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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 878
  
Location: "...way down south in the Everglades..." | kuhlmann - 2016-08-24 8:37 AM total performance - 2016-08-21 4:50 PM SKM - 2016-08-21 3:50 PM Barnmom - 2016-08-21 1:01 PM The Tee Cos passed away, have no idea what happened. Mexican owners, Mexican trainer... Doesn't take much to figure it out. Before I get flamed, it's the truth. Last year, the winner collapsed at the end. His connections said he just needed a drink of water. More like they have a cocktail that hasn't been figured out yet so it can't be tested for. I have to agree with you Stacy. I think they eventually suspend the trainer, nit I m A y be wrong.
There is ZERO reason to bring race into this, ZERO. The fact that you did tells me a ton about you.
Please take a few moments and pull the records on the trainers who have horses in race. Pull the suspension records and you tell me if has to do with race.
This was a tragedy and you lumped an entire race of people together to explain it away when you have ZERO idea what happened. I don't know what happened either but I dang sure am not about to say it has anything to go with the race of his connections. That is ignorant, slanderous, and completely uncalled for.
This horse, Gamey Tee Cos, I would hope they are doing a very serious autopsy on. His trainer just got his license back this summer after being suspended for a year due to a horse testing positive for a cocktail of illegal drugs. I would certainly be suspicious of foul play on this one, simply because past actions do impact and haunt future actions.
But with that said, I agree with Kuhlmann. There's plenty of drug violations across the board for all races of people involved. The TB industry is full of it too. I blame the individuals that treat them like throw-away commodities. Maybe if these racing commissions and organizations would get a little more serious things would change. Right now most of the punishments are slaps on the wrist.
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 Saint Stacey
| kuhlmann - 2016-08-24 6:37 AM
total performance - 2016-08-21 4:50 PM
SKM - 2016-08-21 3:50 PM
Barnmom - 2016-08-21 1:01 PM
The Tee Cos passed away, have no idea what happened.
Mexican owners, Mexican trainer... Doesn't take much to figure it out.
Before I get flamed, it's the truth. Last year, the winner collapsed at the end. His connections said he just needed a drink of water. More like they have a cocktail that hasn't been figured out yet so it can't be tested for.
I have to agree with you Stacy. I think they eventually suspend the trainer, nit I m A y be wrong.
There is ZERO reason to bring race into this, ZERO. The fact that you did tells me a ton about you.
Please take a few moments and pull the records on the trainers who have horses in race. Pull the suspension records and you tell me if has to do with race.
This was a tragedy and you lumped an entire race of people together to explain it away when you have ZERO idea what happened. I don't know what happened either but I dang sure am not about to say it has anything to go with the race of his connections. That is ignorant, slanderous, and completely uncalled for.
I'm sorry my statement offends you. But let's be honest. The match races held in Mexico are a different world. It's also a different culture that views horses a lot different than most people from the USA do. Most Mexican owners and trainers DO match race and many of these horses with Mexican connections DO have a lot more races than their records from AQHA approved tracks show due to the match racing being a huge deal in that culture. There are no rules in that world and the needle is always used because it's about winning.
If you read my comment as racist, then that's your take, not my intent. Like I said...a different culture and view of horses. There are no rules in Mexico. Horses are beasts of burden and disposal commodities. | |
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Who Wants to Trade?
Posts: 4692
| SKM - 2016-08-24 6:50 PM
kuhlmann - 2016-08-24 6:37 AM
total performance - 2016-08-21 4:50 PM
SKM - 2016-08-21 3:50 PM
Barnmom - 2016-08-21 1:01 PM
The Tee Cos passed away, have no idea what happened.
Mexican owners, Mexican trainer... Doesn't take much to figure it out.
Before I get flamed, it's the truth. Last year, the winner collapsed at the end. His connections said he just needed a drink of water. More like they have a cocktail that hasn't been figured out yet so it can't be tested for.
I have to agree with you Stacy. I think they eventually suspend the trainer, nit I m A y be wrong.
There is ZERO reason to bring race into this, ZERO. The fact that you did tells me a ton about you.
Please take a few moments and pull the records on the trainers who have horses in race. Pull the suspension records and you tell me if has to do with race.
