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  More bootie than waist!
Posts: 18425
    
Location: Riding Crackhead. | ThreeCorners - 2014-09-22 7:19 AM Anybody that doesnt think Dual Peppy was a marketable item and thinks the "economy" is reason enough he couldnt be sold doesnt have a clue what they are talking about. That horse is a NCHA World Champion!! FULL brother to Dual Pep. That horse alone would have and could have been sold for FAR more then it would cost to feed all the others very well for years to come!!!
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| CYA Ranch - 2014-09-22 7:23 AM ThreeCorners - 2014-09-22 7:19 AM Anybody that doesnt think Dual Peppy was a marketable item and thinks the "economy" is reason enough he couldnt be sold doesnt have a clue what they are talking about. That horse is a NCHA World Champion!! FULL brother to Dual Pep. That horse alone would have and could have been sold for FAR more then it would cost to feed all the others very well for years to come!!! Bravo
I agree, but if a horse owner is not going to take care of their horses, get rid of them regardless of how much you can sell them for. |
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 Saint Stacey
| There is no excuse for starving any horse, let alone a horse like Dual Peppy. As for the skeletal remains...it is illegal to bury a large animal in the state if CO due to ground water contamination. I'm not trying to support the owner by any means or excuss the condition of the animals. But maybe covering them in lime and tarping the bodies was her way if disposing of them by not burying them. I know a guy that lives by me dumps the bodies of his dead cows in his aug pond right by the highway and let's Mother Nature take her course. It's gross. But it's legal. I also have to question why the State wasn't contacted by anyone. The State has a division that specializes in large animal cruelty. The El Paso County Sheriffs,all the horse rescue ggroups, the media, etc didn't contact them. Why? Seems to me they would be the first place to contact. Yes, the condition of the horses is wrong and something needs to be done. But I think there us a lot more to the story than meets the eye. Especially given that the main group that specializes in these cases has yet to be contacted. |
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Tried and True
Posts: 21185
Location: Where I am happiest | bingo - 2014-09-21 4:57 PM I have to disagree w/you Jbhoot. I think the reason more and more of this is happening is BECAUSE these horses CAN'T be sold. The horse market is OVERLY flooded with horses no one wants. The proof is in situations just like this. Maybe these horses that died were sick from an illness that spread through the herd. maybe they weren't starved. Maybe selling them wasn't even an option. Time will tell hopefully, but it does not take much research to understand what is going on with the horse market. Our economy is bad, just keeping horses is expensive. Add to that an over abundance of unwanted animals and their prices go spiraling downward fast. How many people remember the arabian horse pyramid scheme that went on back in the 80's, maybe 70's? Do you remember the absolutely over bloated prices put on Arabians? Where are all these "valuable" animals now? HHHmmm..... no market for them, is there. I am afraid this is what's going on now. The poor horses are the one's to suffer when people can no longer sell them, or afford to keep those they have bred, and can't sell. The answer, stop breeding so many. Make them valuable again. Just like gold, and diamonds. As the commodity goes down, the price goes up. This is an extremely sad situation. It will be interesting to see what becomes of the owner.
Whaaaatttt????
Lets put this inanother perspective maybe you can understand. This situation, and the stallion involved would be the equivilent of starving Slick By Design, Firewateronetherocks, Epic Leader, or Blazen Jetolena and someone comming along saying "Well the economy is bad", "the horse market is bad" blah blah blah. Are you freaking kidding me?????????????????????????????????????????????? There is ALWAYS a market, and a VERY GOOD market for those individuals! |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1182
Location: Do I hear Banjos? | One thing that seems to happen in all of these cases is that it's never just a matter of "couldn't afford to feed them properly". I'd like the defenders on here to explain to me why if this is all some misunderstanding and there is a good explanation why these folks are not criminally liable for cruelty...WHY is it that along with being emaciated (or dead)...the horses are living in filth? A muck fork and a shovel don't cost a lot. (They had the cash to buy tarps for the dead ones) But see...then these people might actually have to lift a finger and care for these animals.
