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 Jr. Detective
    
Location: Beggs, OK | LDH - 2015-07-09 11:53 PM Also just wanted to add she has NEVER in her life reared like she did. She hardly even get shot going in the gate. Could this be a sign of bleeding? She hasn't bled out and she doesn't cough after I run, but maybe this is like an early sign? Also the videos from tonight are in the original post!
My daughter's little mare started having some anxiety in the alley that led to full on panic before her runs...Then she started getting much stronger in her turns and elevating leaving her barrels. Â I suspected bleeding as a possible issue, but when we scoped her we found a HORRIBLE lower respiratory infection. Â She hadn't coughed or shown us any sign of an issue, other than starting to behave badly in the alley and pulling through her turns. Â Once we got it cleared up she's been back to her normal soft faced self, but she's fighting to get IN the pen now because she wants to run.Â
I finally got a chance to watch the videos .....the horse is not the problem. Find someone that can help you with some lessons and get comfortable just letting her go do her job.
Edited by rachellyn80 2015-07-12 11:52 AM
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Veteran
Posts: 227
Location: Heart of Texas | I would get professional help. From a professional barrel racer. If you feel like she's perfectly healthy, you'd know best. And you already said YOU need help. So get it. I took a lesson with Kay Blanford and it completely changed my riding. Just one hour. I consider myself a good rider. But she was like do A, B, C and it all clicked. The next race we were a half second faster. That's how Fallon won the NFR. She went back to basics and enlisted a good personal trainer. She didn't do it by herself. There's no shame getting help. Clinics are nice but i would get one on one. Especially since this looks to be a dangerous situation. |
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Location: I am not sure most days | I will say I do not consider myself a professional and I have NO world titles but, I have been around horses all of my life and the best horses I ever put my daughter on AND she did well on were the ones that no one else wanted! lol Plus I am the Queen of slowing a horse down. This is a very nice mare and I fee for you because for me this is one of the hardest things to fix! It is hard to control your nerves and stay relaxed and soft handed on a crotch rocket like this!! lol I have a very nice running bred mare that I traded for many years ago and like you I could do whatever I wanted in the pasture with her and she had all of the basics down pat I could run a nice pattern at home but ,she,had been pushed as a futurity horse before I got her and as soon as you took her to a barrel race she became a different horse. I could ride up to the alley and she would stand and not act stupid, she went in fine but the clue was mentally she was a mess. Most people associate a mental problem with a horse that acts all stupid but all of them handle the pressure differently some dance around and spin and get all hyper then others seem to get dull and calm and quiet then they explode when least expected. (this is what my mare did and if I touched her on the barrel pattern she would jump out of the turn or leap up kind of like your mare is doing). I did not have the experience then to fix her at the barrel race and to this day this makes me sick. Basics are a great thing to have but once the basics are there for slow work you have to get them at speed also, and this is where finding someone that understands this is hard, in my opinion, because you have to think outside of traditional methods to fix this. For example, to me you do need to go back to some slow work but it needs to be work that keeps her feet busy and soft. If I was exhibitioning this mare I would go in and have her do multiple circles on the way to the first barrel with a lot of forward motion and push her into the bit then I would break he down to a walk around the barrel and still do at least 3 small circles around the barrel, again keep forward motion and push her into the bit, one circle going into the turn, one circle on the back side of the turn and one circle leaving the turn, pick up a trot and if she even remotely feels chargey or throws her head up push her into a circle to the left (maintain your direction to the 2nd barrel) and when you come out of the circle to head to the barrel give her the chance again to stay relaxed again if she raises her head or gets chargy put her in the circle, keep doing this throughout the whole pattern then allow her to walk home (if she wont walk home don't get in a fight and pull on her, put her back to work doing small forward motion circles all the way back out the alley then put her to work outside of the barrel pen until it is time to go back in and start over. All of this can be practiced at home also which is where I would start since you said she gets excited during practice at home too. This helps my hotter blooded horses a lot this keeps me from pulling on them which just irritates the snot out of them. Break it down at home, maybe just start out at a trot until that feels good and only work one barrel and one direction one day then when she feels good sit down and allow her to stop and think about it then walk away and go trail ride. I will add, this will not happen overnight but, with time and consistancy it has helped mine and you can adapt this in so many different ways. |
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 Balance Beam and more...
Posts: 11511
Location: 31 lengths farms | When you go work cows in what way are you working them? Just gathering them or in a round pen or flat pen and turning them back? Turning cows back will help teach one a lot about natural rate.
