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"Heck's Coming With Me"
Posts: 10793
   
Location: Kansas | Anybody who thinks there's anything good about being a Muslim woman, I dare you to watch the movie Desert Flower, the true story of Waris Dirie, a Somalian woman. It will horrify you and put a whole new light on what young Muslim women can be subjected to. I didn't know about FGM but now I do now and it defies comprehension.
Edited by Frodo 2017-11-16 8:28 AM
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Nut Case Expert
Posts: 9305
Location: Tulsa, Ok | I obviously do not understand and could never comprehend the muslim religion/culture. With that being said there are plenty of christian doctrines I don't get and don't want to get. Plenty of them still believe in love, honor and OBEY. Lots and lots of christian women and even agnostic women are subjugated to their hustands. First dude that tries to tell me what to do is history!!
As far as Barbie is concerned who cares what she wears whether it is a robe and scarf or a sombrero or a bikini. |
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  Fact Checker
Posts: 16572
Location: Displaced Iowegian | SC Wrangler - 2017-11-16 10:30 AM I obviously do not understand and could never comprehend the muslim religion/culture. With that being said there are plenty of christian doctrines I don't get and don't want to get. Plenty of them still believe in love, honor and OBEY. Lots and lots of christian women and even agnostic women are subjugated to their hustands. First dude that tries to tell me what to do is history!!
As far as Barbie is concerned who cares what she wears whether it is a robe and scarf or a sombrero or a bikini.
WHO cares? Those who will take EVERY opportunity to try to stir up more divisiveness in this country...... Those who will take EVERY opportunity to hate on the Muslims ...... Those who will take EVERY opportunity to try to prove that this country should NOT be inclusive of other races, religions or person's rights. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| I don't care if they are making barbie with a hijab. I won't buy one for my grandkids and if I was a parent of young girls, I wouldn't buy one, either. I don't care if people buy them or don't. They do what they think is right and I will do what I think is right. I know I have friends that will probably buy one and we will still be friends because it is not my business what they buy their kids/grandkids.
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 Miss Laundry Misshap
Posts: 5271
| NJJ - 2017-11-16 10:43 AM SC Wrangler - 2017-11-16 10:30 AM I obviously do not understand and could never comprehend the muslim religion/culture. With that being said there are plenty of christian doctrines I don't get and don't want to get. Plenty of them still believe in love, honor and OBEY. Lots and lots of christian women and even agnostic women are subjugated to their hustands. First dude that tries to tell me what to do is history!!
As far as Barbie is concerned who cares what she wears whether it is a robe and scarf or a sombrero or a bikini. WHO cares? Those who will take EVERY opportunity to try to stir up more divisiveness in this country...... Those who will take EVERY opportunity to hate on the Muslims ...... Those who will take EVERY opportunity to try to prove that this country should NOT be inclusive of other races, religions or person's rights.
Anyone taking bets on if the kids automatically take off all the clothes and cut the hair on the doll anyways?
I think that's what was meant by who cares. I certainly don't care. If someone is offended by a doll (which I'd say Frodo certainly is) then we've missed the point of free America anyways. People can do what they want here. If a women subjects herself to following a religion that allows that sort of thing, well, it's none of our business. There are those who've broken free. It takes heart, guts, and willpower. That's what America was made on to begin with. If you don't take steps to free yourself from your own torture, you've locked yourself up.
And don't go on about Muslims in other countries being tortured and mutilated. They aren't here in Free America. I get some can't help themselves, but again, not America's concern. We've got our own problems to face. |
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 Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| 1DSoon - 2017-11-16 6:38 AM
stayceem - 2017-11-15 9:07 PM 1DSoon - 2017-11-15 4:55 PM stayceem - 2017-11-15 4:45 PM Whiteboy - 2017-11-15 3:35 PM Silly Filly - 2017-11-15 3:27 PM Frodo - 2017-11-15 2:03 PM Whiteboy - 2017-11-15 2:32 PM Frodo - 2017-11-15 2:24 PM One miserably hot day last July I was at Texas Roadhouse and watched a Muslim woman dressed in a long dark robe of some sort with a brocade scarf around her head, neck and shoulders getting out of the car. Her husband was dressed in a tank top, shorts and sandals as were the kids. Convince me she was comfortable or that any of us born in the U.S would put up with this. It wasn't her choice. It was her husbands that she dressed like a monk on a 105 degree day. Somewhere under all that garb may have been a lovely figure.
