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RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!

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TexasCountryGirl
Reg. Feb 2004
Posted 2004-03-29 9:06 AM
Subject: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Extreme Veteran


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Location: Fort Polk Louisiana

I had heard a couple weeks ago that Ford is bringing out a diesel F150 and possibly SUVs as early as 2006.  I decided to do some reseach of my own and this is an article I found! YAHHH (our next truck will be a diesel but  not sure what size.  Prob. a F250)

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Ford Motor pushes hard for 6-cylinder diesel for F-150
Rift with supplier opens the door for other engine makers

By RICHARD TRUETT | Automotive News

Despite a canceled deal with International Truck and Engine Corp., Ford Motor Co. still wants to introduce a six-cylinder diesel engine for the F-150 pickup.

A diesel-powered F-150 "could be a big seller," says Dave Szczupak, Ford's global powertrain chief.

The pickup could be introduced as early as 2006, followed by a mid-sized diesel SUV and a car, says Phil Martens, Ford's vice president of North American product creation.

Ford wants to be first on the market with a light-duty diesel truck. It wants to beat General Motors to this market segment to enhance the F-150's status as the world's best-selling vehicle.

But it's unclear where Ford would get a diesel engine for its trucks. Given the expense of designing one, Ford most likely would buy one from a supplier. And that's where things get messy.

International Truck and Engine Corp. already supplies Ford with the 6.0-liter PowerStroke engine used in the F-series Super Duty trucks, but that engine has encountered major quality problems.

This year, Ford repurchased at least 500 trucks suffering from severe engine malfunctions caused by the fuel injection system. Ford also encountered problems with the turbocharger and engine computer.

The new PowerStroke's flawed launch is the major reason for bad blood between Ford and International Truck.

Last year, Ford abruptly canceled plans to buy International Truck's 4.5-liter diesel V-6 for the new F-150. International Truck swallowed a $170 million charge to cover the cost of engine development and factory tooling.

The company later received compensation from Ford. Terms of the settlement were not disclosed.

Martens has ruled out new contracts with International Truck. "We stopped work with International on the V-6," Martens says. "Right now, there are no plans to restart that work."

Martens did not indicate why Ford killed the V-6 deal. But it is believed that the engine was too costly and would not have met future pollution standards. Ford also may have been concerned about the emissions system's durability.

The impasse could not have come at a worse time. Ford sells 250,000 diesel F-series pickups annually, and they are profitable. While Ford struggles with the PowerStroke engine, General Motors is looming in Ford's rearview mirror.

GM's hot-selling Duramax diesel truck engine has helped the automaker to increase its share of diesel truck sales to 29 percent. That's up from 2 percent just three years ago. GM expects to sell 150,000 diesel-powered Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra trucks this year.

The automaker is weighing a decision to boost production capacity at its lone Duramax engine plant in Ohio, says GM's Global Powertrain Vice President Tom Stephens.

If Ford wants to be first to introduce a light-duty diesel pickup in North America, it must find another engine supplier. Each of the suppliers listed below has declined to indicate whether it is negotiating a deal with Ford. But several appear to be possible candidates.

Detroit Diesel Corp. has built a 4.0-liter V-6 that would be ideal for a light-duty truck. The motor is rated at 235 hp and 340 pounds-feet of torque. Detroit Diesel could deliver it for the 2006 model year. A Detroit Diesel official says its affiliation with the Chrysler group would not prevent such a deal.

John Deere produces diesel engines for light and heavy equipment. The company could produce a six-cylinder diesel for a light-duty truck, says company spokesman Ken Golden.

Caterpillar Inc. specializes in diesels for tractor-trailers, buses and earth-moving equipment. But company officials say they have no plans to build a small diesel for a light truck.

Cummins Inc. supplies diesels for Dodge. The heavy-duty Ram 2500 and 3500 trucks feature Cummins' 5.9-liter inline six-cylinder turbo-diesel. Last month, the company signed a long-term contract to supply DaimlerChrysler.

The deal does not prevent Cummins from selling a diesel engine to another automaker, says Cummins spokesman Jason Rawlings. The company is "actively and aggressively" looking for new customers, he says.

Cummins has a variety of engines that could be used in a pickup such as the F-150. And Cummins already supplies some diesel engines to Ford for heavy-duty applications, such as medium-duty trucks.

But DaimlerChrysler might discourage Cummins from selling diesels to Ford for trucks that would compete directly with the Ram.

"We value our relationship with DaimlerChrysler," Rawlings says. "They are an important customer to us. The relationship plays a factor in our decisions."

 

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DoubleUFarms
Reg. Sep 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 9:18 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Double Trouble


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The only problem with the light duty diesels is that people will think they pull like a heavy duty since they are diesels.  Not true! 
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Karebear
Reg. Sep 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 9:29 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!


