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 Regular
Posts: 52
| slipperyslope - 2018-03-15 6:07 PM
kk_sue - 2018-03-15 12:08 PM
*******EDITED***** videos of her first barrel attached
I have a 4 year old futurity horse that has been having the weirdest soundness issues lately then all of a sudden started stopping and turning right before first barrel when that has always been her money barrel she would nail it every time. I moved from Colorado to Texas about 6 weeks ago and before I left Colorado her back and hamstrings were really tight so I had PEMF therapy done a couple times. After I got down to Texas about a week later I think she tied up on me. (Yes she was already on daily electrolytes and has access to a salt block since before we left Colorado ) I went to go clean out waters and she was standing in the middle of her pen pawing aggressively then she stopped with her head down and her leg stretched forwards and her eyes closed and wobbled for a good 30 seconds before starting to paw again. I went to take her temp and when I lifted her blanket the right side of her hindquarters were tensed up and twitching really bad. I took her to the vet and her blood work came back normal her muscle enzymes may have been just slightly elevated. She was put on fluids and the vet said she colicked. But she was never off of food or water and had been going to the bathroom completely normally and wasn’t acting colicky to me at all. The next week she got an abscess I took her in and they did X-rays just to be sure that’s all it was because it wasn’t one we could really see because it was in the bulb of her heel. Her feet look great in X-ray and I got the abscess cleared up. I took her back into the vet because her back is still sore and she just doesn’t seem as powerful in her turns as usual. She was flexion tested positive on the stifle so they X-rayed stifles and those looked good and they couldn’t feel any fluid in them. They said it could be the SI but we decided to try some acupuncture and run her on Robaxin. A few days later she went to a barrel race and ran right at the top with some TOUGH horses. But I went back to the vet the next day because her back was still just hurting her. There was a different vet looking at her and completely out of nowhere he says she has EPM. She does stand camped out in the back end sometimes and she does walk a little camped out sometimes. When she gets into the trailer or walks over something she puts one foot at a time with her front feet then bunny hops with her back feet but other than that she hasn’t showed me any signs at all. She doesn’t stumble. The night before she ran with very high level horses without an issue so I kinda had a hard time believing him. He said horses that have it have a higher chance of “colic” and abscesses. But I started her on the medication (something that starts with a t in DMSO. I’d have to go look at the bottle ). 4 days later out of nowhere she starts acting like she’s going to bite your head off if you touch anywhere under her belly from between her front legs all the way to between her back legs. I had a deep tissue massage and chiropractor done on her because her back problem was still there and I started giving her zesterra because I thought maybe her stomach was hurting. Her back was FINALLY better and didn’t seem like it’s bothering her at all anymore. I went to make a run the next day and she just shut down HARD and turned before first barrel. I exhibitioned her the exact same as always and I rode her like I always do. I ran her the next day and I was pushing he past first I was still sitting forward and two handed and she did the same thing again. I took her to a different arena a few days later that was pretty open behind first and I got her around it but I was pulling her off of it and kicking with my inside leg and doing everything I could and we still hit it. This is very unlike her and for a 4 year old she is very consistent and always very honest. It’s got to be some soundness thing going on. The blood test for EPM came back and my vet said it was 55%. She doesn’t try to bite my head off anymore touching under her belly but she still definitely isn’t happy about it. I am at a complete loss on what to do.
First video is of her ducking. Second video was taken just over a week earlier and was how her first consistently was prior to her ducking it.
https://youtu.be/LJe6j_tO9_4
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=urUp0lFTwpc
Do you have this horse on allbreedpedigree.com? You are describing so many PSSM2 symptoms. Off & one weird lamenesses that vets can't pinpoint/fix; the extremely tight back & hamstrings; tying up (MANY vets think it is colic - as do other people - since they are looking for the "solid tying up" where a horse doesn't move - these horses can have what LOOKS like a milder tying up (it's not really - it's still extremely painful ); the muscle twitching as they have muscle episodes; pawing hard, trying to stretch out various areas of their body, traveling with head way down; abscesses; body soreness all over; ulcers; bunny hoping in the back when cantering, etc. There is a great group on FB - PSSM Forum (NOT the one that says about 5 Panel testing ). If you post your horse's pedigree on there and describe the symptoms, you will get much help. These horses just HURT - so severely. (I saw you posted about treating them also - there are suggested feeding changes, managing, etc BUT it's best to know for sure what you are dealing with - if it's PSSM1 and one or more of the PSSM2 variants, etc. Some respond to changes beautifully, some don't. If it is PSSM2, it is a muscle disease & not a good life long prognosis. The vets don't normally accept/recognize the dna hair testing for the PSSM2 variants, BUT it is the best way to go. Vets will push the muscle biopsy but that does NOT give you a clear picture of what you are dealing with AND there are a lot of false results too.
