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 To the Left
Posts: 1865
   
Location: Florida | I saw exactly that once, it was EPM. Sorry to be a bummer, but get him checked for it. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 678
Location: Canada | I would treat for ulcers. If you gave him Bute for a week this may have made them worse so I'd go ahead and treat for them and see if that changes anything. |
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 Midget Lover
 
Location: Kentucky | Treat for ulcers and research for kissing spine. Mine would do the same thing. |
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 Did I miss the party?
Posts: 3864
| WYOracer - 2016-06-07 12:41 PM Ok anyone have a horse do this? My gelding has always been a little touchy when you saddle him by I always assumed it was just something pinching him bc he would freeze up but as soon as you adjusted the saddle a little bit he was fine and walks off. Well recently it's gotten worse and we went to the vet took some rads and he had a couple spots in his back that were touching so we injected those places. Gave him some time off and rode him and he was still a little stiff at first but rode out fine like normal. We bought a CSI pad to see if that didn't help him out and I rode him in it and he was fine. I went to a barrel race last night saddled him and started tightening the cinch which I do slowly bc of the issue and he freezes again so I adjust and he does it again! So I smooched to him to move out of it and he flies back words throws himself to the ground violently gets up does it two more times lays out flat I try getting saddle undone but can't someone tries to come help me and he blows again finally steps on his rope and stops himself. We have an appointment back at the vet on Friday but any ideas? I'm wondering if it's not a sternum or whither a issue now?
I'm still hung up on this.....I'd have a hard time not looking deeper into the kissing spine. Was a bone scan recommended?
Glad you're both ok and I hope you get it figured out.
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 Expert
Posts: 1631
Location: Somewhere around here | Gator Bug - 2016-06-07 2:34 PM
Southtxponygirl - 2016-06-07 3:26 PM Gator Bug - 2016-06-07 3:17 PM We had a 4YO do this years ago. It was when you went to cinch him. He would explode if you tightened too quickly or most of it at once. We had an older gentleman that saw this in race horses. He cinched him, the horse exploded and passed out. We had to cut the cinch. The old guy told us he saw it in race horses that a nerve would be over the muscle and not under the way it should be. He said it was rare. Cinching quickly or all at once would pinch that nerve. Then, the horse also gets nervous about cinching and expecting it and then can freak out. I mean ours flipped a couple times and passed out. We went to cinching very loose, walked him and then tighten again...repeat. We took it slow at first, then he just stopped doing it. But we always tightened a little and then walked some after that with that horse...he never did it again. I know it sounds completely nuts...like a myth or an old wives tale, but it did work. That would something to look into too and like the other poster {Chaseingcans} said maybe just treat for ulcers also, it would not hurt.
I've heard about this too. If he isn't getting better after testing for ulcers I'd try a smaller cinch, almost too small but that way it won't be cinched in your horses bad spot. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 972
Location: Texas! | barrelracinbroke - 2016-06-07 5:26 PM
WYOracer - 2016-06-07 12:41 PM Ok anyone have a horse do this? My gelding has always been a little touchy when you saddle him by I always assumed it was just something pinching him bc he would freeze up but as soon as you adjusted the saddle a little bit he was fine and walks off. Well recently it's gotten worse and we went to the vet took some rads and he had a couple spots in his back that were touching so we injected those places. Gave him some time off and rode him and he was still a little stiff at first but rode out fine like normal. We bought a CSI pad to see if that didn't help him out and I rode him in it and he was fine. I went to a barrel race last night saddled him and started tightening the cinch which I do slowly bc of the issue and he freezes again so I adjust and he does it again! So I smooched to him to move out of it and he flies back words throws himself to the ground violently gets up does it two more times lays out flat I try getting saddle undone but can't someone tries to come help me and he blows again finally steps on his rope and stops himself. We have an appointment back at the vet on Friday but any ideas? I'm wondering if it's not a sternum or whither a issue now?
I'm still hung up on this.....I'd have a hard time not looking deeper into the kissing spine. Was a bone scan recommended?
Glad you're both ok and I hope you get it figured out.
