash, sired Lisa Lockhart’s An Oakie With Cash. A ranch and performance sire, Biebers Oakie is by a money-earning son of National Cutting Horse Association (NCHA ) Derby Champion Doc’s Lynx, who is an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire, and out of a daughter of NCHA Hall Of Fame sire Docs Oak. Also near the top of the list with three rodeo horses is the all-around performance sire and cutter Especial, who was more running-bred than most people realize. He was an own son of the legendary Doc Bar, a race-bred, halter horse, who’s offspring preferred a game of cat-and-mouse over you-can’t-catch-me. His dam was a daughter of War Leo, who had NCHA earnings and a race record. Especial is the sire of Linda Vick’s AR Will He Tell (out of cutting-bred mare ), Jessica Routier’s College National Finals Rodeo Champion Especials Smoothie (out of a daughter of Smooth Herman, by Jet Smooth ), and Heidi Phillips’ Bunt Line Special (out of a daughter of Peppy San Badger, an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire. ). Like Biebers Oakie, Boon Freckles has the distinction of being an NFR sire through Bar D Mr Dual Olena, who carried Sheena Robbins to the NFR in 2009. Boon Freckles is by Mr Freckles Olena, a son of all around sire and cutting champion Colonel Freckles out of a daughter of legendary cutter and sire Doc O’Lena, and out of an own daughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Boon Bar. On the bottom side, Bar D Mr Dual Olena is out of a granddaughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Dual Pep. Other notables among the top 100 sires thus far are Freckles Floyd, sire of Margaret Stephenson’s Little Tommy Floyd. Freckles Floyd has sired cutters with more than $675,000 in earnings. Elans Playboy, the 2000 AQHA World Champion in senior cutting, has total offspring earnings of $547,000 in reining, reined cow horse and cutting plus the barrel racing earnings of Kissmyskooter, owned by Rivon Nilson and ridden by Kelly Yates. Perhaps the most “cowy” among rodeo’s elite is Diann Griffin’s Adobe Quixote Bar. Sired by Doc Quixote, a sire of cutters with nearly $10.5 million in earnings, Adobe Quixote Bar is out of Jae Bar Maise, by Doc’s Jack Sprat. Jae Bar Maise is a full sister to Jae Bar Fletch, who earned $422,935 as a cutter and sired 30 cutting money earners of more than $1 million. As a producer, Jae Bar Maise has offspring earnings of $583,894 including Adobe Quixote Bar’s barrel racing earnings. Read more: http://www.barrelhorsenews.com/articles/rodeo/3553-a-cut-above.html#ixzz4AcVN2CalÂ
This article is not well researched. Just one thing, War Leo had a speed index of about 67. He was not much of a race horse. I would say that you can do just about anything on a running bred Quarter Horse rather than anything on a cutting bred horse. Smooth Herman was world champion cutting horse. He is by Jet Smooth out of a daughter of King. | |
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Boot Detective
Posts: 1900
| I agree with everything Barrelhorse USA said except that they can't run. (I'm not sure that is what was intended to say). I think their conformation makes them work harder to run. I also consider it a comformation flaw on a horse that is no longer growing. I have seen a lot of colts be downhill but then grow out of it when the front end catches up with the hind end. I don't like riding a downhill horse because it changes how I sit and feel on them and is not comfortable. Another reason I don't like riding them is my saddle wants to slide FORWARD and put too much pressure on their front end. I have seen quite a few though that had speed to spare and have big win records. One of them is Flit To Kill. He won a tremendous amount of $$ in futurities and so have some of his colts that are also downhill. If I had one, I would consider a built up pad to level the saddle and take pressure off the horse' front end. | |
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  Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | streakysox - 2016-06-05 12:00 AM NJJ - 2016-06-04 9:05 AM BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-05-29 12:43 AM Don't buy or breed a horse with cutter bloodlines for a barrel horse ... downhill withers with butt up in the air and low tail set is their specialty bred characteristics to squat the rear end and sweep with the front end ... which gives them lateral movement too but no running speed .. totally different conformation than a speed event horse ... I consider downhill a bad conformation fault for long term soundness ... since a horse with a good conformation is uniform across his topline supports 60% of his own weight with the frontend and much more with a rider and even more when he is faulted by being downhill too ... For some reason people think crossing a Volkswagen with a corvette is going to get them a horse that rides like a high powered tricycle ... lol Perhaps you would like to contact a few of these folks and let them know that they should not be using cutting bred horses for barrel/rodeo horses...................