She is on all breed Pedigree http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/little+cat+big+money I will go look up that Facebook page now | |
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Expert
Posts: 1599
 
| kk_sue - 2018-03-15 7:58 PM slipperyslope - 2018-03-15 6:07 PM kk_sue - 2018-03-15 12:08 PM *******EDITED***** videos of her first barrel attached I have a 4 year old futurity horse that has been having the weirdest soundness issues lately then all of a sudden started stopping and turning right before first barrel when that has always been her money barrel she would nail it every time. I moved from Colorado to Texas about 6 weeks ago and before I left Colorado her back and hamstrings were really tight so I had PEMF therapy done a couple times. After I got down to Texas about a week later I think she tied up on me. (Yes she was already on daily electrolytes and has access to a salt block since before we left Colorado ) I went to go clean out waters and she was standing in the middle of her pen pawing aggressively then she stopped with her head down and her leg stretched forwards and her eyes closed and wobbled for a good 30 seconds before starting to paw again. I went to take her temp and when I lifted her blanket the right side of her hindquarters were tensed up and twitching really bad. I took her to the vet and her blood work came back normal her muscle enzymes may have been just slightly elevated. She was put on fluids and the vet said she colicked. But she was never off of food or water and had been going to the bathroom completely normally and wasn’t acting colicky to me at all. The next week she got an abscess I took her in and they did X-rays just to be sure that’s all it was because it wasn’t one we could really see because it was in the bulb of her heel. Her feet look great in X-ray and I got the abscess cleared up. I took her back into the vet because her back is still sore and she just doesn’t seem as powerful in her turns as usual. She was flexion tested positive on the stifle so they X-rayed stifles and those looked good and they couldn’t feel any fluid in them. They said it could be the SI but we decided to try some acupuncture and run her on Robaxin. A few days later she went to a barrel race and ran right at the top with some TOUGH horses. But I went back to the vet the next day because her back was still just hurting her. There was a different vet looking at her and completely out of nowhere he says she has EPM. She does stand camped out in the back end sometimes and she does walk a little camped out sometimes. When she gets into the trailer or walks over something she puts one foot at a time with her front feet then bunny hops with her back feet but other than that she hasn’t showed me any signs at all. She doesn’t stumble. The night before she ran with very high level horses without an issue so I kinda had a hard time believing him. He said horses that have it have a higher chance of “colic” and abscesses. But I started her on the medication (something that starts with a t in DMSO. I’d have to go look at the bottle ). 4 days later out of nowhere she starts acting like she’s going to bite your head off if you touch anywhere under her belly from between her front legs all the way to between her back legs. I had a deep tissue massage and chiropractor done on her because her back problem was still there and I started giving her zesterra because I thought maybe her stomach was hurting. Her back was FINALLY better and didn’t seem like it’s bothering her at all anymore. I went to make a run the next day and she just shut down HARD and turned before first barrel. I exhibitioned her the exact same as always and I rode her like I always do. I ran her the next day and I was pushing he past first I was still sitting forward and two handed and she did the same thing again. I took her to a different arena a few days later that was pretty open behind first and I got her around it but I was pulling her off of it and kicking with my inside leg and doing everything I could and we still hit it. This is very unlike her and for a 4 year old she is very consistent and always very honest. It’s got to be some soundness thing going on. The blood test for EPM came back and my vet said it was 55%. She doesn’t try to bite my head off anymore touching under her belly but she still definitely isn’t happy about it. I am at a complete loss on what to do. First video is of her ducking. Second video was taken just over a week earlier and was how her first consistently was prior to her ducking it. https://youtu.be/LJe6j_tO9_4 https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=urUp0lFTwpc... Do you have this horse on allbreedpedigree.com? You are describing so many PSSM2 symptoms. Off & one weird lamenesses that vets can't pinpoint/fix; the extremely tight back & hamstrings; tying up (MANY vets think it is colic - as do other people - since they are looking for the "solid tying up" where a horse doesn't move - these horses can have what LOOKS like a milder tying up (it's not really - it's still extremely painful ); the muscle twitching as they have muscle episodes; pawing hard, trying to stretch out various areas of their body, traveling with head way down; abscesses; body soreness all over; ulcers; bunny hoping in the back when cantering, etc. There is a great group on FB - PSSM Forum (NOT the one that says about 5 Panel testing ). If you post your horse's pedigree on there and describe the symptoms, you will get much help. These horses just HURT - so severely. (I saw you posted about treating them also - there are suggested feeding changes, managing, etc BUT it's best to know for sure what you are dealing with - if it's PSSM1 and one or more of the PSSM2 variants, etc. Some respond to changes beautifully, some don't. If it is PSSM2, it is a muscle disease & not a good life long prognosis. The vets don't normally accept/recognize the dna hair testing for the PSSM2 variants, BUT it is the best way to go. Vets will push the muscle biopsy but that does NOT give you a clear picture of what you are dealing with AND there are a lot of false results too. She is on all breed Pedigree http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/little+cat+big+money I will go look up that Facebook page now