This was a tragedy and you lumped an entire race of people together to explain it away when you have ZERO idea what happened. I don't know what happened either but I dang sure am not about to say it has anything to go with the race of his connections. That is ignorant, slanderous, and completely uncalled for.
I'm sorry my statement offends you. But let's be honest. The match races held in Mexico are a different world. It's also a different culture that views horses a lot different than most people from the USA do. Most Mexican owners and trainers DO match race and many of these horses with Mexican connections DO have a lot more races than their records from AQHA approved tracks show due to the match racing being a huge deal in that culture. There are no rules in that world and the needle is always used because it's about winning.
If you read my comment as racist, then that's your take, not my intent. Like I said...a different culture and view of horses. There are no rules in Mexico. Horses are beasts of burden and disposal commodities.
Your statement was most definitely racist. These are AMERICANS running horses.
I firmly believe that statements about bad tests or match racing not need have ethnicity brought them. There are many people many races who participate in match racing and many trainers of many ethnicities who get bad tests.
Your intent was to state that because their race it was obvious that the horse had drugs his system. That implies that everyone of that race dopes their horses and I have a huge issue that implication.
Basically, I find your statement subsequent defense of it highly inappropriate and am ashamed for you. | |
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Saint Stacey
| I'm not sure how it is racist to refer to someone from Mexico as being Mexican? Just like someone from Canada is Canadian, Australia is Australian, Italy is Italian, America is American, etc.
I know a lot of older, small time owners and breeders that have gotten out of racing because of the...people from south of the American boarder...because they are tired of how the industry has changed from that south of the American border influence. Yes, that influence has kept racing alive and the prices up. No one will deny it nor should they complain. But racing has changed with that influence and in many, many cases...it is not a change for the best. I get that there are bad people of every nationality. But it is easier to get ahold of illegal substances from south of the American border so you can't tell me it doesn't impact racing here. That is where Red Bull originated. Most of the illegal substances found in race horses have originated on the match races in the country of Mexico. They then come from that point of origin onto the American tracks.
I have tried to be as politically correct as possible with this post as to not offend. But having seen the changes first hand over the last 30+ years, you won't shame me into thinking the opinion I've developed is wrong. Sorry. | |
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Who Wants to Trade?
Posts: 4692
| SKM - 2016-08-25 12:13 PM
I'm not sure how it is racist to refer to someone from Mexico as being Mexican? Just like someone from Canada is Canadian, Australia is Australian, Italy is Italian, America is American, etc.
I know a lot of older, small time owners and breeders that have gotten out of racing because of the...people from south of the American boarder...because they are tired of how the industry has changed from that south of the American border influence. Yes, that influence has kept racing alive and the prices up. No one will deny it nor should they complain. But racing has changed with that influence and in many, many cases...it is not a change for the best. I get that there are bad people of every nationality. But it is easier to get ahold of illegal substances from south of the American border so you can't tell me it doesn't impact racing here. That is where Red Bull originated. Most of the illegal substances found in race horses have originated on the match races in the country of Mexico. They then come from that point of origin onto the American tracks.
I have tried to be as politically correct as possible with this post as to not offend. But having seen the changes first hand over the last 30+ years, you won't shame me into thinking the opinion I've developed is wrong. Sorry.
You said that having a Mexican owner and a Mexican trainer was the only information needed in the death of the horse.
That statement is inappropriate and completely incorrect.
You can attempt to excuse racism however you want to, that doesn't make right or acceptable.
Furthermore, I do not believe that either the owner or trainer is from Mexico. I believe both are Americans. Even if one was from Mexico, it does not excuse your statement or philosophy in any way. As I've said before, I'm ashamed for you.