So you think she is forced, against her will, into this religion? I'm really confused as to the point you are trying to make with this tread. Some people are into some real kinky stuff. Who am I to judge. Whiteboy - I need to meet you in real life!!!! Your knowledge blows me away and your sense of humor kills me!!! I don't think abuse is funny Have you ever spoken to a Muslim female? I haven't to a ton but have a few and they do it because it's what they believe in. It's similar to some not have sex before marriage or praying every night before bed. It's a part of their belief system and culture. My sister does hair for and she has spoken to many and it's important to them. I'm sure there are some forced into it just as their is domestic violence in Christian relationships.
I don't. And if you were I invite you to shed some light on this.
I am not arguing in favor of the Muslim religion as I don't love most of their beliefs. However, it is their belief and many wear them as part of their culture and belief |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16572
Location: Displaced Iowegian | Nateracer - 2017-11-16 11:01 AM NJJ - 2017-11-16 10:43 AM SC Wrangler - 2017-11-16 10:30 AM I obviously do not understand and could never comprehend the muslim religion/culture. With that being said there are plenty of christian doctrines I don't get and don't want to get. Plenty of them still believe in love, honor and OBEY. Lots and lots of christian women and even agnostic women are subjugated to their hustands. First dude that tries to tell me what to do is history!!
As far as Barbie is concerned who cares what she wears whether it is a robe and scarf or a sombrero or a bikini. WHO cares? Those who will take EVERY opportunity to try to stir up more divisiveness in this country...... Those who will take EVERY opportunity to hate on the Muslims ...... Those who will take EVERY opportunity to try to prove that this country should NOT be inclusive of other races, religions or person's rights.
I think that's what was meant by who cares. I certainly don't care. If someone is offended by a doll (which I'd say Frodo certainly is) then we've missed the point of free America anyways. People can do what they want here. If a women subjects herself to following a religion that allows that sort of thing, well, it's none of our business. There are those who've broken free. It takes heart, guts, and willpower. That's what America was made on to begin with. If you don't take steps to free yourself from your own torture, you've locked yourself up.
And don't go on about Muslims in other countries being tortured and mutilated. They aren't here in Free America. I get some can't help themselves, but again, not America's concern. We've got our own problems to face.
My point EXACTLY ....... If you don't like them....don't buy them ...... |
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 Cute Little Imp
Posts: 2747
Location: N Texas | Frodo - 2017-11-15 2:24 PM
One miserably hot day last July I was at Texas Roadhouse and watched a Muslim woman dressed in a long dark robe of some sort with a brocade scarf around her head, neck and shoulders getting out of the car. Her husband was dressed in a tank top, shorts and sandals as were the kids. Convince me she was comfortable or that any of us born in the U.S would put up with this. It wasn't her choice. It was her husbands that she dressed like a monk on a 105 degree day. Somewhere under all that garb may have been a lovely figure.
Did you ask her if she was being forced? You're making a lot of assumptions. Being raised in a certain religion/culture your whole life, some things become so ingrained that it is extremely difficult to change. For all you know, she may LIKE wearing that, it might make her feel proud. Or maybe she just thinks that's what she's supposed to wear because she has worn it her whole life and she's not comfortable in "regular" clothes.
On 100 degree days, I'll still wear my boots and jeans while everyone else is wearing shorts and flip flops. It's personal preference, no one is forcing me. So unless you verified with her personally WHY she was wearing it, you truly don't know her reason. |
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Cute Little Imp
Posts: 2747
Location: N Texas | Whiteboy - 2017-11-15 2:32 PM
Frodo - 2017-11-15 2:24 PM
One miserably hot day last July I was at Texas Roadhouse and watched a Muslim woman dressed in a long dark robe of some sort with a brocade scarf around her head, neck and shoulders getting out of the car. Her husband was dressed in a tank top, shorts and sandals as were the kids. Convince me she was comfortable or that any of us born in the U.S would put up with this. It wasn't her choice. It was her husbands that she dressed like a monk on a 105 degree day. Somewhere under all that garb may have been a lovely figure.
So you think she is forced, against her will, into this religion? I'm really confused as to the point you are trying to make with this tread.
She wants to be validated that her discrimination and intolerance is ok. |
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"Heck's Coming With Me"
Posts: 10793
Location: Kansas | It is not about the dolls. You totally missed the point. I give up.
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Miss Laundry Misshap
Posts: 5271
| Frodo - 2017-11-16 11:28 AM It is not about the dolls. You totally missed the point. I give up.