Edited by lopnaround 2018-03-16 10:16 AM
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
 
| I had a gelding that would not work his right, his lefts were beautiful, thousand dollars with very good vets and almost a year later found it was his suspensory. He was never lame, no swelling, very good lameness vets could not get him to show him any soreness. He finally came out of a run 3 legged lame and had torn it. The vet said that probably what was bothering him all along a progressive injury till it finally tore . I hardly ran him during that year but I would go to the vet try something different and they would have me go run him so I go run him to see if it worked. This was several years ago and the one thing that I did not do was put a lameness locator on him, nobody had them back man. That is a great tool for picking up issues that can’t be seen by the eye or found through x-rays or ultrasounds. Good luck with your mare.
Edited by rodeomom3 2018-03-16 10:30 AM
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 The best bad guy on the internet
Posts: 3519
Location: Arizona | kk_sue - 2018-03-15 4:28 PM
LIVE2RUN - 2018-03-15 4:13 PM
kk_sue - 2018-03-15 12:08 PM
*******EDITED***** videos of her first barrel attached
I have a 4 year old futurity horse that has been having the weirdest soundness issues lately then all of a sudden started stopping and turning right before first barrel when that has always been her money barrel she would nail it every time. I moved from Colorado to Texas about 6 weeks ago and before I left Colorado her back and hamstrings were really tight so I had PEMF therapy done a couple times. After I got down to Texas about a week later I think she tied up on me. (Yes she was already on daily electrolytes and has access to a salt block since before we left Colorado ) I went to go clean out waters and she was standing in the middle of her pen pawing aggressively then she stopped with her head down and her leg stretched forwards and her eyes closed and wobbled for a good 30 seconds before starting to paw again. I went to take her temp and when I lifted her blanket the right side of her hindquarters were tensed up and twitching really bad. I took her to the vet and her blood work came back normal her muscle enzymes may have been just slightly elevated. She was put on fluids and the vet said she colicked. But she was never off of food or water and had been going to the bathroom completely normally and wasn’t acting colicky to me at all. The next week she got an abscess I took her in and they did X-rays just to be sure that’s all it was because it wasn’t one we could really see because it was in the bulb of her heel. Her feet look great in X-ray and I got the abscess cleared up. I took her back into the vet because her back is still sore and she just doesn’t seem as powerful in her turns as usual. She was flexion tested positive on the stifle so they X-rayed stifles and those looked good and they couldn’t feel any fluid in them. They said it could be the SI but we decided to try some acupuncture and run her on Robaxin. A few days later she went to a barrel race and ran right at the top with some TOUGH horses. But I went back to the vet the next day because her back was still just hurting her. There was a different vet looking at her and completely out of nowhere he says she has EPM. She does stand camped out in the back end sometimes and she does walk a little camped out sometimes. When she gets into the trailer or walks over something she puts one foot at a time with her front feet then bunny hops with her back feet but other than that she hasn’t showed me any signs at all. She doesn’t stumble. The night before she ran with very high level horses without an issue so I kinda had a hard time believing him. He said horses that have it have a higher chance of “colic” and abscesses. But I started her on the medication (something that starts with a t in DMSO. I’d have to go look at the bottle ). 4 days later out of nowhere she starts acting like she’s going to bite your head off if you touch anywhere under her belly from between her front legs all the way to between her back legs. I had a deep tissue massage and chiropractor done on her because her back problem was still there and I started giving her zesterra because I thought maybe her stomach was hurting. Her back was FINALLY better and didn’t seem like it’s bothering her at all anymore. I went to make a run the next day and she just shut down HARD and turned before first barrel. I exhibitioned her the exact same as always and I rode her like I always do. I ran her the next day and I was pushing he past first I was still sitting forward and two handed and she did the same thing again. I took her to a different arena a few days later that was pretty open behind first and I got her around it but I was pulling her off of it and kicking with my inside leg and doing everything I could and we still hit it. This is very unlike her and for a 4 year old she is very consistent and always very honest. It’s got to be some soundness thing going on. The blood test for EPM came back and my vet said it was 55%. She doesn’t try to bite my head off anymore touching under her belly but she still definitely isn’t happy about it. I am at a complete loss on what to do.