Your supposed knowledge of the world is grossly out of line with reality if you believe for one second that the ethnicity or country of origin of a horse's connections has ANY correlation to that horse being doped. | |
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 Vodka for Lunch
Location: Lala Land | Having been to some match races here in TX.... it's appalling what you see at times. | |
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Location: Not Where I Want to Be | kuhlmann - 2016-08-25 1:56 PM SKM - 2016-08-25 12:13 PM I'm not sure how it is racist to refer to someone from Mexico as being Mexican? Just like someone from Canada is Canadian, Australia is Australian, Italy is Italian, America is American, etc. I know a lot of older, small time owners and breeders that have gotten out of racing because of the...people from south of the American boarder...because they are tired of how the industry has changed from that south of the American border influence. Yes, that influence has kept racing alive and the prices up. No one will deny it nor should they complain. But racing has changed with that influence and in many, many cases...it is not a change for the best. I get that there are bad people of every nationality. But it is easier to get ahold of illegal substances from south of the American border so you can't tell me it doesn't impact racing here. That is where Red Bull originated. Most of the illegal substances found in race horses have originated on the match races in the country of Mexico. They then come from that point of origin onto the American tracks. I have tried to be as politically correct as possible with this post as to not offend. But having seen the changes first hand over the last 30+ years, you won't shame me into thinking the opinion I've developed is wrong. Sorry. You said that having a Mexican owner and a Mexican trainer was the only information needed in the death of the horse.
That statement is inappropriate and completely incorrect.
You can attempt to excuse racism however you want to, that doesn't make right or acceptable.
Furthermore, I do not believe that either the owner or trainer is from Mexico. I believe both are Americans. Even if one was from Mexico, it does not excuse your statement or philosophy in any way. As I've said before, I'm ashamed for you.
Your supposed knowledge of the world is grossly out of line with reality if you believe for one second that the ethnicity or country of origin of a horse's connections has ANY correlation to that horse being doped.
SKM is not a racist
she has a Mexican friend.
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  Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | 1DSoon - 2016-08-25 1:57 PM kuhlmann - 2016-08-25 1:56 PM SKM - 2016-08-25 12:13 PM I'm not sure how it is racist to refer to someone from Mexico as being Mexican? Just like someone from Canada is Canadian, Australia is Australian, Italy is Italian, America is American, etc. I know a lot of older, small time owners and breeders that have gotten out of racing because of the...people from south of the American boarder...because they are tired of how the industry has changed from that south of the American border influence. Yes, that influence has kept racing alive and the prices up. No one will deny it nor should they complain. But racing has changed with that influence and in many, many cases...it is not a change for the best. I get that there are bad people of every nationality. But it is easier to get ahold of illegal substances from south of the American border so you can't tell me it doesn't impact racing here. That is where Red Bull originated. Most of the illegal substances found in race horses have originated on the match races in the country of Mexico. They then come from that point of origin onto the American tracks. I have tried to be as politically correct as possible with this post as to not offend. But having seen the changes first hand over the last 30+ years, you won't shame me into thinking the opinion I've developed is wrong. Sorry. You said that having a Mexican owner and a Mexican trainer was the only information needed in the death of the horse.
That statement is inappropriate and completely incorrect.
You can attempt to excuse racism however you want to, that doesn't make right or acceptable.
Furthermore, I do not believe that either the owner or trainer is from Mexico. I believe both are Americans. Even if one was from Mexico, it does not excuse your statement or philosophy in any way. As I've said before, I'm ashamed for you.
Your supposed knowledge of the world is grossly out of line with reality if you believe for one second that the ethnicity or country of origin of a horse's connections has ANY correlation to that horse being doped.
she has a Mexican friend.
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| 1DSoon - 2016-08-25 1:57 PM kuhlmann - 2016-08-25 1:56 PM SKM - 2016-08-25 12:13 PM I'm not sure how it is racist to refer to someone from Mexico as being Mexican? Just like someone from Canada is Canadian, Australia is Australian, Italy is Italian, America is American, etc. I know a lot of older, small time owners and breeders that have gotten out of racing because of the...people from south of the American boarder...because they are tired of how the industry has changed from that south of the American border influence. Yes, that influence has kept racing alive and the prices up. No one will deny it nor should they complain. But racing has changed with that influence and in many, many cases...it is not a change for the best. I get that there are bad people of every nationality. But it is easier to get ahold of illegal substances from south of the American border so you can't tell me it doesn't impact racing here. That is where Red Bull originated. Most of the illegal substances found in race horses have originated on the match races in the country of Mexico. They then come from that point of origin onto the American tracks. I have tried to be as politically correct as possible with this post as to not offend. But having seen the changes first hand over the last 30+ years, you won't shame me into thinking the opinion I've developed is wrong. Sorry. You said that having a Mexican owner and a Mexican trainer was the only information needed in the death of the horse.