I re-read your first post.
I think that sometimes people come here to leave the dangerous place they lived. Not to truly be free (as in married prior to move), but to be safe(r). If they don't see a problem with their religion, who are we to tell them they have to play with white dolls?
No one truly knows if someone else is happy or sad or feels oppressed, unless they make it known. |
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Cute Little Imp
Posts: 2747
Location: N Texas | Frodo - 2017-11-16 11:28 AM
It is not about the dolls. You totally missed the point. I give up.
I get your point. People are welcome to come to America as long as they talk, look, dress, and act like "us". Last time I checked, white English-speaking Christians aren't indigenous to America. Not everyone who comes here does so because they are oppressed or abused.
Have you read the story about the woman the doll is inspired by? Definitely an awesome role model for little girls. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| FLITASTIC - 2017-11-15 12:38 PM
Whiteboy - 2017-11-15 10:03 AM
You don't want those innocent little girls to be happy? I doubt they chose to come here all on their own.
Weather they had a choice or not, someone made that decision for them, they are HERE now and we should not change our culture to make them feel more comfortable. If I moved to Saudi Arabia, I would NOT expect anyone to make any compromises for me either.
I agree, Flit, and as my dad who worked over there for years off and on, they expect you to fit in with them. No changing on their part to make you feel comfortable and at home, in fact, quite the opposite. Dad got thrown in jail for being in an auto accident in Tripoli one time. I think he only spent a few hours in jail, but it was his fault BECAUSE HE WAS AN AMERICAN. In truth, the other guy hit him but it didn't matter to them. And this was back when they were not so hostile as they are now. |
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Cute Little Imp
Posts: 2747
Location: N Texas | Frodo - 2017-11-15 1:09 PM
NJJ - 2017-11-15 12:54 PM FLITASTIC - 2017-11-15 12:47 PM Whiteboy - 2017-11-15 10:42 AM FLITASTIC - 2017-11-15 12:38 PM Whiteboy - 2017-11-15 10:03 AM You don't want those innocent little girls to be happy? I doubt they chose to come here all on their own. Weather they had a choice or not, someone made that decision for them, they are HERE now and we should not change our culture to make them feel more comfortable. If I moved to Saudi Arabia, I would NOT expect anyone to make any compromises for me either. So you would be comfortable assimilating to the muslim religion if you moved to a muslim country? ABSOLUTELY!!!! THats why I am never going to live in one. Even visiting I think we should respect the customs of those places we visit weather or not we live there or not permanently. If you choose to live in a Muslim country, you need to follow THEIR RULES, when you live here, you need to accept ours PERIOD.
And Hitler was a white guy who thought all Jews should be eradicated. They are what you call extremists, not the norm. |
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"Heck's Coming With Me"
Posts: 10793
Location: Kansas | Gunner11 - 2017-11-16 12:08 PM Frodo - 2017-11-16 11:28 AM It is not about the dolls. You totally missed the point. I give up.
I get your point. People are welcome to come to America as long as they talk, look, dress, and act like "us". Last time I checked, white English-speaking Christians aren't indigenous to America. Not everyone who comes here does so because they are oppressed or abused. Have you read the story about the woman the doll is inspired by? Definitely an awesome role model for little girls.
The point you missed is that this was about "defending" Muslim women. Remember my defense twice of Waris Dirie. You took the liberal stance........it's a fulltime job, I know.
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Cute Little Imp
Posts: 2747
Location: N Texas | Frodo - 2017-11-16 12:14 PM
Gunner11 - 2017-11-16 12:08 PM Frodo - 2017-11-16 11:28 AM It is not about the dolls. You totally missed the point. I give up.
I get your point. People are welcome to come to America as long as they talk, look, dress, and act like "us". Last time I checked, white English-speaking Christians aren't indigenous to America. Not everyone who comes here does so because they are oppressed or abused. Have you read the story about the woman the doll is inspired by? Definitely an awesome role model for little girls.
There you go with your assumptions again. I vote Republican but have no problem with the new Barbie. I tend to be more towards the middle because there are things with each side that I despise, as all as things with each side that I agree with. I'm not all-or-nothing :) |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16572
Location: Displaced Iowegian | Frodo - 2017-11-16 12:14 PM Gunner11 - 2017-11-16 12:08 PM Frodo - 2017-11-16 11:28 AM It is not about the dolls. You totally missed the point. I give up.
