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  Keeper of the King Snake
Posts: 7622
   
Location: Dubach, LA | I’m constantly telling my students that there are no do overs in real life. Now here goes barrel racing selling do overs. |
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 Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
 
Location: Displaced Iowegian | Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-04 11:19 AM classicpotatochip - 2018-04-04 10:56 AM SC Wrangler - 2018-04-03 6:32 PM casualdust07 - 2018-04-03 3:57 PM I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it. Agreed! In the big scheme of things buy backs don't have a big effect on my life. Generally the additional fees go into the pot, so just that much bigger payout. This. This. This. Why in the world does anyone care about somebody getting a buy back????? It’s just another entry, what’s the problem? Everybody gets the same option, sooo.... Somebody who got a buyback this weekend might not do it next weekend, for various reasons. I’ve bought repeat runs on occasion, when I either felt I could speed one up, or maybe I just needed to go in and slow one down. Expensive exhibition. Sometimes I’ve hauled for eight hours to be there and ****ed if I’m going to leave first barrel on its side without trying again. My business totally either way. I’ve been at more races with a buy back option than I’ve bought buybacks. My deal. If I go in and win it on a buy back, people shouldn’t get their panties in a twist, because they could’ve entered up the same as me. If I go in and slow one down because he was being a psycho, and I win the 5D with 10,000 added, welp, I’d chuckle all the way to bank!! Either way, everyone gets the option.
LOL .... kind of reminds me of the old adage "It's all about ME" (and screw you!) |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | NJJ - 2018-04-05 5:02 PM Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-04 11:19 AM classicpotatochip - 2018-04-04 10:56 AM SC Wrangler - 2018-04-03 6:32 PM casualdust07 - 2018-04-03 3:57 PM I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it. Agreed! In the big scheme of things buy backs don't have a big effect on my life. Generally the additional fees go into the pot, so just that much bigger payout. This. This. This. Why in the world does anyone care about somebody getting a buy back????? It’s just another entry, what’s the problem? Everybody gets the same option, sooo.... Somebody who got a buyback this weekend might not do it next weekend, for various reasons. I’ve bought repeat runs on occasion, when I either felt I could speed one up, or maybe I just needed to go in and slow one down. Expensive exhibition. Sometimes I’ve hauled for eight hours to be there and ****ed if I’m going to leave first barrel on its side without trying again. My business totally either way. I’ve been at more races with a buy back option than I’ve bought buybacks. My deal. If I go in and win it on a buy back, people shouldn’t get their panties in a twist, because they could’ve entered up the same as me. If I go in and slow one down because he was being a psycho, and I win the 5D with 10,000 added, welp, I’d chuckle all the way to bank!! Either way, everyone gets the option.
My thoughts too,, LOL  |
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Expert
Posts: 2122
Location: The Great Northwest | I would read the rules for the race. If the producer offers buy-backs after race starts, it should be a separate pot, if not ask for your money back.
Is the money going to the producer? Don't enter if the rules don't agree with you.
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Location: In my own little world | I do buybacks at some of my races. Why? Because they are smaller jackpots that are low key, a place where you can make some training runs, bring your Futurity colts to get some runs, be a big inning barrel racer or bring your open horse that needs a tuning run. It is darn sure not "greed" in my part. It's another entry fee plain and simple. And people like having this opportunity. In saying this, do I care for it st the American Semi's or real big races or Assn Finals, no I don't. But if it's spelled out in the rules ahead of time I know that people may take advantage of the opportunity to enter again. So it's in me whether I want to enter that race or not.
It's how I view all barrel races, either enter or don't enter. You don't like certain ground, don't go. Don't like the entry gate set up, don't go. Don't like all the addon fees, don't go. Don't like buybacks, don't go. And yes, there are do-overs in a lot of things in life. |
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Nut Case Expert
Posts: 9305
Location: Tulsa, Ok | ropenrun - 2018-04-06 1:24 AM I do buybacks at some of my races. Why? Because they are smaller jackpots that are low key, a place where you can make some training runs, bring your Futurity colts to get some runs, be a big inning barrel racer or bring your open horse that needs a tuning run. It is darn sure not "greed" in my part. It's another entry fee plain and simple. And people like having this opportunity. In saying this, do I care for it st the American Semi's or real big races or Assn Finals, no I don't. But if it's spelled out in the rules ahead of time I know that people may take advantage of the opportunity to enter again. So it's in me whether I want to enter that race or not. It's how I view all barrel races, either enter or don't enter. You don't like certain ground, don't go. Don't like the entry gate set up, don't go. Don't like all the addon fees, don't go. Don't like buybacks, don't go. And yes, there are do-overs in a lot of things in life.
To me it is just that simple. READ the facts and rules and then decide to run or NOT. Certainly not worth five minutes of whining time that could be spent smiling and riding. |
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 Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | barrel racing addict - 2018-04-04 1:42 PM Keepkick'n - 2018-04-04 10:46 AM Competition is where you go out and do your best. If you dont achieve your best, go home and practice some more. I think buy backs are part of the snowflake mentality where little Johnnie or Susie always get another chance. I like the way you put this Keepkick'n! Some people don't have that kind of money to even think about a buy back either like little Johnnie or Susie. Like any competition out there, it should be one shot. Whatever happens is going to happen. If you don't do well or like the outcome, go back home & practice, practice, practice. You don't see them doing this in football, basketball, or any of the olympic sports. You don't see it in any of the rodeo events so why have it in barrel racing?
