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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 557
 
Location: Kansas and loving it | WYOracer - 2013-12-01 10:56 PM
I think she means the whole Bold Ruler colts were not known for running distance races and he won...smoked the field in the Belmont by 31 lengths proving everyone wrong on his ability to run distance.
I still disagree, Bold Ruler sired a chsmpion almost every year. He was well known and can be found in many champion horses pedigrees. While the barrel horses we are talking about have sires who only sired named champion. I would put John Henry in place of Secretariat. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 898
Location: Mountains of VA | rockette - 2013-12-01 8:50 PM hotpaints - 2013-12-01 7:12 PM What people tend to forget...........the "stars" have to be aligned just right for any horse to become a GREAT horse. Scamper is the perfect example. Secretariat is another great example and I can think of many more.........Hotshot. Bloodlines, conformation, etc. go nowhere if not in the right hands at the right time.
PLUS, many GREAT horses are standing around in somebody's field or "gasp' in somebody's backyard. It just depends on how much money an owner is willing to spend to get the horse "proven". Heck, at the right show, barrel run, etc. any horse could be a 1st class horse. Actually I disagree with Secretariat being in that category. His sire Bold Ruler led th TB sire list 9 times. His dam Something Royal was the daughter of an English triple Crown winner, she also produced stakes winner Sir Gaylord.
I admit that I am not that "up" on TB racing facts. However, just how many star race horses did Secretariat produce, male or female? Here in Virginia, Secretariat is considered a fluke that was never able to successfully reproduce equal to or better than himself.
I also have a perfect example here at my farm. We own a TB mare sired by Rahy. The year her dam was bred for her, his stud fee was $10,000. As a race horse he was a phenom but as a sire he was a dink. However, he is considered a broodmare sire and his grandget have done extremely well. So for example, cloning Rahy would be a waste of money and time IMO. |
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"aint no Barbie"
Posts: 2272
Location: san antonio texas | For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby?? |
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  More bootie than waist!
Posts: 18425
 
Location: Riding Crackhead. | carlos - 2013-12-02 8:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby??
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 Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | CYA Ranch - 2013-12-02 8:14 AM carlos - 2013-12-02 8:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby??
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 Left Out
Posts: 6797
Location: Silex Missouri | carlos - 2013-12-02 8:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby??
I don't think there is one person on this thread who has stated that they "hate Clayton and his babies". I have read this thread several times. The debate, by some, is will the success or failure of this first crop be the determining factor as to if he is a successful stallion. Another point is was it genetics people were after or the expression of those genetics. But not once did I see someone on this particular thread say they hated him or his offspring. Heck for that matter not sure why it is that big of a deal. There are a lot of barrel racers who don't want to or won't own a horse with Beduino bloodlines. Clayton is no different. there will be those who are against cloning .There are those who are mad because people chose to clone their horses and now AQHA is being forced to register those foals. But again, I have not seen anyone say they hated Clayton or his offspring. Any young sire is open to scrutinizing. Whether or not they have produced a one horse wonder or if they are a flop. It's part of the owning of a stallion. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2097
Location: Deep South | willyturnit - 2013-12-02 8:38 AM
carlos - 2013-12-02 8:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby??
I don't think there is one person on this thread who has stated that they "hate Clayton and his babies". I have read this thread several times. The debate, by some, is will the success or failure of this first crop be the determining factor as to if he is a successful stallion. Another point is was it genetics people were after or the expression of those genetics. But not once did I see someone on this particular thread say they hated him or his offspring. Heck for that matter not sure why it is that big of a deal. There are a lot of barrel racers who don't want to or won't own a horse with Beduino bloodlines. Clayton is no different. there will be those who are against cloning .There are those who are mad because people chose to clone their horses and now AQHA is being forced to register those foals. But again, I have not seen anyone say they hated Clayton or his offspring. Any young sire is open to scrutinizing. Whether or not they have produced a one horse wonder or if they are a flop. It's part of the owning of a stallion.
Well said. |
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Hungarian Midget Woman
Location: Midwest | carlos - 2013-12-02 8:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby??
I'll take one... if someone has one they hate... I will do them that favor....just throwing that out there lol |
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Miss Southern Sunshine
Posts: 7427
Location: South Central Florida | willyturnit - 2013-12-02 9:38 AM carlos - 2013-12-02 8:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby?? I don't think there is one person on this thread who has stated that they "hate Clayton and his babies". I have read this thread several times. The debate, by some, is will the success or failure of this first crop be the determining factor as to if he is a successful stallion. Another point is was it genetics people were after or the expression of those genetics. But not once did I see someone on this particular thread say they hated him or his offspring. Heck for that matter not sure why it is that big of a deal. There are a lot of barrel racers who don't want to or won't own a horse with Beduino bloodlines. Clayton is no different. there will be those who are against cloning .There are those who are mad because people chose to clone their horses and now AQHA is being forced to register those foals. But again, I have not seen anyone say they hated Clayton or his offspring. Any young sire is open to scrutinizing. Whether or not they have produced a one horse wonder or if they are a flop. It's part of the owning of a stallion.
This was well said. I happen to like cloning, I would bred to a clone in a second if I had the money. I don't think it's for everyone, but I did not see any Clayton bashing here.
My only problem with the cloning, is the court decission. I think someone should start a cloning registery. . .could be a part of AQHA or a private organization. I would like to see them registered. BUT I don't understand why the Government can force a private organization or association to set it's rules a certain way. Just seems intrusive...I know big shock. |
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| I am confused...Clayton is Scampers clone right? And clones cant be registered or can they? And can you enter horses in the BFA that arent registered for proof of age? |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | c-mae - 2013-12-02 9:29 AM I am confused...Clayton is Scampers clone right? And clones cant be registered or can they? And can you enter horses in the BFA that arent registered for proof of age?