In the first video the first thing I noticed was you seem to kind of be hanging on her head headed to the first...I noticed because I tend to do the same thing to my gelding at times and what happens is then you get to the first and want to rate and you pull some more but you've been pulling from the get go and sending them anyway and pretty soon they aren't sure if you are just pulling because or if you actually want/need them to listen up. Been there done that, not meaning it as a jab at all.
She looks like she has some good things about her, but I also see a horse that is panicking a little too headed into the turn which brings her head up and drops her back and then her butt end falls out on her making her stride long where it should be short and dynamic. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 807
Location: New Mexico | I disagree with most everyone here about the rearing. I feel sometimes that we make a bigger deal about the alley than the horse and a lot of times are the creator of the problem. Someone else said "she wanted to run". I agree. Don't make mountains out of mole hills and don't spend so much time in the alley and I think the problem will take care of itself. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1857
| crzystevielvr - 2015-07-10 1:55 PM
I disagree with most everyone here about the rearing. I feel sometimes that we make a bigger deal about the alley than the horse and a lot of times are the creator of the problem. Someone else said "she wanted to run". I agree. Don't make mountains out of mole hills and don't spend so much time in the alley and I think the problem will take care of itself.
yep 
you look a little stiff and heavy with your hands during the run and I would say that it made her nervous and panic. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 227
Location: Soon to be outta here:) | I fully admit that a lot of it is me, and I agree with everyone that I need professional help... so that being said.... who does everyone suggest? I am located in Minnesota, I'm willing to travel but if I have to go very far I won't be able to go very often. Suggestions on people to go to would be great!
Also, a little background on her that I don't really think I've given. She was bought off the track, within a week (had no more training than track training) she was sold to a girl who had her running in the 2d at big barrel races around here in 30 days. The girl stuck a tie down and big bit on her and ran her until she started getting so hot and crazy that she couldn't handle her. She then sold her to a friend of mine who turned her out completely for over 6 months. She told me that the mare doesn't like bits and I should run her in a hack. However, I have tried running in a hack and needless to say, that didn't work lol. After being with her and turned out for 6 months another friend of mine bought her and took her down to Texas where she was with pj burger for a little while getting training, and then worked with my friends aunt. I was young when I bought her, and my firmed was a lot older and I trusted her a lot. She told me that she had her running in the 2d down there, but still has never shown me the video. But when she was telling me how to ride her after I bought her, she always told me to hold her back going to first, so that's what I tried to do. Before zip I ran a little cow horse, so my natural instinct was to just throw the reins forward and my friend drilled into me that I can't do that. She used to tell me to hold her to the time line, but I felt like that just made z so mad she wouldn't want to turn anyways, so I gave up on that. But I think part of why I'm so terrible n her face was because when I first started riding her after I bought her I was told to pretty much hold on her. Now I need to work really hard to change my instincts on her to just let her go as opposed to holding her.
My biggest fear is making her gate sour or turning her into a blown up horse. I want to avoid that at all costs. That being said, suggestions for people to take her to for lessons would be awesome!
Thank you! |
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 Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | Am I the only one here that sees the problem? If you think you can override nature, you are mistaken. |
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 Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | I had a horse like her....I was too stupid to slow him down and I blew him up. My advice would be to haul her, but make her lope controlled through the whole pattern. I think an Ed Wright clinic would suit this horse best.
What Ed Wright told me, is that I kept checking my horse, giving it back, checking, giving it back. By the time it's time to ACTUALLY rate, I had asked too many times and he gave me the bird. |
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Veteran
Posts: 227
Location: Soon to be outta here:) | komet. - 2015-07-11 1:23 AM
Am I the only one here that sees the problem? If you think you can override nature, you are mistaken.
Override nature as in that this horse isn't meant to be a barrel horse or...? |
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 Peat and Repeat
Posts: 2773
Location: IN MY OWN LITTLE WORLD AT LEAST THEY KNOW ME HERE | Jmo-
Get her ovaries checked- soreness during a heat cycle for some mares is very painful.
I'm a oddball mare person and love mares.
Mare is ran for many yrs came n cycle so hard and was horrible and a nasty ho. Lol for lack of a better term.
Had a mare marble put in by vet. Fixed her right up.
My young mare currently riding?
Slowed down from 1/2 d to 3/4d????
Quit eating and tried several feeds
Vitamins added
B12 shots
Back soreness.
Addressed Fitted w new saddle
Back, legs, Hocks AND stifles xrayed n injected and go hand n hand
Teeth kept floated
Changed feed
Ulcer ck scoped no ulcers and treated just because
So
Took her back to vet and had ovaries checked and YEP she gets huge and sore
So having mare marble put in.