The rads were two weeks ago. This was the third time I've saddled him since. First two he was fine this time was at a jackpot. I Unsaddled loaded him up and made a vet appointment. Couldn't get in until Friday just curious to see if anyone has had similar cases wether it is related to the spine issue or something else entirely that we are missing. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1526
Location: Texas | WYOracer - 2016-06-07 2:41 PM
Ok anyone have a horse do this? My gelding has always been a little touchy when you saddle him by I always assumed it was just something pinching him bc he would freeze up but as soon as you adjusted the saddle a little bit he was fine and walks off. Well recently it's gotten worse and we went to the vet took some rads and he had a couple spots in his back that were touching so we injected those places. Gave him some time off and rode him and he was still a little stiff at first but rode out fine like normal. We bought a CSI pad to see if that didn't help him out and I rode him in it and he was fine. I went to a barrel race last night saddled him and started tightening the cinch which I do slowly bc of the issue and he freezes again so I adjust and he does it again! So I smooched to him to move out of it and he flies back words throws himself to the ground violently gets up does it two more times lays out flat I try getting saddle undone but can't someone tries to come help me and he blows again finally steps on his rope and stops himself. We have an appointment back at the vet on Friday but any ideas? I'm wondering if it's not a sternum or whither a issue now?
He's cinchy. They don't get over it. Saddle, don't pull tight, walk tighten more, walk tighten more, lunge pull tight lunge get on. These horses will set back just so you know. It's just them. They are costerphobic. |
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  Keeper of the King Snake
Posts: 7622
Location: Dubach, LA | Ulcers. Run some omeprazole through him and get him on Guardion. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 926
| barrelracinbroke - 2016-06-07 6:26 PM
WYOracer - 2016-06-07 12:41 PM Ok anyone have a horse do this? My gelding has always been a little touchy when you saddle him by I always assumed it was just something pinching him bc he would freeze up but as soon as you adjusted the saddle a little bit he was fine and walks off. Well recently it's gotten worse and we went to the vet took some rads and he had a couple spots in his back that were touching so we injected those places. Gave him some time off and rode him and he was still a little stiff at first but rode out fine like normal. We bought a CSI pad to see if that didn't help him out and I rode him in it and he was fine. I went to a barrel race last night saddled him and started tightening the cinch which I do slowly bc of the issue and he freezes again so I adjust and he does it again! So I smooched to him to move out of it and he flies back words throws himself to the ground violently gets up does it two more times lays out flat I try getting saddle undone but can't someone tries to come help me and he blows again finally steps on his rope and stops himself. We have an appointment back at the vet on Friday but any ideas? I'm wondering if it's not a sternum or whither a issue now?
I'm still hung up on this.....I'd have a hard time not looking deeper into the kissing spine. Was a bone scan recommended?
Glad you're both ok and I hope you get it figured out.
Was the xray done with a clinic based xray machine? And he had a few spots 'touching'? Please pursue this. KS is present in about 40% of the equine population, and has only been documented in the past 10 years or so since clinic based machines were available. If your horse is this dramatic there is something wrong, very wrong. I didn't listen early enough to my KS horse, and I regret every day of it. When horses do this 'cinchy' isn't the problem it's the symptom.
Check back with the guy that did the injections and go from there. Good Luck. |
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| I have flies like you would not believe around here. My horse's mid line has sores all the way down it. I would certainly check that area. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 415
| How old is this horse? I have a 1D horse who when getting her back into shape this year decided to start getting spooky (she's 9) and bucked a few times the cinch touched her when saddling, thought it was a fluke thing and then she bucked me off once after saddling and getting on right away  completely totally unlike her to do anything like this. She randomly freaked out/bucked/pulled back about 4 times (different days) and then just stopped all of a sudden so I never got the chance to look into it. She is on Omeprazole and has breathing problems so is back on her meds so I'm guessing it was one of those two things...maybe look into those? Along with maybe see a different vet about KS |
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Expert
Posts: 1526
Location: Texas | Could be kidding spine or just cinchy. Did the radiograph show her back vertebrae were touching? |
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Did I miss the party?
Posts: 3864
| WYOracer - 2016-06-07 5:11 PM barrelracinbroke - 2016-06-07 5:26 PM WYOracer - 2016-06-07 12:41 PM Ok anyone have a horse do this? My gelding has always been a little touchy when you saddle him by I always assumed it was just something pinching him bc he would freeze up but as soon as you adjusted the saddle a little bit he was fine and walks off. Well recently it's gotten worse and we went to the vet took some rads and he had a couple spots in his back that were touching so we injected those places. Gave him some time off and rode him and he was still a little stiff at first but rode out fine like normal. We bought a CSI pad to see if that didn't help him out and I rode him in it and he was fine. I went to a barrel race last night saddled him and started tightening the cinch which I do slowly bc of the issue and he freezes again so I adjust and he does it again! So I smooched to him to move out of it and he flies back words throws himself to the ground violently gets up does it two more times lays out flat I try getting saddle undone but can't someone tries to come help me and he blows again finally steps on his rope and stops himself. We have an appointment back at the vet on Friday but any ideas? I'm wondering if it's not a sternum or whither a issue now? I'm still hung up on this.....I'd have a hard time not looking deeper into the kissing spine. Was a bone scan recommended?