Actually - they offer it at quite a few team ropings.... I don't know about other events. |
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Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | classicpotatochip - 2018-04-04 10:56 AM SC Wrangler - 2018-04-03 6:32 PM casualdust07 - 2018-04-03 3:57 PM I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it. Agreed! In the big scheme of things buy backs don't have a big effect on my life. Generally the additional fees go into the pot, so just that much bigger payout. This. This. This. Why in the world does anyone care about somebody getting a buy back????? It’s just another entry, what’s the problem? Everybody gets the same option, sooo.... Somebody who got a buyback this weekend might not do it next weekend, for various reasons. I’ve bought repeat runs on occasion, when I either felt I could speed one up, or maybe I just needed to go in and slow one down. Expensive exhibition. Sometimes I’ve hauled for eight hours to be there and ****ed if I’m going to leave first barrel on its side without trying again. My business totally either way. I’ve been at more races with a buy back option than I’ve bought buybacks. My deal. If I go in and win it on a buy back, people shouldn’t get their panties in a twist, because they could’ve entered up the same as me. If I go in and slow one down because he was being a psycho, and I win the 5D with 10,000 added, welp, I’d chuckle all the way to bank!! Either way, everyone gets the option.
Of all the things for people to get their panties in a wad over...this one is silly. The more entries, the better the race will pay - for EVERYONE - pretty much a win/win.
(and no, I've never bought back - but who knows - someday I might have the urge)
Edited by MS2011 2018-04-06 2:49 PM
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Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | NJJ - 2018-04-03 8:30 AM It boils down to "greed" ...... more money in the Producer's pocket !!! Kinda curious NJJ - Have you ever produced a BIG event? Why would you deem a producer 'greedy' for simply allowing more entries? It's also more money being paid back to the barrel racers.........
Edited by MS2011 2018-04-06 2:53 PM
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | MS2011 - 2018-04-06 2:52 PM NJJ - 2018-04-03 8:30 AM It boils down to "greed" ...... more money in the Producer's pocket !!! Kinda curious NJJ - Have you ever produced a BIG event? Why would you deem a producer 'greedy' for simply allowing more entries? It's also more money being paid back to the barrel racers.........
Why did you single out NJJ shes not the only one on here that feels like that? Just saying  |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | What kinda buged me about the buy backs is that some of the races I went to and thats been a pretty good while since I'm not running anymore, but once the books were closed they started to sell buybacks, to me once the books are closed they are closed.  |
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Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 3:29 PM What kinda buged me about the buy backs is that some of the races I went to and thats been a pretty good while since I'm not running anymore, but once the books were closed they started to sell buybacks, to me once the books are closed they are closed.
How do you know if you want a buy back, until after you've made your first run? It's an option - depending on how you run.
Most of the races around here leave books open until the last 25, 50 or the last horse. I despise that ancient rule that when the first horse runs, books are closed. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | MS2011 - 2018-04-06 4:08 PM Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 3:29 PM What kinda buged me about the buy backs is that some of the races I went to and thats been a pretty good while since I'm not running anymore, but once the books were closed they started to sell buybacks, to me once the books are closed they are closed.
Most of the races around here leave books open until the last 25, 50 or the last horse. I despise that ancient rule that when the first horse runs, books are closed.
I didnt say anything about the books being close after the first horse ran its usually close to the end of the race when books are closed.. If theres going to be any buy backs they need to have it in print or on the entry forms at least, been to a few and then its announced in the middle of the race about being able to buy buy backs after barrel racers have left after their runs, I didnt think it was fair for the ones that had made their runs and then left, so thats why I think they should have it on the entry forms that there will be buy backs so at least some will have the option to buy one are not. I said I dont like the buy backs but if they want buy backs then let others know so they can decide to run at that race or not. Like I said I dont care for them, but I'm not going to sit at a race and complain about them if I myself knew that they were going to have them at that time, but if they spring them on us during the middle of the barrel race then I do have a problem with that, and thats my opinion. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 3:25 PM MS2011 - 2018-04-06 2:52 PM NJJ - 2018-04-03 8:30 AM It boils down to "greed" ...... more money in the Producer's pocket !!! Kinda curious NJJ - Have you ever produced a BIG event? Why would you deem a producer 'greedy' for simply allowing more entries? It's also more money being paid back to the barrel racers.........