That statement is inappropriate and completely incorrect.
You can attempt to excuse racism however you want to, that doesn't make right or acceptable.
Furthermore, I do not believe that either the owner or trainer is from Mexico. I believe both are Americans. Even if one was from Mexico, it does not excuse your statement or philosophy in any way. As I've said before, I'm ashamed for you.
Your supposed knowledge of the world is grossly out of line with reality if you believe for one second that the ethnicity or country of origin of a horse's connections has ANY correlation to that horse being doped.
she has a Mexican friend.
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12842
| kuhlmann - 2016-08-24 8:21 PM
SKM - 2016-08-24 6:50 PM
kuhlmann - 2016-08-24 6:37 AM
total performance - 2016-08-21 4:50 PM
SKM - 2016-08-21 3:50 PM
Barnmom - 2016-08-21 1:01 PM
The Tee Cos passed away, have no idea what happened.
Mexican owners, Mexican trainer... Doesn't take much to figure it out.
Before I get flamed, it's the truth. Last year, the winner collapsed at the end. His connections said he just needed a drink of water. More like they have a cocktail that hasn't been figured out yet so it can't be tested for.
I have to agree with you Stacy. I think they eventually suspend the trainer, nit I m A y be wrong.
There is ZERO reason to bring race into this, ZERO. The fact that you did tells me a ton about you.
Please take a few moments and pull the records on the trainers who have horses in race. Pull the suspension records and you tell me if has to do with race.
This was a tragedy and you lumped an entire race of people together to explain it away when you have ZERO idea what happened. I don't know what happened either but I dang sure am not about to say it has anything to go with the race of his connections. That is ignorant, slanderous, and completely uncalled for.
I'm sorry my statement offends you. But let's be honest. The match races held in Mexico are a different world. It's also a different culture that views horses a lot different than most people from the USA do. Most Mexican owners and trainers DO match race and many of these horses with Mexican connections DO have a lot more races than their records from AQHA approved tracks show due to the match racing being a huge deal in that culture. There are no rules in that world and the needle is always used because it's about winning.
If you read my comment as racist, then that's your take, not my intent. Like I said...a different culture and view of horses. There are no rules in Mexico. Horses are beasts of burden and disposal commodities.
I firmly believe that statements about bad tests or match racing not need have ethnicity brought them. There are many people many races who participate in match racing and many trainers of many ethnicities who get bad tests.
Your intent was to state that because their race it was obvious that the horse had drugs his system. That implies that everyone of that race dopes their horses and I have a huge issue that implication.
Basically, I find your statement subsequent defense of it highly inappropriate and am ashamed for you.
Have to agree with Kuhlman here. The way this was stated it certainly was racist. There are several tracks in E TX where match races are run and a ton in LA. Not every one there is Mexican and not every horse is on drugs. During the QH meet at LA Downs most of the horses in the races are Mexican own/trained. I really don't think they let them run much on drugs there. By the way, the reason that Match racing is ilegal in TX is because of the Parimutual wagering which is illegal | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| SKM - 2016-08-25 12:13 PM I'm not sure how it is racist to refer to someone from Mexico as being Mexican? Just like someone from Canada is Canadian, Australia is Australian, Italy is Italian, America is American, etc. I know a lot of older, small time owners and breeders that have gotten out of racing because of the...people from south of the American boarder...because they are tired of how the industry has changed from that south of the American border influence. Yes, that influence has kept racing alive and the prices up. No one will deny it nor should they complain. But racing has changed with that influence and in many, many cases...it is not a change for the best. I get that there are bad people of every nationality. But it is easier to get ahold of illegal substances from south of the American border so you can't tell me it doesn't impact racing here. That is where Red Bull originated. Most of the illegal substances found in race horses have originated on the match races in the country of Mexico. They then come from that point of origin onto the American tracks. I have tried to be as politically correct as possible with this post as to not offend. But having seen the changes first hand over the last 30+ years, you won't shame me into thinking the opinion I've developed is wrong. Sorry.