In my mind the horrible filthy conditions speak to a clear case of neglect. They can say the dead ones got into blister beetles or coliced or whatever lies and justification they would like to make up....but the fact is...if they gave a rats behind about these animals they would have been taking care of them. Not leaving them standing in crap in a barn full of dead horses. They could have reached out for help to get the dead ones removed. But I'm guessing they knew if they did someone would report the conditions the others were in and they would be in deep poop themselves.
Any on here saying Oh the economy is bad...they couldn't sell them...I say Horse pucky. Show me proof that this heartless owner tried to get help...tried to sell...contacted vets or rescue groups anything. Otherwise...I'm not buying the excuses.
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Tried and True
Posts: 21185
Location: Where I am happiest | TrailGirl - 2014-09-22 7:51 AM One thing that seems to happen in all of these cases is that it's never just a matter of "couldn't afford to feed them properly". I'd like the defenders on here to explain to me why if this is all some misunderstanding and there is a good explanation why these folks are not criminally liable for cruelty...WHY is it that along with being emaciated (or dead)...the horses are living in filth? A muck fork and a shovel don't cost a lot. (They had the cash to buy tarps for the dead ones) But see...then these people might actually have to lift a finger and care for these animals.
In my mind the horrible filthy conditions speak to a clear case of neglect. They can say the dead ones got into blister beetles or coliced or whatever lies and justification they would like to make up....but the fact is...if they gave a rats behind about these animals they would have been taking care of them. Not leaving them standing in crap in a barn full of dead horses. They could have reached out for help to get the dead ones removed. But I'm guessing they knew if they did someone would report the conditions the others were in and they would be in deep poop themselves.
Any on here saying Oh the economy is bad...they couldn't sell them...I say Horse pucky. Show me proof that this heartless owner tried to get help...tried to sell...contacted vets or rescue groups anything. Otherwise...I'm not buying the excuses.
Exactly!!!!
My Dad always said "The only excuse is there is NO excuse". |
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 Angel in a Sorrel Coat
Posts: 16030
Location: In a happy place | I am like Roxie....I can't look. These poor animals depend on someone to take care of them. They trust people to do this. To take an animal that had once won so much and was obviously pampered then to get to this point.
This is just wrong.
Some of these posts show just how far in the toilet our world and our thinking has gone.
I hope this person never sees the light of day again. As far as I am concerned there is no excuse for poor animals to be treated like this. She could have gotten someone to take them some how some way.
Cruel beyond words. |
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 Proud to be Deplorable
Posts: 1929
| SKM - 2014-09-22 7:45 AM
There is no excuse for starving any horse, let alone a horse like Dual Peppy. As for the skeletal remains...it is illegal to bury a large animal in the state if CO due to ground water contamination. I'm not trying to support the owner by any means or excuss the condition of the animals. But maybe covering them in lime and tarping the bodies was her way if disposing of them by not burying them. I know a guy that lives by me dumps the bodies of his dead cows in his aug pond right by the highway and let's Mother Nature take her course. It's gross. But it's legal. I also have to question why the State wasn't contacted by anyone. The State has a division that specializes in large animal cruelty. The El Paso County Sheriffs,all the horse rescue ggroups, the media, etc didn't contact them. Why? Seems to me they would be the first place to contact. Yes, the condition of the horses is wrong and something needs to be done. But I think there us a lot more to the story than meets the eye. Especially given that the main group that specializes in these cases has yet to be contacted.
This just came out on Friday so maybe they will be brought in today. There is a campaign to call every one in government today going on the face book page. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 507
Location: Lost in the corn of Iowa. | I can't watch anymore and not chime in. I agree that this is wrong in every sense of the word and the person or persons involved should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. But sadly this happens all the time. Just because it is a famous NCHA horse are we hearing about it at this national level. And I don't buy the horse market is crap and the horse can't be sold. It doesn't matter what the horse is worth, do what's best for the horse. If you knew a 5 figure horse was gonna be fat n sassy in a 4H'r backyard then sell the dang thing for $100, do what's best for the horse not your purse strings. Or do what people in Texas did when that huge hay shortage and drought happened. Idk, I think it was 10-12 yrs ago. They hauled horses and cows to other areas of the country and auctioned them off knowing that they would've probably starved to death where they were currently at. So this excuse of they couldn't sell the horses for their value is a load of bull. You can rant and rave all you want but you have to let the law work, right or wrong we just have to let this play out. |
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 Good Grief!