Pretty sure you can enter non registered horses in BFA and several futurities with age verification by vet or whatever the governing rules say for each event. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1163
Location: Sapulpa, OK | I still think the mare is 80% of the genetic makeup of the foal...... so if he is only bred to good mares, he will produce. |
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Hungarian Midget Woman
Location: Midwest | palgalz - 2013-12-02 9:38 AM I still think the mare is 80% of the genetic makeup of the foal...... so if he is only bred to good mares, he will produce.
No....it's 50/50 nuclear DNA
Foal may take on more "behavioral" aspects from the mare from being raised by her...but in terms of genetic makeup, it's 50/50
Minus the mtDNA....but that is a VERY small segment of DNA... MUCH less than nuclear DNA |
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 Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | carlos - 2013-12-02 9:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby?? No they wont.. because a few people I have run across are dead set aganist them being successful.and I am not saying ones on this thread.... 
Edited by Bibliafarm 2013-12-02 10:09 AM
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 Angel in a Sorrel Coat
Posts: 16030
Location: In a happy place | carlos - 2013-12-02 7:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby??
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 557
Location: Kansas and loving it | hotpaints - 2013-12-02 6:53 AM
rockette - 2013-12-01 8:50 PM hotpaints - 2013-12-01 7:12 PM What people tend to forget...........the "stars" have to be aligned just right for any horse to become a GREAT horse. Scamper is the perfect example. Secretariat is another great example and I can think of many more.........Hotshot. Bloodlines, conformation, etc. go nowhere if not in the right hands at the right time.
PLUS, many GREAT horses are standing around in somebody's field or "gasp' in somebody's backyard. It just depends on how much money an owner is willing to spend to get the horse "proven". Heck, at the right show, barrel run, etc. any horse could be a 1st class horse. Actually I disagree with Secretariat being in that category. His sire Bold Ruler led th TB sire list 9 times. His dam Something Royal was the daughter of an English triple Crown winner, she also produced stakes winner Sir Gaylord.
I also have a perfect example here at my farm. We own a TB mare sired by Rahy. The year her dam was bred for her, his stud fee was $10,000. As a race horse he was a phenom but as a sire he was a dink. However, he is considered a broodmare sire and his grandget have done extremely well. So for example, cloning Rahy would be a waste of money and time IMO.
Ok, I get where you are coming from. I thought you meant Secretariat wad a fluke because Bold Ruler was not a good sire. Now I understand you mean Secretariat as a performer than sire. I gotcha now. I agree.  |
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"aint no Barbie"
Posts: 2272
Location: san antonio texas | willyturnit - 2013-12-02 8:38 AM carlos - 2013-12-02 8:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby?? I don't think there is one person on this thread who has stated that they "hate Clayton and his babies". I have read this thread several times. The debate, by some, is will the success or failure of this first crop be the determining factor as to if he is a successful stallion. Another point is was it genetics people were after or the expression of those genetics. But not once did I see someone on this particular thread say they hated him or his offspring. Heck for that matter not sure why it is that big of a deal. There are a lot of barrel racers who don't want to or won't own a horse with Beduino bloodlines. Clayton is no different. there will be those who are against cloning .There are those who are mad because people chose to clone their horses and now AQHA is being forced to register those foals. But again, I have not seen anyone say they hated Clayton or his offspring. Any young sire is open to scrutinizing. Whether or not they have produced a one horse wonder or if they are a flop. It's part of the owning of a stallion.
WO... wait a second I'm not starting a fight so please back off. OK OK hate is a strong word I threw it out there hastily and without thought so I apologize for saying "hate"... Please forgive me and move on from that. Just substitute the word "hate" for "don't like" or "has something against". |
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 Expert
Posts: 1691
Location: Pendleton, OR | All I have to say is... "Run Jack Run!" |
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Left Out
Posts: 6797
Location: Silex Missouri | carlos - 2013-12-02 12:28 PM willyturnit - 2013-12-02 8:38 AM carlos - 2013-12-02 8:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby?? I don't think there is one person on this thread who has stated that they "hate Clayton and his babies". I have read this thread several times. The debate, by some, is will the success or failure of this first crop be the determining factor as to if he is a successful stallion. Another point is was it genetics people were after or the expression of those genetics. But not once did I see someone on this particular thread say they hated him or his offspring. Heck for that matter not sure why it is that big of a deal. There are a lot of barrel racers who don't want to or won't own a horse with Beduino bloodlines. Clayton is no different. there will be those who are against cloning .There are those who are mad because people chose to clone their horses and now AQHA is being forced to register those foals. But again, I have not seen anyone say they hated Clayton or his offspring. Any young sire is open to scrutinizing. Whether or not they have produced a one horse wonder or if they are a flop. It's part of the owning of a stallion.
I'm not attacking you. I use larger font because it is easier for me to read. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1218
Location: Great NW | carlos - 2013-12-02 6:12 AM For those of you that hate Clayton and his babies.... So what's gonna happen when a few years from now some of you are at some barrel race somewhere and someone comes in and just smokes the field or just turns your head because this horse just looked nice and ran a nice set of cans. You go up and ask the person about his/her horse and it happens to be a Clayton baby!!! Cuz that's gonna happen.
Will you admit then that you actually complimented a horse that turned out to be a Clayton baby??
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