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 Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
  
| astreakinchic - 2017-02-09 10:57 AM
stayceem - 2017-02-09 11:42 AM
SaraJean - 2017-02-09 10:26 AM
wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 8:38 AM sounds to me like a horse that is loved and somewhat spoiled by a kid just playing around with it-hear me out here. Then a trainer takes said colt and makes him work and do things that are expected NOW and not when the colt feels like it. I started colts and got several this way. Trust me, a 3 yr old untouched horse will buck less than one that is played with daily, saddled etc from day one, but never MADE to do anything. I bet the colt comes out of it, all the ones I worked with did. I had a colt I raised that I wanted to keep from that colt crop, so I halter broke all the others that were sold first. I rope them to halter break. All this time I could play with my colt, he would follow me anywhere and even pick up feet. He loved me. Until the day it was time to officially halter break him. I roped him and the look on his face was utter shock. I had apparenty broken some truce we had. He got over it in a quick hurry but he had the biggest fit about being tied etc than any of the others that I just worked with like we weren't the "best of friends."Â
THIS!!!!!!! There is such a huge difference in a horse letting you play with them and real true training where they are told what to do & when to do it. It's perfectly normal for a horse that is a bit spoiled & a pet to not take kindly to training. Heck, I've got a couple in my own barn! I've got over 15 years experience starting colts......have a couple very special fillies that I raised, both are a touch on the spoiled side & both threw dang good fits over the start of real training.Â
It sounds like you know the trainer you're using pretty well. Give him some time and see how things go. But jumping to a different trainer after he's only had the horse a week doesn't make sense at all. One thing to consider is that the colt may be stressed from moving to a new barn & being away from his girl. When I was training a lot I gave most of the colts either miracle clay or redmond daily gold to buffer their stomachs for the first week or so.
Now your daughter.....she's 12....there is no way in hell I would allow her to be doing the training on this colt if the trainer feels he's that rank. Yes, he's fine with her walking around on him but all hell could break loose the first time she really kicks him or TELLS him to do something. And reality is she's just a little girl, while she's probably a good rider she doesn't have the years of experience it takes to know what to do when problems arise. It's not worth the risk, if something happens it could ruin her love of horses or much worse. Regardless of what she wants, you are the parent & it's your decision what happens with this horse.
I do agree this could be the case but I am a firm believer in bonding with horses and if he has bonded with her and then thrown into something else where there isn't that bond, it could be a fight or flight type of mentality. Not to say, he shouldn't learn to respect everyone because he should but I think it will be interesting to see how the next couple weeks go.
I tend to fiddle with my colts a lot, granted they still have discipline but I have found it usually make them easier to break but again, I have been the one to do it so maybe that is where the disconnect is here. No saying your daughter should be the one breaking him but maybe that's why I have had more positive experiences than others. When you take a colt with a blank slate, barely handled, they learn respect right away without any other expectations. Sounds like he has learned to bond with your daughter and expects bond and trust with his handler which he doesn't have yet with the new trainer.
I have a 2 year old, coming 3 I plan to get on this spring. She has been the easiest horse to teach anything to. I hope that continues 
If you do not believe this go watch BUCK on netflix he addresses this spoiled issue.
I will check it out.
But my horses are "spoiled" yet have discipline. My colt lunges, saddles, ponies, etc really well and I would already be on her if I had an indoor. My reply was based on my experience. I think there are 1,000,000 ways to train a colt. I have seen some I agree with and some I don't. each person has their own style so that's where I say maybe the style doesn't mesh well with this colt. Or because he has learned more from bonding with his 12 year old and his expectations are different. I am trying to be open minded to help the OP.