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Location: Cap'n Joan Rotgut.....alberta | saying the horse economy is bad is a pretty poor excuse to do this to any horse.......
and you ever notice how the pond scum that starve horses are pretty plump and well fed them selves.........i have no use for any animal starver.....NONE and there are NO EXCUSES...........
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 Knowledge is Power
Posts: 4051
Location: wherever my daughter's running | This is extremely hard to look at. These horse certainly did not deserve this and I pray someone intervenes very soon. I have rescued a horse from someone that was fat and actually grilling him a steak on his deck when I went to get the horse. He was a lazy, uncaring, jacka** and that may well be the case with the owner of these horses and if it is I hope she gets the book thrown at her. On the flip side if she is hoarder that sheds a whole new light on the situation. My mother is a hoarder so I know first hand how they think. Thankfully she hoards material things not living creatures. There is no reasoning with people like her. They value (in their mind) what they have amassed. IT does not matter if it is at the botton of a pile that reaches the ceiling it is the fact that can say oh I have one of those - and they say it in such a proud way you would think it was beautifully displayed - not burried under junk. They love and value having these possession but do not in any way take care of them. It is a horrible illness that destorys families. These people are very guarded and slick about how to prevent people for seeing how they really live. My mother is well put together when she goes out and you would never know the way she lives. I have cleaned out - up - and thrown away and her response was that since I threw away a plastic chicken not to consider myself her daughter anymore. I am her only child and I know for a fact she loves her stuff far more than she loves me. She refuses counseling - and I don't have the heart to committ her. This is the reality of the other possibility as to why this woman did this. |
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 The Original Cyber Bartender
Location: Washington | cruise - 2014-09-22 7:45 AM This is extremely hard to look at. These horse certainly did not deserve this and I pray someone intervenes very soon. I have rescued a horse from someone that was fat and actually grilling him a steak on his deck when I went to get the horse. He was a lazy, uncaring, jacka** and that may well be the case with the owner of these horses and if it is I hope she gets the book thrown at her. On the flip side if she is hoarder that sheds a whole new light on the situation. My mother is a hoarder so I know first hand how they think. Thankfully she hoards material things not living creatures. There is no reasoning with people like her. They value (in their mind) what they have amassed. IT does not matter if it is at the botton of a pile that reaches the ceiling it is the fact that can say oh I have one of those - and they say it in such a proud way you would think it was beautifully displayed - not burried under junk. They love and value having these possession but do not in any way take care of them. It is a horrible illness that destorys families. These people are very guarded and slick about how to prevent people for seeing how they really live. My mother is well put together when she goes out and you would never know the way she lives. I have cleaned out - up - and thrown away and her response was that since I threw away a plastic chicken not to consider myself her daughter anymore. I am her only child and I know for a fact she loves her stuff far more than she loves me. She refuses counseling - and I don't have the heart to committ her. This is the reality of the other possibility as to why this woman did this.
 's
This is why there should no discussing with this person who has these animals, they feel they are fine. Get the animals out of there and let them wear the coat of victim hood proudly. We all agree that the only victims here are the four legged ones.
Hope to read later today thay they have been taken away from this person...
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 Playing the Waiting Game
Posts: 2304
| SG. - 2014-09-21 9:25 PM suzy2qtee - 2014-09-21 9:18 PM SG. - 2014-09-21 9:14 PM suzy2qtee - 2014-09-21 9:11 PM Stitch4k9 - 2014-09-21 8:37 PM suzy2qtee - 2014-09-21 8:01 PM Stitch4k9 - 2014-09-21 7:44 PM Bingo,
I don't know where you are located. But................ Colorado's economy is booming. The cutting community in CO would have bought these animals had they known there was a dire need. And while you are researching............ cutting prices are not as high as they once were.
Having dealt with a number of these situations. Both equine and canine. It rarely is because of the economy. It becomes a hording situation which is sadly a mental illness.