President of Whitney's Fan Club


Posts: 1345
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Location: In the East but wanting to be in the West!

I think that is a good idea, but I have to agree that people will think the trucks will pull like the bigger ones.  Where I live, people buy these big trucks to just to drive around in them.  It surely ups the price on them for us people who need them!

BTW I LOVE our F-250.  It's a 99 and I have had ZERO problems with it.  Of course you can get a lemon with any of 'em.

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lynn 3
Reg. Feb 2004
Posted 2004-03-29 9:30 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!


Extreme Veteran


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I read a real interesting article on article over on the horsetrailerworld site. It said that 30% of the vehicles in western europe are diesel powered. It was also talking about the new technology that had come out and is soon to be coming out. I think it was called diesel myths and myth busters or something like that. I couldn't get it to come up a minute ago.
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CissyGirl
Reg. Mar 2004
Posted 2004-03-29 9:47 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Veteran


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I agree w/the other posters. A diesel engine is a good idea but people do stupid things. Like it's not bad enough people already pull trailers with explorers and rangers

I drive a diesel Super Duty (F250) and I love the heck out of it. I had an auction I HAD to get to last spring and I had 2 injectors clogged. I could not find another truck to haul with so I decided to go on with only 6 cylinders firing. I pulled a 3h slant gn trailer with 3 horses from western Iowa to Corsica, SD maintaining the speed limit on 6 cylinders. Now that's the meaning of Ford tough.

The bad part about diesels, they are expensive to fix. I ended up replacing all the injectors and o-rings, costing me $2500. But you save an engine in between by owning a diesel. I've got $143k on mine and still going strong.

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alamobanjo
Reg. Nov 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 10:29 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Sherlock Holmes...


Posts: 13082
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Ok, diesel owners, how much is maintenance on a diesel engine. For example, how much is an oil change, and how often do you change the oil??
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DoubleUFarms
Reg. Sep 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 10:31 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Double Trouble


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Well, we change the oil ourself, so we only have the cost of the filter and oil.  But you change the oil every 5,000 miles, which is different from gas engines, which is 3,000 miles. 

You will find that diesels do a whole lot better on fuel than gas engines.  Probably enough to pay your entries. 

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alamobanjo
Reg. Nov 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 10:50 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Sherlock Holmes...


Posts: 13082
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Location: South Dakota
Originally written by DoubleUFarms on 2004-03-29 10:31 AM

Well, we change the oil ourself, so we only have the cost of the filter and oil.  But you change the oil every 5,000 miles, which is different from gas engines, which is 3,000 miles. 

You will find that diesels do a whole lot better on fuel than gas engines.  Probably enough to pay your entries. 

How much oil does it take? More than a gas engine? I am in the market for a new truck. But, the maintenance of a diesel has my husband scared.

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DoubleUFarms
Reg. Sep 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 10:53 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Double Trouble


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Location: Whosuredaddy...

Oh gosh, I can't really remember.  My other half does it, but I think it's like 6 quarts at maybe $1.70 a quart.  I know it's under $10 for the fuel filter.  All in all they are cheaper for oil changes, just as long as you keep them up to date.  Never let them go over or you can mess up a lot of vital parts of your truck. 

All I can say is that a diesel has saved me money, but mine had no underlying problems before.

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TXCanchaser
Reg. Jan 2004
Posted 2004-03-29 10:55 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



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Posts: 339
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Location: East Texas
I love our F250 diesel!!! It's a 2000 model and has been very good to us.
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AlmostaRanch
Reg. Oct 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 11:06 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Miss Southern Hospitality


Posts: 3482
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Originally written by DoubleUFarms on 2004-03-29 10:31 AM

Well, we change the oil ourself, so we only have the cost of the filter and oil.  But you change the oil every 5,000 miles, which is different from gas engines, which is 3,000 miles. 

You will find that diesels do a whole lot better on fuel than gas engines.  Probably enough to pay your entries. 

 I take mine in and get it all done for $80.00 and that's every 5-6,000 miles, depending on how often & how many miles you pull.

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Three 4 Luck
Reg. Sep 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 11:09 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



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Ford diesel holds 15 quarts of oil.  We change every 6000 miles on our Fords and Dodges--oil analysis proved that this was the optimum timing.  The older Chevy engine has to be changed more often, but the Duramax that we had (and sold due to injector problems) was on the same schedule as the rest.

I learned friday that when you smell oil, you should stop and raise the hood to check on your truck.  My high pressure oil pump went out and blew some o-rings along with it.  I lost 9 quarts of oil in 20 miles.  Oops!    BTW, my truck has just over 90,000 miles on it and this is the only problem I've had so far.