Still wondering when theres others on here that feel the same way as Norma? |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | I think buy backs are a bunch of crap. It is not the same as just another entry. It is allowing people with money to have practice runs. Maybe we can let the people with money buy up the first in the ground spots while we are at it
oh and i cant stand the argument or lack there of... i dont know why so many people get their panties in a wad over something so silly.
who says you get to proclaim what is silly. I think people who get upset over other people not in agreement are silly
flame away |
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Location: In my own little world | kwanatha - 2018-04-07 12:41 AM
 I think buy backs are a bunch of crap. It is not the same as just another entry. It is allowing people with money to have practice runs. Maybe we can let the people with money buy up the first in the ground spots while we are at it
oh and i cant stand the argument or lack there of... i dont know why so many people get their panties in a wad over something so silly.
who says you get to proclaim what is silly. I think people who get upset over other people not in agreement are silly
flame away
No flaming here. We are all entitled to our own way of thinking and reasons for it. Why isn't it "just another entry"? They could make a worse run than they did the 1st time, they could tip, they could break pattern. Their 1st run may have got them a check but the buyback run isn't going to get them a check (assuming they have to forfeit their 1st run like my rules are). Every entry fee is payout. Every entry is competition. It might be a 1D horse buying back or it might be a 4D horse. As far as it being an advantage to people with money, not necessarily. I feel its of great benefit for training purposes, however we all race for different reasons and that probably influences our way of thinking on this issue. I can think of several times I would have taken an advantage of making another run regardless if I was allowed to win money or not with it. But as I said before, I only like to see it at smaller, low dollar races. |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | ropenrun - 2018-04-07 12:49 AM kwanatha - 2018-04-07 12:41 AM I think buy backs are a bunch of crap. It is not the same as just another entry. It is allowing people with money to have practice runs. Maybe we can let the people with money buy up the first in the ground spots while we are at it
oh and i cant stand the argument or lack there of... i dont know why so many people get their panties in a wad over something so silly.
who says you get to proclaim what is silly. I think people who get upset over other people not in agreement are silly
flame away No flaming here. We are all entitled to our own way of thinking and reasons for it. Why isn't it "just another entry"? They could make a worse run than they did the 1st time, they could tip, they could break pattern. Their 1st run may have got them a check but the buyback run isn't going to get them a check (assuming they have to forfeit their 1st run like my rules are ). Every entry fee is payout. Every entry is competition. It might be a 1D horse buying back or it might be a 4D horse. As far as it being an advantage to people with money, not necessarily. I feel its of great benefit for training purposes, however we all race for different reasons and that probably influences our way of thinking on this issue. I can think of several times I would have taken an advantage of making another run regardless if I was allowed to win money or not with it. But as I said before, I only like to see it at smaller, low dollar races.
I still do not agree. Honestly i find most of the justification for them silly perhaps people need to learn how to lose. It is one of lifes most valuable lessons. I dont think appreciate a loser of the race getting to have a practice run then winning money. If it were for just for practice then ok. |
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 BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25352
Location: Bastrop, Texas | I’m not going to sit here and lambaste producers over their decision to offer buybacks. It’s easy and maybe popular amongst the masses to imply the producers are “greedy”. For those who wish to take this stance, I have a dirty little secret for you. Producers do what they do for two reasons: 1.) they love barrel racing, and 2.) they want to make money by producing a product (jackpots) that generates profit.
Some call it “greed” but I call it “profit motive”. I think it unfairly denigrates producers by calling them greedy, when the producers are the ones who are willing to get up off their asses and do something that will both promote the sport, while demonstrating to younger people that there may be a way to earn income while being involved in a sport we all claim to love. I see a lot of hypocrisy here. These people are the ones willing to take a chance and attempt to earn income in developing a product that, hopefully, expands and promotes the sport. I don’t like buybacks, personally, for reasons that people have exhaustively stated, but that’s up to a producer.
If you are so adamantly against buybacks, your b!tching and whining rings hollow if you are still willing to enter. On balance, over the course of a year, it may well be that a buyback policy winds up has no net effect on your winnings. In fact, it’s possible that you come out ahead.
Again, my main thrust here is that lambasting the “greedy” producers
is a cheap shot. You don’t like it? Fine....take your money elsewhere.
That’s the simple solution. If enough people do that, those same “greedy” producers will adjust accordingly. We are ALL greedy, when it comes to generating a profit from our hard work. |
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BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25352
Location: Bastrop, Texas | I’ll take this a step further. One can apply the same sort of argument to producers who offer “equal paybacks” at their 4D and 5D jackpots.
Producers don’t do this because they think it’s a nice gesture to those who don’t consistently run in the 1D. They do it because they think it is popular with many and will attract more entries. As with the “buyback” jackpots, “equal payout” jackpots will become more popular when producers have had a chance to evaluate their bottom line. That’s the beauty of free market capitalism.
I think the same basic kind of thinking is what gave rise to the “D” system in barrel racing, several years back. That system evolved out of a healthy profit motive, and the impact on our sport can’t be questioned.
“Greed is good”
- Gordon Gekko (also Ronald Reagan)
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Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 5:07 PM Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 3:25 PM MS2011 - 2018-04-06 2:52 PM NJJ - 2018-04-03 8:30 AM It boils down to "greed" ...... more money in the Producer's pocket !!! Kinda curious NJJ - Have you ever produced a BIG event? Why would you deem a producer 'greedy' for simply allowing more entries? It's also more money being paid back to the barrel racers.........
Edited by MS2011 2018-04-07 6:05 PM
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