As someone who has gotten a few untouched 4 year olds, I don't enjoy that... when you spend the majority of the time fighting over picking feet up, tying, etc. I would rather they be exposed to that stuff early on. | |
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 Warrior Mom
Posts: 4400
| I'm not going to remove the colt from the trainer unless he tells me he can't do anything with him... he's not one to waste his time or my money... he's brutally honest and I appreciate that about him. In the meantime, I think it will do wonders for my daughter to go over and watch him and learn from him... he won't let her on him till he knows for certain he's done throwing tantrums. He's got several nice finished good horses she can ride and work on her horsemanship skills, instead of worrying if the horse is going to pitch... all of these replies make sense, I didn't think he'd be difficult BECAUSE he was so gentle and loving, but it totally makes sense that THAT is the reason he's being a giant turd! | |
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  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
 
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | stayceem - 2017-02-09 10:24 AM astreakinchic - 2017-02-09 10:57 AM stayceem - 2017-02-09 11:42 AM SaraJean - 2017-02-09 10:26 AM wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 8:38 AM sounds to me like a horse that is loved and somewhat spoiled by a kid just playing around with it-hear me out here. Then a trainer takes said colt and makes him work and do things that are expected NOW and not when the colt feels like it. I started colts and got several this way. Trust me, a 3 yr old untouched horse will buck less than one that is played with daily, saddled etc from day one, but never MADE to do anything. I bet the colt comes out of it, all the ones I worked with did. I had a colt I raised that I wanted to keep from that colt crop, so I halter broke all the others that were sold first. I rope them to halter break. All this time I could play with my colt, he would follow me anywhere and even pick up feet. He loved me. Until the day it was time to officially halter break him. I roped him and the look on his face was utter shock. I had apparenty broken some truce we had. He got over it in a quick hurry but he had the biggest fit about being tied etc than any of the others that I just worked with like we weren't the "best of friends." THIS!!!!!!! There is such a huge difference in a horse letting you play with them and real true training where they are told what to do & when to do it. It's perfectly normal for a horse that is a bit spoiled & a pet to not take kindly to training. Heck, I've got a couple in my own barn! I've got over 15 years experience starting colts......have a couple very special fillies that I raised, both are a touch on the spoiled side & both threw dang good fits over the start of real training.
It sounds like you know the trainer you're using pretty well. Give him some time and see how things go. But jumping to a different trainer after he's only had the horse a week doesn't make sense at all. One thing to consider is that the colt may be stressed from moving to a new barn & being away from his girl. When I was training a lot I gave most of the colts either miracle clay or redmond daily gold to buffer their stomachs for the first week or so.
Now your daughter.....she's 12....there is no way in hell I would allow her to be doing the training on this colt if the trainer feels he's that rank. Yes, he's fine with her walking around on him but all hell could break loose the first time she really kicks him or TELLS him to do something. And reality is she's just a little girl, while she's probably a good rider she doesn't have the years of experience it takes to know what to do when problems arise. It's not worth the risk, if something happens it could ruin her love of horses or much worse. Regardless of what she wants, you are the parent & it's your decision what happens with this horse. I do agree this could be the case but I am a firm believer in bonding with horses and if he has bonded with her and then thrown into something else where there isn't that bond, it could be a fight or flight type of mentality. Not to say, he shouldn't learn to respect everyone because he should but I think it will be interesting to see how the next couple weeks go. I tend to fiddle with my colts a lot, granted they still have discipline but I have found it usually make them easier to break but again, I have been the one to do it so maybe that is where the disconnect is here. No saying your daughter should be the one breaking him but maybe that's why I have had more positive experiences than others. When you take a colt with a blank slate, barely handled, they learn respect right away without any other expectations. Sounds like he has learned to bond with your daughter and expects bond and trust with his handler which he doesn't have yet with the new trainer. I have a 2 year old, coming 3 I plan to get on this spring. She has been the easiest horse to teach anything to. I hope that continues If you do not believe this go watch BUCK on netflix he addresses this spoiled issue. I will check it out. But my horses are "spoiled" yet have discipline. My colt lunges, saddles, ponies, etc really well and I would already be on her if I had an indoor. My reply was based on my experience. I think there are 1,000,000 ways to train a colt. I have seen some I agree with and some I don't. each person has their own style so that's where I say maybe the style doesn't mesh well with this colt. Or because he has learned more from bonding with his 12 year old and his expectations are different. I am trying to be open minded to help the OP. As someone who has gotten a few untouched 4 year olds, I don't enjoy that... when you spend the majority of the time fighting over picking feet up, tying, etc. I would rather they be exposed to that stuff early on.
I have mentioned it on here before that I want 100% given to me in work ethic. A spoiled horse will generally give about 25%. There is a fine line between spoiled and just a great loving relationship. I'm sure we have all had a touch of both. I started my first home raised baby when I was 15. Let me tell you about spoiled! He was so loved he couldn't do anything wrong in my mind. He is 24 now and still just as loved/spoiled, but he is the last horse I ever trained that I let act the way he does and get away with it. I am guilty of giving one a handful of grass and seeing the others eyeing me. In my mind they are conspiring about the unfairness and because I don't want to hit dirt later, I give them all a handful too lol.
