|
|
 Loves to compete
Posts: 5760
   
Location: Oakdale, CA | Whoop Z Day Z - 2016-05-24 8:06 PM THE MARKET IS UP! A LOT! Even at the sales prices are really up!
I agree with this. I also think there is a shorteage of horses under 5 maybe even 4. So I'm looking for a nice horse and I feel like what I like is up about 5,000 at least. At that price though thats tough to spit out for a prospect unless they have a special proven mother. those are hard to find. So now I'm not sure if I should buy something proven for another 5,000 or more or buy a weanling or yearling. I'm getting old though I would rather pay upfront than as I go............ |
|
| |
|
 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 434
Location: Northwest Florida | RunNitroRun - 2016-05-24 4:30 PM
Right or wrong people will pay WAY MORE for "pretty."
I think a truly well broke horse will bring $4000-5000 and if the horse is a Pal/Buckskin/Blue roan etc the price is even higher then that.
Definitely right. I believe even if buyers don't go out looking for pretty, it's the pretty that catches their eye. It's also the "pretty" that gets the ads more attention if you post on social media, thus reaching more potential buyers. |
|
| |
|
 Lady Di
Posts: 21556
Location: Oklahoma | got boost? - 2016-05-26 11:38 AM
Whoop Z Day Z - 2016-05-24 8:06 PM THE MARKET IS UP! A LOT! Even at the sales prices are really up!
I agree with this. I also think there is a shorteage of horses under 5 maybe even 4. So I'm looking for a nice horse and I feel like what I like is up about 5,000 at least. At that price though thats tough to spit out for a prospect unless they have a special proven mother. those are hard to find. So now I'm not sure if I should buy something proven for another 5,000 or more or buy a weanling or yearling. I'm getting old though I would rather pay upfront than as I go............
Yes, you should pay the other $5K and get something fun and ready to go and safe. I have a couple that would work. ;) |
|
| |
|
Regular
Posts: 81
| What worries me about 'overpricing' horses is more the additional cost associated with breeding so many recip mares these days.
The cost of the recip mare (upwards of several thousand) is having to be absorbed in the sale of the colt. So instead of just purchasing the quality of breeding, training, and potential of the colt, now you have you tack on the additional cost of the recip.
It will be interesting to see how that drives the industry as it becomes more of the norm to AI and utilize a recip mare, then to have well bred mares actually carry their babies. |
|
| |
|
  That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| Vmtaylor - 2016-05-26 4:09 PM What worries me about 'overpricing' horses is more the additional cost associated with breeding so many recip mares these days. The cost of the recip mare (upwards of several thousand) is having to be absorbed in the sale of the colt. So instead of just purchasing the quality of breeding, training, and potential of the colt, now you have you tack on the additional cost of the recip. It will be interesting to see how that drives the industry as it becomes more of the norm to AI and utilize a recip mare, then to have well bred mares actually carry their babies. The input costs have nothing to do with the sales price. There will always be someone that can do it cheaper and better. Those who have higher priced stock can charge what they charge because the demand is there. Remove the money they run for and the prices will drop, increase the money and prices will go up.
Edited by Whiteboy 2016-05-26 4:14 PM
|
|
| |
|
Regular
Posts: 81
| My only disagreement there is if you have two babies out of identical bred mares, out of the same stud, the only difference is one is moved to a recip mare..... The up charge on the recip mare will have to be higher to cover that cost. Which then allows the other who had the mare carry the baby to charge similar or same price point. |
|
| |
|
 Coyote Country Queen
Posts: 5666
| Vmtaylor - 2016-05-26 4:38 PM
My only disagreement there is if you have two babies out of identical bred mares, out of the same stud, the only difference is one is moved to a recip mare..... The up charge on the recip mare will have to be higher to cover that cost. Which then allows the other who had the mare carry the baby to charge similar or same price point.