First video is of her ducking. Second video was taken just over a week earlier and was how her first consistently was prior to her ducking it.
https://youtu.be/LJe6j_tO9_4
https://youtu.be/urUp0lFTwpc
I watched your video several times. I see no soundness issue at all. I think she just got way too low and in a bad position and couldn't make that turn is all. Have you ran her again?
I’ve ran her in different pens and she does the same thing. She getting down too low because that’s when she starts to duck it. I know there’s for sure a lot of soundness issues going on it’s just trying to get them pinpointed and treated that’s the issue but she’s definitely not a happy pony right now soundness wise. But if you watch the video of how she normally turns her style is to just get real low
Oh wow, well good luck and I hope you find out what's wrong. Gosh, if only they could talk!! So frustrating, I am sure! | |
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Expert
Posts: 1599
| You may also want to try a Bone Scan. Full body is about $1200...but for lameness you can't pinpoint it's a great tool. The vet will look at areas that "light up" and go back and xray or ultrasound depending on location. | |
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| I would pursue PSSM and Kissing Spine.
We have one with KS who aside from your specific performance issue has very similar issues. I pursued PSSM via diet changes as well initially. We never did test him because we found the KS and that made a world of difference. We kept him on a similar diet without the supplementing and just recently changed back to what the rest of the barn eats - we will see, if he goes backwards I would pursue PSSM more.
Anyway, he stood camped out, sensitive to the touch, muscles in his hind end looked rock hard at times and a couples times after we got done roping on him and tied him back to the fence he seemed to have some kind of episode where he just got p!ssed at the world. He also had severe anxiety in the box. Up until that point I was also running him on barrels and he was blowing up at the 2nd. He was see regularly by a few different chiros and they never picked up on it.
We took him in because improvements from diet had stalled, despite time off, and after a longer night of roping he’d be very back sore. They showed up in a X-ray clear as day after he flexed, trotted, etc 10/10. Injections have worked wonderfully for him so far. He’s not gone back to the barrels, I think there is a mental block there, he gets terrible anxiety and neither of us enjoy it. So he gets to rope, we’re both happier. | |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 534
Location: Ohio girl moved to PA | Call me crazy but, have you talked to an animal communicator?? Its worth a shot in my opinion. I have a girl talk to my horses every now and then and i love it and they do too. Its so awesome to experience and I know its real because shes told me things only my horses would know. Its not very expensive! | |
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 Expert
Posts: 5293
| One thing I would do, change directions. Start going to the left barrel first. It will free up her mind, your mind, and you may be able to put all this behind you. If you go left and she never does it again, its all good. SOmething to try anyway. | |
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 Ms Bling Bling Sleeze Kitty
Posts: 20917
Location: LouLouVille, OK | kk_sue - 2018-03-15 4:51 PM lopnaround - 2018-03-15 3:35 PM I just reread your post. The camping out is a sure sign of kissing spine, but also could be tightness in muscles due to PSSM. Agree with above- xray back and test for PSSM 1 and 2. For now it wouldn't hurt to just swtich to a PSSM diet- low starch and sugar with Omega 3 and Omega 6 (Rice bran and Veg oil is what I use) along with a good amino acid, electrolyte, and Vit E supplement. Right now she is on pasture all day, gets alfalfa at night and gets 1/2 can of oats with Renew gold, vitamin E, electrolytes and MVP In-sync 4
If she carries PSSM spring grass and oats have alot of NSC (sugar and Carbs) the Renew Gold is good... all you have to do to test for that is pull hair and send off... AQHA does it or you can find a lab to do it. But body soreness and colic can come from a horse not able to process NSC.... She has a badazz style! | |
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Location: in the ozone | cindyt - 2018-03-16 1:53 PM
kk_sue - 2018-03-15 4:51 PM lopnaround - 2018-03-15 3:35 PM I just reread your post. The camping out is a sure sign of kissing spine, but also could be tightness in muscles due to PSSM. Agree with above- xray back and test for PSSM 1 and 2. For now it wouldn't hurt to just swtich to a PSSM diet- low starch and sugar with Omega 3 and Omega 6 (Rice bran and Veg oil is what I use) along with a good amino acid, electrolyte, and Vit E supplement. Right now she is on pasture all day, gets alfalfa at night and gets 1/2 can of oats with Renew gold, vitamin E, electrolytes and MVP In-sync 4
There aren't any "carriers" of PSSM - whether it's type 1 or 2 - they either have it or they don't. (n/P1 HAS it for example, does not have to be P1/P1)
And PSSM2 has NOTHING to do with starch & sugars and this horse has more of the symptoms & breeding towards PSSM2. Renew Gold has not been a good suggestion for PSSM2 either.