Article by Tanya Randall Photo by Ty Stockton
Sheena Robbins and Bar D Mr Dual Olena.
The last thing you expect to see on the list of rodeo horse sires are the names Kit Dual, Smart Little Jerry, Smart Aristocrat, Smart Lil Highbrow, Lenas Wright On, Bet On Me 498, Dual Rey and Elans Playboy. These notable horses are known for their brilliance in the cattle classes of cutting and working cow horse as well as reining, and their ability to pass that on to their offspring in those respective disciplines.
A glance at the leading sires of rodeo horses, as of September 22, you find Biebers Oakie, which crossed with a daughter of racehorse and National Finals Rodeo (NFR ) sire Judge Cash, sired Lisa Lockhart’s An Oakie With Cash. A ranch and performance sire, Biebers Oakie is by a money-earning son of National Cutting Horse Association (NCHA ) Derby Champion Doc’s Lynx, who is an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire, and out of a daughter of NCHA Hall Of Fame sire Docs Oak.
Also near the top of the list with three rodeo horses is the all-around performance sire and cutter Especial, who was more running-bred than most people realize. He was an own son of the legendary Doc Bar, a race-bred, halter horse, who’s offspring preferred a game of cat-and-mouse over you-can’t-catch-me. His dam was a daughter of War Leo, who had NCHA earnings and a race record.
Especial is the sire of Linda Vick’s AR Will He Tell (out of cutting-bred mare ), Jessica Routier’s College National Finals Rodeo Champion Especials Smoothie (out of a daughter of Smooth Herman, by Jet Smooth ), and Heidi Phillips’ Bunt Line Special (out of a daughter of Peppy San Badger, an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire. ).
Like Biebers Oakie, Boon Freckles has the distinction of being an NFR sire through Bar D Mr Dual Olena, who carried Sheena Robbins to the NFR in 2009. Boon Freckles is by Mr Freckles Olena, a son of all around sire and cutting champion Colonel Freckles out of a daughter of legendary cutter and sire Doc O’Lena, and out of an own daughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Boon Bar. On the bottom side, Bar D Mr Dual Olena is out of a granddaughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Dual Pep.
Other notables among the top 100 sires thus far are Freckles Floyd, sire of Margaret Stephenson’s Little Tommy Floyd. Freckles Floyd has sired cutters with more than $675,000 in earnings. Elans Playboy, the 2000 AQHA World Champion in senior cutting, has total offspring earnings of $547,000 in reining, reined cow horse and cutting plus the barrel racing earnings of Kissmyskooter, owned by Rivon Nilson and ridden by Kelly Yates.
Perhaps the most “cowy” among rodeo’s elite is Diann Griffin’s Adobe Quixote Bar. Sired by Doc Quixote, a sire of cutters with nearly $10.5 million in earnings, Adobe Quixote Bar is out of Jae Bar Maise, by Doc’s Jack Sprat. Jae Bar Maise is a full sister to Jae Bar Fletch, who earned $422,935 as a cutter and sired 30 cutting money earners of more than $1 million. As a producer, Jae Bar Maise has offspring earnings of $583,894 including Adobe Quixote Bar’s barrel racing earnings.
Read more: http://www.barrelhorsenews.com/articles/rodeo/3553-a-cut-above.html#ixzz4AcVN2Cal
This article is not well researched. Just one thing, War Leo had a speed index of about 67. He was not much of a race horse. I would say that you can do just about anything on a running bred Quarter Horse rather than anything on a cutting bred horse. Smooth Herman was world champion cutting horse. He is by Jet Smooth out of a daughter of King.
You are really reaching to discredit the facts......Out of ALL of the sires mentioned you pick out WAR LEO.....  | |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| NJJ - 2016-06-05 9:09 AM
streakysox - 2016-06-05 12:00 AM NJJ - 2016-06-04 9:05 AM BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-05-29 12:43 AM Don't buy or breed a horse with cutter bloodlines for a barrel horse ... downhill withers with butt up in the air and low tail set is their specialty bred characteristics to squat the rear end and sweep with the front end ... which gives them lateral movement too but no running speed .. totally different conformation than a speed event horse ... I consider downhill a bad conformation fault for long term soundness ... since a horse with a good conformation is uniform across his topline supports 60% of his own weight with the frontend and much more with a rider and even more when he is faulted by being downhill too ... For some reason people think crossing a Volkswagen with a corvette is going to get them a horse that rides like a high powered tricycle ... lol Perhaps you would like to contact a few of these folks and let them know that they should not be using cutting bred horses for barrel/rodeo horses...................