I think what you're saying is the ET foal will be higher priced, so other foals that aren't ET can also be priced that high, thus having a higher profit. Typically, the type of mares that are doing ET are higher quality mares that will produce foals of a higher value. So even if those foals are priced higher it doesn't necessarily mean that the value of all foals by that particular stallion will have an increased value. The mare plays such an important role in the value of the foal. So if you have 2 foals with the same sire, but one is out of a very proven mare with exceptional papers and the other is just a mediocre mare, the higher quality mare will have a higher valued foal. The other mare owner may try to price their foal at that higher value, but they likely aren't going to get that higher price because of the difference in dams. So financially the owner of the higher quality mare can justify the expense of the ET because they can recoup that expense based on the value of the foal. If the mares are similar, then the owner of the ET mare just won't get as much of a profit. Regardless of the expenses put into getting the foal on the ground, the horse is only worth what it's worth. Like was previously mentioned, owners can't always expect to get all of their money back out of a horse when they sell it. If you've spent $7,000 to do an ET but the foal only has a value of $4,000 then you might have to sell for a loss if you can't find a buyer to pay the higher price to cover expenses. The same with training, if you pay a trainer several thousand dollars to train the horse and it just doesn't turn out to be a performance horse, you might not cover all of you expenses when you sell. |
|
| |
|
| Some are, some aren't. I never know how to price a horse myself. I have a 4 year old for sale priced very cheap because I haven't been able to ride her much this spring but whoever gets her and puts time on her will have a nice horse probably worth twice as much as I'm asking by this fall.... |
|
| |
|
 Expert
Posts: 3104
Location: Arkansas | We went to a catalog auction in TX in March looking for a well broke gelding that my husband could start in the roping pen (he opened his mouth and priced his using gelding and the guy paid for him). The nice, broke geldings were going for $3800 and up-several over $10K. We ended up with a really nice paint mare (for my hubby who doesn't like paints or mares). We bought a bargain though, because she is broke, broke and we haven't found anything she won't do yet. |
|
| |
|
 Total Germophobe
Posts: 6443
Location: Montana | Delta Cowgirl - 2016-05-24 3:06 PM Here is the "buyer from hell" cartoon video. Enjoy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjX6UJXQKEw&feature=youtu.be[/qu... May I just say, that happens in our business, especially the last part where the buyer was p!$$y because we couldn't sell something for their price. We have had people trash us on FB and Google because we couldn't meet their terms, recommending them, politely, another place of business that could possibly help them. Ugh...retail can kind of suck, but oh well, such is life.
As far as horse prices, are they over-priced...that is a yes and no question. A horse is only worth as much as someone will pay for it, no mattered what it is priced at. Does that mean I agree with what some people price their horses at? No. But I just don't worry about it and move on to the next one. I think it is too broad of a subject to generalize and there are too many opinions.
Edited by mtcanchazer 2016-05-28 9:14 PM
|
|
| |
|
Impressive!!
Posts: 1954
Location: Idaho | Tdove - 2016-05-24 6:23 AM A nice bred, broke correctly horse is worth over 4000. Each one of them probably has at least that put into them and are selling at a loss, if in the business of raising them. The real cost of a horse is feed and maintenance, which you will run up to that number, pretty quick. So, people get in their 50k truck which cost more to feed/maintain, whose value drops like a rock, then turn around and complain about a 5k horse. I have little sympathy for people that complain about horse prices. I have a simple answer. Get in the business of raising, training, or trading horses and you will change your mind immediately....
YES!!! When I was younger and I saw 3 year olds going for $10k+ I just never understood how or why they were worth that much... then we got into breeding a small program... top quality mares, top quality stallions, raising them, keeping them sound and training... yeah good luck touching one of my 3 year olds for under $10k!!!  |
|
| |
|
 Elite Veteran
Posts: 654
Location: Scurry, TX | We have been in the horse business for over forty years and i have heard this comment every year about horse prices.
The reasons for good horses never change.
The time and money it takes to make a Good horse will never be compensated enough when it is sold,.
If you had to pay someone from the day a colt is born to the day you sell it as a riding horse. Well lets just say if would be a hard bill to pay.
Hours and hours of ground work and wet saddle pads are never thought of let alone the bloodlines, confirmation and ability of the horse
Try it sometime. Most of us do it for the love a very few actually make some good money. |
|
| |
|
 Elite Veteran
Posts: 891
| Alamo1 - 2016-05-27 3:35 PM
We have been in the horse business for over forty years and i have heard this comment every year about horse prices.
