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Blessed 
   
Location: Here | TurnLane - 2015-07-20 12:13 PM barrelracr131 - 2015-07-20 11:44 AM Try to find a local mill that mixes feed, but does not mix any medicated feed on the premises.
This is what my boarding stable does. Very cost effective and my horse is far from skinny. Lol This is where it gets confusing, even if they do not mix medicated feeds- it does not mean they dont bring in product to add to their mix that is from a medicated facility- nor does it mean they test their corn. So molasses being the number one suspect ingredient brought in to facilities that otherwise would be med free. Premixes and minerals being second.
I would like to know the source of confirmed data on this. I know BlueBonnet doesn't use liquid molasses... So where is this information |
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | rachellyn80 - 2015-07-20 10:46 AM
98%.... I think it needs to be clarified that most cases of Ionophore toxicity would not be recognized, acknowledged, or even investigated.  That's been the entire point of the conversations over the past 7 months.  When you muddy the water with random numbers it serves no purpose other than to cause doubt in the minds of those who don't take the time to eductate themselves anyway.  Ultimately no, we will not find a feed that is 100% perfect...but, I have to ask.  When the person that you mentioned tried BB feeds, what were they feeding before that caused them to switch?  What was the horse's digestive health during this time?  I only mention this because I truly did not see the big changes in my horses condition until we added the digestive  supplement to help them process the nutrients that we were giving them.  Prior to that, we could have fed them anything we wanted and never would have truly seen them rebound.
Ionophores are not our only problem...anything that is mixed at a feed mill can end up in your feed. Â Â
Kinda off thread but didn't want to go back thru the older threads! Does anyone know of a feed store in the Jackson MS area that sells Purina that is from ionophore free plant? We'll need feed when we get back from barrel run and our store is completely different direction. Thanks if anyone can help me out. |
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | Bibliafarm - 2015-07-21 4:14 PM
 I went from triple crown and ADM to Purina equine sr.. its always been my go to feed when desperate. and my horses have always done well on it all ages all disciplines all activity level.. I add soaked alfalfa cubes and soaked beet pulp..is it the best? no.. but its easy to digest, they look great and its beet pulp based.
We use the Strategy for 3 youngest and Sr and Sr Active for the 2 oldest, and they look great. Nobody can believe our 36 year old gelding is that old. Wish I knew how to post pics. . . . |
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 Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | SG. - 2015-07-22 1:24 PM TurnLane - 2015-07-20 12:13 PM barrelracr131 - 2015-07-20 11:44 AM Try to find a local mill that mixes feed, but does not mix any medicated feed on the premises.
This is what my boarding stable does. Very cost effective and my horse is far from skinny. Lol This is where it gets confusing, even if they do not mix medicated feeds- it does not mean they dont bring in product to add to their mix that is from a medicated facility- nor does it mean they test their corn. So molasses being the number one suspect ingredient brought in to facilities that otherwise would be med free. Premixes and minerals being second.
From a friend of mine who is a dealer. And I know the molasses broker of the company she said they buy from so I know their methods.  |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | Something to consider: If the ionophore issue is not important to the customer, it will not be important to the feed companys. Sometimes you have to take a stand and if enough people stop buying from companys that use equipment that runs medicated feed then they will have to change or suffer the consequences. |
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 Warrior Mom
Posts: 4400
| I kinda got lost on the feed companies that are ionophore free.. is nutrena free? Where I'm moving I'll have access to purina , nutrena , and triple crown. I used tc before and wasn't happy with it so I'm not planning on going back to that.. |
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Blessed
Location: Here | TurnLane - 2015-07-23 9:21 AM SG. - 2015-07-22 1:24 PM TurnLane - 2015-07-20 12:13 PM barrelracr131 - 2015-07-20 11:44 AM Try to find a local mill that mixes feed, but does not mix any medicated feed on the premises.
This is what my boarding stable does. Very cost effective and my horse is far from skinny. Lol This is where it gets confusing, even if they do not mix medicated feeds- it does not mean they dont bring in product to add to their mix that is from a medicated facility- nor does it mean they test their corn. So molasses being the number one suspect ingredient brought in to facilities that otherwise would be med free. Premixes and minerals being second.
I will just say it, It is hard to claim this as truth, too much hearsay in it
Sorry not trying to
But facts... not well she said she said. This issue is too important |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | want2chase3 - 2015-07-23 9:44 AM
I kinda got lost on the feed companies that are ionophore free.. is nutrena free? Where I'm moving I'll have access to purina , nutrena , and triple crown. I used tc before and wasn't happy with it so I'm not planning on going back to that..
Your choice list is Purina, and Cargill.....not much of a choice. For most its not: Purina, Cargill, or ADM. I don't think any of those really have horses or owners as the #1 interest. My opinion.
http://www.cargill.com/feed/news/2010/NA3030977.jsp
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | SG. - 2015-07-23 10:19 AM TurnLane - 2015-07-23 9:21 AM SG. - 2015-07-22 1:24 PM TurnLane - 2015-07-20 12:13 PM barrelracr131 - 2015-07-20 11:44 AM Try to find a local mill that mixes feed, but does not mix any medicated feed on the premises.