Edited by wyoming barrel racer 2017-02-09 11:52 AM
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | want2chase3 - 2017-02-09 10:30 AM I'm not going to remove the colt from the trainer unless he tells me he can't do anything with him... he's not one to waste his time or my money... he's brutally honest and I appreciate that about him. In the meantime, I think it will do wonders for my daughter to go over and watch him and learn from him... he won't let her on him till he knows for certain he's done throwing tantrums. He's got several nice finished good horses she can ride and work on her horsemanship skills, instead of worrying if the horse is going to pitch... all of these replies make sense, I didn't think he'd be difficult BECAUSE he was so gentle and loving, but it totally makes sense that THAT is the reason he's being a giant turd!
What are his tantrums? Does he buck every time he is saddled? Or every time he is ridden? At the beginning of the lesson or rides nice and then throws a fit later in a ride? Most spoiled ones through their fits early on, and once they figure out it does them no good they are wonderful the rest of the lesson. IMO outlaws are the ones that cheat you later on. Once you have settled in for the ride, they look for an opportunity to pile it to you. Those are hard to get out of it, and these days I won't waste my time on one. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | Many people have already said it but I am going to say it in a different way. Some of the horses that have the worst tempers are the gentlest. Frequently they are so easygoing, especially on the ground, that no one thinks to ask them to do anything much. This is particularly true of young horses. So when they are pushed a bit they explode. It surprises a lot of people. Usually if you can get through the explosion, and you need a pretty salty trainer expecting that sort of thing, they will line on out. But gentle horses frequently have tempers. We handle our foals a bunch so they can do the basics like be caught, tied up, load in a trailer, give them a bath, and blanket them, but they spend a whole bunch of time just in the pasture out with other horses not being overly messed with for that reason. In fact, I have one right now that is 'too gentle.' She's a sweet mare, loves people but doesn't have much respect for space. So we are working on going out to the pasture and chasing her away from us quite a bit. She only gets to come to us when invited. I have increased her respect for space and people quite a bit in the last couple weeks but I had to do it by wacking her pretty good on the butt and shoulder with a sorting stick. I've been doing the same thing with my hands and a bucket at feeding time. She will still come up to you for scratches but only when you have held your hand out to her and approached slowly at a certain distance. This is a healthy attitude to have in a horse because they are easy to correct. I want a horse with some respect. They get desensitized by being exposed to the right stimuli in the right environment. If you have have them overly desensitized young, when they are suddenly exposed to new much new they don't know how to handle all of it at once. A bit of appropriate level fear/respect in them actually helps them learn faster. I like having my hands on them too much early to let them completely alone until they are yearlings or two year olds. All of ours are pretty easy to handle but most of them aren't monsters at the trainer because we still instill respect. I have actually gotten to where I don't always trust one that is really gentle young. I work hard in those to support their love of people with scratches and some attention but we also make them work and do things they don't want to do and instill respect so their lives are a little easier down the road. | |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| oija - 2017-02-09 12:55 PM
Many people have already said it but I am going to say it in a different way. Some of the horses that have the worst tempers are the gentlest. Frequently they are so easygoing, especially on the ground, that no one thinks to ask them to do anything much. This is particularly true of young horses. So when they are pushed a bit they explode. It surprises a lot of people. Usually if you can get through the explosion, and you need a pretty salty trainer expecting that sort of thing, they will line on out. But gentle horses frequently have tempers. We handle our foals a bunch so they can do the basics like be caught, tied up, load in a trailer, give them a bath, and blanket them, but they spend a whole bunch of time just in the pasture out with other horses not being overly messed with for that reason. In fact, I have one right now that is 'too gentle.' She's a sweet mare, loves people but doesn't have much respect for space. So we are working on going out to the pasture and chasing her away from us quite a bit. She only gets to come to us when invited. I have increased her respect for space and people quite a bit in the last couple weeks but I had to do it by wacking her pretty good on the butt and shoulder with a sorting stick. I've been doing the same thing with my hands and a bucket at feeding time. She will still come up to you for scratches but only when you have held your hand out to her and approached slowly at a certain distance. This is a healthy attitude to have in a horse because they are easy to correct. I want a horse with some respect. They get desensitized by being exposed to the right stimuli in the right environment. If you have have them overly desensitized young, when they are suddenly exposed to new much new they don't know how to handle all of it at once. A bit of appropriate level fear/respect in them actually helps them learn faster. I like having my hands on them too much early to let them completely alone until they are yearlings or two year olds. All of ours are pretty easy to handle but most of them aren't monsters at the trainer because we still instill respect. I have actually gotten to where I don't always trust one that is really gentle young. I work hard in those to support their love of people with scratches and some attention but we also make them work and do things they don't want to do and instill respect so their lives are a little easier down the road.