I get your point. People are welcome to come to America as long as they talk, look, dress, and act like "us". Last time I checked, white English-speaking Christians aren't indigenous to America. Not everyone who comes here does so because they are oppressed or abused. Have you read the story about the woman the doll is inspired by? Definitely an awesome role model for little girls.
There you go again........when you can't defend your statements ..... just start calling others "the liberals" ....... typical !!!! I think most of us got your point .... you don't like or want ANY Muslims in YOUR country! YOU have made that very clear! |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | Are barbies only sold in the US? Asking because I really don't know.
But, theres nothing wrong with wearing a hijab if someone wants to. I don't see why its hurting anyone for a muslim girl to get a Barbie she can relate to. Like others have said, no ones forcing anyone to buy it. And no ones making all the other barbies wear them either LOL.
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Nut Case Expert
Posts: 9305
Location: Tulsa, Ok | NJJ - 2017-11-16 11:22 AM Nateracer - 2017-11-16 11:01 AM NJJ - 2017-11-16 10:43 AM SC Wrangler - 2017-11-16 10:30 AM I obviously do not understand and could never comprehend the muslim religion/culture. With that being said there are plenty of christian doctrines I don't get and don't want to get. Plenty of them still believe in love, honor and OBEY. Lots and lots of christian women and even agnostic women are subjugated to their hustands. First dude that tries to tell me what to do is history!!
As far as Barbie is concerned who cares what she wears whether it is a robe and scarf or a sombrero or a bikini. WHO cares? Those who will take EVERY opportunity to try to stir up more divisiveness in this country...... Those who will take EVERY opportunity to hate on the Muslims ...... Those who will take EVERY opportunity to try to prove that this country should NOT be inclusive of other races, religions or person's rights.
I think that's what was meant by who cares. I certainly don't care. If someone is offended by a doll (which I'd say Frodo certainly is) then we've missed the point of free America anyways. People can do what they want here. If a women subjects herself to following a religion that allows that sort of thing, well, it's none of our business. There are those who've broken free. It takes heart, guts, and willpower. That's what America was made on to begin with. If you don't take steps to free yourself from your own torture, you've locked yourself up.
And don't go on about Muslims in other countries being tortured and mutilated. They aren't here in Free America. I get some can't help themselves, but again, not America's concern. We've got our own problems to face.
Heck if you don't like them not only don't buy them, don't look at them. Just avoid the toy aisles in Walmart - they are full of scary little rugrats running around like ants which is way scarier than what is on the shelves. |
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 BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25351
Location: Bastrop, Texas | Settle down everybody. We've been here before in this country, in a certain sense. In WWII, following the unprovoked attack on Pearl Harbor, which took the lives of about 3000 Americans, FDR issued an executive order which sent tens of thousands fellow citizens to what were essentially concentration camps, surrounded by barbed wire and armed guards, in some of the most hostile places in the country.
Their homes and businesses had to be abandoned, many of which were never recovered. They were shipped to hell holes in deserts on trucks and trains like cattle, not unlike the way Jews were shipped to Treblinka and Aushwitz.
Why? Simply because they had slanted eyes. That's all.
Meanwhile, many of those slanted eyed families still sent their sons off to war. They were placed in segregated, slanted-eyed soldier units. Many died serving a country that imprisoned their families back home. The most decorated unit in Europe was a regiment of all slanted-eyed soldiers. You seldom hear about this, and many younger people are absolutely oblivious to this chapter in our history.
What we are witnessing today with Muslims and Hijabs is yet another similar painful episode that illustrates a harsh reality about inherent human nature....prejudice and bigotry. I honestly understand this and I'm not without my own prejudices. I'm half Lebanese and was raised in a home where my grandfather was Muslim and my grandmother was Christian Lebanese. I was surrounded by fantastic people who were Arabs and many were Muslim. The first mosque in North America was built over 100 years ago not far from where I was raised. My grandpa was an extremely patriotic, grateful, proud American who served on the battlefields of France during WWII, and he raised two sons who served in WWII and Korea. I never ever ever witnessed the kind of anti-American hate we see coming from a small minority of Muslim Americans. I think it's a disturbing trend, but at the same time, let's not paint with a broad brush and repeat the same mistakes we've made in the past. Vigilance, fighting terrorists, and extreme vetting are all good.
Fretting over Barbie dolls wearing a costume that represents a people we don't know or understand will just make it worse. The good news is those women are free to rip those Hijabs off, if they so desire.....some even have. |
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