This is what my boarding stable does. Very cost effective and my horse is far from skinny. Lol This is where it gets confusing, even if they do not mix medicated feeds- it does not mean they dont bring in product to add to their mix that is from a medicated facility- nor does it mean they test their corn. So molasses being the number one suspect ingredient brought in to facilities that otherwise would be med free. Premixes and minerals being second.
Sorry not trying to
But facts... not well she said she said. This issue is too important
Rachel knows her. Is that enough validity for you to believe that I know a reputable person who asked them directly and wwhose word I trust?
I am at least glad you say you are not trying to be (insert emoticons of your choice- because Lord dont let me assume!)..... but I also know the VP of the liquid feed company that sells to them. Liquid feed sells MOER MEDICATED TONS of feed nationally than any feed mill. Feed is what I do. You may need to ask Rachel or Liana DeWeese my level of seriousness on this subject. I can assure you- it is much more important to me than you couuld ever assume. |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | SG. - 2015-07-22 1:24 PM TurnLane - 2015-07-20 12:13 PM barrelracr131 - 2015-07-20 11:44 AM Try to find a local mill that mixes feed, but does not mix any medicated feed on the premises.
This is what my boarding stable does. Very cost effective and my horse is far from skinny. Lol This is where it gets confusing, even if they do not mix medicated feeds- it does not mean they dont bring in product to add to their mix that is from a medicated facility- nor does it mean they test their corn. So molasses being the number one suspect ingredient brought in to facilities that otherwise would be med free. Premixes and minerals being second.
So, SG I will ask you the same underlined below---- how do you know this? I see it on the ingredient list? http://bluebonnetfeeds.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/172463_Intensify-Textured-Fab_Sht.pdf
Also, you recently tried to correct me that molasses doesnt come from sugar beets in another post. This is simply not true. I know BB uses cane molasses but most use molasses and if you want to get technical, 70% of liquid molasses "products" are blends anyhow in order to make them easier to handle for the mill and the end user.
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 Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | TurnLane - 2015-07-23 11:35 AM SG. - 2015-07-22 1:24 PM TurnLane - 2015-07-20 12:13 PM barrelracr131 - 2015-07-20 11:44 AM Try to find a local mill that mixes feed, but does not mix any medicated feed on the premises.
This is what my boarding stable does. Very cost effective and my horse is far from skinny. Lol This is where it gets confusing, even if they do not mix medicated feeds- it does not mean they dont bring in product to add to their mix that is from a medicated facility- nor does it mean they test their corn. So molasses being the number one suspect ingredient brought in to facilities that otherwise would be med free. Premixes and minerals being second.
Technically what she corrected you on was this comment: There is the molasses argument and yet many feed beet pulp and it is a by product of molasses with a high sugar content, although for clarification in this feed it says plain beet pulp (which I have ever rarely seen).
SG feeds Omega Force like I was and it lists Dried Cane Molasses as an ingredient in the pellet....It's a matter of terminology and what came "first". Molasses isn't a by product of beet pulp, but I don't know enough about how dried cane molasses is processed at this point to comment.
Ultimately everyone is trying to do what they think is right by their horses and make healthy choices. |
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 Hugs to You
Posts: 7551
Location: In The Land of Cotton | Molasses is a by product of the sugar beet - not beet pulp. Beet pulp is also a by product of the sugar beet. Cane molasses is a by product of the sugar cane - mainly grown in So Florida or over seas. Sugar is also a by product of sugar cane - pure cane sugar.
Molasses is a by product from the extraction of sugars from cane and sugar beets.. The liquid is boiled to a certain temperature and turns into molasses. |
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Expert
Posts: 1207
| I'm confused!! So is the cane molasses in the BB feed good or bad for a horse??  |
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 Expert
Posts: 5293
| Sandok - 2015-07-23 11:34 AM
I'm confused!! So is the cane molasses in the BB feed good or bad for a horse??
I think what they were making the point of, is molasses is molasses and several companies supply liquid molasses to various feed mills. Because of that process, all molasses has the potential to be contaminated, even if it is being used to make a feed in an ionophore free mill. THats my understanding. I have now switched to whole oats and great forage with just 1 supplement. I don't want to have to read about feed contamination anymore. |
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | Chandler's Mom - 2015-07-23 1:10 AM rachellyn80 - 2015-07-20 10:46 AM 98%.... I think it needs to be clarified that most cases of Ionophore toxicity would not be recognized, acknowledged, or even investigated. That's been the entire point of the conversations over the past 7 months. When you muddy the water with random numbers it serves no purpose other than to cause doubt in the minds of those who don't take the time to eductate themselves anyway. Ultimately no, we will not find a feed that is 100% perfect...but, I have to ask. When the person that you mentioned tried BB feeds, what were they feeding before that caused them to switch? What was the horse's digestive health during this time? I only mention this because I truly did not see the big changes in my horses condition until we added the digestive supplement to help them process the nutrients that we were giving them. Prior to that, we could have fed them anything we wanted and never would have truly seen them rebound.