With that said there is plenty of blame to pass around on this situation. What happened to family members who have been involved with these horses in the past? How about others in the CO cutting community who didn't notice that this woman and her horses dropped from site? How about neighbors? Heck evan the local feed store should have wondered what happened.
Until everyone stops pointing fingers of blame and starts to take some responsibility to check on each other we will not solve much of anything.
karen
karen While the economy may be booming the horse industry has NOT.
Depends on what and where. Good horses are still bringing decent prices. This is an area where ranch geldings are in demand and families pay dearly for 4-h and High School Rodeo prospects.
These horses could have been sold.
karen
In no way was I saying there is an excuse for what has happened to these poor creatures. I was just responding to the fact that the horse industry is still in a downcline. Yes I feel that those horses could of had a place if the irresponsible care takers hadn't failed them. But to place blame on the FEED store and NEIGHBORS?? My neighbors wouldn't have any idea of what is happening at my place, the closest one is over 3/4 miles away. |
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 Shipwrecked and Flat Out Zapped
Posts: 16390
Location: DUMPING CATS AND PIGS IN TEXAS :) | Did anyone already say who exactly owns the horses right now? |
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Proud to be Deplorable
Posts: 1929
| LRQHS - 2014-09-22 10:22 AM
Did anyone already say who exactly owns the horses right now?
The Dual peppy Partnership. Rick and Sherry Brunzel are one of the partners and are in charge of care. Don't know if there are any other partners in this.
Edited by jbhoot 2014-09-22 10:31 AM
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Shipwrecked and Flat Out Zapped
Posts: 16390
Location: DUMPING CATS AND PIGS IN TEXAS :) | jbhoot - 2014-09-22 10:28 AM LRQHS - 2014-09-22 10:22 AM Did anyone already say who exactly owns the horses right now? The Dual Partnership. Rick and Sherry Brunzel are one of the partners and are in charge of care. Don't know if there are any other partners in this.
And, he came from the Babcock Ranch, right? Sold in the bankruptsy sale, right? Was he still breeding? |
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Blessed 
Location: Here | LRQHS - 2014-09-22 10:22 AM Did anyone already say who exactly owns the horses right now?
1992 Stallion
SIRE DAM MATERNAL GRANDSIRE
1089924PEPPY SAN BADGER1615218MISS DUAL DOC0986607DOC'S REMEDY
DESCRIPTIONNAMEADDRESSDATE OF SALEDATE TRANSFER RECORDED
BREEDER :GREG AND/OR LAURA WARDTULARE, CAN/AN/A
CURRENT OWNER :DUAL PEPPY PARTNERSCOLORADO SPRINGS, CO01/30/1998
2ND PREV OWNER :GREG AND/OR LAURA WARDTULARE, CA03/27/1992N/A
Edited by SG. 2014-09-22 10:37 AM
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 Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | There is a fb page, Justic for Dual Pep that has contact phone numbers and information on it. Babcock is trying to get him back. |
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Shipwrecked and Flat Out Zapped
Posts: 16390
Location: DUMPING CATS AND PIGS IN TEXAS :) | SG. - 2014-09-22 10:36 AM LRQHS - 2014-09-22 10:22 AM Did anyone already say who exactly owns the horses right now?
1992 Stallion
SIRE DAM MATERNAL GRANDSIRE
1089924PEPPY SAN BADGER1615218MISS DUAL DOC0986607DOC'S REMEDY
DESCRIPTIONNAMEADDRESSDATE OF SALEDATE TRANSFER RECORDED
BREEDER :GREG AND/OR LAURA WARDTULARE, CAN/AN/A
CURRENT OWNER :DUAL PEPPY PARTNERSCOLORADO SPRINGS, CO01/30/1998
2ND PREV OWNER :GREG AND/OR LAURA WARDTULARE, CA03/27/1992N/A
Sorry I'm asking so many questions lol just confused....so, where is the Babcock Ranch in this equation? |
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Saint Stacey
| JMHO but if it wasn't for Babcock's poor business practices, Dual Peppy never would have been put in this situation to begin with. Seems to me that they don't deserve him back either. Now I'm going to have to Google. Seems like he was sold when Babcock's declared bankruptcy a few years ago. I could be wrong though.
Edited by SKM 2014-09-22 10:48 AM
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