The reasons for good horses never change.
The time and money it takes to make a Good horse will never be compensated enough when it is sold,.
If you had to pay someone from the day a colt is born to the day you sell it as a riding horse. Well lets just say if would be a hard bill to pay.
Hours and hours of ground work and wet saddle pads are never thought of let alone the bloodlines, confirmation and ability of the horse
Try it sometime. Most of us do it for the love a very few actually make some good money.
AMEN !!!!! I breed barrel & roping prospects & some may say I am high on my price, but you get what you pay for. I have sold weanlings & yearlings that the buyers are in ahhhh with. Why, because they are handled since birth. A reputable breeder puts a lot of time & effort into their baby's. Our baby's are taught to lead at a young age as I'm sure Alomo 1 are to. This is alot of work. Then you have stud fees, mare at vets to be bred" vet fees", ship semen fees, if breeding doesn't take, repeat vet & shipping fees. Feed mare for 11 months, feed mare & foal until foal is weaned. Then feed foal. Lets not forget vaccinations of mare & foal & worming. Oh & if you have a foaling problem, vet charges for farm calls. This is not cheap. And then if said horse isn't sold by age 2 - 2 1/2, then we pay training charges & if you send your horse to a reputable trainer, it isn't cheap. I sure don't breed to make money. like Now there are
horse traders " the ones who go out & buy a cheap horse & ride it for a few months at jackpots & claim it is a top winning horse & sell it for $20,000 plus dollars & they have ruined it. Myself I breed for the love of the horse & this business of barrel racing & the best thing is when someone buys a horse from me & goes on to win with it, the happiness they have, well that is the biggest happiness I have about being a horse breeder, putting some happiness in someone's life. And NO I didn't post this for someone to buy a horse from me as some would think LOL
Edited by okhorselover 2016-05-28 7:21 PM
|
|
| |
|
| I agree, most breeders don't make much once all of the blood, sweat, and vet bills are accounted for. A lot of breeders work their tails off just to keep the mares and babies alive and healthy. It is most definitely a labor of love.
Edited by BigMomma 2016-05-28 3:48 PM
|
|
| |
|
 Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | If you let yourself slip.... and become friends with the horse you have for sale.... you have a problem. Lets face it. Everyone likes to have a big friend... and it's pretty hard to find anything in North America bigger than a horse... so....
What price do you put on your friend? Probably they are priced higher than a lot of folks want to pay...
I'm guilty.... I make friends with horses... But in my defense... I've never had a horse successfully lie to me.... (not that they didn't try. But I can read body language) |
|
| |
|
 To the Left
Posts: 1865
Location: Florida | I have been on both sides of this discussion. If you want a well bred foal on the ground you already have 2 or 3 thousand into it. Add halter broke, loading in a trailer, stands for the farrier, you have another year's hard work. Then if you want well broke, $5,000 is practially a break even. Anyone who thinks different should raise their own colt and find out how much it really costs.
|
|
| |
|
 Expert
Posts: 1481
Location: TEXAS | I agree with almost everyone and I'll add
if someone else sells a horse I bred & raised for $1,000s more I definitely did something RIGHT  in my breeding... |
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 891
| turn3turnsok - 2016-05-30 9:00 AM
I agree with almost everyone and I'll add
if someone else sells a horse I bred & raised for $1,000s more I definitely did something RIGHT in my breeding...
Edited by okhorselover 2016-05-30 5:25 PM
|
|
| |
|
 Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | okhorselover - 2016-05-30 4:38 PM turn3turnsok - 2016-05-30 9:00 AM I agree with almost everyone and I'll add
if someone else sells a horse I bred & raised for $1,000s more I definitely did something RIGHT in my breeding... Not if you sold to a horse trader. Big difference in them & reputable barrel horse people. Question is, is the horse's you sold doing anything ?, like winning ? I am so gratefull for the wonderful professional people who buy horses from me. They are out there doing something. Horse trader horse's usually have issues & are down the road.
Oh my. Was that meant to be as insulting as it sounded? |
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 891
|
Edited by okhorselover 2016-05-30 5:36 PM
|
|
| |
Folks on-line