Now I will say and add to this---
I have done some research and have talked to several vets. Race track n big hosp lameness vets on the magnetic blankets.
My chiro n race track. Has had a race client w 3 colts that stared reacting as to irratic behavior, bucking etc that previously didn't.
The owners had added daily magnetic blankets to the program.
One gelding started tying up n did so 2 times.
This vet advises them to stop using magnetics and behavior n symptoms stopped.
With that being said vet told me that some it helps and some it doesn't.
So try pulling this away from her and get the ovaries checked and see what you got.
FYI---
Folks DO NOT bash or send me any unsavory comments/messages to me on the magnetics as I AM NOT KNOCKING tHE USEAGE OR SUCCESS with them.
Just passing on a professional successful race track vets advise.
Original poster- I so hope u find your mares problem and get it fixed.
Vet bills n mystery problems make me tired :0/
Edited by Yakima 2015-07-11 8:55 AM
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Veteran
Posts: 227
Location: Soon to be outta here:) | Yakima - 2015-07-11 8:46 AM
Jmo-
Get her ovaries checked- soreness during a heat cycle for some mares is very painful.
I'm a oddball mare person and love mares.
Mare is ran for many yrs came n cycle so hard and was horrible and a nasty ho. Lol for lack of a better term.
Had a mare marble put in by vet. Fixed her right up.
My young mare currently riding?
Slowed down from 1/2 d to 3/4d????
Quit eating and tried several feeds
Vitamins added
B12 shots
Back soreness.
Addressed Fitted w new saddle
Back, legs, Hocks AND stifles xrayed n injected and go hand n hand
Teeth kept floated
Changed feed
Ulcer ck scoped no ulcers and treated just because
So
Took her back to vet and had ovaries checked and YEP she gets huge and sore
So having mare marble put in.
Now I will say and add to this---
I have done some research and have talked to several vets. Race track n big hosp lameness vets on the magnetic blankets.
My chiro n race track. Has had a race client w 3 colts that stared reacting as to irratic behavior, bucking etc that previously didn't.
The owners had added daily magnetic blankets to the program.
One gelding started tying up n did so 2 times.
This vet advises them to stop using magnetics and behavior n symptoms stopped.
With that being said vet told me that some it helps and some it doesn't.
So try pulling this away from her and get the ovaries checked and see what you got.
FYI---
Folks DO NOT bash or send me any unsavory comments/messages to me on the magnetics as I AM NOT KNOCKING tHE USEAGE OR SUCCESS with them.
Just passing on a professional successful race track vets advise.
Original poster- I so hope u find your mares problem and get it fixed.
Vet bills n mystery problems make me tired :0/
She does have TERRIBLE heat cycles. When she's in heat, which is pretty much all the time, she leans on walls with her hip, she is constantly squatting and is just a pain. When I first bought her I couldn't do anything at all with her when she was in heat. She was crazy. She wouldn't even walk in a circle and if you put a leg on her she would freak out. She was on an injectable regumate but she stated swelling up huge and painful every time she was given the shot, it didn't matter who did it, me or a vet or where we did it. She would swell up at the injection site and it would be very painful. Since I couldn't figure that out I put her on regumate, which kept her out of heat but all of the videos from last year are her on regulate daily, so it really didn't help that much. Then last fall I took her down to a vet in Oklahoma who injects the space around her ovaries. She felt like a new horse after she had that done. She will still come into heat though, so I'm wondering if it doesn't last very long. She ran great the first few times after she had it done, but now we are back to the old same stuff. It does help an amazing amount after its been done though. Out of all the injections she's had, I noticed the biggest difference after getting her ovaries done.
She has had a complete reproductive exam, although she was NOT in heat when they did it, it was kind of a spur of the moment thing so I didn't have it planned out to when she would be in heat. I have heard a lot about the marble thing, I actually think she maybe had one for a little while with a previous owner, although I'm not sure how much it helped. But she was also an ulcer-y hot mess when I bought her so if the marble didn't work, it could have been one of the other 300 things that she needed worked on causing no improvement.
Do you know how much have the marble put in costs? Is it dangerous at all to them, have any negative side effects? Can any vet do that or would I need to talk to a specialist?
Her heat cycles are for sure a lingering problem, I was just hoping that now that I can ride her during her heat cycles that the injections helped enough that they would be all she needed. But since she still does come into heat, I guess that could be an issue still!