Very nicely put! | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 912
Location: Alabama | LMS - 2017-02-09 11:02 AM
hmm here's the old school chiming in......I broke and trained my first 3 yr old when I was 12-took him to college with me AND he was an orphan I hand raised-turned out to be a bada$$ too......AND I still don't mind riding colts-taught me a lot-mostly that I really don't trust what too many other people do with their horses. Maybe now is the time for your "kid" to become a horsewoman!  With some gentle guidance and probably some trips with trusted friends (of yours ) that will help her learn. Â
This. I would bring the colt home. Strap a helmet on the kid. Show her some training vids, and let them figure it out. If it goes south ditch the colt. They just might surprise you and the trainer.
I did pretty much the same. Raised a colt up from 6 months old. Broke and trained him myself. I did the whole bare back in a halter stuff too. Saddled and rode off the first time when he was 21 months old. He is now a nice older teenager in Mo loving life and taking great care of a nice lady and her kids. One time I put a man on him with a "you're going to do what I say" mentality. ( My grandpa needed a few more points to win a year end saddle.) SMH Let's just say it did not go well. I however could ride that gelding to hell and back without so much as a single balk. | |
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Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 11:47 AM
stayceem - 2017-02-09 10:24 AM astreakinchic - 2017-02-09 10:57 AM stayceem - 2017-02-09 11:42 AM SaraJean - 2017-02-09 10:26 AM wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 8:38 AM sounds to me like a horse that is loved and somewhat spoiled by a kid just playing around with it-hear me out here. Then a trainer takes said colt and makes him work and do things that are expected NOW and not when the colt feels like it. I started colts and got several this way. Trust me, a 3 yr old untouched horse will buck less than one that is played with daily, saddled etc from day one, but never MADE to do anything. I bet the colt comes out of it, all the ones I worked with did. I had a colt I raised that I wanted to keep from that colt crop, so I halter broke all the others that were sold first. I rope them to halter break. All this time I could play with my colt, he would follow me anywhere and even pick up feet. He loved me. Until the day it was time to officially halter break him. I roped him and the look on his face was utter shock. I had apparenty broken some truce we had. He got over it in a quick hurry but he had the biggest fit about being tied etc than any of the others that I just worked with like we weren't the "best of friends."Â THIS!!!!!!! There is such a huge difference in a horse letting you play with them and real true training where they are told what to do & when to do it. It's perfectly normal for a horse that is a bit spoiled & a pet to not take kindly to training. Heck, I've got a couple in my own barn! I've got over 15 years experience starting colts......have a couple very special fillies that I raised, both are a touch on the spoiled side & both threw dang good fits over the start of real training.Â
It sounds like you know the trainer you're using pretty well. Give him some time and see how things go. But jumping to a different trainer after he's only had the horse a week doesn't make sense at all. One thing to consider is that the colt may be stressed from moving to a new barn & being away from his girl. When I was training a lot I gave most of the colts either miracle clay or redmond daily gold to buffer their stomachs for the first week or so.