 Article by Tanya Randall  Photo by Ty Stockton
Â
Sheena Robbins and Bar D Mr Dual Olena.
The last thing you expect to see on the list of rodeo horse sires are the names Kit Dual, Smart Little Jerry, Smart Aristocrat, Smart Lil Highbrow, Lenas Wright On, Bet On Me 498, Dual Rey and Elans Playboy. These notable horses are known for their brilliance in the cattle classes of cutting and working cow horse as well as reining, and their ability to pass that on to their offspring in those respective disciplines.
A glance at the leading sires of rodeo horses, as of September 22, you find Biebers Oakie, which crossed with a daughter of racehorse and National Finals Rodeo (NFR ) sire Judge Cash, sired Lisa Lockhart’s An Oakie With Cash. A ranch and performance sire, Biebers Oakie is by a money-earning son of National Cutting Horse Association (NCHA ) Derby Champion Doc’s Lynx, who is an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire, and out of a daughter of NCHA Hall Of Fame sire Docs Oak.
Also near the top of the list with three rodeo horses is the all-around performance sire and cutter Especial, who was more running-bred than most people realize. He was an own son of the legendary Doc Bar, a race-bred, halter horse, who’s offspring preferred a game of cat-and-mouse over you-can’t-catch-me. His dam was a daughter of War Leo, who had NCHA earnings and a race record.
Especial is the sire of Linda Vick’s AR Will He Tell (out of cutting-bred mare ), Jessica Routier’s College National Finals Rodeo Champion Especials Smoothie (out of a daughter of Smooth Herman, by Jet Smooth ), and Heidi Phillips’ Bunt Line Special (out of a daughter of Peppy San Badger, an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire. ).
Like Biebers Oakie, Boon Freckles has the distinction of being an NFR sire through Bar D Mr Dual Olena, who carried Sheena Robbins to the NFR in 2009. Boon Freckles is by Mr Freckles Olena, a son of all around sire and cutting champion Colonel Freckles out of a daughter of legendary cutter and sire Doc O’Lena, and out of an own daughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Boon Bar. On the bottom side, Bar D Mr Dual Olena is out of a granddaughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Dual Pep.
Other notables among the top 100 sires thus far are Freckles Floyd, sire of Margaret Stephenson’s Little Tommy Floyd. Freckles Floyd has sired cutters with more than $675,000 in earnings. Elans Playboy, the 2000 AQHA World Champion in senior cutting, has total offspring earnings of $547,000 in reining, reined cow horse and cutting plus the barrel racing earnings of Kissmyskooter, owned by Rivon Nilson and ridden by Kelly Yates.
Perhaps the most “cowy” among rodeo’s elite is Diann Griffin’s Adobe Quixote Bar. Sired by Doc Quixote, a sire of cutters with nearly $10.5 million in earnings, Adobe Quixote Bar is out of Jae Bar Maise, by Doc’s Jack Sprat. Jae Bar Maise is a full sister to Jae Bar Fletch, who earned $422,935 as a cutter and sired 30 cutting money earners of more than $1 million. As a producer, Jae Bar Maise has offspring earnings of $583,894 including Adobe Quixote Bar’s barrel racing earnings.
Read more: http://www.barrelhorsenews.com/articles/rodeo/3553-a-cut-above.html#ixzz4AcVN2Cal
 This article is not well researched. Just one thing, War Leo had a speed index of about 67. He was not much of a race horse. I would say that you can do just about anything on a running bred Quarter Horse rather than anything on a cutting bred horse. Smooth Herman was world champion cutting horse. He is by Jet Smooth out of a daughter of King.