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dianeguinn
Reg. Oct 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 3:51 PM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Lady Di


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As  someone who is mechanically challenged, I must say I don't know what is scaring your husband about diesel maintenance....they only thing you have to maintain is changing the oil regularly and making sure your air filter is clean (diesels need a lot of air to run efficiently)...I had a Ford F-350 and sold it with no problems at 150K and I think it's still going.  I currently have a Chevy Duramax Crew Cab and I love it 3 times as much as my Ford...doubt I'll ever go back...it tells me when I need to change the oil and does better on fuel.  I also drive a diesel Volkswagen bug and love it...40 mpg....If you ask me, GAS engines are the ones to worry about!  That's why I didn't want a gas automobile.
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turn34cash
Reg. Sep 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 4:10 PM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!


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Posts: 284
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I have my oil changed every 5000 miles and it is $50 for a diesel oil change around here.  The last time I bought an air filter it was $20... 
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panhandlepony
Reg. Mar 2004
Posted 2004-03-29 4:25 PM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!





2525
Location: Panhandle of, Texas

We have one of the new Dodge Cummins 1 tons after three BAD Ford Powerstrokes...never owned a Dodge before but this one has been a jewel.

My husband pro rodeos and our kids jr. rodeo and in less than 1 year, it has over 40K miles and has NEVER (knock on wook) been in the shop for anything.

We pull an 38' Elite LQ 4 horse with ease and the mileage is better than any Ford we ever owned at 14 mpg with NO chip!  18 mpg in town.

Oil changes are around $50 and we change it every 6000 miles.

You'll love a diesel!

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SG.
Reg. Sep 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 4:55 PM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!


Blessed
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Just a note for those changing the oil every 5000 to 6000 miles...

on my new dodge is says in the service manual for heavy service which I consider pulling a trailer to change oil every 3500 miles....

Just something to ponder with summer coming on and hot summer temps.....

I am on my 2nd dodge.... the first one we still have has 280,000 miles on it and I always changed the oil every 2500 to 3000 miles.... I guess I had good luck with that So I am going to stay with it....

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wideopen
Reg. Nov 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 5:09 PM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



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I think you are right SG.  I have a GMC desiel with 180K.  I drive it to work during the day and pull with it at night on on the weekends.  My husband is a Chev/GMC mech/tech and he insisted that he change it every 3000.  I have never (knock, knock) had any trouble out of it.
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got boost?
Reg. Sep 2003
Posted 2004-03-29 5:47 PM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Loves to compete


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Well being in the oil change business.  This is what we recommend.  3,000 mile oil changes are preferred.  However it depends on the driving conditions of each individual and stop and go or pulling a trailer etc....  Here in the valley of California we call it extreme driving conditions on our diesels.  We tell our customers they can go 5,000 miles on their oil changes if they are willing to check their oil levels themselves.  Their are many advantages to changing oil every 3,000 miles.  For example at our shop whe check all fluids and inspect your vehicle.  My employees can detect an early problem before it happens out on the road.  ie on a new 03 dodge it was leaking coolant we were able to show the customer the problem.  Often it is covered under warranty but we can give you a heads up.  Now with all the commuter cars and stuff we stay suggest 3,000 mile oil changes this is because a lot of people don't check their oil and they will come in 2 qrts low.  Well guess what your engine only holds 4 quarts.  That is a large majority of our customers.  It is hard to compare prices because in our full service oil change business we include a full service carwash in the service.  Also we are independant and we use a higher quality oil filters, air filters and fuel filters on diesels and all our customers cars.  That is our choice.  My husband is anal and sleeps better at night with quality filters.

i do change my oil every 3,000 miles SG. is correct.........

danelle

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alamobanjo
Reg. Nov 2003
Posted 2004-03-30 9:57 AM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Sherlock Holmes...


Posts: 13082
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Location: South Dakota
Thank you! I am e-mailing him some responses. We did about get a 4 door Ford gas engine last night, but it was sold. Dang!!
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Three 4 Luck
Reg. Sep 2003
Posted 2004-03-30 12:33 PM
Subject: RE: Good news for you diesel truck lovers!!!!



Accident Prone


Posts: 22277
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Originally written by SG. on 2004-03-29 4:55 PM

Just a note for those changing the oil every 5000 to 6000 miles...

on my new dodge is says in the service manual for heavy service which I consider pulling a trailer to change oil every 3500 miles....

We based our numbers off of what the oil analysis was telling us.  Had it tested with up to 7500 miles between changes and 6000 miles proved to be the optimum interval.  We do use a higher grade of oil than what you can go out and buy at Wal Mart.  We have a large fleet of farm trucks that are in the dust and mud and hot weather, and tow heavy loads and this has worked very well for us.

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