Now your daughter.....she's 12....there is no way in hell I would allow her to be doing the training on this colt if the trainer feels he's that rank. Yes, he's fine with her walking around on him but all hell could break loose the first time she really kicks him or TELLS him to do something. And reality is she's just a little girl, while she's probably a good rider she doesn't have the years of experience it takes to know what to do when problems arise. It's not worth the risk, if something happens it could ruin her love of horses or much worse. Regardless of what she wants, you are the parent & it's your decision what happens with this horse. I do agree this could be the case but I am a firm believer in bonding with horses and if he has bonded with her and then thrown into something else where there isn't that bond, it could be a fight or flight type of mentality. Not to say, he shouldn't learn to respect everyone because he should but I think it will be interesting to see how the next couple weeks go. I tend to fiddle with my colts a lot, granted they still have discipline but I have found it usually make them easier to break but again, I have been the one to do it so maybe that is where the disconnect is here. No saying your daughter should be the one breaking him but maybe that's why I have had more positive experiences than others. When you take a colt with a blank slate, barely handled, they learn respect right away without any other expectations. Sounds like he has learned to bond with your daughter and expects bond and trust with his handler which he doesn't have yet with the new trainer. I have a 2 year old, coming 3 I plan to get on this spring. She has been the easiest horse to teach anything to. I hope that continues If you do not believe this go watch BUCK on netflix he addresses this spoiled issue. I will check it out. But my horses are "spoiled" yet have discipline. My colt lunges, saddles, ponies, etc really well and I would already be on her if I had an indoor. My reply was based on my experience. I think there are 1,000,000 ways to train a colt. I have seen some I agree with and some I don't. each person has their own style so that's where I say maybe the style doesn't mesh well with this colt. Or because he has learned more from bonding with his 12 year old and his expectations are different. I am trying to be open minded to help the OP. As someone who has gotten a few untouched 4 year olds, I don't enjoy that... when you spend the majority of the time fighting over picking feet up, tying, etc. I would rather they be exposed to that stuff early on.
I have mentioned it on here before that I want 100% given to me in work ethic. A spoiled horse will generally give about 25%. There is a fine line between spoiled and just a great loving relationship. I'm sure we have all had a touch of both. I started my first home raised baby when I was 15. Let me tell you about spoiled! He was so loved he couldn't do anything wrong in my mind. He is 24 now and still just as loved/spoiled, but he is the last horse I ever trained that I let act the way he does and get away with it. I am guilty of giving one a handful of grass and seeing the others eyeing me. In my mind they are conspiring about the unfairness and because I don't want to hit dirt later, I give them all a handful too lol.
Ya know, this is a good point. The 2 4 year olds I have fought with the most are ones I have purchased at 4 supposedly with the basics done but when asked to do these things they were just DINKS and I automatically assumed they had not been handled as they said. Both later I suspected they ruled the roast with their past owners and never really thought about it until now.
And I guess maybe my definition of spoiled isn't the same as many of yours. Because the ones I have had from the start were my kind of spoiled and broke out easily. Its the ones I don't know all their history that were the toughest. But my horses when I say spoiled, they are brought in and brushed, pick their feet out, blanketed, manes braided, etc. Just messing with them. So they are friendly in the pasture but they are respectful still.
Maybe mine are spoiled but not brats  | |
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Warrior Mom
Posts: 4400
| wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 11:50 AM
want2chase3 - 2017-02-09 10:30 AM I'm not going to remove the colt from the trainer unless he tells me he can't do anything with him... he's not one to waste his time or my money... he's brutally honest and I appreciate that about him. In the meantime, I think it will do wonders for my daughter to go over and watch him and learn from him... he won't let her on him till he knows for certain he's done throwing tantrums. He's got several nice finished good horses she can ride and work on her horsemanship skills, instead of worrying if the horse is going to pitch... all of these replies make sense, I didn't think he'd be difficult BECAUSE he was so gentle and loving, but it totally makes sense that THAT is the reason he's being a giant turd!
What are his tantrums? Does he buck every time he is saddled? Or every time he is ridden? At the beginning of the lesson or rides nice and then throws a fit later in a ride? Most spoiled ones through their fits early on, and once they figure out it does them no good they are wonderful the rest of the lesson. IMO outlaws are the ones that cheat you later on. Once you have settled in for the ride, they look for an opportunity to pile it to you. Those are hard to get out of it, and these days I won't waste my time on one.Â
From what he told me, he worked him on the ground first in the round pen, saddled him, ground drove him some, my daughter did that a lot with him, so he was going great, he went to step on him and he just exploded... he stayed with him and rode it out and he mellowed out a little but when it was time to move forward and stay on the rail instead of just wandering wherever he chose, he exploded again... he stayed with him and rode thru it... it seems like whenever he puts a little pressure on him to do things a certain way he gets to throwing bucking fits... good thing is he didn't buck him off so he's basically learning he can't get his rider off by bucking... he's never had a rider try to mount from the ground, my daughter would push him over to the fence and just plop on his back... so who knows if that what set him off first... | |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | Exactly lol, even my spoiled old guy is safe, but he likes to pin his ears for no reason. Scares everyone else, but I just tell him to knock it off and he quits. He's one of those with a BIG personality though. I love him and his nasty ears with all my heart.