What difference does it make? The reason I just happened to pick War Leo is because the paint in my avatar has War Leo on his papers. I have already done the research on him. Now I have justified my choices/ opinions to a simpleton. | |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | streakysox - 2016-06-05 9:53 AM NJJ - 2016-06-05 9:09 AM streakysox - 2016-06-05 12:00 AM NJJ - 2016-06-04 9:05 AM BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-05-29 12:43 AM Don't buy or breed a horse with cutter bloodlines for a barrel horse ... downhill withers with butt up in the air and low tail set is their specialty bred characteristics to squat the rear end and sweep with the front end ... which gives them lateral movement too but no running speed .. totally different conformation than a speed event horse ... I consider downhill a bad conformation fault for long term soundness ... since a horse with a good conformation is uniform across his topline supports 60% of his own weight with the frontend and much more with a rider and even more when he is faulted by being downhill too ... For some reason people think crossing a Volkswagen with a corvette is going to get them a horse that rides like a high powered tricycle ... lol Perhaps you would like to contact a few of these folks and let them know that they should not be using cutting bred horses for barrel/rodeo horses...................
Article by Tanya Randall Photo by Ty Stockton
Sheena Robbins and Bar D Mr Dual Olena.
The last thing you expect to see on the list of rodeo horse sires are the names Kit Dual, Smart Little Jerry, Smart Aristocrat, Smart Lil Highbrow, Lenas Wright On, Bet On Me 498, Dual Rey and Elans Playboy. These notable horses are known for their brilliance in the cattle classes of cutting and working cow horse as well as reining, and their ability to pass that on to their offspring in those respective disciplines.
A glance at the leading sires of rodeo horses, as of September 22, you find Biebers Oakie, which crossed with a daughter of racehorse and National Finals Rodeo (NFR ) sire Judge Cash, sired Lisa Lockhart’s An Oakie With Cash. A ranch and performance sire, Biebers Oakie is by a money-earning son of National Cutting Horse Association (NCHA ) Derby Champion Doc’s Lynx, who is an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire, and out of a daughter of NCHA Hall Of Fame sire Docs Oak.
Also near the top of the list with three rodeo horses is the all-around performance sire and cutter Especial, who was more running-bred than most people realize. He was an own son of the legendary Doc Bar, a race-bred, halter horse, who’s offspring preferred a game of cat-and-mouse over you-can’t-catch-me. His dam was a daughter of War Leo, who had NCHA earnings and a race record.
Especial is the sire of Linda Vick’s AR Will He Tell (out of cutting-bred mare ), Jessica Routier’s College National Finals Rodeo Champion Especials Smoothie (out of a daughter of Smooth Herman, by Jet Smooth ), and Heidi Phillips’ Bunt Line Special (out of a daughter of Peppy San Badger, an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire. ).
Like Biebers Oakie, Boon Freckles has the distinction of being an NFR sire through Bar D Mr Dual Olena, who carried Sheena Robbins to the NFR in 2009. Boon Freckles is by Mr Freckles Olena, a son of all around sire and cutting champion Colonel Freckles out of a daughter of legendary cutter and sire Doc O’Lena, and out of an own daughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Boon Bar. On the bottom side, Bar D Mr Dual Olena is out of a granddaughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Dual Pep.
Other notables among the top 100 sires thus far are Freckles Floyd, sire of Margaret Stephenson’s Little Tommy Floyd. Freckles Floyd has sired cutters with more than $675,000 in earnings. Elans Playboy, the 2000 AQHA World Champion in senior cutting, has total offspring earnings of $547,000 in reining, reined cow horse and cutting plus the barrel racing earnings of Kissmyskooter, owned by Rivon Nilson and ridden by Kelly Yates.
Perhaps the most “cowy” among rodeo’s elite is Diann Griffin’s Adobe Quixote Bar. Sired by Doc Quixote, a sire of cutters with nearly $10.5 million in earnings, Adobe Quixote Bar is out of Jae Bar Maise, by Doc’s Jack Sprat. Jae Bar Maise is a full sister to Jae Bar Fletch, who earned $422,935 as a cutter and sired 30 cutting money earners of more than $1 million. As a producer, Jae Bar Maise has offspring earnings of $583,894 including Adobe Quixote Bar’s barrel racing earnings.
Read more: http://www.barrelhorsenews.com/articles/rodeo/3553-a-cut-above.html#ixzz4AcVN2Cal
. Just one thing, War Leo had a speed index of about 67. He was not much of a race horse. I would say that you can do just about anything on a running bred Quarter Horse rather than anything on a cutting bred horse. Smooth Herman was world champion cutting horse. He is by Jet Smooth out of a daughter of King. What difference does it make? The reason I just happened to pick War Leo is because the paint in my avatar has War Leo on his papers. I have already done the research on him. Now I have justified my choices/ opinions to a simpleton.