Just a couple things to clear up since there is too much misinformation around anyway. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | I haven’t seen anyone else saying anything about the horse not wanting to pick up the right lead (in second video), was very resilient when asked to pick up that lead which happens to be the first barrels lead...... she swished her tail, didn’t want to go forward, def a pain issue to the RIGHT side (or opposite side) whatever is causing this needs to be fixed before she doesn’t want to perform anymore because that’s a super nice horse!!
I had a mare with major SI issues, she would never duck the barrel she just couldn’t get the set turn and push off the back side.
I also ran one two years ago that ducked the 2nd and we found out she had severe ovarian cysts, we thought it was si but did ultra sound and found cysts, had them removed (dissolved) and now she doesn’t duck anymore. Also used regumate
Whatever it is just take one step at a time, all these opinions can be over whelming!!! You’ll figure it out | |
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 Star Padded Honey
Posts: 8890
Location: NW MT | I defnitelly agree on checking on PSSM. Lots of people are "closed minded" about it, but they are very real diseases and any of us that have symptomatic horses, are both relieved and heartbroken when we get the diagnosis. It is great to finally know "what" is wrong with your horse, and then can try to help with different management, but very heartbreaking to see what they go through - and face that some, no matter what you try, just never respond OR respond for awhile & then back to extremely painful issues. Also, with PSSM2 being a muscle disease, more often than not, it also shortens their life considerably. | |
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 The Worst Seller Ever
Posts: 4138
Location: Oklahoma | joemama - 2018-03-15 3:01 PM lopnaround - 2018-03-15 2:47 PM joemama - 2018-03-15 2:36 PM imturnin3 - 2018-03-15 2:00 PM Some thing to think about.. I had a gelding with sore hamstrings. Injected his hocks (upper and lower)less than a week later his hamstring soreness is GONE. Also look into Pssm kissing spines. Saddle soreness. Hope you find it and it's and easy fix. Could any of these cause a horse to turn hard in front of the 1st then go on and run 2nd and 3rd perfectly?
ETA- YES....if a horse is sore on one side they could duck the first and then turn the others perfectly.
Why would a horse sit pretty darn hard in front of the barrel vs running by it? I could see a soreness issue causing the horse to run by the barrel but not sit hard and turn in front of it. Could it because they know the soreness shows when pushing out of the barrel? Im not arguing, just curious and never seen this.
I had a horse that did the same thing, except he did it on the 2nd. I did everything I could to try to fix him from vets to tuning. He would do it about every other time. I finally gave up and sold him.