I mean spoiled as in nippy, run you over if they want out a gate you are opening, kick at you. No respect for your personal space because in their mind they are the boss and you are their minion. Scared and wild horses are usually easier to bring around than one that has been mauled by humans and allowed to do the same back. | |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | want2chase3 - 2017-02-09 11:44 AM wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 11:50 AM want2chase3 - 2017-02-09 10:30 AM I'm not going to remove the colt from the trainer unless he tells me he can't do anything with him... he's not one to waste his time or my money... he's brutally honest and I appreciate that about him. In the meantime, I think it will do wonders for my daughter to go over and watch him and learn from him... he won't let her on him till he knows for certain he's done throwing tantrums. He's got several nice finished good horses she can ride and work on her horsemanship skills, instead of worrying if the horse is going to pitch... all of these replies make sense, I didn't think he'd be difficult BECAUSE he was so gentle and loving, but it totally makes sense that THAT is the reason he's being a giant turd! What are his tantrums? Does he buck every time he is saddled? Or every time he is ridden? At the beginning of the lesson or rides nice and then throws a fit later in a ride? Most spoiled ones through their fits early on, and once they figure out it does them no good they are wonderful the rest of the lesson. IMO outlaws are the ones that cheat you later on. Once you have settled in for the ride, they look for an opportunity to pile it to you. Those are hard to get out of it, and these days I won't waste my time on one. From what he told me, he worked him on the ground first in the round pen, saddled him, ground drove him some, my daughter did that a lot with him, so he was going great, he went to step on him and he just exploded... he stayed with him and rode it out and he mellowed out a little but when it was time to move forward and stay on the rail instead of just wandering wherever he chose, he exploded again... he stayed with him and rode thru it... it seems like whenever he puts a little pressure on him to do things a certain way he gets to throwing bucking fits... good thing is he didn't buck him off so he's basically learning he can't get his rider off by bucking... he's never had a rider try to mount from the ground, my daughter would push him over to the fence and just plop on his back... so who knows if that what set him off first...
That makes a lot of sense actually, the horse is learning to do things that weren't his idea. Best part, like you said, is he isn't getting the rider off. I wouldn't give up on the horse/trainer combo just yet. Does he ride daily? Daily wet saddle pads and a tired horse will do wonders for that attitude. When I had one like this, I tried to quit being a friend because the horse didn't deserve it. Just worked on respect and showing them they have a job to do like it or not. Then once they are trustworthy and settle in, they start getting treated like the partner they are. | |
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Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 12:46 PM
Exactly lol, even my spoiled old guy is safe, but he likes to pin his ears for no reason. Scares everyone else, but I just tell him to knock it off and he quits. He's one of those with a BIG personality though. I love him and his nasty ears with all my heart.
I mean spoiled as in nippy, run you over if they want out a gate you are opening, kick at you. No respect for your personal space because in their mind they are the boss and you are their minion. Scared and wild horses are usually easier to bring around than one that has been mauled by humans and allowed to do the same back.Â
Totally understand now. I have never allowed "bratty" behavior so when I got some of these with that behavior, I just assumed they weren't handled when in actuality they were handled but in the wrong way. Just never thought about it beyond "crap this thing is an a...hole."
My coming 3 year old can get nosey, not nippy but nosey and she gets put in her place. Anyone else have just a starving 2/3 year old? LOL I cannot feed that thing enough!!!!! She scarfes her food down to go and try and eat the others food, rarely leaves the roundbale. I feel like I am raising a teenage boy (sorry I went a little OT HAHA) Just to add, she is not missing any meals but I do think she is growing. | |
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 A Barrel Of Monkeys
Posts: 12972
Location: Texas | In the past, I didn't do much with my babies. I halter broke them and left them alone. Fast forward, I moved to a smaller place and kept one mare, who foaled here. The neighbor kids played with that baby all the time. She was rotten.
When I sent her to the trainer, he called me and told me she was a bronc, but asked me to give it a couple of weeks to see if she lined out. Thank goodness, she did. She was just spoiled and used to running the show. | |
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| I agree with the above. I bought a 5 year old last April that was very patterned but did not know how to lope a circle, flex, etc. No foundation work was done at all. He has a huge personality, in your pocket, sweet, sweet, sweet so I bought him despite his lack of training. I immediately sent him to my trainer for a few months to get the necessary work done on him and boy did he get ****y! He loves running barrels so he is a happy camper there but ask him to flex or do a drill that makes him collect and use himself and he would pin his ears and go backwards, he had never been asked to really work at anything and he did not like it one bit. He came home with a different attitude and all the foundation work done but still my fun loving goof ball. I would not give up on the colt, with the trainers guidance what a great opportunity to learn.