Assigning values, morals, behavior to someone because of their race is being racist. | |
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 Veteran
Posts: 211
Location: Vinton, La. | Why not just wait until the real reason this nice colt died is found out before accusations are thrown out?
I've been in the racing industry for a very long time. The drugs are not new to the racing world because of the Mexicans. Drugs have been in racing forever. Social media is just bringing it front and center.
BTW, the owner, trainer, breeder, stallion owners and the farm where Tee Cos stands are devastated. As am I since I know the Louisiana connections to Tee Cos and was looking forward to watching Gamey Tee Cos run in the All American. | |
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 Hog Tie My Mojo
Posts: 4847
Location: Opelousas, LA | Bigtime mistake - 2016-08-25 8:38 PM Why not just wait until the real reason this nice colt died is found out before accusations are thrown out? I've been in the racing industry for a very long time. The drugs are not new to the racing world because of the Mexicans. Drugs have been in racing forever. Social media is just bringing it front and center. BTW, the owner, trainer, breeder, stallion owners and the farm where Tee Cos stands are devastated. As am I since I know the Louisiana connections to Tee Cos and was looking forward to watching Gamey Tee Cos run in the All American.
Yep, and they are some of the best people in the industry. This horse doing well in the All American would have been a huge, well deserved boost to thier farm. I agree that waiting until the authorities find out what killed this horse would be much better than all the rumors and accusations.
As far as the race issue goes, if you have looked at a race program lately you would see that more than half the horses running have hispanic connections. Most of these guys are honest, hardworking people that care deeply about thier horses. I know there are some that cheat and could care less about the well being of thier animals but it's not fair to consider everyone with a hispanic sounding name a cheater. To be honest, there are three trainers on long term suspensions right now, last names Taylor, Smith and Hebert, sounds like white guys to me. | |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | Barnmom - 2016-08-26 9:09 AM Bigtime mistake - 2016-08-25 8:38 PM Why not just wait until the real reason this nice colt died is found out before accusations are thrown out? I've been in the racing industry for a very long time. The drugs are not new to the racing world because of the Mexicans. Drugs have been in racing forever. Social media is just bringing it front and center. BTW, the owner, trainer, breeder, stallion owners and the farm where Tee Cos stands are devastated. As am I since I know the Louisiana connections to Tee Cos and was looking forward to watching Gamey Tee Cos run in the All American. Yep, and they are some of the best people in the industry. This horse doing well in the All American would have been a huge, well deserved boost to thier farm. I agree that waiting until the authorities find out what killed this horse would be much better than all the rumors and accusations.
As far as the race issue goes, if you have looked at a race program lately you would see that more than half the horses running have hispanic connections. Most of these guys are honest, hardworking people that care deeply about thier horses. I know there are some that cheat and could care less about the well being of thier animals but it's not fair to consider everyone with a hispanic sounding name a cheater. To be honest, there are three trainers on long term suspensions right now, last names Taylor, Smith and Hebert, sounds like white guys to me.
Edited by NJJ 2016-08-26 11:20 AM
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 Bulls Eye
Posts: 6443
Location: Oklahoma | kuhlmann - 2016-08-25 12:56 PM
SKM - 2016-08-25 12:13 PM
I'm not sure how it is racist to refer to someone from Mexico as being Mexican? Just like someone from Canada is Canadian, Australia is Australian, Italy is Italian, America is American, etc.
I know a lot of older, small time owners and breeders that have gotten out of racing because of the...people from south of the American boarder...because they are tired of how the industry has changed from that south of the American border influence. Yes, that influence has kept racing alive and the prices up. No one will deny it nor should they complain. But racing has changed with that influence and in many, many cases...it is not a change for the best. I get that there are bad people of every nationality. But it is easier to get ahold of illegal substances from south of the American border so you can't tell me it doesn't impact racing here. That is where Red Bull originated. Most of the illegal substances found in race horses have originated on the match races in the country of Mexico. They then come from that point of origin onto the American tracks.
I have tried to be as politically correct as possible with this post as to not offend. But having seen the changes first hand over the last 30+ years, you won't shame me into thinking the opinion I've developed is wrong. Sorry.