I really like your mare. I hope you find an answer!! | |
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 Dog Resuce Agent
Posts: 3459
Location: southeast Texas | slipperyslope - 2018-03-16 6:36 PM cindyt - 2018-03-16 1:53 PM kk_sue - 2018-03-15 4:51 PM lopnaround - 2018-03-15 3:35 PM I just reread your post. The camping out is a sure sign of kissing spine, but also could be tightness in muscles due to PSSM. Agree with above- xray back and test for PSSM 1 and 2. For now it wouldn't hurt to just swtich to a PSSM diet- low starch and sugar with Omega 3 and Omega 6 (Rice bran and Veg oil is what I use) along with a good amino acid, electrolyte, and Vit E supplement. Right now she is on pasture all day, gets alfalfa at night and gets 1/2 can of oats with Renew gold, vitamin E, electrolytes and MVP In-sync 4 There aren't any "carriers" of PSSM - whether it's type 1 or 2 - they either have it or they don't. (n/P1 HAS it for example, does not have to be P1/P1 ) And PSSM2 has NOTHING to do with starch & sugars and this horse has more of the symptoms & breeding towards PSSM2. Renew Gold has not been a good suggestion for PSSM2 either. Just a couple things to clear up since there is too much misinformation around anyway.
Each horse is different on what they can tolerate.
For now I would cut oats and see what kind of changes you see.
Price bran is an inflammation. But my guy does good on renew gold. Plus I've got him on golden paste.
Edited by roxieannie 2018-03-19 9:15 AM
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Ms Bling Bling Sleeze Kitty
Posts: 20917
Location: LouLouVille, OK | roxieannie - 2018-03-19 9:13 AM slipperyslope - 2018-03-16 6:36 PM cindyt - 2018-03-16 1:53 PM kk_sue - 2018-03-15 4:51 PM lopnaround - 2018-03-15 3:35 PM I just reread your post. The camping out is a sure sign of kissing spine, but also could be tightness in muscles due to PSSM. Agree with above- xray back and test for PSSM 1 and 2. For now it wouldn't hurt to just swtich to a PSSM diet- low starch and sugar with Omega 3 and Omega 6 (Rice bran and Veg oil is what I use) along with a good amino acid, electrolyte, and Vit E supplement. Right now she is on pasture all day, gets alfalfa at night and gets 1/2 can of oats with Renew gold, vitamin E, electrolytes and MVP In-sync 4 There aren't any "carriers" of PSSM - whether it's type 1 or 2 - they either have it or they don't. (n/P1 HAS it for example, does not have to be P1/P1 ) And PSSM2 has NOTHING to do with starch & sugars and this horse has more of the symptoms & breeding towards PSSM2. Renew Gold has not been a good suggestion for PSSM2 either. Just a couple things to clear up since there is too much misinformation around anyway.
Each horse is different on what they can tolerate.
For now I would cut oats and see what kind of changes you see.
Price bran is an inflammation. But my guy does good on renew gold. Plus I've got him on golden paste.
Edited by cindyt 2018-03-19 10:40 AM
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Location: in the ozone | cindyt - 2018-03-19 9:39 AM
roxieannie - 2018-03-19 9:13 AM slipperyslope - 2018-03-16 6:36 PM cindyt - 2018-03-16 1:53 PM kk_sue - 2018-03-15 4:51 PM lopnaround - 2018-03-15 3:35 PM I just reread your post. The camping out is a sure sign of kissing spine, but also could be tightness in muscles due to PSSM. Agree with above- xray back and test for PSSM 1 and 2. For now it wouldn't hurt to just swtich to a PSSM diet- low starch and sugar with Omega 3 and Omega 6 (Rice bran and Veg oil is what I use) along with a good amino acid, electrolyte, and Vit E supplement. Right now she is on pasture all day, gets alfalfa at night and gets 1/2 can of oats with Renew gold, vitamin E, electrolytes and MVP In-sync 4 There aren't any "carriers" of PSSM - whether it's type 1 or 2 - they either have it or they don't. (n/P1 HAS it for example, does not have to be P1/P1 ) And PSSM2 has NOTHING to do with starch & sugars and this horse has more of the symptoms & breeding towards PSSM2. Renew Gold has not been a good suggestion for PSSM2 either. Just a couple things to clear up since there is too much misinformation around anyway.
Each horse is different on what they can tolerate.
For now I would cut oats and see what kind of changes you see.
Price bran is an inflammation. But my guy does good on renew gold. Plus I've got him on golden paste.
You can "read" all you want but live it to know for sure. And MANY PSSM2 horses have no problems with starch or sugar.
Also people calling them "carriers" is very misleading ... way too many people say it that way to cover up a positive horse, symptomatic or not. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 824
Location: Duvall, WA | kk_sue - 2018-03-15 1:23 PM
imturnin3 - 2018-03-15 2:18 PM
Yes!!