My three girls all high school rodeoed, bought the 13 year old a horse that although when trying him they seemed to click but it went downhill quick. He was gougeous and flawless at home but high strung when you entered. We had the conversation that if she wanted to compete she's going to have to sell him and we would keep looking. My 14-year-old who had never been on him, said she wanted to try him and she would trade horses if she liked him. She was sitting at the top in her division and I told her she could do that but that meant she wouldn't be able to compete hard because the horse wasn't mentally ready for the arena, she said she didn't care she wanted to get on him. She made a flawless run at home, turned that third barrel and she had a smile from ear to ear and I knew it was a done deal. I emphasized again that she was giving up winning and she said she didn't care she was willing to wait on him. They switched horses, the 13 year old started winning again while the 14 year old took it slow and easy. She learned so much from working with that horse and I was proud of her that for her it wasn't just about winning. Sounds like your daughter might feel the same way. | |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | stayceem - 2017-02-09 11:58 AM wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 12:46 PM Exactly lol, even my spoiled old guy is safe, but he likes to pin his ears for no reason. Scares everyone else, but I just tell him to knock it off and he quits. He's one of those with a BIG personality though. I love him and his nasty ears with all my heart.
I mean spoiled as in nippy, run you over if they want out a gate you are opening, kick at you. No respect for your personal space because in their mind they are the boss and you are their minion. Scared and wild horses are usually easier to bring around than one that has been mauled by humans and allowed to do the same back. Totally understand now. I have never allowed "bratty" behavior so when I got some of these with that behavior, I just assumed they weren't handled when in actuality they were handled but in the wrong way. Just never thought about it beyond "crap this thing is an a...hole." My coming 3 year old can get nosey, not nippy but nosey and she gets put in her place. Anyone else have just a starving 2/3 year old? LOL I cannot feed that thing enough!!!!! She scarfes her food down to go and try and eat the others food, rarely leaves the roundbale. I feel like I am raising a teenage boy (sorry I went a little OT HAHA ) Just to add, she is not missing any meals but I do think she is growing.
YES!!!! My show horse. He also smacks me at least once a week with his huge head. personal space is a real issue with him and he is probably 1300-1400 lbs and 16.3 and 3/4's lol. He gets popped on the cheek every time he smacks me and I have no idea how he does it! I'm barely over 5' tall. He's all up there and I'm all down here. I am not a treat giver but he gets some occasionally. I blame that on him always in my bubble. But like you said, this horse can eat and eat and eat. Then when I let him out of his stall in the morning, he goes around to every other feeder to see if he can scavange something. Then stares at me like he is cheated out of a snack. He has hay in front of him at all times. At the shows I feed at least twice as much as everyone I know. I would think he has worms but he is on a great deworming schedule and very healthy. | |
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Warrior Mom
Posts: 4400
| wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 12:50 PM
want2chase3 - 2017-02-09 11:44 AM wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 11:50 AM want2chase3 - 2017-02-09 10:30 AM I'm not going to remove the colt from the trainer unless he tells me he can't do anything with him... he's not one to waste his time or my money... he's brutally honest and I appreciate that about him. In the meantime, I think it will do wonders for my daughter to go over and watch him and learn from him... he won't let her on him till he knows for certain he's done throwing tantrums. He's got several nice finished good horses she can ride and work on her horsemanship skills, instead of worrying if the horse is going to pitch... all of these replies make sense, I didn't think he'd be difficult BECAUSE he was so gentle and loving, but it totally makes sense that THAT is the reason he's being a giant turd! What are his tantrums? Does he buck every time he is saddled? Or every time he is ridden? At the beginning of the lesson or rides nice and then throws a fit later in a ride? Most spoiled ones through their fits early on, and once they figure out it does them no good they are wonderful the rest of the lesson. IMO outlaws are the ones that cheat you later on. Once you have settled in for the ride, they look for an opportunity to pile it to you. Those are hard to get out of it, and these days I won't waste my time on one. From what he told me, he worked him on the ground first in the round pen, saddled him, ground drove him some, my daughter did that a lot with him, so he was going great, he went to step on him and he just exploded... he stayed with him and rode it out and he mellowed out a little but when it was time to move forward and stay on the rail instead of just wandering wherever he chose, he exploded again... he stayed with him and rode thru it... it seems like whenever he puts a little pressure on him to do things a certain way he gets to throwing bucking fits... good thing is he didn't buck him off so he's basically learning he can't get his rider off by bucking... he's never had a rider try to mount from the ground, my daughter would push him over to the fence and just plop on his back... so who knows if that what set him off first...