Ionophores are not our only problem...anything that is mixed at a feed mill can end up in your feed. Kinda off thread but didn't want to go back thru the older threads! Does anyone know of a feed store in the Jackson MS area that sells Purina that is from ionophore free plant? We'll need feed when we get back from barrel run and our store is completely different direction. Thanks if anyone can help me out.
Purina is free anywhere from what I read. |
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Expert
Posts: 1207
| Well cr__!! I thought I was being safe switching to the BB feed. I've been thinking of switching to oats anyway, as far as forage goes, I have grass, some hay and I feed alfalfa cubes wanting to get those Ominis cubes. Been talking to Dr. Schnell and the CurOst products. I might go that way. Right now I have them on THE MM. Just started them so don't know yet. |
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Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | BEET PULP, THE MATERIAL LEFT BEHIND WHEN TABLE SUGAR IS EXTRACTED FROM SUGAR BEETS, IS A SAFE HORSE FEED IF FED APPROPRIATELY.
Beet pulp contains lots of fermentable fiber and is fairly easy for horses to digest. It is often incorporated into "complete" or "high fiber" commercial concentrates as a source of fiber and some horse owners feed it as a separate "mash" for a variety of reasons, one of the most common being the belief that it is high calorie and will help horses gain weight.
However, beet pulp is not high calorie--it has only slightly more calories than good quality hay and less than an equivalent weight of oats. Beet pulp does contain about 10 percent protein, 0.8 percent calcium and 0.5 percent phosphorus, making it a more "balanced" source of energy and fiber than the more traditional wheat bran (15 percent protein, 0.06 percent calcium, 1.3 percent phosphorus). The high fiber content may "normalize" fermentation in the
large colons, resulting in more efficient "digestion" over all, which may be why many "hard keeper" horses that have a significant portion of their grain concentrates replaced with beet pulp seem to maintain better body condition. It has been used to replace over 50% of the forage in horse's rations without adverse effects when fed with other balanced concentrates.
Be aware however that it has no Vitamin A and that if it is used to replace most of the forage in a ration, Vitamin A may need to be supplemented. Contrary to popular belief, beet pulp itself is not high in sugar. However some beet pulp products DO have added molasses to increase palatability, so owners with carbohydrate intolerant horses need to read the labels carefully. T |
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Expert
Posts: 5293
| Sandok - 2015-07-23 12:16 PM
Well cr__!! I thought I was being safe switching to the BB feed. I've been thinking of switching to oats anyway, as far as forage goes, I have grass, some hay and I feed alfalfa cubes wanting to get those Ominis cubes. Been talking to Dr. Schnell and the CurOst products. I might go that way. Right now I have them on THE MM. Just started them so don't know yet.
According to these posts Blue bonnet is fine cause they use a molasses powder? Thats what everyone switched to if you could get it. I cant get omnis cubes or BB out here in CA |
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Regular
Posts: 92
| Highpoint Performance Horses fed Purina feed from 1992-2000 prior to moving to Texas. When we moved to Texas we fed Purina feed from 2000-2005 prior to ever being sponsored by Purina. We fed a lot of our older horses the equine Sr. and had great results.
Purina is the industry leader in research of their products. We as embassadors go to the Purina research facility even year to educate ourselves on developing new products and understanding the products that are out there. There research facility is huge! State of the art and open to the public. Anyone can set up an appointment to see this facility. I promise you when you leave there you will have a new understanding on feed. The years of research that goes into each new product is impressive. They will show you that research! They will show you the animals used in that research and they will show you the trials that they are doing at that time.
IONOPHORES are antibiotic agents that are beneficial ingredients in cattle feed but can be deadly to the horse even in very small amounts. An iodophors free manufacturing system is not the same as an ionophore safe manufacturing system. "FREE" means ionophores are not used in any feeds that may be manufactured in that system. Therefore some cattle feeds may be run on a "FREE" system but the formula does not contain ionophores. "SAFE" only means some cattle feeds that "DO" contain ionophores in the formula will be run on that system, however, a series of "flushing" is emplemented. When cattle feeds containing ionophores are run on a system at least one batch of non- ionophore containing cattle feed is run through the system in order to flush any remaining ionophore from the system before any horse feed is run through the system. Regardless of the flushing procedure there is always the risk of ionophore contamination of horse feed manufactured on a "safe" system. Horse feed should be manufactured on a ionophores "FREE" manufacturing system.
PURINA MILLS HORSE FEEDS ARE "ONLY" MANUFACTURED ON AN IONOPHORE "FREE" MANUFACTURING SYSTEM.
I was shocked to learn how many other feed companies do not use the "FREE" system. Most small and local mills are NOT!
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Expert
Posts: 1207
| I can get both, but have to travel some for the ominus cubes and I work during the week so it would have to be on a Saturday morning, BB is made right at my back door (sort of) I work in Ardmore, OK. But I am just wanting to simplify feeding. They aren't getting rode right now anyway with it being so hot. |
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