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Overbreeding mares

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Last activity 2024-03-25 1:40 AM
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Couchjockey123
Reg. Feb 2024
Posted 2024-02-29 12:35 AM
Subject: Overbreeding mares


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Are the best mares in the industry being overbred? With ICSI and ET being normal now and some good mares and some mediocre mares having 5,6,7,8 foals a year...should there be a limit on the number of offspring a mare should be able to register every year?

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cindyt
Reg. Dec 2003
Posted 2024-02-29 11:11 AM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares



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YES 

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Liana D
Reg. Sep 2008
Posted 2024-02-29 11:23 AM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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Yes and yes

there one out there that isn't that good  that has over 80 foals

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lonely va barrelxr
Reg. Apr 2005
Posted 2024-02-29 12:04 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares



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I've got mixed feelings on this. On one hand, if we limit the mare offspring numbers per year then I feel absolutely that we should limit the stallion offspring numbers per year. Other hand is no limits on mare offspring if no limits on stallion offspring. It's hella expensive to produce foals with either ET or ICSI. If someone wants to sink that money into foals then it's up to their pocketbook. I don't think we want to start forcing a qualifying structure for breeding our horses. Some mares and stallions throw exceptional offspring without ever being broke, let alone competing. A 3D mare or stallion may produce consistent 1D and 2D offspring. It's a slippery slope for sure. 

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Mighty Broke
Reg. Jul 2004
Posted 2024-02-29 12:25 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares



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lonely va barrelxr - 2024-02-29 1:04 PM


I've got mixed feelings on this. On one hand, if we limit the mare offspring numbers per year then I feel absolutely that we should limit the stallion offspring numbers per year. Other hand is no limits on mare offspring if no limits on stallion offspring. It's hella expensive to produce foals with either ET or ICSI. If someone wants to sink that money into foals then it's up to their pocketbook. I don't think we want to start forcing a qualifying structure for breeding our horses. Some mares and stallions throw exceptional offspring without ever being broke, let alone competing. A 3D mare or stallion may produce consistent 1D and 2D offspring. It's a slippery slope for sure. 


What she said.

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CanCan
Reg. May 2004
Posted 2024-02-29 1:39 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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Yes, yes, and yes. Studs too.

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Couchjockey123
Reg. Feb 2024
Posted 2024-02-29 11:20 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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Liana D - 2024-02-29 11:23 AM


Yes and yes


there one out there that isn't that good  that has over 80 foals


Liana D; if we are thinking of the same one I wholeheartedly agree, and there are a dozen + stallions standing by her that I can count off the top of my head

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Couchjockey123
Reg. Feb 2024
Posted 2024-02-29 11:23 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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CanCan - 2024-02-29 1:39 PM


Yes, yes, and yes. Studs too.


I think it's two fold, I believe it drives the foals values down when there are double digits being born annually. I think they should limit stallions and mare number of offering so that everything isn't inbred in thr not so distant future. With DTF being the sire of every other stallion and RC Back In Black being the dam of sooo many standing at stud, our horses are going to become more and more inbred until they won't hold up.

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CanCan
Reg. May 2004
Posted 2024-03-01 10:03 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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Couchjockey123 - 2024-02-29 11:23 PM


CanCan - 2024-02-29 1:39 PM


Yes, yes, and yes. Studs too.



I think it's two fold, I believe it drives the foals values down when there are double digits being born annually. I think they should limit stallions and mare number of offering so that everything isn't inbred in thr not so distant future. With DTF being the sire of every other stallion and RC Back In Black being the dam of sooo many standing at stud, our horses are going to become more and more inbred until they won't hold up.


Yes! I've only been on the fringes of the industry for 25 years and I've seen the hardiness and the good minds bred out of our horses already. 

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Whiteboy
Reg. Jul 2012
Posted 2024-03-04 3:46 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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In terms of gene pool, I would rather 1,000 foals out of a good mare, than 1 out of some of the mares being bred.  

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LRQHS
Reg. Nov 2011
Posted 2024-03-04 7:36 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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My thoughts... some people have horses and have too much money...they use their money to try to breed for hopes of glory. There is nothing you can do about that. There is a QH race horse breeder/owner/racer that is dominating every sale. I don't pretend to know his mindset, but he definitely thinks quantity over quality will get him in the spotlight. Or maybe he just likes seeing his name in the magazines. Who knows, but he's full scale shoving his breeding decisions down everyone's throats.

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CanCan
Reg. May 2004
Posted 2024-03-05 9:29 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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"For the second straight year, the number of stallions with money-winning offspring declined, dropping from 6,765 stallions in 2022 to 6,645 in 2023. In 2021, stallion numbers were at 6,877. That's a decline of 2% each year."

- BHN March 2024 p 49

At this rate it won't be long before we will need a "No diving" sign in the gene pool. 

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cindyt
Reg. Dec 2003
Posted 2024-03-06 11:36 AM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares



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Whiteboy - 2024-03-04 3:46 PM


In terms of gene pool, I would rather 1,000 foals out of a good mare, than 1 out of some of the mares being bred.  


I would take 1 out of a good mare most may not know then the 1000 assembly lines

but I am so outside the box lol 

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Whiteboy
Reg. Jul 2012
Posted 2024-03-06 11:48 AM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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So just trying to wrap my head around why people are against breeding the best mares.  Looking at the "for sale" ads on bhw, it is a rare exception to find one out of even a mediocre mare.  Is it price, concern about the gene pool, or something else that bothers you?

 

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r_beau
Reg. Apr 2010
Posted 2024-03-07 8:52 AM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares



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lonely va barrelxr - 2024-02-29 12:04 PM


I've got mixed feelings on this. On one hand, if we limit the mare offspring numbers per year then I feel absolutely that we should limit the stallion offspring numbers per year. .....


It's a slippery slope for sure. 


^^This.

 

I wouldn't understand how you could limit mares from breeding but NOT limit studs from breeding. It's both or none.

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Couchjockey123
Reg. Feb 2024
Posted 2024-03-24 7:49 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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More concern about the gene pool. When 15 of the junior stallions coming are out of the same mare it makes me wonder what pedigrees will look like in 10 years and if it will be possible to still get true outcrosses or if we will have to go back to crossing barrel/race on cow breds.

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CanCan
Reg. May 2004
Posted 2024-03-24 8:47 PM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares


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Couchjockey123 - 2024-03-24 7:49 PM


More concern about the gene pool. When 15 of the junior stallions coming are out of the same mare it makes me wonder what pedigrees will look like in 10 years and if it will be possible to still get true outcrosses or if we will have to go back to crossing barrel/race on cow breds.


Have you looked at cutter's lately? They are tiny and crazy. No going back to that. 

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streakysox
Reg. Jul 2008
Posted 2024-03-25 1:40 AM
Subject: RE: Overbreeding mares



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I would rather see a bunch of offspring out if a mare that has passed genetics test than one out of any horse mare or stallion that is positive for any trait. There are way more than you know. Some halter, some performance. Stallions have to be tested but they do not have to advertise the fact. 

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