Glad you're both ok and I hope you get it figured out.
The rads were two weeks ago. This was the third time I've saddled him since. First two he was fine this time was at a jackpot. I Unsaddled loaded him up and made a vet appointment. Couldn't get in until Friday just curious to see if anyone has had similar cases wether it is related to the spine issue or something else entirely that we are missing.
I'm just thinking out loud here but, if was this was the third time he'd been saddled since he was injected a couple of weeks ago and he was ok the first couple times, it makes me wonder if the injections already wore off. Is it possible there's a little more extensive of an issue in damage to the vertebrae than injections were able to negate and hence they only lasted a couple of weeks? Curious as to what steroid he used and if he used HA as well......
Or, maybe it is ulcers, or cinchy or something. I've never had a horse flip over from ulcers and I'm quite thankful for that!
Please keep us updated, I'm interested to hear what your vet has to say. Wishing you the best in figuring it out.
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Industrial Srength Barrel Racer
Posts: 7268
| YEP - my mare does this. I've tried different saddles, different pads, finally treated for ulcers - she is STILL cinchy but maybe not as bad - I think it has become a learned behavior with her, really. I cinch her EXTREMELY slowly - and I have never, ever just pulled it up tight. I tighten a tiny bit, walk her, tighten some more, etc. She isn't AWFUL but I feel a bit like I am un-arming a bomb! It is very nerve-wracking. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 639
Location: God's country...aka TEXAS | I would also look more into the kissing spine. I speak from experience. lol. When they have KS, they also have muscle spasms which can happen at any given moment. Mine would act like something was trying to kill him one minute and the next he was fine. Sometimes the injections don't last long at all. As others have said, I would also treat for ulcers. Anything causing the pain can also cause them to develop ulcers. Good luck! |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 972
Location: Texas! | I'm going to see if they will scope on Friday as well as obviously recheck the spine and see if he's ounchy again. I cinch him slow this was only about halfway tight and was walking when he froze up I normally would readjust the saddle but I had already done that twice so just smooched him forward and he exploded. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 972
Location: Texas! | I also have been palpating his back where we did the injections and where he was super back sore and he seems relatively pain free I can get a reaction but it's very mild and I have to press pretty hard so that's why I'm wondering if this was caused by something else but will definitely still look into the KS more. |
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Location: NE Texas | Griz - 2016-06-08 5:18 AM
YEP - my mare does this. I've tried different saddles, different pads, finally treated for ulcers - she is STILL cinchy but maybe not as bad - I think it has become a learned behavior with her, really. I cinch her EXTREMELY slowly - and I have never, ever just pulled it up tight. I tighten a tiny bit, walk her, tighten some more, etc. She isn't AWFUL but I feel a bit like I am un-arming a bomb! It is very nerve-wracking.
ditto - my 6 year old thoroughbred mare does this. I even untie her when I'm cinching now just in case she sits back. She's extremely touchy - she doesn't even really liked to be brushed and certainly not with a stiff brush. I've tried different saddles, pads, girths, chiro, vet check, ulcer treatment.... the only thing that's made a difference is now when I saddle I just put it on her and do one-loop around and don't tighten...go around and do some other things and let her settle with it on.... walk her around...tighten enough to get on.... warm her up and after I feel her loosen up I do some flexing. I DO NOT flex until she's relaxed...if I ask for flex before she's relaxed under the saddle it's stiff/quick movements so I just wait until I feel her relax before asking her to do other things. I can jump on bare back and no problem - i really think it has something to do with the nerve around the cinch as others have mentioned but i am not 100% certain. I'd like to add that she is not sore at all in any pressure points. |
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 Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | Hope you get it figured out.....keep us updated. Could magnesium help with the touchiness and sensitivity? I know it's a small piece of the puzzle but it popped in my head. |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | reading a horses mind is definately a process
1) I would start with giving something for ulcers and i would cover front and hind. I like to use ritetrack as it is buffered and will help front and hind. I don't use to cure but it will give them relief very quickly and you will know in a few days if that is your problem.
2) after a few days. I would start on an absorbable magnesium
3) as far as nerve or ribs I would try a surcingle and try it pretty tight taking normal precautions to cinch up slow but tight. just looking to see if the horse doesn't care because it is not a saddle. go ahead and work horse with it on, then check to see if he associates that with pain in a couple days.
4) if surcingle is ok, then have saddle checked to see if the tree is twisted/broke or just not fitting right. if the surcingle was ok but after working he later resents it then i would go with pain and who knows where it is coming from...
5) vet again and take these results to him/her. tests that would be interesting to check out would be pssm 1, 2 and epm. thermal scan of back/wither area. pelvic exam
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