Really? Simpleton????? .....however, by your first statement (highlighted), you were trying to discredit the article which PROVES that MANY cutting bred horses sire winners!
But thank you, for your kind words in calling me a "simpleton"....and you managing to show your 
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 I Don't Brag
Posts: 6960
| BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-05-30 10:51 PM
rodeoveteran - 2016-05-29 1:19 PM
I would have never picked her, but it goes to show, ya, you never know.
I was given a 19 year old mare a couple of years ago and she is VERY downhill. When I first get on her it feels like we are going down a steep hill, and that is WITH the better saddle fit and old fashioned built up pad I now have her in. To top it off, she is very front endy in her turns, hitting and dropping her front end, then pivoting around the barrel with force. It took me a whole summer and many saddle changes before I was not doing a Stroud Layout around the first barrel, damaging several ligaments in my left hip socket, before I got things figured out. I don't know HOW I never yard darted!
But it was all worth it. She is honest, gritty and pretty awesome on the racetrack and hard panned we see so often around here. After sinking 9 years in to an expensive horse I thought would be "the one", and only getting 2 half summers out of due to illnesses and lameness, my aging, downhill, free horse never took me to the Finals in our Regional Assn for the first time in almost 10 years.
I would have never picked her out, and would have lost out on this gritty, fun, pain in the butt mare that now has a forever home.
???? my aging, downhill, free horse............... never............ took me to the Finals in our Regional Assn for the first time in almost 10 years. ????
Now that she is 21-22 years old ... what are you going to buy to ride next year??
What is your point BH? MINE was that if I had passed this very downhill horse, I would have missed out on a lot of fun and trips to the paywindow that I had been missed on the gorgeous, well balanced, race bred mare that I had spent years, blood sweat and tears on.
THIS is why they say, you don't ride the papers, and conformation is not everything, heart goes a LONG way. This mare is not the prettiest or having the best, most pleasing conformation, is not what I would have picked had I been buying, but she is now 21 years old AND STILL SOUND and competitive. I wouldn't go out of my way to buy a downhill horse, but I wouldn't totally discount one either, especially after riding this mare. What I look for is fit and this little mare fits my way of riding (after I learned to compensate for her downhillness, lol).
As to what I am going to buy? Not that it is any of your concern, but I have some young horses to bring along and then, not even being in the market, bought a horse that I am really hoping will turn in to a rodeo horse. I have limited funds, not a bottomless pocketbook and am closer to the end of my barrel racing career than the beginning....that nice, gorgeous, capable mare not only took most of my available funds but also took most of my heart for facing adversity in this sport. My "aging, free horse" downhill or not, brought back some fun and heart to this long in the tooth barrel racer..gave me heart to keep going instead of giving up. I don't know what your problem is with that.
Oh, and by the way, she is race bred. Just sayin'.... | |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | streakysox - 2016-06-05 9:53 AM NJJ - 2016-06-05 9:09 AM streakysox - 2016-06-05 12:00 AM NJJ - 2016-06-04 9:05 AM BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-05-29 12:43 AM Don't buy or breed a horse with cutter bloodlines for a barrel horse ... downhill withers with butt up in the air and low tail set is their specialty bred characteristics to squat the rear end and sweep with the front end ... which gives them lateral movement too but no running speed .. totally different conformation than a speed event horse ... I consider downhill a bad conformation fault for long term soundness ... since a horse with a good conformation is uniform across his topline supports 60% of his own weight with the frontend and much more with a rider and even more when he is faulted by being downhill too ... For some reason people think crossing a Volkswagen with a corvette is going to get them a horse that rides like a high powered tricycle ... lol Perhaps you would like to contact a few of these folks and let them know that they should not be using cutting bred horses for barrel/rodeo horses...................
Article by Tanya Randall Photo by Ty Stockton
Sheena Robbins and Bar D Mr Dual Olena.
The last thing you expect to see on the list of rodeo horse sires are the names Kit Dual, Smart Little Jerry, Smart Aristocrat, Smart Lil Highbrow, Lenas Wright On, Bet On Me 498, Dual Rey and Elans Playboy. These notable horses are known for their brilliance in the cattle classes of cutting and working cow horse as well as reining, and their ability to pass that on to their offspring in those respective disciplines.