You said that having a Mexican owner and a Mexican trainer was the only information needed in the death of the horse.
That statement is inappropriate and completely incorrect.
You can attempt to excuse racism however you want to, that doesn't make right or acceptable.
Furthermore, I do not believe that either the owner or trainer is from Mexico. I believe both are Americans. Even if one was from Mexico, it does not excuse your statement or philosophy in any way. As I've said before, I'm ashamed for you.
Your supposed knowledge of the world is grossly out of line with reality if you believe for one second that the ethnicity or country of origin of a horse's connections has ANY correlation to that horse being doped.
In no way did I take Stacey's original comment as racist. Facts are facts. Look at the world of match racing south of the border. I think you need to step back and take a breath...
Edited by TwistedK 2016-08-26 3:39 PM
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 Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | Mexican isn't a race, it's a person from Mexico. | |
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 BHW's Lance Armstrong 
Posts: 11134
Location: Somewhere between S@%&# stirrer and Saint | I also was not going to comment on this thread but now I can't contain myself LOL. Horse racing is all about greed and prestige. I have seen all sides of it and have done it all also. However, There is one thing I have not done in horse racing. With that said, why are we always speculating? I learned many things at Ruidoso from famous trainers, to jockeys to vets to gate headers. I love going to Ruidoso to watch the fastest horses run down the track. Let me tell you that everyone at Ruidoso tries to get an edge up on the competition. I have witnessed it all at Ruidoso. I will not name names but you would know them all. With that said I will admit I did get in trouble once myself for clenbuterol at Ruidoso for giving out samples and was banned for 2 years.If you think people won't try to get an edge to win over a million dollars you live in lala land. Many owners think their horses are clean but smart trainers don't tell their owners because their job is to win races.
Several years ago I went to the Heritage sale to buy horses to shut the mouth of a person that claimed their sale horses were clean and never got any help to grow them. I had blood pulled on the horses by a vet. I talked to one of the Mexican grooms that worked for the prep farm that I have known for 20 years and he told me what the program of the farm was. Those horses were on a program that would not pass the test barn. No I will not disclose the farm or the person because I told her I would not ever tell anyone so don't PM me.
Let's enjoy the races at Ruidoso and let the test barn do its job and let the chips fall where they may. Good luck horses and jockeys for a safe race.
OBT I ran my last horse 2 years ago clean in a maiden race and was never even close to being competitive! That was its last race.
Edited by Douglas J Gordon 2016-08-30 4:52 PM
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | The Illegal drug use is not only the race track its in the show ring too. Not only the Mexicans use drugs, I think more white americans are at fault useing drugs on their horses then the Mexicans, just cause their Mexican heritage does not make them all drug users, Heck check out the AQHA suspension list, the Full suspension will make your eyes pop outa of your head seeing all the names. LOL I see names that I know and heard of and I'm like WOW really!!!! | |
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Who Wants to Trade?
Posts: 4692
| Southtxponygirl - 2016-08-30 10:06 AM
The Illegal drug use is not only the race track its in the show ring too. Not only the Mexicans use drugs, I think more white americans are at fault useing drugs on their horses then the Mexicans, just cause their Mexican heritage does not make them all drug users, Heck check out the AQHA suspension list, the Full suspension will make your eyes pop outa of your head seeing all the names. LOL I see names that I know and heard of and I'm like WOW really!!!!
AQHA had to drop their suspensions because they didn't hold up in court. Bad tests are bad tests and they're distributed across a variety of ethnicities. | |
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 Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | kuhlmann - 2016-08-30 10:40 AM Southtxponygirl - 2016-08-30 10:06 AM The Illegal drug use is not only the race track its in the show ring too. Not only the Mexicans use drugs, I think more white americans are at fault useing drugs on their horses then the Mexicans, just cause their Mexican heritage does not make them all drug users, Heck check out the AQHA suspension list, the Full suspension will make your eyes pop outa of your head seeing all the names. LOL I see names that I know and heard of and I'm like WOW really!!!! AQHA had to drop their suspensions because they didn't hold up in court. Bad tests are bad tests and they're distributed across a variety of ethnicities.
How did they force AQHA not to suspend for bad tests? I thought associations could suspend for whatever they wanted? | |
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