Oh yes, he will be ridden daily definitely. Lots and lots of riding, exposure to all kinds of stuff, he's trains everything from drafts to show jumpers, to roping and barrel horses, even seen some gaited horses out there. He always says the scariest part of his pen is where he keeps his roping steers penned up lol. | |
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 Keeper of the King Snake
Posts: 7622
Location: Dubach, LA | Â Go get your horse. Today. | |
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Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 1:18 PM
stayceem - 2017-02-09 11:58 AM wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-09 12:46 PM Exactly lol, even my spoiled old guy is safe, but he likes to pin his ears for no reason. Scares everyone else, but I just tell him to knock it off and he quits. He's one of those with a BIG personality though. I love him and his nasty ears with all my heart.
I mean spoiled as in nippy, run you over if they want out a gate you are opening, kick at you. No respect for your personal space because in their mind they are the boss and you are their minion. Scared and wild horses are usually easier to bring around than one that has been mauled by humans and allowed to do the same back. Totally understand now. I have never allowed "bratty" behavior so when I got some of these with that behavior, I just assumed they weren't handled when in actuality they were handled but in the wrong way. Just never thought about it beyond "crap this thing is an a...hole." My coming 3 year old can get nosey, not nippy but nosey and she gets put in her place. Anyone else have just a starving 2/3 year old? LOL I cannot feed that thing enough!!!!! She scarfes her food down to go and try and eat the others food, rarely leaves the roundbale. I feel like I am raising a teenage boy (sorry I went a little OT HAHA ) Just to add, she is not missing any meals but I do think she is growing.
Glad I am not the only one then!!!
My filly was wormy when I got her, came off the ranch and had little contact. She wasn't really a hungry beast then but she also was still pretty unsure about humans altogether. But yes, I get the puppy dog look every time I go out there. | |
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Warrior Mom
Posts: 4400
| CanCan - 2017-02-09 1:21 PM
 Go get your horse. Today.
Curious as to why you think I should go get him? | |
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Warrior Mom
Posts: 4400
| rodeomom3 - 2017-02-09 1:14 PM
 I agree with the above.  I bought a 5 year old last April that was very patterned but did not know how to lope a circle, flex, etc. No foundation work was done at all.  He has a huge personality, in your pocket, sweet, sweet, sweet so I bought him despite his lack of training.  I immediately sent him to my trainer for a few months to get the necessary work done on him and boy did he get ****y!  He loves running barrels so he is a happy camper there but ask him to flex or do a drill that makes him collect and use himself and he would pin his ears and go backwards, he had never been asked to really work at anything and he did not like it one bit.  He came home with a different attitude and all the foundation work done but still my fun loving goof ball.  I would not give up on the colt, with the trainers guidance what a great opportunity to learn.
 My three girls all high school rodeoed, bought the 13 year old a horse that although when trying him they seemed to click but it went downhill quick.  He was gougeous and flawless at home but high strung when you entered.  We had the conversation that if she wanted to compete she's going to have to sell him  and we would keep  looking.   My 14-year-old who had never been on him, said she wanted to try him and she would trade horses if she liked him.  She was sitting at the top in her division  and I told her she could do that but that meant she wouldn't be able to compete hard because the horse wasn't mentally ready for the arena, she said she didn't care she wanted to get on him.   She made a flawless run at home,  turned that third barrel and she had a smile from ear to ear and I knew it was a done deal.   I emphasized again that she was giving up winning and she said she didn't care she was willing to wait on him.  They switched horses, the 13 year old started winning again while the 14 year old took it slow and easy.  She learned so much from working with that horse and I was proud of her that for her it wasn't just about winning.  Sounds like your daughter might feel the same way.Â
Wow and there was no jealousy between your daughters? My goodness that's impressive! I've got a 16 yr old step daughter who doesn't technically have a horse right now, she doesn't live with us full time... but if I even suggested to my daughter to let her "sister" ride him instead because she's got way more experience and time in the saddle, I'd be in the middle of a $hit storm! I'm short a horse though.. | |
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