A glance at the leading sires of rodeo horses, as of September 22, you find Biebers Oakie, which crossed with a daughter of racehorse and National Finals Rodeo (NFR ) sire Judge Cash, sired Lisa Lockhart’s An Oakie With Cash. A ranch and performance sire, Biebers Oakie is by a money-earning son of National Cutting Horse Association (NCHA ) Derby Champion Doc’s Lynx, who is an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire, and out of a daughter of NCHA Hall Of Fame sire Docs Oak.
Also near the top of the list with three rodeo horses is the all-around performance sire and cutter Especial, who was more running-bred than most people realize. He was an own son of the legendary Doc Bar, a race-bred, halter horse, who’s offspring preferred a game of cat-and-mouse over you-can’t-catch-me. His dam was a daughter of War Leo, who had NCHA earnings and a race record.
Especial is the sire of Linda Vick’s AR Will He Tell (out of cutting-bred mare ), Jessica Routier’s College National Finals Rodeo Champion Especials Smoothie (out of a daughter of Smooth Herman, by Jet Smooth ), and Heidi Phillips’ Bunt Line Special (out of a daughter of Peppy San Badger, an Equi-Stat all-time leading cutting horse sire. ).
Like Biebers Oakie, Boon Freckles has the distinction of being an NFR sire through Bar D Mr Dual Olena, who carried Sheena Robbins to the NFR in 2009. Boon Freckles is by Mr Freckles Olena, a son of all around sire and cutting champion Colonel Freckles out of a daughter of legendary cutter and sire Doc O’Lena, and out of an own daughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Boon Bar. On the bottom side, Bar D Mr Dual Olena is out of a granddaughter of all-time leading cutting horse sire Dual Pep.
Other notables among the top 100 sires thus far are Freckles Floyd, sire of Margaret Stephenson’s Little Tommy Floyd. Freckles Floyd has sired cutters with more than $675,000 in earnings. Elans Playboy, the 2000 AQHA World Champion in senior cutting, has total offspring earnings of $547,000 in reining, reined cow horse and cutting plus the barrel racing earnings of Kissmyskooter, owned by Rivon Nilson and ridden by Kelly Yates.
Perhaps the most “cowy” among rodeo’s elite is Diann Griffin’s Adobe Quixote Bar. Sired by Doc Quixote, a sire of cutters with nearly $10.5 million in earnings, Adobe Quixote Bar is out of Jae Bar Maise, by Doc’s Jack Sprat. Jae Bar Maise is a full sister to Jae Bar Fletch, who earned $422,935 as a cutter and sired 30 cutting money earners of more than $1 million. As a producer, Jae Bar Maise has offspring earnings of $583,894 including Adobe Quixote Bar’s barrel racing earnings.
Read more: http://www.barrelhorsenews.com/articles/rodeo/3553-a-cut-above.html#ixzz4AcVN2Cal
This article is not well researched. Just one thing, War Leo had a speed index of about 67. He was not much of a race horse. I would say that you can do just about anything on a running bred Quarter Horse rather than anything on a cutting bred horse. Smooth Herman was world champion cutting horse. He is by Jet Smooth out of a daughter of King. What difference does it make? The reason I just happened to pick War Leo is because the paint in my avatar has War Leo on his papers. I have already done the research on him. Now I have justified my choices/ opinions to a simpleton.
Wow,, really  | |
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 Peecans
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Butt high horses come in all sections of the breed you would get a piece of turd breeding to race horses that don't complement just as fast as breeding a cutter to a race horse that don’t complement each other.
I spend years planning and picking my breeding’s, and I have a ton of faith in my program, though young we will do great things. I think the issues come from breeding cool name to cool name and not actually looking at the horses, you have to be hard on the mare and stallion, no matter how and what you are crossing. | |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-05-29 12:43 AM
Don't buy or breed a horse with cutter bloodlines for a barrel horse ... downhill withers with butt up in the air and low tail set is their specialty bred characteristics to squat the rear end and sweep with the front end ... which gives them lateral movement too but no running speed .. totally different conformation than a speed event horse ...