As for magnets I only use them rarely on her, I do have a blanket but I only put it on every once in a while, not even before every run |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 742
| If you can keep a marble in, it could help but I have never known anyone that their mares could keep them in. When they gave the Regumate/progest shot was it water based or oil based? My vet tries to only use water based so the chances of abscessing are minimal.
If I were you I would definitely go back to basics in training and not even worry about the barrel pattern for months and treat the heat cycles and the possible ulcers with Ulcergard. |
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 Expert
Posts: 3815
Location: The best kept secret in TX | I am by no means an expert. And I haven't read all the comments.
However, I would have to agree with komet. You look really stiff in the video where she reared up. Let her go. She looks like a high calibur horse and in my opinion you ride well. You just look stiff and keep your arms in the same position it seems (holding her back). Lots of pent up energy in her and a hard runner at that. Spending less time in the alley way and letting her run instead of holding her back may help a lot. |
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | https://youtu.be/Xq-Vst3pO9M
OK I pondered to post because I dont want to sound harsh so please dont take this wrong.. but get help ..
IN the video above of you at home...From the minute you stepped on she was in control (she walked off right away) and your body langauge is saying go.. the energy level in these type horses.. their brain is on overdrive.. so its up to us as riders to calm and take it down a notch ... and yes I realize shes a barrel horse.. but they also need control and relaxation. its not all about the GO and the SPEED..I see you getting on and she walks off right away in a hyped up mode and you allow it.. I dont see any walking or suppling or flexing and getting her to relax.. these type horses need that and sometimes thats all these type horses need.. I dont think you have the tools yet to ride this horse properly without her blowing up at some point her brain..so a great trainer and the right one will help... I feel she should be evauluated and her feed program to. she and you have high nervous energy and the combo will end up a disaster for her and you... right now shes to much horse for you imho....and the video person in background just intensifies it..yelling ..sorry just my thoughts..mare needs calm reassurance and shes flying high in the videos.
I personally would not have paired you two up and not saying that in a bad way.. good luck I know your trying to do whats best so find a good trainer for you and her.please dont take this wrong its just how I see this from my perspective.
and this comment from your first post contradicts the videos.
..She's broke to death off barrels, I ride her in a snaffle, she works like a charm. She's off the track and the girl who bought her started her too fast too soon so I bought her quite a bit blown up. Anyone who has any sort of advice at all, please share. We do tons of slow work, rate every single time we get to a barrel
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10D Crack Champion
| I don't know anything about anything so keep that in mind when you read my advice. If you are sure this horse is not in any pain, (don't forget the teeth), saddle fits properly, your saddle fits you properly, stirrups are the correct length, etc, then have someone else ride the horse for you. Now when I say someone, I don't mean just anyone. I mean someone honest who rides a lot of barrel horses and rides them successfully. That is a great way to find out what your horse is doing with you and without you and why. Let that person slow work your horse and make an easy run if the person will do it....even if you have to pay the person to do it. That person can probably give you lots of helpful tips for you and this horse. |
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Veteran
Posts: 227
Location: Soon to be outta here:) | Bibliafarm - 2015-07-11 10:01 PM
https://youtu.be/Xq-Vst3pO9MÂ OK I pondered to post because I dont want to sound harsh so please dont take this wrong.. but get help ..
IN the video above of you at home...From the minute you stepped on she was in control (she walked off right away) and your body langauge is saying go.. the energy level in  these type horses.. their brain is on overdrive.. so its up to us as riders to calm and take it down a notch ... and yes I realize shes a barrel horse.. but they also need control and relaxation. its not all about the GO and the SPEED..I see you getting on and she walks off right away in a hyped up mode and you allow it.. I dont see any walking or suppling or flexing and getting her to relax.. these type horses need that and sometimes thats all these type horses need.. I dont think you have the tools yet to ride this horse properly without her blowing up at some point her brain..so a great trainer and the right one will help... I feel she should be evauluated and her feed program to. she and you have high nervous energy and the combo will end up a disaster for her and you... right now shes to much horse for you imho....and the video person in background just intensifies it..yelling ..sorry just my thoughts..mare needs calm reassurance and shes flying high in the videos.
I personally would not have paired you two up and not saying that in a bad way.. good luck I know your trying to do whats best so find a good trainer for you and her.please dont take this wrong its just how I see this from my perspective.
and this comment from your first post contradicts the videos.
..She's broke to death off barrels, I ride her in a snaffle, she works like a charm. She's off the track and the girl who bought her started her too fast too soon so I bought her quite a bit blown up. Anyone who has any sort of advice at all, please share. We do tons of slow work, rate every single time we get to a barrel Â
I appreciate your opinion! I do agree that she was a lot of horse for me, and still probably is, but I would much rather look into getting help rather than giving up on her.