I've seen horses with all of the above exhibit this behavior. As well as the kissing spine show up as what was thought to be si issues, and thought to be pssm. Horse couldn't turn first. But Inhaled second and third
I’m not super familiar with pssm. Is it easy to test for? Can it be treated and managed if that is it?
If she did indeed tie up then she likely does have PSSM. Barrel lines typically have PSSM2 not PSSM1 like in the AQHA five panel test.
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1056
| could be a magnesium deficiency. try Mag Restore...........also you might be anticipating in your body language in your approach | |
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Ms Bling Bling Sleeze Kitty
Posts: 20917
Location: LouLouVille, OK | slipperyslope - 2018-03-21 9:14 PM cindyt - 2018-03-19 9:39 AM roxieannie - 2018-03-19 9:13 AM slipperyslope - 2018-03-16 6:36 PM cindyt - 2018-03-16 1:53 PM kk_sue - 2018-03-15 4:51 PM lopnaround - 2018-03-15 3:35 PM I just reread your post. The camping out is a sure sign of kissing spine, but also could be tightness in muscles due to PSSM. Agree with above- xray back and test for PSSM 1 and 2. For now it wouldn't hurt to just swtich to a PSSM diet- low starch and sugar with Omega 3 and Omega 6 (Rice bran and Veg oil is what I use) along with a good amino acid, electrolyte, and Vit E supplement. Right now she is on pasture all day, gets alfalfa at night and gets 1/2 can of oats with Renew gold, vitamin E, electrolytes and MVP In-sync 4 There aren't any "carriers" of PSSM - whether it's type 1 or 2 - they either have it or they don't. (n/P1 HAS it for example, does not have to be P1/P1 ) And PSSM2 has NOTHING to do with starch & sugars and this horse has more of the symptoms & breeding towards PSSM2. Renew Gold has not been a good suggestion for PSSM2 either. Just a couple things to clear up since there is too much misinformation around anyway.
Each horse is different on what they can tolerate.
For now I would cut oats and see what kind of changes you see.
Price bran is an inflammation. But my guy does good on renew gold. Plus I've got him on golden paste. You can "read" all you want but live it to know for sure. And MANY PSSM2 horses have no problems with starch or sugar. Also people calling them "carriers" is very misleading ... way too many people say it that way to cover up a positive horse, symptomatic or not.
MANY PSSM1 horses can handle sugar and starch just as much as 2 can or cant... all horses are different and until the OP confirms that is what she's dealing with, I have bigger fish to fry then my terminology with you.  | |
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Location: in the ozone | cindyt - 2018-03-22 11:51 AM
slipperyslope - 2018-03-21 9:14 PM cindyt - 2018-03-19 9:39 AM roxieannie - 2018-03-19 9:13 AM slipperyslope - 2018-03-16 6:36 PM cindyt - 2018-03-16 1:53 PM kk_sue - 2018-03-15 4:51 PM lopnaround - 2018-03-15 3:35 PM I just reread your post. The camping out is a sure sign of kissing spine, but also could be tightness in muscles due to PSSM. Agree with above- xray back and test for PSSM 1 and 2. For now it wouldn't hurt to just swtich to a PSSM diet- low starch and sugar with Omega 3 and Omega 6 (Rice bran and Veg oil is what I use) along with a good amino acid, electrolyte, and Vit E supplement. Right now she is on pasture all day, gets alfalfa at night and gets 1/2 can of oats with Renew gold, vitamin E, electrolytes and MVP In-sync 4 There aren't any "carriers" of PSSM - whether it's type 1 or 2 - they either have it or they don't. (n/P1 HAS it for example, does not have to be P1/P1 ) And PSSM2 has NOTHING to do with starch & sugars and this horse has more of the symptoms & breeding towards PSSM2. Renew Gold has not been a good suggestion for PSSM2 either. Just a couple things to clear up since there is too much misinformation around anyway.
Each horse is different on what they can tolerate.
For now I would cut oats and see what kind of changes you see.
Price bran is an inflammation. But my guy does good on renew gold. Plus I've got him on golden paste. You can "read" all you want but live it to know for sure. And MANY PSSM2 horses have no problems with starch or sugar. Also people calling them "carriers" is very misleading ... way too many people say it that way to cover up a positive horse, symptomatic or not. MANY PSSM1 horses can handle sugar and starch just as much as 2 can or cant... all horses are different and until the OP confirms that is what she's dealing with, I have bigger fish to fry then my terminology with you.
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