I consider downhill a bad conformation fault for long term soundness ... since a horse with a good conformation is uniform across his topline supports 60% of his own weight with the frontend and much more with a rider and even more when he is faulted by being downhill too ...
For some reason people think crossing a Volkswagen with a corvette is going to get them a horse that rides like a high powered tricycle ... lol
There are a lot of nice cutting studs that are not build downhill, to generalize all cutters are not conformationally correct, is wrong.
The cutters I know like the horse to be conformationally correct, as a cutter has to get his but in the ground, it is harder for a down hill horse to get their but in the ground as more then 60 percent of the weight is on the front end. Whereas a horse who is even only has the 60 percent weight on the front end. The cutters I know cull the horses that are bum high. | |
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 Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | Considering War Leo was foaled in 1956. That was a heck of a long time ago. I think they did things different back then. This was in the infancy of AQHA. I always thought he was AAA. There was a time when A was the fastest rating they could get. But looking him up on equibase, he was a Stakes Winner with: Starts: 8 Firsts: 2 Seconds: 1 Thirds: 2 Earnings: $1,006 Earnings Per Start: $126. They don't have a speed figure for him. I don't have any AQHA money left. Anyone want to look up his performance record? It's going to bother me until I find out. | |
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Regular
Posts: 66
| Personally I don't like downhill horses. I had a Western Pleasure mare who was quite downhill and she was about 16 hands- I was constantly having to re-adjust and fix my seat.
However I completely disagree with the blanket statement about cutting horses. Not all cutting horses are downhill and if you breed a cutter to a racing bred horse wisely you can out breed the downhill tendency. One of my favorite horses that I've owned and barrel raced was cutting breed on the sire's side and Thoroughbred Race Bred on the dams side. She was not at all downhill, quite the opposite actually she had very prominent high withers.
It doesn't matter what discipline the horse is bred for you can always run into a downhill horse. I've seen down hill horses among pleasure bred horses, HUS bred horses, reining bred horses, running bred horses and cutting bred horses, it happens to everyone and I think it is often caused by poor breeding choices. If you breed a downhill horse be smart and mix it to a horse that isn't downhill! Try to minimize the potential that the offspring will be downhill. Not every horse is perfect no matter what breed or pedigree.
BARRELHORSEUSA you want some more proof of a cutting horse sire making top notch barrel horses look at PG Dry Fire-some of his offspring have been ruling the Northwest Barrel races the last few years. I don't think PG Dry Fire is downhill but all of his offspring are wicked fast and catty on their turns.
Edited by christylynn89 2016-06-06 4:00 PM
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 That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| You all make my head hurt! | |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Whiteboy - 2016-06-06 4:15 PM You all make my head hurt!
LOL.. mine too  | |
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 Georgia Peach
Posts: 8338
Location: Georgia |
Just thought some of you should know, my downhill horse won a saddle this weekend.  | |
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 I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | Just to set something straight...Tanya Randall is the queen of barrel horse research and knows everything about pedigrees and she deserves an apology. | |
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Blessed 
Location: Here | The only one that should be butt hurt here is Tanya. She knows her facts and does #1 job researching and writing articles. To claim it wasn't well
researched is just wrong | |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Nevertooold - 2016-06-06 7:50 PM Just to set something straight...Tanya Randall is the queen of barrel horse research and knows everything about pedigrees and she deserves an apology.
I agree  | |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | SG. - 2016-06-06 10:02 PM The only one that should be butt hurt here is Tanya. She knows her facts and does #1 job researching and writing articles. To claim it wasn't well
researched is just wrong
Well we do have some on here that think their the smartest ones on here.  | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1008
| My 4yo colt is race bred and very downhill since a mid 2 yo. Last time I measured he was 15.3 at the hip and 15. (1/2) at the wither. He string tests to 16 hh so I'm really hoping he evens out. He's gangly and uncoordinated right now. Really hoping this changes when he evens out. I bought him with the assumption he wouldn't stay this way! | |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | Southtxponygirl - 2016-06-06 10:14 PM SG. - 2016-06-06 10:02 PM The only one that should be butt hurt here is Tanya. She knows her facts and does #1 job researching and writing articles. To claim it wasn't well
researched is just wrong Well we do have some on here that think their the smartest ones on here.
I agree.....I posted that article because she is well known to write factual articles, etc.....but hey, I was called a "simpleton" by the same person so ............. | |
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