That video is from well over a year ago and no I didn't have much control. It was a couple weeks after that video that I started working with a trainer and we spent all summer, and winter, working on getting her more broke. If I don't have to work in the morning I will take a video of me riding her off barrels so people can see her work. She's not flawless obviously, but she has come leaps and bounds since that video was taken. At that time I would have been terrified to put her in a snaffle. Her head was 20 feet in the air, she was pushy, I couldn't even get her to calmly lope a circle in front of the barrels, I had to start further back and work our way up. She was a HOT mess and I didn't help. I was also riding in a 12 inch bob Marshall saddle, which was too small for me and caused me to grip with my legs to keep my seat... it was just a mess in every way. I learned a lot since that time and she would not be allowed to do that now. Now she stands still until I ask her to move and she needs to give to the bit the second I pick up on the reins and her feet don't move until I say its okay.... she is 10,000xs calmer now...she rides like a totally different horse hahaha!
I am 100% sure that there is still a lot of improvement that could happen, but she is much better than she was in that video! I would be more than happy to look into having more training to get her perfect, but it makes me cringe to watch that video and how I used to let her move and behave, I just hadn't ever had as much horse as her and didn't really know what I should do lol. Like you said, she's probably way too much horse for me, but I also do know that the advantage I have for her is that I have all the time in the world. I have no problem giving her all the time she needs to become a great barrel horse, and I know a lot of people wouldn't do that and I think it would end badly for her. I don't want to sell her, I love her so much, she wants to work and she has a huge heart and so much try. I want to exhaust literally every option before I would consider selling. |
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Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | LDH - 2015-07-11 8:06 AM
komet. - 2015-07-11 1:23 AM
Am I the only one here that sees the problem? If you think you can override nature, you are mistaken.
Override nature as in that this horse isn't meant to be a barrel horse or...?
I don't know where you live... but I used to take horses like this out on a trail tide... but I'm not talking any trail ride... I used to live in the Mark Twain national forest.. I'd take a horse out... away from any trail. I'd make the horse weave it's way through the trees.. let it be a horse for a day... or two.. or more... as long as it takes... Too many drills is a bad thing... |
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 BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25352
Location: Bastrop, Texas | Bibliafarm - 2015-07-11 10:01 PM
https://youtu.be/Xq-Vst3pO9MÂ OK I pondered to post because I dont want to sound harsh so please dont take this wrong.. but get help ..
IN the video above of you at home...From the minute you stepped on she was in control (she walked off right away) and your body langauge is saying go.. the energy level in  these type horses.. their brain is on overdrive.. so its up to us as riders to calm and take it down a notch ... and yes I realize shes a barrel horse.. but they also need control and relaxation. its not all about the GO and the SPEED..I see you getting on and she walks off right away in a hyped up mode and you allow it.. I dont see any walking or suppling or flexing and getting her to relax.. these type horses need that and sometimes thats all these type horses need.. I dont think you have the tools yet to ride this horse properly without her blowing up at some point her brain..so a great trainer and the right one will help... I feel she should be evauluated and her feed program to. she and you have high nervous energy and the combo will end up a disaster for her and you... right now shes to much horse for you imho....and the video person in background just intensifies it..yelling ..sorry just my thoughts..mare needs calm reassurance and shes flying high in the videos.
I personally would not have paired you two up and not saying that in a bad way.. good luck I know your trying to do whats best so find a good trainer for you and her.please dont take this wrong its just how I see this from my perspective.
and this comment from your first post contradicts the videos.
..She's broke to death off barrels, I ride her in a snaffle, she works like a charm. She's off the track and the girl who bought her started her too fast too soon so I bought her quite a bit blown up. Anyone who has any sort of advice at all, please share. We do tons of slow work, rate every single time we get to a barrel Â
This is real sound, sensible advice. You have gotten a ton of good advice here. Take a step back and think about all the recommendations/observations people have made over and over again....then start fresh. I think this is a very talented mare you have. With a lot of help and a little luck you could end up having many successful years on her. You are both worth it. |
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Hungarian Midget Woman
Location: Midwest | Â If you don't want to sell, I'd consider having someone put 30-60 days on her working on calming her down and putting a good foundation on her.Â
Then, take some lessons with that same person. I'm sure someone on here can pm you some names. Good luck!
Edited by barrelracr131 2015-07-12 10:40 AM
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Folks on-line